Is God able to perfectly match us with the right spouse? Why or why not?

genez said:

"This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior,
who desires all men to be saved and to come to the know-
ledge of the truth." 1 Tm 2:3-4​

Not over writing our wills when it comes to rejecting Christ. That is the rock too heavy to lift. For, its his will that all believe.

He can not coerce human volition when it comes to salvation.

"The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand
slowness. Instead he is patient with you, not wanting anyone to
perish, but everyone to come to repentance." 2 Pet 3:9​

If those who think God's sovereignty can make people to believe? Those two witnesses state its not the case.

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Who do you think gave man that free volition?

PeterJames0510 said:

Who do you think gave man that free volition?

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Adam had free volition. So did the woman before they fell.

When men fell (in Adam) the fallen flesh took over and dominated over their soul's ability to have free volition. That is why God must provide grace in salvation. Grace = (God's enabling power) - as the means to suppress the domineering oppressive influence of the flesh over the soul. Grace is supplied, so that while under grace? A man's soul is momentarily placed in a state to having free volition as God intended. Man rejects God while under the influence of Grace. Man is then without excuse.

God created man in His image. We are to reflect God's image in our new creation in Christ. Done so when controlled by the Holy Spirit and walking in truth. As so, we can now reflect the image of God.

God is absolute sovereignty. No man can make God to do what He does not want to do.

And, God gave man (who was created in His image) a reserved area for volition in our souls, for our sovereignty to reflect upon His own as His image of sovereignty..

Our sovereignty being, that no one can make us want to do what we do not want to. Though.. men can torture us and force us do things we would not want to do. But , they can not make us want to do what we do not want to do. There is a fine distinction to be found there.

Men are in Hell because they did not want to want to believe in Christ when grace was enabling them to believe.

Under threats men can fake believing at the point of a sword. But, they will not really believe.

No one would be in the Lake of Fire if God was sovereign over the volition He created for men to have. Same goes for the angels that rejected Him.

genez said:

Yes...

But when men fell the flesh took over and dominated their soul's ability to have free volition. That is why God must provide grace as the means to suppress the influence of the flesh. Grace, so that while under grace, a man's soul is momentarily restored to having free volition.

God created man in His image. We are to reflect God in our creation. When controlled by the Holy Spirit and walking in truth we can now reflect the image of God.

God is absolute sovereign. No man can make God to do what He does not want to do.

And, God gave man (who is in His image) a reserved area of volition, for our sovereignty to reflect upon His own.. That no one can make us want to do what we do not want to. Men can torture us, and make us do things we would not want to. But , they can not make us want to do what we do not want to do. There is a fine distinction to be found there.

Men are in Hell because they did not want to be made able to want to believe in Christ. Under threats men can fake it at the point of a sword. But, they will not really believe.

No one would be in the Lake of Fire if God was sovereign over the volition He created for men to have. Same goes for the angels that rejected Him.

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That's not the point ...

The point is that God can give man free will and God does *not* lost His sovereignty. He can still do whatever He wants, whenever He wants to, whether you or I like it or not.

He has given man free will .. that free will does *not* throw a monkey wrench into God's plan. Every time we exercise our choices, God has allowed it. In fact, there are some choices our heart might make that God stops.

For salvation, while it is true that God has us choose Him for salvation, it is not the same as saying that our free will somehow stops Him or His ultimate plan. Nothing stops God.

PeterJames0510 said:

That's not the point ...

The point is that God can give man free will and God does *not* lost His sovereignty. He can still do whatever He wants, whenever He wants to, whether you or I like it or not.

He has given man free will .. that free will does *not* throw a monkey wrench into God's plan. Every time we exercise our choices, God has allowed it. In fact, there are some choices our heart might make that God stops.

For salvation, while it is true that God has us choose Him for salvation, it is not the same as saying that our free will somehow stops Him or His ultimate plan. Nothing stops God.

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Two things. You responded quickly before I was able to edit my post to clarify what I missed... Please read it again.

Two... God made the sovereign Choice to give man an area of having his own sovereignty that no one can change. That area reflects God's own sovereignty as having created man in His image. It was with God's sovereignty that He chose to create men and angels with that special aspect in our volition...

