hostility for Trump

Daniel Martinovich · Oct 6, 2019

martymonster said:
Um, I don't have a problem with people who voted for Trump. Um?

Did I take you to mean the opposite of what you meant? So sorry.

martymonster · Oct 6, 2019

Daniel Martinovich said:
Did I take you to mean the opposite of what you meant? So sorry.

I meant that people hate Trump, because the media told them to, because they have no critical thinking skills.

Daniel Martinovich · Oct 6, 2019

martymonster said:
I meant that people hate Trump, because the media told them to, because they have no critical thinking skills.

I see that. Sorry.

childeye 2 · Oct 6, 2019

Daniel Martinovich said:
Trump is doing the things he can do that point us in that direction. Despite all his flaws.

He's promoting a lie that Russia was framed for interfering in the election by Democrats the media and Ukraine. You don't see that?

childeye 2 · Oct 6, 2019

martymonster said:
I meant that people hate Trump, because the media told them to, because they have no critical thinking skills.

Have you read the reports that Trump tried to force Ukraine to promote the theory that Russia was framed for interfering in the 2016 elections by the Democrats, media, and the Ukraine? They provide documented texts from official envoys to the Ukraine with corroborating statements made by Trump.

childeye 2 · Oct 6, 2019

martymonster said:
I meant that people hate Trump, because the media told them to, because they have no critical thinking skills.

This is why you need to qualify your terms.

Daniel Martinovich · Oct 6, 2019

childeye 2 said:
He's promoting a lie that Russia was framed for interfering in the election by Democrats the media and Ukraine. You don't see that?

Seriously, are you like 17 years old and believe yourself to be informed about these things?

childeye 2 · Oct 6, 2019

Daniel Martinovich said:
Seriously, are you like 17 years old and believe yourself to be informed about these things?

No I'm not seventeen as if that mattered. I'd think a seventeen year old could comprehend the situation.
But yes I believe I'm pretty much informed. The question was are you?

Ricky M · Oct 6, 2019

CitizenD said:
If Trump does things that are destructive to our social fabric (constant lying, turning insults into a national sport, ignoring social norms, binding other polls to him and getting them to violate social norms) then those things need to be called out. It's not "good" or "christian" to ignore these problems.

Nor to support them

Ricky M · Oct 6, 2019

Sketcher said:
What people said about Bush came close, and he was actually a decent guy. Leftists have been saying that Republicans are racist for decades, so when a Republican finally came along that actually said some overtly racist things on the campaign trail, maybe they felt they needed to kick it up a notch.

I guarantee you that you would not be hearing this from the American left if Trump had run as a Democrat while espousing the left-wing policies he had espoused in the past (gun control, socialized medicine, abortion). His making fun of the one-armed guy would not have mattered to them. His past affairs and sexual harassment would not have mattered to them, they would have rallied around him like they did with Bill Clinton. Bullying on Twitter? They'd be fine with it, they themselves bully conservatives on Twitter.

As Christians, we need to be more fair than that. Should we be critical of his character? Yes, the same as we needed to be critical of Obama's character, and Clinton's character. We need to call sin out.

And we need to stop supporting it.

Ricky M · Oct 6, 2019

childeye 2 said:
No I'm not seventeen as if that mattered. I'd think a seventeen year old could comprehend the situation.
But yes I believe I'm pretty much informed. The question was are you?

Well now that someone else has asked, I was going to ask what your background is. If I had to guess you're a transplant from Asia (India?) by the way you phrase things..? I think your question is valid, and I'd answer it, except for your attitude. If that's just a cultural mis-interpretation on my part, I apologize and will answer. But no, if that's your real attitude, I'll wish you good luck with that and take a pass.

Ricky M · Oct 6, 2019

Sketcher said:
I rightly said that many loud voices on the left have double standards for character, and that Christians should not have double standards for character.

The left has double standards. The right has double standards. Is it not a double standard as a Christian to choose either one of these above the other?

Daniel Martinovich · Oct 6, 2019

childeye 2 said:
No I'm not seventeen as if that mattered. I'd think a seventeen year old could comprehend the situation.
But yes I believe I'm pretty much informed. The question was are you?

Never mind. I should not have said that. I thought you were referring to something else. You were referring to CrowdStrike that Trump is quite suspicious about.

Sketcher · Oct 6, 2019

Ricky M said:
The left has double standards. The right has double standards. Is it not a double standard as a Christian to choose either one of these above the other?

No. You require truth of your own side as well as the other.

Ricky M · Oct 6, 2019

Ricky M · Oct 6, 2019

Sketcher said:
No. You require truth of your own side as well as the other.

But in a world on path to the antichrist, is that a reasonable expectation?

Ricky M · Oct 6, 2019

childeye 2 said:
I think that Trump hatred is probably more about being frustrated with Trump followers not being able to think for their selves. Trump says Obama's not born in America and they believe it. Trump says the Democrats hate their country and his followers believe Him. Even Trump says he could shoot someone on the street and not lose a vote.

And to be sure, now with evidence mounting that Trump withheld security aid to the Ukraine because he wanted Zelensky to promote the theory that Russia was framed by the Democrats and the media and the Ukraine, they probably don't care. People on this site who are on record saying it was a lie invented by people who hate Trump, will probably next be saying there's nothing wrong with forcing a country to spread false narratives to help his political campaign. And they'll probably justify that with the hypocritical assertion that the Democrats do it.

I was with you up to the last sentence. Actually if it were the democrats in power they'd be pulling their own sort of shenanigans. The question isn't are the democrats guilty or are the republicans guilty; they're both guilty and as Christians it's time to step away from them both.

Ricky M · Oct 6, 2019

childeye 2 said:
None of this is relevant to Trumps statement.

Trump's statements are rarely relevant

creslaw · Oct 6, 2019

It has been interesting to see how some Christians justify personal attacks on President Trump’s character, seemingly excusing any pejorative adjective because they believe it is “the truth”.

Putting aside that most of what we see as “the truth” in the political sphere is dependent on biased sources of information, the reason Jesus told us not to condemn another person’s character (Luke 6:37) is because we will be judged by the same standard by which we judge others – let them without sin cast the first stone.

In another place Jesus said we should should judge what is right & wrong behaviour according to the righteous standard taught in Scripture (John 7:24). I am surprised so many Christians seem unable to distinguish between character and behaviour. Saint Paul behaved in an appalling way towards early Christians (Acts 26:11) because he was mistaken not because he was an evil person.

When we use what we think we know to call another person racist, bigoted, immoral, evil, etc we are condemning ourselves because we all are guilty under God’s holy law … and it is only through the saving grace of Jesus Christ that we are not all on our way to hell.

Sketcher · Oct 6, 2019

Ricky M said:
But in a world on path to the antichrist, is that a reasonable expectation?

I can reasonably expect that reasonable people can lead other reasonable people in requiring truth in a fuller way. And if the Antichrist comes and kills me, then that's what happens.

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