I've Been Doubting My Faith For A While Now..

nb408

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I'm surrounded by Christians, was raised Christian, and work at a coffee shop inside a church. This past year I've been through some stuff that has made me question everything that I believe.

I hear it all the time that God will figure it out. Praise goes to him, not me. God is good. Rely on nothing but him. Do you know him? Yes I have a personal relationship with him. How so? He's revealed himself to me through reading the Bible, prayer and experiences. I have a personal relationship with him and that's what he wants with everybody. But your sin is in the way so you just need to believe in Jesus. He paid the price for your sins. Repent and be forgiven. Live the life he's meant you to live.

I have repented of my sins. I have been baptized. I have read the Bible more than once. Carefully studied it. I have given my life to him and surrounded myself with community. I've relied completely on him to a fault. The problem with relying completely on God. What happens when your life falls apart. When your faith finally breaks? Who do you think you'll blame? Whatever/whomever you relied on. The God that you thought you knew. Following God has become so transactional.. Follow God and he will give you peace of mind. You will finally love again. Be free from all of your bondage. In plain sight this is what it is. I'll give you happiness, freedom, and peace of mind if you give me your belief. Happiness, freedom and peace of mind? I want those things. Here take what you want so that I can get them. It's transactional. That's what church is all about. Have faith, believe so that x =y. You're selling yourself for what looks appealing. Do you know what happiness is? Freedom? All you know is the pain of not knowing. All everybody goes by is appearances. How can you know what you need if you don't know yourself?

I still believe in God but I don't believe in others who rely on something completely outside of themselves. To preach at people and believe that every responsibility you have will be taken care of by someone else. It's a recipe for destruction. Do you know how easy it is to break someones faith like that?

Yes I'm doubting everything but I'm still firm in my belief that there's a power greater than me. One that works through me. Through everybody. But until I see someone with a perfect life, I don't believe the God that you believe. Until you are so firm in your belief that anything can happen and you have no need to prove yourself. No compulsion to get equal. Prove what you believe, only then can I agree with you. Jesus came into this world as a perfect example of how we should live. He suffered what we suffered and more. But was it really suffering if the purpose was for forgiveness? Suffering is not suffering when it's derived by purpose. It becomes a work. We're living with so much suffering and pain. Everyone is eagerly waiting for the children of God to be revealed Roman's 8:19. Who are the children of God? And where does it start? Individually. Because as an individual you are part of the collective. The body of christ. Is your hand any less a part of you then your head? It's all you, as a collective and individually. It's you.

We are the body of christ, where is christ exactly? If you know him personally like most say they do, then you'll personally know where he is. That still small voice inside of you. Always knocking. Revelation 3:20
 

2PhiloVoid

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I'm surrounded by Christians, was raised Christian, and work at a coffee shop inside a church. This past year I've been through some stuff that has made me question everything that I believe.

I hear it all the time that God will figure it out. Praise goes to him, not me. God is good. Rely on nothing but him. Do you know him? Yes I have a personal relationship with him. How so? He's revealed himself to me through reading the Bible, prayer and experiences. I have a personal relationship with him and that's what he wants with everybody. But your sin is in the way so you just need to believe in Jesus. He paid the price for your sins. Repent and be forgiven. Live the life he's meant you to live.

I have repented of my sins. I have been baptized. I have read the Bible more than once. Carefully studied it. I have given my life to him and surrounded myself with community. I've relied completely on him to a fault. The problem with relying completely on God. What happens when your life falls apart. When your faith finally breaks? Who do you think you'll blame? Whatever/whomever you relied on. The God that you thought you knew. Following God has become so transactional.. Follow God and he will give you peace of mind. You will finally love again. Be free from all of your bondage. In plain sight this is what it is. I'll give you happiness, freedom, and peace of mind if you give me your belief. Happiness, freedom and peace of mind? I want those things. Here take what you want so that I can get them. It's transactional. That's what church is all about. Have faith, believe so that x =y. You're selling yourself for what looks appealing. Do you know what happiness is? Freedom? All you know is the pain of not knowing. All everybody goes by is appearances. How can you know what you need if you don't know yourself?

I still believe in God but I don't believe in others who rely on something completely outside of themselves. To preach at people and believe that every responsibility you have will be taken care of by someone else. It's a recipe for destruction. Do you know how easy it is to break someones faith like that?

