Baptism

yeshuaslavejeff

simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua
Jan 6, 2005
39,944
11,098
okie
✟214,996.00
Faith
Anabaptist
Someone brought a point to my attention which I thought was quite interesting. Consider the moment God the Father chose to communicate His pleasure with His Son (Matthew 3). It's the only time I am aware of that He did this, and I wonder why it might not have happened at some other time, like at some point after His resurrection, for example. Or even at His ascension perhaps, when His ministry had reached fulfillment and He returned His heavenly throne. Is there significance in the fact that God the Father revealed Himself in this way at the moment Christ was baptized? