The Call by Pastor Rick Joyner?

K2K · Jul 8, 2019

I hear the Lord talking to me everyday, but if someone does hear Him it is very difficult to explain it. It should be easy to explain. God is spirit and His Holy Spirit speaks to our spirit, and while His words often comes across as an impression, an unction, or vague feelings, we are supposed to be hearing Him in words. Those people who wrote the Bible heard 'words', and we can too. That is where my faith is at.

So according to my faith, I do hear words from Him -- if I take time to seek Him and actually try to listen to what He says. Actually, I will hear Him at different times of the day even when I am not seeking Him. Sometimes He has things He wants to say to me, and I just start hear His voice. That is why the authors of the Scriptures would put down 'The word of the Lord came to me saying'. He does that. He did it then, He does it now. They were trying to tell us that, but who will believe it?

Now normally He just talks to me about the little things in my personal life. I like to talk to Him about my son's soccer teams. It's not important, it's just what I like to talk to Him about. Yet He can talk about anything. He is God so of course He can talk about anything. He could tell me the winning lottery numbers, but He doesn't. He is God, what does He care about me having the winning lottery numbers. What He usually like to talk to me about is how I can be better. Is that a surprise? And the main way I can be better is to listen to Him and seek Him more. That should be a surprise either.

He like to takes me places where Him and I can and would just talk. He often like to take me to yard sales. He has even given me a business where I find things at yard sales are resale them on-line. I don't make much doing that, but I do wind up talking to Him a lot. Oh people, He will tell me where to go and when - what to look at and how to bargain. He sometimes has me tell a little parable to a kid at a yard sale. Did He ever tell you the story about the busy beaver? And sometime at the yard sale He gives me a word for someone. I feel so silly when He has told me to give a person a word like, 'so your a pastor'.

Honestly, I don't like giving words from the Lord. You just feel weird and most people don't want them anyway. What I do like is just walking and talking with Him. The world would be a lot better place if people just understood this. So I would really like it if people would simply believe He is there for them and start seeking them. To that end I probably get upset with those pompous people who by their own wisdom want to tell you all about Him when they obviously never listen to Him. Never-the-less His patience with them is still amazing.

So back to the OP. Rick Joyner hears from the Lord, but what do I really care about that. There are many many people who do hear from the Lord. Some amaze me that they hear from Him so well. I know a lot of them, because the Lord has had me working in ministry with them. So Rick Joyner is nobody special. He is just someone that wrote down some of the visions the Lord gave them. He is just someone trying follow the Lord's instructions for Him. Every minister show be making it there job to do that exact thing, and many are.

Then I run across people who honestly think the Bible has all that God has to say to us. How sad is that. That means they have never heard the Lord tell them He loves them. They have never heard Him joke with them. They are not being taught by Him. They don't even know how you feel a bit silly giving a word from the Lord. They have never heard the Lord tell them, "Karl, if you pray for that person I will heal them.", and then see it happen. They don't see the big things God can do, but far worst than that, they don't see the little things He does. And no matter what testimony I give them, they can't accept it simply because they don't believe the Lord Jesus Christ is the Word of God who is alive and active.

Of them it was written, "With their eyes they don't see and with their ears they don't hear". They do read that and study intently the sacred writings which explain all that I am saying, but they don't believe what they read. They say that the Bible is all that God has to say to us today and don't see they they are the one who with their eyes they don't see and with their ears they don't hear.

I would take so much time telling them this, but my hope is for them, and even if it wasn't, the Lord tells me to write, because He wants them to listen to Him far more than I do. He is so real and He so badly wants them to seek Him by faith, but they just can't get it. Their pride stands in their way.

Presbyterian Continuist · Jul 8, 2019

K2K said:
I hear the Lord talking to me everyday, but if someone does hear Him it is very difficult to explain it. It should be easy to explain. God is spirit and His Holy Spirit speaks to our spirit, and while His words often comes across as an impression, an unction, or vague feelings, we are supposed to be hearing Him in words. Those people who wrote the Bible heard 'words', and we can too. That is where my faith is at.

So according to my faith, I do hear words from Him -- if I take time to seek Him and actually try to listen to what He says. Actually, I will hear Him at different times of the day even when I am not seeking Him. Sometimes He has things He wants to say to me, and I just start hear His voice. That is why the authors of the Scriptures would put down 'The word of the Lord came to me saying'. He does that. He did it then, He does it now. They were trying to tell us that, but who will believe it?

Now normally He just talks to me about the little things in my personal life. I like to talk to Him about my son's soccer teams. It's not important, it's just what I like to talk to Him about. Yet He can talk about anything. He is God so of course He can talk about anything. He could tell me the winning lottery numbers, but He doesn't. He is God, what does He care about me having the winning lottery numbers. What He usually like to talk to me about is how I can be better. Is that a surprise? And the main way I can be better is to listen to Him and seek Him more. That should be a surprise either.

He like to takes me places where Him and I can and would just talk. He often like to take me to yard sales. He has even given me a business where I find things at yard sales are resale them on-line. I don't make much doing that, but I do wind up talking to Him a lot. Oh people, He will tell me where to go and when - what to look at and how to bargain. He sometimes has me tell a little parable to a kid at a yard sale. Did He ever tell you the story about the busy beaver? And sometime at the yard sale He gives me a word for someone. I feel so silly when He has told me to give a person a word like, 'so your a pastor'.

Honestly, I don't like giving words from the Lord. You just feel weird and most people don't want them anyway. What I do like is just walking and talking with Him. The world would be a lot better place if people just understood this. So I would really like it if people would simply believe He is there for them and start seeking them. To that end I probably get upset with those pompous people who by their own wisdom want to tell you all about Him when they obviously never listen to Him. Never-the-less His patience with them is still amazing.

So back to the OP. Rick Joyner hears from the Lord, but what do I really care about that. There are many many people who do hear from the Lord. Some amaze me that they hear from Him so well. I know a lot of them, because the Lord has had me working in ministry with them. So Rick Joyner is nobody special. He is just someone that wrote down some of the visions the Lord gave them. He is just someone trying follow the Lord's instructions for Him. Every minister show be making it there job to do that exact thing, and many are.

Then I run across people who honestly think the Bible has all that God has to say to us. How sad is that. That means they have never heard the Lord tell them He loves them. They have never heard Him joke with them. They are not being taught by Him. They don't even know how you feel a bit silly giving a word from the Lord. They have never heard the Lord tell them, "Karl, if you pray for that person I will heal them.", and then see it happen. They don't see the big things God can do, but far worst than that, they don't see the little things He does. And no matter what testimony I give them, they can't accept it simply because they don't believe the Lord Jesus Christ is the Word of God who is alive and active.

Of them it was written, "With their eyes they don't see and with their ears they don't hear". They do read that and study intently the sacred writings which explain all that I am saying, but they don't believe what they read. They say that the Bible is all that God has to say to us today and don't see they they are the one who with their eyes they don't see and with their ears they don't hear.

I would take so much time telling them this, but my hope is for them, and even if it wasn't, the Lord tells me to write, because He wants them to listen to Him far more than I do. He is so real and He so badly wants them to seek Him by faith, but they just can't get it. Their pride stands in their way.

A godly author wrote: "Nine out of every ten impressions come from the world, flesh, or the devil." In the light of that, how can you distinguish between an impression, a vague feeling, or voice coming from those three, and coming from the Lord?

Presbyterian Continuist · Jul 8, 2019

When I am looking for guidance, I will go to the Scripture, or discuss my issue with a trusted godly mentor. I don't go listening for voices, or looking for impressions and feelings, because if I did that, the devil is always there to give me one. When God wants to speak to me, He will be quite definite about it and it is usually based on a verse or passage of Scripture. For instance, recently I had a bit of a forgiveness problem with an individual in my church. I was asked to say a prayer for the visiting preacher. When I went to pray, I got the very distinct word: "When you stand praying, forgive!" So I had to confess it to the others, and when I had done that, I felt free to pray. Then I got: "If you have forgiven, you need to demonstrate it by your actions". This comes from the book of James. Through this, I needed to show my support for the person through my conduct towards him, even though I did not agree with his conduct. These words were definite and Scripture-based. They were not impressions, vague feelings, or "voices", but a definite, strong conviction in my heart.

K2K · Jul 9, 2019

Oscarr said:
A godly author wrote: "Nine out of every ten impressions come from the world, flesh, or the devil." In the light of that, how can you distinguish between an impression, a vague feeling, or voice coming from those three, and coming from the Lord?

Have you not read that their are more with us than against us???

It amazes me that those who cry "Bible, Bible, Bible" often don't know what the Bible says.

There is a story in the Old testament about a prophet and a man standing next to him. The man next to him is terrified because he see this massive army around them, but the prophet is amazed an wonders why that man can't see that their are more with them than against them. He prayed that the eyes of that man would be opened. That isn't what we are talking about here is it?

Again, it is written; with their eyes they don't see and with their ears they don't hear!

The enemy does exist, but if you are not aware that there are more with you, isn't it because you just are not seeing what is going on. In the vision that Rick Joyner gets and he testifies to, there indeed is an enemy, but also those with him that he see also. We don't fear the enemy, we fear God, and if for no other reason than there are more angelic beings than demonic beings. So seek the Lord for yourself and you will come to know what a godly man looks like. He looks like the prophet who knew there was an enemy but there were more with him than against him.

My friends - if you don't know the Lord you don't have understanding!! Yes, we battle with the powers, principalities, and dark forces in this world. Yet if you have eyes to see you will see the angels descending and ascending on Jesus Christ. You will know of them, because if you dwell in his winds those angels watch over you. You will know of them, because they are all ministering spirit sent by the Lord to those who will inherit salvation - which might explain why some know of the ministering angels sent by the Lord and others just don't have a clue. Jesus told his disciple that he would see the angels ascending and descending on him. Jacob saw the ladder with them coming and going. Daniel saw the angel with the Lord. Isaiah saw the host of heaven around the throne. But the Pharisees thought Jesus Christ had a demon. So what is your walk like?

Are you like the Pharisees who think even the righteous have a demon? Are you against those seeing and testifying about the visions the Lord Jesus Christ gives them, and saying that God has said all He was going to say to us in the Bible. Jesus told the Pharisees, "Why do you not understand what I am saying. It is because you can't hear my voice." (Jn 8:43)

The good news is that all who seek find. Jesus made that clear then. So even those Pharisees, if they repented of thinking their ways are right, and indeed truthfully had started seeking the Lord and truly accepted the testimony of Jesus Christ provided in the Bible, they would come to actually have know Him, the King of kings, the Lord or lords, the One who commands the angels in heaven. And they would have come to know what the prophet of God knew - that there are more with you than against you!!l

There are more angels in the Kingdom of God than there are demons. And the Kingdom of God is in your midst. So if you come to know the King or kings, then soon the angels He sends to minister to you also. But first the King, Jesus Christ, because He is the door, and nobody gets in expect through Him. But if you know Him you will go in and out, or have you not read about that also?

Presbyterian Continuist · Jul 9, 2019

K2K said:
Have you not read that their are more with us than against us???

It amazes me that those who cry "Bible, Bible, Bible" often don't know what the Bible says.

There is a story in the Old testament about a prophet and a man standing next to him. The man next to him is terrified because he see this massive army around them, but the prophet is amazed an wonders why that man can't see that their are more with them than against them. He prayed that the eyes of that man would be opened. That isn't what we are talking about here is it?

Again, it is written; with their eyes they don't see and with their ears they don't hear!

The enemy does exist, but if you are not aware that there are more with you, isn't it because you just are not seeing what is going on. In the vision that Rick Joyner gets and he testifies to, there indeed is an enemy, but also those with him that he see also. We don't fear the enemy, we fear God, and if for no other reason than there are more angelic beings than demonic beings. So seek the Lord for yourself and you will come to know what a godly man looks like. He looks like the prophet who knew there was an enemy but there were more with him than against him.

My friends - if you don't know the Lord you don't have understanding!! Yes, we battle with the powers, principalities, and dark forces in this world. Yet if you have eyes to see you will see the angels descending and ascending on Jesus Christ. You will know of them, because if you dwell in his winds those angels watch over you. You will know of them, because they are all ministering spirit sent by the Lord to those who will inherit salvation - which might explain why some know of the ministering angels sent by the Lord and others just don't have a clue. Jesus told his disciple that he would see the angels ascending and descending on him. Jacob saw the ladder with them coming and going. Daniel saw the angel with the Lord. Isaiah saw the host of heaven around the throne. But the Pharisees thought Jesus Christ had a demon. So what is your walk like?

Are you like the Pharisees who think even the righteous have a demon? Are you against those seeing and testifying about the visions the Lord Jesus Christ gives them, and saying that God has said all He was going to say to us in the Bible. Jesus told the Pharisees, "Why do you not understand what I am saying. It is because you can't hear my voice." (Jn 8:43)

The good news is that all who seek find. Jesus made that clear then. So even those Pharisees, if they repented of thinking their ways are right, and indeed truthfully had started seeking the Lord and truly accepted the testimony of Jesus Christ provided in the Bible, they would come to actually have know Him, the King of kings, the Lord or lords, the One who commands the angels in heaven. And they would have come to know what the prophet of God knew - that there are more with you than against you!!l

There are more angels in the Kingdom of God than there are demons. And the Kingdom of God is in your midst. So if you come to know the King or kings, then soon the angels He sends to minister to you also. But first the King, Jesus Christ, because He is the door, and nobody gets in expect through Him. But if you know Him you will go in and out, or have you not read about that also?

It is important, at this stage, to consider the implications of the hypothesis that presents itself to the observers as a whole, in order to see the possibilities of the imagination when it is viewing the distant future of the obligations that are underpinning the probabilities of what we are expecting to see. It is impossible to come to any conclusion without a full understanding of what has been proposed, which any novice to the consideration can clearly understand the theory of the proposition.

It is important that sense is made of the ramifications of whether we believe the theory behind the distant probabilities or not. But we cannot make sense of it until we fully understand the accountability of the many directions that the movers and shakers of the system decide to take. Once we understand this, then we can view the philosophical and theological implications of what we are led to understand and appreciate, because these implications are absolutely vital to the progress of our development and maturity in the cosmic expanse of the universe!

This makes a lot of sense to me. I trust that it does to you!

K2K · Jul 9, 2019

I wish sooo much, that people would start seeking our Lord Jesus Christ. He is so real and you will find Him if you seek Him. You will find that He is everything the Bible testifies that He is.

For example, He is the Wonderful Counselor. But one day I pull up to the post office because I had packages to leave off there. My Lord started talking to me. He said, "Karl, they call Me Wonderful Counselor and so I am, but I am not a wonderful counselor to those who don't listen to Me."

It is really obvious, if you think about it. Yet I run across self proclaimed experts on Him who write things like the Bible has all that the Lord will tell us today. Unknowingly they clearly confessed the He is not a Wonderful Counselor to them, because they are not getting counsel from Him, but are relying on their understanding of what He told others.

Another time the Lord told me:
WHAT TEACHER DOESN’T PUT A BOOK IN FRONT OF HIS STUDENTS TODAY; YET NOT JUST A BOOK BUT OVERHEAD TRANSPARENCIES, VISUALS, AND OTHER MATERIAL? FOR I TELL YOU TRULY, IF THEY ARE NOT LISTENING TO ME THEY ARE NOT MY PUPIL, THEY ARE NOT MY STUDENT; I TELL YOU TRULY, THEY ARE NOT MY DISCIPLE UNLESS THEY ARE HEARING FROM ME. SO DON’T TELL THEM TO READ THE BOOK, THEM TO TAKE THE CLASS!

It is written they will all be taught of God, but some are just not listening!!

Ps 78:1,2 Listen, O my people, to my instruction; Incline your ears to the words of my mouth. I will open my mouth in a parable; I will utter dark saying of old.

He is the ancient of days, so you need to listen to Him. He is the Word who is one with God and is God. The One who took on flesh. Those that knew Him and wrote the Bible heard from Him, and they knew to listen to Him and that He opened His mouth in parables. Parables and little sayings are good ways to teach, and He know that.

So Rick Joyner writes some books about visions he got from the Lord and those visions are in parable format. That is not surprising. They glorify Jesus Christ, and the devil is not about to do that. The person going, "Bible, Bible, Bible" is not glorifying Jesus Christ, they are glorifying the Bible and doing it glorify themselves!

The Spirit once told me, "
WE DON’T USE THE LORD TO PREACH THE SCRIPTURES; WE USE THE SCRIPTURES TO PREACH THE LORD!!

So look - I use the Bible to lead people to the Lord and try to get them to seek Him. But some won't listen to me. The Lord once took me to Ezk 3:6,7 and spoke to me, personally giving me the same kind of assignment. He told me "I am sending you to a people that should listen to you, but they will not be willing to listen to you since they are unwilling to listen to Me."

I am suppose to tell people to listen to Him. If you are unwilling to actually seek Him and His voice, by faith - a faith that believes that He is indeed standing their trying to get you to listen to Him (Rev 3:20) then you are indeed not going to listen to me because your are unwilling to listen to Him. If you are unwilling to listen to Him you are going to have to say the Bible is all that God has to say to you/us, because you don't believe He is their for you. Thus you don't know Him as Wonderful Counselor. You are not being taught by Him. You are not listening to His instructions to you, because you don't even believe He is there to be heard from. It is a sad state you are in. Many people will tell Him lots of things on that day, only to be told that He never knew them. If you are not hearing from Him, you don't know Him. You could be the chief priest where ever you are at but it is not going to save you, because you don't know Him.

And if you don't know Him, perhaps you are thinking that most everything heard is from the devil, because you just can't see that there are more with us than against us!!

K2K · Jul 9, 2019

Oscarr said:
It is important, at this stage, to consider the implications of the hypothesis that presents itself to the observers as a whole, in order to see the possibilities of the imagination when it is viewing the distant future of the obligations that are underpinning the probabilities of what we are expecting to see. It is impossible to come to any conclusion without a full understanding of what has been proposed, which any novice to the consideration can clearly understand the theory of the proposition.

It is important that sense is made of the ramifications of whether we believe the theory behind the distant probabilities or not. But we cannot make sense of it until we fully understand the accountability of the many directions that the movers and shakers of the system decide to take. Once we understand this, then we can view the philosophical and theological implications of what we are led to understand and appreciate, because these implications are absolutely vital to the progress of our development and maturity in the cosmic expanse of the universe!

This makes a lot of sense to me. I trust that it does to you!

What is important is that people start seeking the Lord instead of leaning on their own understanding!!!!

You write about 'full understanding' and fail to realize the God is understanding!!

You might want to read Proverbs. King Saul wrote a lot about hearing the Lord and seeking Him. but maybe you don't understand?

Prov 2:6 For the Lord gives wisdom; From His mouth come knowledge and understanding.

In case you don't understand - The Lord Jesus Christ sends His Spirit who speaks to our spirit, and from His mouth come the words of the Father and the Son, because the Spirit does not speak on His own initiative!

Prov 3:5 Trust in the Lord with all your heart and do not lean on your own understanding.

My friends - if you are going around coming up with all sorts of ideas, but are not actually seeking the Lord and trusting in what He says, then you are leaning on your own understanding!

BTW - keep reading Proverbs, but while you read start asking Him to reveal the meaning of the verses, and listen for His voice. His thoughts are not your thoughts, so you will start getting revelation.

Presbyterian Continuist · Jul 9, 2019

K2K said:
Another time the Lord told me:
WHAT TEACHER DOESN’T PUT A BOOK IN FRONT OF HIS STUDENTS TODAY; YET NOT JUST A BOOK BUT OVERHEAD TRANSPARENCIES, VISUALS, AND OTHER MATERIAL? FOR I TELL YOU TRULY, IF THEY ARE NOT LISTENING TO ME THEY ARE NOT MY PUPIL, THEY ARE NOT MY STUDENT; I TELL YOU TRULY, THEY ARE NOT MY DISCIPLE UNLESS THEY ARE HEARING FROM ME. SO DON’T TELL THEM TO READ THE BOOK, THEM TO TAKE THE CLASS!

I don't believe that this is from God at all. Paul says to Timothy that all Scripture is inspired of God. There is no way that God will tell anyone not to read the Bible and to accept a "voice" instead. What the "voice" has told you is that those who read and depend on the Bible are not disciples of Christ. This is totally contradictory to what Jesus said to the rich man in hell, that his brothers had the Law and the Prophets (written Scripture) and if they didn't believe that, then it would be no use even if a person rose from the dead to warn them not to end up in hell. So, your "voice" is saying not to read the Law and the Prophets and yet Jesus said that they are the foundation for faith in God! I think you need to carefully examine what the spirit is who is telling you these things. It is certainly not the Holy Spirit!