Yes I'm doubting everything but I'm still firm in my belief that there's a power greater than me. One that works through me. Through everybody. But until I see someone with a perfect life, I don't believe the God that you believe. Until you are so firm in your belief that anything can happen and you have no need to prove yourself. No compulsion to get equal. Prove what you believe, only then can I agree with you. Jesus came into this world as a perfect example of how we should live. He suffered what we suffered and more. But was it really suffering if the purpose was for forgiveness? Suffering is not suffering when it's derived by purpose. It becomes a work. We're living with so much suffering and pain. Everyone is eagerly waiting for the children of God to be revealed Roman's 8:19. Who are the children of God? And where does it start? Individually. Because as an individual you are part of the collective. The body of christ. Is your hand any less a part of you then your head? It's all you, as a collective and individually. It's you.

We are the body of christ, where is christ exactly? If you know him personally like most say they do, then you'll personally know where he is. That still small voice inside of you. Always knocking. Revelation 3:20

Hello nb408,

I hear you, loud and clear. It's most definitely true that not much of anything in our Christian walk is easy, is it? Everything is fraught with pitfalls and perils of one sort or another and I think that in many ways we can all relate with you on this general struggle. And of course, the resulting doubts that come about are not helpful in facing what we have to face.

But in your case, I'm wondering, what have the members of your own church advised you to do with your feelings in all of this?

Peace,

2PhiloVoid
 
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I'm surrounded by Christians, was raised Christian, and work at a coffee shop inside a church. This past year I've been through some stuff that has made me question everything that I believe.

I hear it all the time that God will figure it out. Praise goes to him, not me. God is good. Rely on nothing but him. Do you know him? Yes I have a personal relationship with him. How so? He's revealed himself to me through reading the Bible, prayer and experiences. I have a personal relationship with him and that's what he wants with everybody. But your sin is in the way so you just need to believe in Jesus. He paid the price for your sins. Repent and be forgiven. Live the life he's meant you to live.

I have repented of my sins. I have been baptized. I have read the Bible more than once. Carefully studied it. I have given my life to him and surrounded myself with community. I've relied completely on him to a fault. The problem with relying completely on God. What happens when your life falls apart. When your faith finally breaks? Who do you think you'll blame? Whatever/whomever you relied on. The God that you thought you knew. Following God has become so transactional.. Follow God and he will give you peace of mind. You will finally love again. Be free from all of your bondage. In plain sight this is what it is. I'll give you happiness, freedom, and peace of mind if you give me your belief. Happiness, freedom and peace of mind? I want those things. Here take what you want so that I can get them. It's transactional. That's what church is all about. Have faith, believe so that x =y. You're selling yourself for what looks appealing. Do you know what happiness is? Freedom? All you know is the pain of not knowing. All everybody goes by is appearances. How can you know what you need if you don't know yourself?

I still believe in God but I don't believe in others who rely on something completely outside of themselves. To preach at people and believe that every responsibility you have will be taken care of by someone else. It's a recipe for destruction. Do you know how easy it is to break someones faith like that?

Yes I'm doubting everything but I'm still firm in my belief that there's a power greater than me. One that works through me. Through everybody. But until I see someone with a perfect life, I don't believe the God that you believe. Until you are so firm in your belief that anything can happen and you have no need to prove yourself. No compulsion to get equal. Prove what you believe, only then can I agree with you. Jesus came into this world as a perfect example of how we should live. He suffered what we suffered and more. But was it really suffering if the purpose was for forgiveness? Suffering is not suffering when it's derived by purpose. It becomes a work. We're living with so much suffering and pain. Everyone is eagerly waiting for the children of God to be revealed Roman's 8:19. Who are the children of God? And where does it start? Individually. Because as an individual you are part of the collective. The body of christ. Is your hand any less a part of you then your head? It's all you, as a collective and individually. It's you.

We are the body of christ, where is christ exactly? If you know him personally like most say they do, then you'll personally know where he is. That still small voice inside of you. Always knocking. Revelation 3:20
OK, you've acknowledged that a merely transactional faith is a problem. What specifically are you having doubts with, and why?
 
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Tolworth John

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There is nothing wrong with having questions or doubts about ones faith.
We are told/commanded to always have a reason for what and why we believe.

No where are we promised an easy or trouble free life, rather we are promised the opposite.

When life kicks you in the teeth, that is when you decide whether or not to trust God or not.
We rarely really have to trust God and it hurts when we have to use unused faith muscles.

Investigate your doubts and find the answers
 
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PKFox

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Believe it or not, I know exactly what you're going through because I have been in a similar boat for the past few months, though I'm slowly coming out of it... So maybe being a couple steps beyond where you currently are can help (and if not, you're welcome to disregard anything I say and I won't even be offended).

I've relied completely on him to a fault. The problem with relying completely on God. What happens when your life falls apart.
Well it's not easy by any means. Your whole world flips upside down and everything goes into "disaster mode", and it feels impossible to keep going... I think those are the times we grow the most, even if it means we take a few steps away from God for a bit (not to say that's recommended biblically, but I understand that it happens because I've been there).

Following God has become so transactional.. Follow God and he will give you peace of mind. You will finally love again. Be free from all of your bondage.
I agree that it should be more relational yet still feels transactional. However, I also have come to the conclusion that these are more of side effects that come with accepting and trusting in God as opposed to an "I do this, you do that" dynamic because there have been times when I've felt peace, love, and/or freedom because I wasn't following God. The peace didn't last very long, but it was there for a moment. However, we have a God-sized hole in our hearts that can lead to these blessings of peace of mind, etc. Other things can only temporarily provide those blessings that God can provide eternally.

I still believe in God but I don't believe in others who rely on something completely outside of themselves. To preach at people and believe that every responsibility you have will be taken care of by someone else. It's a recipe for destruction. Do you know how easy it is to break someones faith like that?
Yeah, it's not easy. The only reason I find comfort in trusting that God can and will take care of me is because I know I can't successfully take care of myself without him. I've tried... That's not to say it doesn't still feel like a recipe for disaster. Sometimes though, everything can be falling apart, but the comfort of having something (God) - something constant, something consistent to hold onto - really helps in those times. It's harder when you don't believe he's actually there, but it's still possible if you reflect on how he's taken care of you in the past instead of focusing on the struggles of the here and now.

Yes I'm doubting everything but I'm still firm in my belief that there's a power greater than me. One that works through me. Through everybody. But until I see someone with a perfect life, I don't believe the God that you believe.
I like the way you wrote that, but the flaw comes in with the expectation that you'll find someone with a perfect life. Only Jesus can do that, and he already did. Seeking someone else who has successfully done so is an impossible venture (though that's not to say I haven't also tried).
It's also healthy to question who you believe and why. I'd like to hope you'd believe in the God of the Bible, especially when you come out of this state of life that is feels like everything's completely falling apart, but figuring that out for yourself is part of the journey.

Prove what you believe, only then can I agree with you.
If I could prove it, it wouldn't be faith. Hebrews 11:1
I know that's the opposite of what you're asking here, but it's all I've got. God has proven himself to me in ways that I wish I could explain, but often I can't because it's the unexplainable, simple feeling of peace in a whirlwind of chaos, the near death experience that didn't result in death by pure miracle... I suppose I could go on, but I won't.

We are the body of christ, where is christ exactly? If you know him personally like most say they do, then you'll personally know where he is. That still small voice inside of you. Always knocking. Revelation 3:20
Oof, I wish I had the answer to this too. It's hard to hear God's voice (though more so when you're not trying to listen... something I feel I should probably be working on even though I'm not right now). Sometimes, we can't seem to find God. Even David felt this: Psalm 22:1-2. It doesn't mean God's not there, just that he might not be actively speaking to us right now (which I know from very recent experience). After all, “When you’re going through something difficult and you wonder where God is, remember the teacher is always quiet during the test.” -Anonymous
Hindsight reveals a lot too though. A lot that I have reflected even here, I did NOT believe or want to believe in the eye of the storms (not that they're over yet). I didn't want to cling to God when I was literally falling apart. I was tired of the God/Jesus/Bible/Church answers everyone gave me when I shared my struggles with them (because I too was surrounded by Christians). But, looking back, God was there, even when I turned my back on him because it didn't feel like he was there, and I'm grateful because I don't think I'd have made it through (as in, I literally would've quit my job and moved away) if it weren't for him.

Hope this helps at least a little (and sorry it turned out so long, but you made a lot of good points).
 
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roman2819

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I'm surrounded by Christians, was raised Christian, and work at a coffee shop inside a church. This past year I've been through some stuff that has made me question everything that I believe.

I hear it all the time that God will figure it out. Praise goes to him, not me. God is good. Rely on nothing but him. Do you know him? Yes I have a personal relationship with him. How so? He's revealed himself to me through reading the Bible, prayer and experiences. I have a personal relationship with him and that's what he wants with everybody. But your sin is in the way so you just need to believe in Jesus. He paid the price for your sins. Repent and be forgiven. Live the life he's meant you to live.

I have repented of my sins. I have been baptized. I have read the Bible more than once. Carefully studied it. I have given my life to him and surrounded myself with community. I've relied completely on him to a fault. The problem with relying completely on God. What happens when your life falls apart. When your faith finally breaks? Who do you think you'll blame? Whatever/whomever you relied on. The God that you thought you knew. Following God has become so transactional.. Follow God and he will give you peace of mind. You will finally love again. Be free from all of your bondage. In plain sight this is what it is. I'll give you happiness, freedom, and peace of mind if you give me your belief. Happiness, freedom and peace of mind? I want those things. Here take what you want so that I can get them. It's transactional. That's what church is all about. Have faith, believe so that x =y. You're selling yourself for what looks appealing. Do you know what happiness is? Freedom? All you know is the pain of not knowing. All everybody goes by is appearances. How can you know what you need if you don't know yourself?

I still believe in God but I don't believe in others who rely on something completely outside of themselves. To preach at people and believe that every responsibility you have will be taken care of by someone else. It's a recipe for destruction. Do you know how easy it is to break someones faith like that?

Yes I'm doubting everything but I'm still firm in my belief that there's a power greater than me. One that works through me. Through everybody. But until I see someone with a perfect life, I don't believe the God that you believe. Until you are so firm in your belief that anything can happen and you have no need to prove yourself. No compulsion to get equal. Prove what you believe, only then can I agree with you. Jesus came into this world as a perfect example of how we should live. He suffered what we suffered and more. But was it really suffering if the purpose was for forgiveness? Suffering is not suffering when it's derived by purpose. It becomes a work. We're living with so much suffering and pain. Everyone is eagerly waiting for the children of God to be revealed Roman's 8:19. Who are the children of God? And where does it start? Individually. Because as an individual you are part of the collective. The body of christ. Is your hand any less a part of you then your head? It's all you, as a collective and individually. It's you.

We are the body of christ, where is christ exactly? If you know him personally like most say they do, then you'll personally know where he is. That still small voice inside of you. Always knocking. Revelation 3:20

Many Christians face similar challenge at various points of their life. Faith is about perseverance. Keep faith and keep going.
 
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nb408

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OK, you've acknowledged that a merely transactional faith is a problem. What specifically are you having doubts with, and why?
I'm having doubts with the Jesus that everyone as a collective believes in. Living my whole life surrounded by Christians, I'm starting to see how many people have blind faith. I love Christianity and Christians but even I myself would regurgitate what I heard to others. It was genuine. But I no longer am worried or care about what people say anymore. I care about how they're living. I see so many people, Christians, suffering and thinking that they had a personal revelation with God when they haven't. Simply just following the crowd. Afraid to say anything that the church wouldn't agree with.

The worst part is, I can't pinpoint exactly what's wrong with the church nor is it my job to. But something about it is wrong right now. This is where my doubt is coming from. Which isn't much to work with but what I want to know is the truth. So I'm in a stage where I'm seeking. I'm not seeking the God who everyone believes. I'm seeking the God of the universe. My foundation is with the Bible and Christianity. I can't change that nor do I want to. But I'm willing to let everything go and be objective about who God is and where he's at.

I guess to sum it up, I'm doubting Jesus Christ as being a seperate entity from who we are. Where we are. Because if he's somewhere else, then we would be searching for him outside. Not internally.
 
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Sketcher

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I guess to sum it up, I'm doubting Jesus Christ as being a seperate entity from who we are. Where we are. Because if he's somewhere else, then we would be searching for him outside. Not internally.
This part confuses me. Are you doubting that Jesus Christ is a separate being from you and from me? And what do you mean by searching for him internally, rather than externally?
 
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nb408

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This part confuses me. Are you doubting that Jesus Christ is a separate being from you and from me? And what do you mean by searching for him internally, rather than externally?
Yes that's correct. If he's somewhere outside of myself. Then I'll have to build idols, do something to get his attention. So many verses point to him being in us. We are the temple. Children of God. The body of christ. I know the verse that his ways are above my ways. His thoughts above mine. It should be simple for him to be outside of myself and objectively look at my thoughts and heart in regards to the verse.. But it's so much deeper than that.

Why are we told to be like Jesus? To follow in his footsteps? He's God.. If we are nothing more than victims, then there's no reason to follow in his footsteps. The only way we can follow in his footsteps are if we are capable of doing it. God says we can through Jesus christ. Through God himself. I continually look outside of myself for answers and because of that I'm more lost than ever. Which leads me here on this forum seeking more validation for what I believe. Continually searching and asking in a repetitive cycle. Which only leads to more and more confusion. A continual vote on what I should believe.. I need a solid foundation. A rock that can't be moved. A belief that can't waver. How else can you find this kind of faith without finding where God is? It's as if I've been asleep my whole life and I'm barely starting to wake up Ephesians 5:14. What I'm after isn't something that can ever falter. Something so solid that I'll rejoice in trials. Be thankful during heartbreak. Have peace during a storm. I won't settle for less. Which is why I've been doubting almost everything. And going through hell this past year.
 
