The Normalizing Of Bastard Children

zoidar said:

I didn't vote because I didn't understand the question. What does it mean if a child is unclean? Anyhow I came to think of this:

John
9:1 As He passed by, He saw a man blind from birth. 2 And His disciples asked Him, “Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents, that he would be born blind?” 3 Jesus answered, “It was neither that this man sinned, nor his parents; but it was so that the works of God might be displayed in him.

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A view: "this man" and "his parents" - were they "clean" or "unclean" ?

A child is unclean if none of their parents is a <true> believer. According to what is written in the Bible.

yeshuaslavejeff said:

"Realistic" ? Who is doing His Will ?
The death penalty for adultery is still true - God's Word has not changed. Only men have dropped it, and some will, some won't, make it happen one way or another. (in some countries if a spouse cheats, the other spouse takes care of it.... to put it most mild)...

"Better planning to live better lives for ourselves" ? Did that ever work(in the flesh/ world) ? Or "more importantly by our children" and "get that blessing" ? Did that come to pass for most people ?

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Ah, the good old days of OT law. It sure worked out great, didn't it?

zoidar said:

Then a child born in a Christian marriage is automatically saved, but not so if born outside of marriage?

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No. No one is "automatically saved".

Note in Scripture , and everywhere else I know of, "sanctified" does not mean "saved".

p.s. subject to more research, study or reading. (to verify or clarify, to be sure)

A Realist said:

Ah, the good old days of OT law. It sure worked out great, didn't it?

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Where does any unrepentant sinner go / what is their destiny ? (according to the Creator and His Word, Plan and Purpose )
They still die, separate from Christ, without hope for eternal life, if they don't receive a circumcised heart, not made with human hands, from the Father in heaven.

Christ is Lord said:

This bastard talk and labeling people as such really has no use anymore. I’m really surprise this thread even exists.

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Perhaps what Jesus Says is More Important about bastards and who they are ?

Christ is Lord said:

Exactly. Unclean simply meant you weren’t supposed to come into God’s presence which is sacred space.

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So who is not allowed into God's Presence in the life to come ?

Christ is Lord said:

You can be unclean for having your period, you can also be unclean for touching a dead body. These are things that have to happen. Someone has to bury the dead and women have their period.

EDIT: This was what happened in the OT. I’m not advocating this view but merely stating facts.

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"This was what happened in the OT." ? WHAT is what happened ? Don't people still touch dead bodies and women have their time of month ?

SkyWriting said:

Paul gave lots of bad advice.

Jesus has never blinded anyone with darkness.
He is light.

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Jesus taught Paul. Paul spoke from the Father and from the Son. Those who dismiss Jesus or any of the faithful messengers like Paul, have already dismissed God the Father.

Most people , including those who remain perverts, thieves, adulterers, idolators, etc
are living in darkness. Jesus did not have to blind them so to speak.

SkyWriting said:

The illustration is regarding other religions. Not step brothers.

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No.

Brightmoon said:

if some jerk told me that I was unclean because I was having my period , I’d have to leave the room before he got slapped . Women have periods because we don’t go into heat like a dog would . Our ability to have sex isn’t coupled to our fertility

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Jesus says so in His Word. It has nothing to do with other aspects that most likely concern you ?

SkyWriting said:

That is all obsolete bunk.

It's true that it is history. But it is obsolete health practice.

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Really?! So doctors shouldn't wash their hands after touching a dead body before they go deliver a baby ? !!!?

CharismaticLady said:

Especially when it came to women.

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Jesus taught Paul.

Missed the mark. Mis-application of God's Word.

Whoever is without scourging is not God's child. (yes, scourging /discipline is painful or discomforting, while necessary for every child to be a child)

God, as a Perfect Father, scourges every son of His.

SkyWriting said:

Ephesians 2:8-9
For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast. (Not bastards though?)

Acts 16:31
And they said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.”(Not bastards though?)

John 3:16
“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.(Not bastards though?)

Romans 10:9-10
Because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved.(Not bastards though?)

John 5:24
Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.(Not bastards though?)

Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.(Not bastards though?)

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SkyWriting said:

People can have poor motives, but still offer valuable insights.
People are rarely good at being all bad.

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People are usually all bad, and stay all bad. Just by being born.
They usually have no insights at all, and especially no valuable insights.
"Whatever is born of the flesh..... profits NOTHING."

yeshuaslavejeff said:

"This was what happened in the OT." ? WHAT is what happened ? Don't people still touch dead bodies and women have their time of month ?

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I am not advocating that we label people as unclean because of those things is what I’m saying

yeshuaslavejeff said:

The child in the womb , based on what all Scripture says, is sanctified if one of the parents is a <true> believer/ saved/ circumcised heart by Yahuweh.....

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Yes, but what if neither parent is saved? What happens to the embryo if aborted?

yeshuaslavejeff said:

Jesus says so in His Word. It has nothing to do with other aspects that most likely concern you ?

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. Somehow Jesus doesn’t come off as much of a misogynist. Demeaning women over a natural phenomenon like having a period is abuse . Just because that was practiced during the Bronze Age doesn’t mean that it should be practiced now.

besides I think this was a twisted way of protecting women from being forced to have sex when they were cramping and also vulnerable to possibly life threatening infections. Bronze Age men treated women like property and property has no rights so the men were told the women were unclean rather than just coming out and saying that she needed to protect herself a little

CharismaticLady said:

Yes, but what if neither parent is saved? What happens to the embryo if aborted?

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why don’t you askGod.


( I hate these pointless angels dancing on the head of a pin questions )

yeshuaslavejeff said:

So you are speaking specifically here of those who became born again then, right ?

Not as if anyone should berate someone who is not born again apart from the Heavenly Father's Guidance and Direction,
but there is a life and death difference between those who are born again and those who are not.

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In that particular sentence, yes. Earlier, I had presented an instance where a woman had a child out of wedlock prior to becoming a Christian. @Daniel C argued that it was still acceptable to call the woman a harlot and her child a bastard even though Christ would have given them new identities and would not see them as such. He further argued (or seemed to argue; pardon me if I'm misconstruing your answer, Daniel) that they would still be judged as such despite their new identities.

But even for non-believing single parents, I don't think it's right to immediately insult someone for having a child despite being unmarried. There's definitely a life and death difference, as you said, but I do think compassion is key here, because we're representing Christ. Christ absolutely recognized people's sin, and He called (and still calls) people to repentance, but He responded with patience and gentleness. (A particular instance of this that sticks in my mind is that of the woman caught in adultery in John 8: Christ sees people dragging her out to be stoned to death. He diffuses the situation and calls for her to sin no more. He doesn't call her a harlot, even though as the only perfect human to ever walk the Earth He would have had the right to. He is patient with her and gentle towards her.)

Brightmoon said:

why don’t you askGod.


( I hate these pointless angels dancing on the head of a pin questions )

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Being aware of how God judges is important. If not to you, it is to me.