K2K · Jul 10, 2019

Oscarr said:
I don't believe that this is from God at all. Paul says to Timothy that all Scripture is inspired of God. There is no way that God will tell anyone not to read the Bible and to accept a "voice" instead. What the "voice" has told you is that those who read and depend on the Bible are not disciples of Christ. This is totally contradictory to what Jesus said to the rich man in hell, that his brothers had the Law and the Prophets (written Scripture) and if they didn't believe that, then it would be no use even if a person rose from the dead to warn them not to end up in hell. So, your "voice" is saying not to read the Law and the Prophets and yet Jesus said that they are the foundation for faith in God! I think you need to carefully examine what the spirit is who is telling you these things. It is certainly not the Holy Spirit!

Where did you come up with this " There is no way that God will tell anyone not to read the Bible and to accept a "voice" instead."???

That was never said nor implied - except perhaps in your mind from whatever is in it.

What is being explained, in the Bible and by those who know the Lord, is that we are to get to know Jesus Christ via His Holy Spirit talking to our spirit, so that we can read get understanding in all things, and especially the Bible which serves as the textbook.

What you did in the post is set up a false target to knock down. Nobody is telling you to not read and study the Bible, but we are telling you and anyone thinking that Jesus Christ not around to be heard from, that the Word is near you!!(and haven't your read the Jesus Christ is the Word of God and He is not the Bible)

The Bible might be near you at times, but the Bible is not in your heart and on your lips, but rather the Spirit of God is found speaking to you in your heart and on your lips.

Because people, like the Pharisees and those who followed Moses, and even some today, don't understand that God still speaks to us today!!!!!

The Word is near you!! Yet it is also written, that with their ears they don't hear!!

Jesus explained to them (and this explanation still applies to some today)

Jn 8:43 Why do you not understand what I am saying? It is because you cannot hear My word.

So the Bible is worth reading. You might find out by reading it the you are not hearing what He says!!

Jn 8:47 He who is of God hears the words of God; for this reason you do not hear them, because you are not of God".

Jesus said that to some so that they might consider that there is a problem if you are not hearing the words of God. Those Pharisees and religious leaders at that time studied the Scriptures, but they didn't listen to what we know as the small voice of the Lord (the Holy Spirit) speaking to them. They didn't even believe that was possible. So they couldn't hear the Lord because of their wrong belief!

If and since there is nothing new under the sun, there must be people like that today. So do you/we know anyone like that. If so, wouldn't yo be helping them, even perhaps ourselves, if we considered that?

Jesus was telling that information then to people, not to condemn them, but to convict them of their sins. The were standing in the very presence of the Holy One of God and they didn't know it because with their ears they didn't hear. They were relying on their study of the Scriptures, but not on a faith that says the Word is near them, in their hearts and on their lips.

Jesus wanted to change that in them, so He explained it to them, because He knew that all who seek find. If only He could get them to start seeking God, instead of thinking God was gone and all then now had was the Scriptures. If only they could realize that the Word was indeed near them.

And so why does Rick Joyner write those books? Isn't it to explain to people that God does still talk to people today? Yet they are a stubborn people, always learning but never coming to the realization that God is an omni-present being who wants people listening to Him. Yeah, He is not the only spirit around. That snake still causes doubt by saying "Did God really say?" S

o it is that people say, not knowing what spirit they are of, "Did God really give Rick Joyner those visions and speak to him in those vision. Look, if you don't know if God did or did not give Rick Joyner, why don't you ask the Lord for yourself and listen to what the Spirit of God has to say about it? OH YEAH - could it be that with your ears you don't hear and with your eyes you don't see?

That's just a rhetorical question - I don't need to know the answer, but I assure people, they need to know the answer, because His sheep hears His voice. The Word is near you, and Jesus Christ is the Word of God - but He is not the Scriptures. So read the Scriptures, what do they tell you, if not that Jesus Christ can be heard from today. His sheep do hear His voice, and your tittles, your position, your self proclaimed knowledge with not get you anywhere with Him. But your listening to Him and obeying His voice and personal instructions to you will get you somewhere. It will get you to heaven. It will get you His grace and mercy. It will get you His wonderful counsel. It will get you His teachings to you personally.

It will get you Him as a friend of yours!!!

Presbyterian Continuist · Jul 10, 2019

K2K said:
Where did you come up with this " There is no way that God will tell anyone not to read the Bible and to accept a "voice" instead."???

That was never said nor implied - except perhaps in your mind from whatever is in it.

What is being explained, in the Bible and by those who know the Lord, is that we are to get to know Jesus Christ via His Holy Spirit talking to our spirit, so that we can read get understanding in all things, and especially the Bible which serves as the textbook.

But that is not what your prophetic word said.

What you did in the post is set up a false target to knock down. Nobody is telling you to not read and study the Bible, but we are telling you and anyone thinking that Jesus Christ not around to be heard from, that the Word is near you!!(and haven't your read the Jesus Christ is the Word of God and He is not the Bible)

The Bible might be near you at times, but the Bible is not in your heart and on your lips, but rather the Spirit of God is found speaking to you in your heart and on your lips.

God wrote the Bible through the agency of the Holy Spirit. It is the way that He has communicated with mankind. The way to know God and Christ is to mediate in the written Word until it becomes part of us. The Bible is more than a text book. It is God speaking to us through it. He does not speak in any "voice" outside of the Bible, and He does not say anything that has not already been inspired in the Bible.