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I'm surrounded by Christians, was raised Christian, and work at a coffee shop inside a church. This past year I've been through some stuff that has made me question everything that I believe.

I hear it all the time that God will figure it out. Praise goes to him, not me. God is good. Rely on nothing but him. Do you know him? Yes I have a personal relationship with him. How so? He's revealed himself to me through reading the Bible, prayer and experiences. I have a personal relationship with him and that's what he wants with everybody. But your sin is in the way so you just need to believe in Jesus. He paid the price for your sins. Repent and be forgiven. Live the life he's meant you to live.

I have repented of my sins. I have been baptized. I have read the Bible more than once. Carefully studied it. I have given my life to him and surrounded myself with community. I've relied completely on him to a fault. The problem with relying completely on God. What happens when your life falls apart. When your faith finally breaks? Who do you think you'll blame? Whatever/whomever you relied on. The God that you thought you knew. Following God has become so transactional.. Follow God and he will give you peace of mind. You will finally love again. Be free from all of your bondage. In plain sight this is what it is. I'll give you happiness, freedom, and peace of mind if you give me your belief. Happiness, freedom and peace of mind? I want those things. Here take what you want so that I can get them. It's transactional. That's what church is all about. Have faith, believe so that x =y. You're selling yourself for what looks appealing. Do you know what happiness is? Freedom? All you know is the pain of not knowing. All everybody goes by is appearances. How can you know what you need if you don't know yourself?

I still believe in God but I don't believe in others who rely on something completely outside of themselves. To preach at people and believe that every responsibility you have will be taken care of by someone else. It's a recipe for destruction. Do you know how easy it is to break someones faith like that?

Yes I'm doubting everything but I'm still firm in my belief that there's a power greater than me. One that works through me. Through everybody. But until I see someone with a perfect life, I don't believe the God that you believe. Until you are so firm in your belief that anything can happen and you have no need to prove yourself. No compulsion to get equal. Prove what you believe, only then can I agree with you. Jesus came into this world as a perfect example of how we should live. He suffered what we suffered and more. But was it really suffering if the purpose was for forgiveness? Suffering is not suffering when it's derived by purpose. It becomes a work. We're living with so much suffering and pain. Everyone is eagerly waiting for the children of God to be revealed Roman's 8:19. Who are the children of God? And where does it start? Individually. Because as an individual you are part of the collective. The body of christ. Is your hand any less a part of you then your head? It's all you, as a collective and individually. It's you.

We are the body of christ, where is christ exactly? If you know him personally like most say they do, then you'll personally know where he is. That still small voice inside of you. Always knocking. Revelation 3:20
After reading scripture as much as you have surely you can see that we aren't promised a life free of problems and strife. Sin gets in the way of our good life and creates all sorts of problems. It doesn't even have to be our own sin, the sins of others negatively affect us. Look at the Apostles, 11 of the 12 were executed, they lived miserable lives but served Christ and relied upon him.

Look deeper in this struggle of faith in your life.
 
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aiki

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I'm surrounded by Christians, was raised Christian, and work at a coffee shop inside a church.

Well, Jesus kicked folks out of the temple for making it a place of commerce, a place where buying and selling occurred. I wonder what he'd do if he entered a church with a coffee shop in it. I don't think he'd be happy.

I hear it all the time that God will figure it out. Praise goes to him, not me. God is good. Rely on nothing but him. Do you know him? Yes I have a personal relationship with him. How so? He's revealed himself to me through reading the Bible, prayer and experiences. I have a personal relationship with him and that's what he wants with everybody. But your sin is in the way so you just need to believe in Jesus. He paid the price for your sins. Repent and be forgiven. Live the life he's meant you to live.

Uh huh.

I have repented of my sins. I have been baptized. I have read the Bible more than once. Carefully studied it. I have given my life to him and surrounded myself with community. I've relied completely on him to a fault. The problem with relying completely on God. What happens when your life falls apart.

You've used a lot of vague phrases here so its hard to respond to what you're saying. Generally, when one is walking in constant dependence upon God, trusting Him, living in moment-by-moment surrender to Him, life's difficulties don't have the power to cause utter collapse. It is when we are trusting in ourselves that we suffer collapse. Our power is very, very limited; God's is not.