Now.. If you like it, or not? That is what God sovereignly chose to create. It was His sovereign choice, and God does what He wants.

Otherwise? We have a cruel, insane God ,condemning people to Hell for what amounts to God's own decision, not man's.

PeterJames0510 said:

For salvation, while it is true that God has us choose Him for salvation, it is not the same as saying that our free will somehow stops Him or His ultimate plan. Nothing stops God.

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I have been only talking about man having been granted sovereignty in one area. That area is our ability in choosing to accept, or reject God.

Everything else is as God wants it. No argument from me there.

Neostarwcc said:

God has perfectly planned the lives of every human being that has walked this earth. But does this also include our spouses? I'm asking this question because sometimes God's "choice f ok f us can be emotionally and physically abusive, not interested in sex... the list goes on. Are these "bad" marriages ever planned by God? Before you go to say of course not! These were just "test" marriages. I wont accept that answer because God HATES divorce. He wouldn't plan for you to get divorced he would plan on the two of you to stay together if an abusive spouse was in his plans. Yes sometimes God tests us with abuse and "bad" stuff in our lives. So surely if we get divorced we failed the test right? Is this in Gods plan? Since he planned out every aspect of our lives? Why or why not?

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I don't know where I stand on this. I understand many people believe God does lead them to "the right person" however a huge part of me doesn't believe this is generally true for everybody. You've given circumstances as examples of why I some how don't believe God to be some cupid for everybody.
A part of me thinks that believing stuff like this can be potentially dangerous because of the bad decision making that can happen to the believer. Some people hold on and choose to remain in this toxic life which is almost the equivalent of suicide all because of the delusion that "God brought us together".

Additionally, even statistically speaking it doesn't sound true. The person you with is just one of the millions out there with the same personality, maybe having some similar appearance.

A part of me does believe that God does bring people in your life for the sake of you to grow in maturity, especially with relationships.. but you are designed with a mind. And the mind should rule over the heart.
if you and the person are just destroying each other, then you need to drop any beliefs of "God brought us together" and whatever religious beliefs you have in regards to separation.

Neostarwcc said:

So surely if we get divorced we failed the test right? Is this in Gods plan? Since he planned out every aspect of our lives? Why or why not?

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Just to answer this sentence on point. The answer is no. That doesn't mean you failed any test. What about the spouses that ended up getting murdered by their abusive partners? What is your spouse was someone like Ted Bundy or any of the serial killers with spouses. Do you think that leaving is failing God's test based on these circumstances?

God's first gift to you is life (his ultimate gift being your son), therefore it is your duty to also take care of your lives. Staying in an abusive relationship that has been given it's numerous chances can be a sin in itself, because one you are slowly throwing away the life God gave you over a single person.

Neostarwcc said:

God has perfectly planned the lives of every human being that has walked this earth. But does this also include our spouses? I'm asking this question because sometimes God's "choice f ok f us can be emotionally and physically abusive, not interested in sex... the list goes on. Are these "bad" marriages ever planned by God? Before you go to say of course not! These were just "test" marriages. I wont accept that answer because God HATES divorce. He wouldn't plan for you to get divorced he would plan on the two of you to stay together if an abusive spouse was in his plans. Yes sometimes God tests us with abuse and "bad" stuff in our lives. So surely if we get divorced we failed the test right? Is this in Gods plan? Since he planned out every aspect of our lives? Why or why not?

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as to the question posed in the OP "Is God able to perfectly match us with the right spouse? Why or why not?" of course he is, because he is God.

as to the content, of the OP humans have a divine purpose and individuals acting under this capacity are going to live healthy lives with their families and spouses, individuals who fight it will live in conflict not necessarily resulting in divorce or unhappy marriage but a loss of fulfillment.

SkyWriting said:

That is correct.

2 Thessalonians 2:11
Therefore God sends them a strong delusion, so that they may believe what is false,

Romans 1:28
And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind to do what ought not to be done.

John 12
Therefore they could not believe. For again Isaiah said, “He has blinded their eyes and hardened their heart, lest they see with their eyes, and understand with their heart, and turn, and I would heal them.”