Because people, like the Pharisees and those who followed Moses, and even some today, don't understand that God still speaks to us today!!!!!

The people did not study the Scriptures for themselves. They accepted the Pharisees' and Rabbis' teachings which were so watered down, that the people were not getting the pure word of God, and were unable to obtain copies of the Torah to check things out for themselves. The Torah, for most people, was seen as a sacred icon, interpreted for them by the Rabbis and the Pharisees. This is why Jesus told the Pharisees that they were blocking the people from entering into the true things of God, and refusing to enter in themselves.

The Word is near you!! Yet it is also written, that with their ears they don't hear!!

Jesus explained to them (and this explanation still applies to some today)

Jn 8:43 Why do you not understand what I am saying? It is because you cannot hear My word.

Because Jesus is the Word of God, what He was saying to the Jews was the Word of God to them. The people were not hearing an inner "voice". It was Jesus in person speaking to them, and what He said is recorded in the Gospels for us to read and apply to ourselves.

So the Bible is worth reading. You might find out by reading it the you are not hearing what He says!!

Jn 8:47 He who is of God hears the words of God; for this reason you do not hear them, because you are not of God".

The Bible is the Word of God. There is no other voice except the voice of the Spirit that speaks through the written word, not apart from it.

Jesus said that to some so that they might consider that there is a problem if you are not hearing the words of God. Those Pharisees and religious leaders at that time studied the Scriptures, but they didn't listen to what we know as the small voice of the Lord (the Holy Spirit) speaking to them. They didn't even believe that was possible. So they couldn't hear the Lord because of their wrong belief!

The Pharisees were so entrenched in their own interpretation of the Scriptures, and their own misquided view of who the Messiah should have been, they missed that Jesus was the Messiah, they were blinded to the written prophecies about Him because of their hardened hearts.

If and since there is nothing new under the sun, there must be people like that today. So do you/we know anyone like that. If so, wouldn't you be helping them, even perhaps ourselves, if we considered that?

We do that by teaching them the Scriptures and the truth that is contained in them.

Jesus was telling that information then to people, not to condemn them, but to convict them of their sins. The were standing in the very presence of the Holy One of God and they didn't know it because with their ears they didn't hear. They were relying on their study of the Scriptures, but not on a faith that says the Word is near them, in their hearts and on their lips.

They were relying on their own interpretation of the Scriptures. Jesus used the Scriptures to show the two disciples at Emmaeus all the prophecies concerning Him that were written in them.

Jesus wanted to change that in them, so He explained it to them, because He knew that all who seek find. If only He could get them to start seeking God, instead of thinking God was gone and all then now had was the Scriptures. If only they could realize that the Word was indeed near them.

And so why does Rick Joyner write those books? Isn't it to explain to people that God does still talk to people today? Yet they are a stubborn people, always learning but never coming to the realization that God is an omni-present being who wants people listening to Him. Yeah, He is not the only spirit around. That snake still causes doubt by saying "Did God really say?" So it is that people say, not knowing what spirit they are of, "Did God really give Rick Joyner those visions and speak to him in those vision. Look, if you don't know if God did or did not give Rick Joyner, why don't you ask the Lord for yourself and listen to what the Spirit of God has to say about it? OH YEAH - could it be that with your ears you don't hear and with your eyes you don't see?

That's just a rhetorical question - I don't need to know the answer, but I assure people, they need to know the answer, because His sheep hears His voice. The Word is near you, and Jesus Christ is the Word of God - but He is not the Scriptures. So read the Scriptures, what do they tell you, if not that Jesus Christ can be heard from today. His sheep do hear His voice, and your tittles, your position, your self proclaimed knowledge with not get you anywhere with Him. But your listening to Him and obeying His voice and personal instructions to you will get you somewhere. It will get you to heaven. It will get you His grace and mercy. It will get you His wonderful counsel. It will get you His teachings to you personally.

It will get you Him as a friend of yours!!!

I get all I need from the Scriptures and from faithful and godly men who teach the Scriptures, but not from those who get 'visions" and "new revelations" that are not found in the Scriptures.

K2K · Jul 11, 2019

Oscarr said:
But that is not what your prophetic word said.

God wrote the Bible through the agency of the Holy Spirit. It is the way that He has communicated with mankind. The way to know God and Christ is to mediate in the written Word until it becomes part of us. The Bible is more than a text book. It is God speaking to us through it. He does not speak in any "voice" outside of the Bible, and He does not say anything that has not already been inspired in the Bible.

The people did not study the Scriptures for themselves. They accepted the Pharisees' and Rabbis' teachings which were so watered down, that the people were not getting the pure word of God, and were unable to obtain copies of the Torah to check things out for themselves. The Torah, for most people, was seen as a sacred icon, interpreted for them by the Rabbis and the Pharisees. This is why Jesus told the Pharisees that they were blocking the people from entering into the true things of God, and refusing to enter in themselves.

Because Jesus is the Word of God, what He was saying to the Jews was the Word of God to them. The people were not hearing an inner "voice". It was Jesus in person speaking to them, and what He said is recorded in the Gospels for us to read and apply to ourselves.

The Bible is the Word of God. There is no other voice except the voice of the Spirit that speaks through the written word, not apart from it.