Following God has become so transactional.. Follow God and he will give you peace of mind.

Well, the peace that God gives you is Himself. He doesn't dole out packages of peace, or joy, or power. He is those things for us. When you ask God for more peace, then, you are asking for more of Him. But the more of God we have in our lives, the less there must be of us. As John the Baptist said, "He must increase, but I must decrease." (John 3:30) The throne of my heart (and yours) seats only one, you see.

I'll give you happiness, freedom, and peace of mind if you give me your belief. Happiness, freedom and peace of mind? I want those things. Here take what you want so that I can get them. It's transactional.

Yes, it is. But relating with God isn't only transactional. And it is important to properly understand what the transaction is: More of God, less of me; the "old man" dies and the new creation in Christ lives; I am being replaced, not improved.

God takes everything, you see, and gives me Himself instead.

That's what church is all about. Have faith, believe so that x =y. You're selling yourself for what looks appealing. Do you know what happiness is? Freedom? All you know is the pain of not knowing. All everybody goes by is appearances. How can you know what you need if you don't know yourself?

The Christian life is not "church." The Christian life is Christ.

It isn't my faith that is important but the object of my faith.

Yes, I know what happiness is. But it is fleeting and circumstantial. God offers to me joy instead, that is anchored in Him.

I don't go by appearances in my walk with God. That sort of a walk with Him ended many decades ago.

The key to walking with God is not knowing myself so much as it is knowing Him. He's what is important, not me.

I still believe in God but I don't believe in others who rely on something completely outside of themselves.

Then you don't really understand the Christian faith. Read John 15:5 and Philippians 2:13.

To preach at people and believe that every responsibility you have will be taken care of by someone else. It's a recipe for destruction. Do you know how easy it is to break someones faith like that?

You aren't God's puppet. But you don't act unilaterally, either. You work out only what God has first worked in. You receive and transmit. You don't generate and sustain.

Yes I'm doubting everything but I'm still firm in my belief that there's a power greater than me. One that works through me. Through everybody. But until I see someone with a perfect life, I don't believe the God that you believe.

??? It seems you haven't known the God I walk with every day. I'm not perfect but my Saviour is. And I am in him, clothed in his perfect righteousness, and on this basis alone am I acceptable to God. My ability to be perfect in practice, then, has nothing to do with my adoption into God's family. My adoption is secure in Christ, not me. (1 Corinthians 1:30-31)

He suffered what we suffered and more. But was it really suffering if the purpose was for forgiveness? Suffering is not suffering when it's derived by purpose. It becomes a work.

I'm sorry, but this irrational. The purpose for which one suffers does not negate the fact that one is suffering.
 
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Kris Jordan

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Yes that's correct. If he's somewhere outside of myself. Then I'll have to build idols, do something to get his attention. So many verses point to him being in us. We are the temple. Children of God. The body of christ. I know the verse that his ways are above my ways. His thoughts above mine. It should be simple for him to be outside of myself and objectively look at my thoughts and heart in regards to the verse.. But it's so much deeper than that.

Why are we told to be like Jesus? To follow in his footsteps? He's God.. If we are nothing more than victims, then there's no reason to follow in his footsteps. The only way we can follow in his footsteps are if we are capable of doing it. God says we can through Jesus christ. Through God himself. I continually look outside of myself for answers and because of that I'm more lost than ever. Which leads me here on this forum seeking more validation for what I believe. Continually searching and asking in a repetitive cycle. Which only leads to more and more confusion. A continual vote on what I should believe.. I need a solid foundation. A rock that can't be moved. A belief that can't waver. How else can you find this kind of faith without finding where God is? It's as if I've been asleep my whole life and I'm barely starting to wake up Ephesians 5:14. What I'm after isn't something that can ever falter. Something so solid that I'll rejoice in trials. Be thankful during heartbreak. Have peace during a storm. I won't settle for less. Which is why I've been doubting almost everything. And going through hell this past year.

Hi nb408,

After reading your posts, I'm wondering if you were raised with (or surrounded by those with) an idealistic view of Christianity. As in, if you commit your life to Jesus = everything will be wonderful; you'll never struggle, have questions or doubts; you'll never face times of suffering (but if you do, Jesus will make it go away right away) -- that kind of thing?

Does that sum up what your core struggle is?
 
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TzephanYahu

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where is christ exactly?

Shalom nb408,

From reading your post I feel two things. Firstly, that your perspective is skewed and secondly, and most importantly, baptism of the Holy Spirit.

Most people, like me, assume that the baptism of the Holy Spirit just happens when you believe or after water baptism. That is the case for some but not everybody. For me it wasn't until about 14 years after becoming a believer. But, there is a strong difference between before and after. There is a joy, peace and connection with the Father that will turn your life around for the better.

Rather than debate the other points you raised at this time, I encourage you to seek this baptism above all things, above anything else in life. It may not happen straight away, it may take tears, fasting and pleading for a while, like it did with me, or could happen with laying on of hands immediately. But don't stop seeking this until you KNOW it has happened for you. It doesn't have to be accompanied by tongues, that's a misconception, but it will be accompanied by love and peace.

Seek this above all things and don't stop until you know fully.

Love & Shalom
 
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nb408

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Not entirely. I hear it all the time that believing in Jesus, you will have trials and tribulations. That's its not easy and the purpose of suffering is to refine you and make you stronger in Christ. That Christians aren't perfect and it's the blood of Jesus that sets us free.

But obviously someone isn't going to be a Christian if it doesn't benefit them in any way. "I want eternal life. I want to live the best life I possibly can." What better life is there then the one you were originally meant to live before the fall?

That's my motivation. I want to live the best life I possibly can. I could care less about cars, money, popularity, all of that is trash compared to what I'm after. I'm literally after the heart of what God intended for all of us. There's no doubt that there is no better way of life then that. I honestly don't care what that means. It's what I'm after. I'm at a place where I won't settle for anything less than peace of mind. Contentment, thankfulness. Pure joy. Which a lot of people will say that isn't reality. That it's childish thinking. If God intended that for us, and Jesus paid the price to live there again. Why wouldn't it be possible? I don't want to continually live a life that God didn't intend for me to live.

I live with so much suffering inside of my mind. So much chaos. If someone tells me to follow someone who will bring me more burdens and more weight. Both logically and emotionally that's foul. I couldn't do it. This is what I hear when I see someone preach who is unhappy or discontent with any part of there life. My standards are ridiculously high and I do admit that I'm stubborn. But it's because I will settle for nothing less than the absolute best that this life has to offer.
 
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That's my motivation. I want to live the best life I possibly can. I could care less about cars, money, popularity, all of that is trash compared to what I'm after. I'm literally after the heart of what God intended for all of us.

And this is HIMSELF. Not a state of being, but the Greatest Being, God Almighty. He is what we were created for, to know and love Him and to be "vessels sanctified and meet for His use."

It's what I'm after. I'm at a place where I won't settle for anything less than peace of mind.

But such peace is the by-product of fellowship with God. It cannot be obtained apart from Him. God is our peace. As He dominates in our life, we are at peace.

If God intended that for us, and Jesus paid the price to live there again. Why wouldn't it be possible? I don't want to continually live a life that God didn't intend for me to live.

Well, then, the life you want isn't a condition first of all, but a Person. Joy, peace, love - these all are who God is. To want these things, then, is to want Him. Many believers want the effects of fellowship with God without God, without the full and constant surrender to Him that is the key to walking with, and enjoying, Him (James 4:7; 1 Peter 5:6; Romans 12:1; Romans 6:13, etc.), and out of which walk the abundant life arises.

I live with so much suffering inside of my mind. So much chaos.

This not the mind of Christ.

Matthew 11:28-29
28 Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
29 Take My yoke upon you and learn of me, for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls.


Chaos and suffering are not characteristic of a mind that has yielded to God, to His will and way. When God is in full control of you, chaos, fear, and confusion are cast out.

2 Timothy 1:7
7 For God has not given us a spirit of fear, but of power and of love and of a sound mind.
 
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nb408

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And this is HIMSELF. Not a state of being, but the Greatest Being, God Almighty. He is what we were created for, to know and love Him and to be "vessels sanctified and meet for His use."



But such peace is the by-product of fellowship with God. It cannot be obtained apart from Him. God is our peace. As He dominates in our life, we are at peace.



Well, then, the life you want isn't a condition first of all, but a Person. Joy, peace, love - these all are who God is. To want these things, then, is to want Him. Many believers want the effects of fellowship with God without God, without the full and constant surrender to Him that is the key to walking with, and enjoying, Him (James 4:7; 1 Peter 5:6; Romans 12:1; Romans 6:13, etc.), and out of which walk the abundant life arises.



This not the mind of Christ.

Matthew 11:28-29
28 Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
29 Take My yoke upon you and learn of me, for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls.