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It is really easy to quote passages out of context and supply your own meaning. In each of the cases above, God is punishing those who rejected Him after seeing all that He has created and all that God has done. After deliberately rejecting God, and the knowledge of God, repeatedly, God finally will harden the hearts of such people, sending them a strong delusion, so they cannot be saved, just as God did with Pharaoh, and with Elect Israel, and all those who deliberately sin against God in the face of His glory and grace.

Hebrews 10:26-30 (NIV)
26 If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left, 27 but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God. 28 Anyone who rejected the law of Moses died without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 How much more severely do you think someone deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified them, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him who said, “It is mine to avenge; I will repay,” and again, “The Lord will judge his people.”

Hebrews 3:13-15 (NIV)
13 But encourage one another daily, as long as it is called “Today,” so that none of you may be hardened by sin’s deceitfulness. 14 We have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original conviction firmly to the very end. 15 As has just been said:

“Today, if you hear his voice,
do not harden your hearts
as you did in the rebellion.”

Neostarwcc said:

God has perfectly planned the lives of every human being that has walked this earth. But does this also include our spouses? I'm asking this question because sometimes God's "choice f ok f us can be emotionally and physically abusive, not interested in sex... the list goes on. Are these "bad" marriages ever planned by God? Before you go to say of course not! These were just "test" marriages. I wont accept that answer because God HATES divorce. He wouldn't plan for you to get divorced he would plan on the two of you to stay together if an abusive spouse was in his plans. Yes sometimes God tests us with abuse and "bad" stuff in our lives. So surely if we get divorced we failed the test right? Is this in Gods plan? Since he planned out every aspect of our lives? Why or why not?

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With over 60% of marriages ending in divorce, and only about 20% of those that remain married are actually happily married, I would suggest to you that God does not perfectly plan any aspect of a persons life, including finding finding the perfect spouse. Those marriages that remain happy are so because of many factors, but in particular, it takes loving sacrifice of one's pride, time, faith, hope, and all that each person possesses for a marriage to work.

Read the instruction in the below Passage and you tell me if you think marriage is perfectly planned by God...

1 Corinthians 7:25-39 (NIV)
Concerning the Unmarried
25 Now about virgins: I have no command from the Lord, but I give a judgment as one who by the Lord’s mercy is trustworthy. 26 Because of the present crisis, I think that it is good for a man to remain as he is. 27 Are you pledged to a woman? Do not seek to be released. Are you free from such a commitment? Do not look for a wife. 28 But if you do marry, you have not sinned; and if a virgin marries, she has not sinned. But those who marry will face many troubles in this life, and I want to spare you this.

29 What I mean, brothers and sisters, is that the time is short. From now on those who have wives should live as if they do not; 30 those who mourn, as if they did not; those who are happy, as if they were not; those who buy something, as if it were not theirs to keep; 31 those who use the things of the world, as if not engrossed in them. For this world in its present form is passing away.

32 I would like you to be free from concern. An unmarried man is concerned about the Lord’s affairs—how he can please the Lord. 33 But a married man is concerned about the affairs of this world—how he can please his wife— 34 and his interests are divided. An unmarried woman or virgin is concerned about the Lord’s affairs: Her aim is to be devoted to the Lord in both body and spirit. But a married woman is concerned about the affairs of this world—how she can please her husband. 35 I am saying this for your own good, not to restrict you, but that you may live in a right way in undivided devotion to the Lord.

36 If anyone is worried that he might not be acting honorably toward the virgin he is engaged to, and if his passions are too strong[a] and he feels he ought to marry, he should do as he wants. He is not sinning. They should get married. 37 But the man who has settled the matter in his own mind, who is under no compulsion but has control over his own will, and who has made up his mind not to marry the virgin—this man also does the right thing. 38 So then, he who marries the virgin does right, but he who does not marry her does better.

39 A woman is bound to her husband as long as he lives. But if her husband dies, she is free to marry anyone she wishes, but he must belong to the Lord. 40 In my judgment, she is happier if she stays as she is—and I think that I too have the Spirit of God.

Cis.jd said:

I understand many people believe God does lead them to "the right person" however a huge part of me doesn't believe this is generally true for everybody.

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Leading and choosing are different animals. He may reveal a suitable prospect but both have the freedom to choose differently.

A part of me thinks that believing stuff like this can be potentially dangerous because of the bad decision making that can happen to the believer.

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In the tenure of my walk, He’s addressed two persons of His own volition and spoke of others I chose to engage with. He advises me in my interactions but doesn’t twist my arm. The decision rests in my lap.

Where things get murky is when an individual behaves or projects one thing (which elicits an appropriate response) and I’m being told otherwise by the Holy Spirit.

Many romanticize the idea of God directing their steps. But the truth of our dichotomies and blind spots are another matter when you’re on the other side of them. He sees the hidden thing the other has not revealed and knows the end. Its not an easy road to walk.

A part of me does believe that God does bring people in your life for the sake of you to grow in maturity, especially with relationships.. but you are designed with a mind. And the mind should rule over the heart.

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The heart is deceitful. There are many things that sound good that aren’t good for us in the long run. I’ve learned to consider my feelings but my head is in the driver’s seat.

The other person may have a different end in mind. You can’t trespass their will to achieve the end you feel is correct. If we’re not aligned I give way and wish them the best.

There’s no guarantee the other will adhere to the Lord’s suggestions. You must always prepare yourself for the possibility they won’t.

Neostarwcc said:

God has perfectly planned the lives of every human being that has walked this earth. But does this also include our spouses? I'm asking this question because sometimes God's "choice f ok f us can be emotionally and physically abusive, not interested in sex... the list goes on. Are these "bad" marriages ever planned by God? Before you go to say of course not! These were just "test" marriages. I wont accept that answer because God HATES divorce. He wouldn't plan for you to get divorced he would plan on the two of you to stay together if an abusive spouse was in his plans. Yes sometimes God tests us with abuse and "bad" stuff in our lives. So surely if we get divorced we failed the test right? Is this in Gods plan? Since he planned out every aspect of our lives? Why or why not?

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God gives us free will. Christians are just as liable to make bad choices as any one else. often, emotion overrules the inner witness of our spirit that tells us not to get involved. God is not a robot, neither are we. God is not bothered if we fail. He can use failure to bring us closer to Himself. That includes (watching out for stones here) marriage failure. God did not intend for Adam to disobey and bring death upon the human race. Nevertheless, God's glorious plan of salvation is revealed as a result of man's folly. I am divorced. I got married when I was in a particularly low point in my life. It was not a good decision. God hates divorce. He also hates pride, rebellion, stubbornness, greed, dishonesty - all kinds of evil. Why single out one particular sin? Does the blood of Christ not avail for people who get divorced?
God has a plan and purpose for each one of us. But His plan is a goal (the salvation of our souls). It is not a regimented, mapped out blueprint that must be followed at all costs. God is way bigger than that.

genez said:

Our volition.

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Our volition is not a rock.

GingerBeer said:

Our volition is not a rock.

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I did clarify in other posts that only an area designated by God is that rock He can not lift.

Its an area where we either will choose for, or against God.

And, that it can only be freed up to be used if God's enabling grace is supplied. Empowered by grace to prevent man's flesh from preventing the soul's chance to choose. Its why without grace no one can get saved.

GingerBeer said:

Our volition is not a rock.

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And... you are really not Ginger Beer.

genez said:

I did clarify in other posts only an area designated by God is that rock He can not lift.

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But you're playing with words pretending that a rock is the same as free will and it isn't the same.

genez said:

And... you are really not Ginger Beer.

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Very true, and I never claimed that I am ginger beer, it is just my nickname.

GingerBeer said:

But you're playing with words pretending that a rock is the same as free will and it isn't the same.

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And, Herod was not a fox. Even though Jesus said he was. Why? Because of how you just reasoned what you did.

genez said:

And, Herod was not a fox. Even though Jesus said he was. Why? Because of how you just reasoned what you did.

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And this bears what relationship to the question that is the title of this thread?

GingerBeer said:

And this bears what relationship to the question that is the title of this thread?

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I see. You want to bounce me out of here. Forget the context for what was said as well...