The Pharisees were so entrenched in their own interpretation of the Scriptures, and their own misquided view of who the Messiah should have been, they missed that Jesus was the Messiah, they were blinded to the written prophecies about Him because of their hardened hearts.

We do that by teaching them the Scriptures and the truth that is contained in them.

They were relying on their own interpretation of the Scriptures. Jesus used the Scriptures to show the two disciples at Emmaeus all the prophecies concerning Him that were written in them.

I get all I need from the Scriptures and from faithful and godly men who teach the Scriptures, but not from those who get 'visions" and "new revelations" that are not found in the Scriptures.

Here is what the Bible says:

Jn 3:16 For God so loved the world, that He gave His only Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

Do you see the "in Him", part of the above verse. The Bible is not a "Him" in any sense of the word!!

So we are faith is not in the Bible, but "in Him" according to what is written in the Bible!!

So there is a "Him", the Christ, in who true believers believe in.

Whether a person wishes to believe Rick Joyner has it right or wrong, there is clearly a "Him" that Rick has put his faith in.

But what of someone who states "I get all I need from the Scriptures and from faithful and godly men who teach the Scriptures"

They have not put there faith in someone who could be referred to as "Him". There faith is clear, according to their own words, is in the Scriptures and those men (not a Him, but men) who they think are godly.

Now if we read the Bible we find that there was a problem where the Jews were searching the Scriptures thinking in them they had eternal life, instead of turning to Jesus Christ, the "Him" we are talking about.

Jn 5:39 You search the Scriptures because you think that in them … (note that the Scriptures are clearly referred to as 'them' not 'Him')… you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me; and you are unwilling to come to Me so that you may have life.

Now I have been telling people to seek Jesus Christ. He said He stands at the door and knocks and if anyone hears His voice and open the door to Him, He will come into them and eat with them and them with Him (Rev 3:20)

Yet I have run across some, not just one person but I have run across many, that write things like '"get all I need from the Scriptures", and that somehow the Scriptures ('them', is all God has to say to us today). If that is not searching the Scriptures because they think that in them they get eternal life instead of seeking Him, that Rick Joyner claims to know (whether he does or not, that is his testimony - that Him, Jesus Christ can be heard from in his visions).

So no wonder a person doesn't like Rick Joyner. He points the to 'Him" Jesus Christ, when they are unwilling to come to Him so they my have life.

The real question that comes to me and amazes me is; "Why?"

Why, when I and others point them to Jesus Christ are they not at least willing to seek Him????

Honestly, a person can not seriously read the bible and not see the verses I quoted above. Jn 3:16 was the first verse I memorized, and that because I was require to do as a kid taken to church. I didn't even know "Him" at the time, but I knew from the Bible that our faith was supposed to be in "Him"!!

So, it can't be that they don't know but it has to be that they seriously "reject" Him!!

But why? Is it just that they can't find the faith in them to actually seek Him?

Is 30:9 For this is a rebellious people, false sons, Sons who refuse to listen to the instructions of the Lord; Who say to the seers "You must not see visions";

Oh my - there it is - right in the Bible. The Bible has the answer - they are rebellious people, false sons, Sons who refuse to listen to the instructions of the Lord; Who say to the seers "You must not see visions".

So they are rebellious. Maybe they don't realize it? But they read the Bible and the sacred and Holy Writings do explain this. They even explain that those type of people tell 'seers, "You must not see visions.' Well, visions are what Rick Joyner is writing about in his books. Before I knew the Lord I never concerned myself with whether someone wrote down some vision they had. So even if I didn't believe it, I would never have made a big deal about it. Oh, but some do. They get intent on this subject.

To them I write, 'you need to seek the Lord and ask Him about it.' Yet they write back explaining that their faith is in the Scriptures, and that the Scriptures has all that God has to say to them. But they don't see that by stating that, they have clearly stated the do not believe in Jesus Christ. They don't believe that He (as in Him) can or does give people vision today. Those seers, must not see visions.

There is a problem, isn't there. They say they believe the Scriptuers, but they don't even believe what was written in the Scriptures, because the don't believe in Him. The refuse to listen to the instructions of the Lord - they say to seears, "You must not see visions.

Of course that is not something new. Jesus explained it and it is recorded in the very Scriptures they have put their faith in.

Jn 5:46,47 For if you believed Moses, you would believe Me. But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe My words?

That was said by Jesus to a people who studied the writings of Moses. Indeed, to the very people Jesus said were searching the Scriptures thinking in them they had eternal life, instead of coming to Him. They too had put their faith in the Scriptures, but they really didn't believe the Scriptures or they would have believed the Lord's words!

And note: that verse indicates clearly that the Lord's word are not the Scriptures!!!!

Yes, the Lord spoke to those who wrote the Scriptures and they wrote them down. But they are not the Lord's specific words to you, they were spoken to those men who indeed heard directly from the Lord, and those words are a testimony to you that the Christ can be heard from, but some (as Isaiah put it)

"refuse to listen to the instructions of the Lord"

DennisTate · Oct 1, 2019

K2K said:
Have you not read that their are more with us than against us???

It amazes me that those who cry "Bible, Bible, Bible" often don't know what the Bible says.

There is a story in the Old testament about a prophet and a man standing next to him. The man next to him is terrified because he see this massive army around them, but the prophet is amazed an wonders why that man can't see that their are more with them than against them. He prayed that the eyes of that man would be opened. That isn't what we are talking about here is it?

Again, it is written; with their eyes they don't see and with their ears they don't hear!

The enemy does exist, but if you are not aware that there are more with you, isn't it because you just are not seeing what is going on. In the vision that Rick Joyner gets and he testifies to, there indeed is an enemy, but also those with him that he see also. We don't fear the enemy, we fear God, and if for no other reason than there are more angelic beings than demonic beings. So seek the Lord for yourself and you will come to know what a godly man looks like. He looks like the prophet who knew there was an enemy but there were more with him than against him.

My friends - if you don't know the Lord you don't have understanding!! Yes, we battle with the powers, principalities, and dark forces in this world. Yet if you have eyes to see you will see the angels descending and ascending on Jesus Christ. You will know of them, because if you dwell in his winds those angels watch over you. You will know of them, because they are all ministering spirit sent by the Lord to those who will inherit salvation - which might explain why some know of the ministering angels sent by the Lord and others just don't have a clue. Jesus told his disciple that he would see the angels ascending and descending on him. Jacob saw the ladder with them coming and going. Daniel saw the angel with the Lord. Isaiah saw the host of heaven around the throne. But the Pharisees thought Jesus Christ had a demon. So what is your walk like?

Are you like the Pharisees who think even the righteous have a demon? Are you against those seeing and testifying about the visions the Lord Jesus Christ gives them, and saying that God has said all He was going to say to us in the Bible. Jesus told the Pharisees, "Why do you not understand what I am saying. It is because you can't hear my voice." (Jn 8:43)

The good news is that all who seek find. Jesus made that clear then. So even those Pharisees, if they repented of thinking their ways are right, and indeed truthfully had started seeking the Lord and truly accepted the testimony of Jesus Christ provided in the Bible, they would come to actually have know Him, the King of kings, the Lord or lords, the One who commands the angels in heaven. And they would have come to know what the prophet of God knew - that there are more with you than against you!!l

There are more angels in the Kingdom of God than there are demons. And the Kingdom of God is in your midst. So if you come to know the King or kings, then soon the angels He sends to minister to you also. But first the King, Jesus Christ, because He is the door, and nobody gets in expect through Him. But if you know Him you will go in and out, or have you not read about that also?

Exactly..... I have several Christian friends who are amazingly gifted and they sure are given helpful insights in difficult situations.

Heart2Soul · Oct 2, 2019

DennisTate said:
Exactly..... I have several Christian friends who are amazingly gifted and they sure are given helpful insights in difficult situations.

Good word! Only one third of the angels were cast down...that leaves two thirds on our side!

DennisTate · Oct 2, 2019

Heart2Soul said:
Good word! Only one third of the angels were cast down...that leaves two thirds on our side!

I have an extremely strange testimony........ I suppose I could put it on the Spiritual Gifts forum perhaps?????

Here are some clues on how weird it is:

My conversation with the Rabbi.....

S010 · Oct 3, 2019

There were a lot of posts I did not read thoroughly in this thread. Just wondering if anyone mentioned "Pilgrim's Progress, by John Bunyan" It's very similar to Joyner's book and has blessed many.

DennisTate · Oct 3, 2019

S010 said:
There were a lot of posts I did not read thoroughly in this thread. Just wondering if anyone mentioned "Pilgrim's Progress, by John Bunyan" It's very similar to Joyner's book and has blessed many.

I' ve heard of it... and happened to find a copy... but I found that it was written in a style that was difficult for me to get into...

S010 · Oct 3, 2019

AFAIK There are multiple editions. The book was written by John Bunyan while he was in prison for his faith in the 1600's and is based on a dream(s). It is considered the second most influential book after the bible and is translated in around 200 languages.

I read "The Final Quest" shortly after I gave my life to JESUS around 16 years ago on recommendation from a local youth pastor after sharing some of the visions GOD gave me. The pastor did not know how to respond but had just finished reading Rick's book so he loaned me a copy. These are the only 2 books I've read in the last 16 years apart from the bible.

Here's an audio version of Pilgrim's Progress with scripture references and easier to understand english.

DennisTate · Nov 8, 2019

S010 said:
AFAIK There are multiple editions. The book was written by John Bunyan while he was in prison for his faith in the 1600's and is based on a dream(s). It is considered the second most influential book after the bible and is translated in around 200 languages.

I read "The Final Quest" shortly after I gave my life to JESUS around 16 years ago on recommendation from a local youth pastor after sharing some of the visions GOD gave me. The pastor did not know how to respond but had just finished reading Rick's book so he loaned me a copy. These are the only 2 books I've read in the last 16 years apart from the bible.

Here's an audio version of Pilgrim's Progress with scripture references and easier to understand english.

Thank you.... I shall have to give this a listen soon ......

Brian Mcnamee · Dec 9, 2019

DennisTate said:
I am amazed by all the many great spiritual lessons illustrated in this fascinating book.

I listened to it four or five times last week when I was too tired to read.... and it was so encouraging.

Faith comes from hearing, hearing the word of God. the signs and wonders in Rick Joyner"s church are exactly like the manifestations in Kundalini yoga.

advance to 38 minutes if you do not have time to see the whole thing.

yeshuaslavejeff · Dec 9, 2019

The Call by Pastor Rick Joyner?

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simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

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