Chaos and suffering are not characteristic of a mind that has yielded to God, to His will and way. When God is in full control of you, chaos, fear, and confusion are cast out.

2 Timothy 1:7
7 For God has not given us a spirit of fear, but of power and of love and of a sound mind.
I like what you said but. How does someone completely surrender to God? I've said the prayer many times as authentically as I can. I've read and studied the Bible. I feel like I've done everything, and this is where I'm stuck. Because this revelation has to come personally. I've been to many churches where you raise your hand and say a prayer if you want to surrender your life to God. People pray over you and celebrate. Which is often times shortly lived. You have to stay in the word, pray daily. Surrender everything to him daily.

What I realized is that there's no words you need to say, actions you need to do. If it were so, I wouldn't be on this forum right now. Such personal revelation can only come when God wants it to come. You can imagine how bitter that can make a person who sees others with this revalation while seeking it to no avail.

I must admit, the best I've ever felt on this earth was when I fully believed that peace of mind. Confidence. Love. Thankfulness. Joy. Unity. All of this comes from what you believe. All of this is always at your disposal. All it takes is a complete shift in perspective. A renewal of your mind. Which is entirely in your own control. Because of my Christian background I'm afraid that my philosophy is entering into self worship. But it's actually the opposite. I end up caring for others more because I'm finally free from bondage. From seeking approval, seeking contentment, seeking love. Instead of seeking I've entered into it. And until God himself comes into my life this is what I believe. That God is in me with everything that I do. So intertwined with me and with everything that nothing I can do or say can seperate me from him. Which means that everything in my life. Everything good that is to come relies completely on what I believe.
 
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klutedavid

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There is nothing wrong with having questions or doubts about ones faith.
We are told/commanded to always have a reason for what and why we believe.

No where are we promised an easy or trouble free life, rather we are promised the opposite.

When life kicks you in the teeth, that is when you decide whether or not to trust God or not.
We rarely really have to trust God and it hurts when we have to use unused faith muscles.

Investigate your doubts and find the answers
Well that is the truth, through much trial and tribulation. Who ever said that the Christian life was a walk in the park?

2 Corinthians 1:6
But if we are afflicted, it is for your comfort and salvation; or if we are comforted, it is for your comfort, which is effective in the patient enduring of the same sufferings which we also suffer.

Romans 8:17
And if children, heirs also, heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, if indeed we suffer with Him so that we may also be glorified with Him.
 
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roman2819

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I like what you said but. How does someone completely surrender to God? I've said the prayer many times as authentically as I can. I've read and studied the Bible. I feel like I've done everything, and this is where I'm stuck. Because this revelation has to come personally. I've been to many churches where you raise your hand and say a prayer if you want to surrender your life to God. People pray over you and celebrate. Which is often times shortly lived. You have to stay in the word, pray daily. Surrender everything to him daily.

What I realized is that there's no words you need to say, actions you need to do. If it were so, I wouldn't be on this forum right now. Such personal revelation can only come when God wants it to come. You can imagine how bitter that can make a person who sees others with this revalation while seeking it to no avail.

I must admit, the best I've ever felt on this earth was when I fully believed that peace of mind. Confidence. Love. Thankfulness. Joy. Unity. All of this comes from what you believe. All of this is always at your disposal. All it takes is a complete shift in perspective. A renewal of your mind. Which is entirely in your own control. Because of my Christian background I'm afraid that my philosophy is entering into self worship. But it's actually the opposite. I end up caring for others more because I'm finally free from bondage. From seeking approval, seeking contentment, seeking love. Instead of seeking I've entered into it. And until God himself comes into my life this is what I believe. That God is in me with everything that I do. So intertwined with me and with everything that nothing I can do or say can seperate me from him. Which means that everything in my life. Everything good that is to come relies completely on what I believe.

'Submit to God' and 'Persevere in God' are 2 sides of the same coin.

Saying prayers of submission does not mean things change in the way we hope. Christians are always bombarded by many issues, eg finance, family, jobs, problems etc, and they never totally ceased. But amidst all these, we have the peace of God.

To appreciate what is walking with God, i suggest we consider the lives of biblical characters such as Abraham, Jacob, Joseph, Moses, the prophets etc. We will see that they have to peesevere. For 300 years after Christ, Christians had to persevere amid persecutions. They suffered but they had the peace of God. Today, so do we.

The book , Understanding Prayer Faith and God's will' speak quite a fair bit about lives of patriarchs and David. I believe it will enable you to appreciate the Christian journey.
 
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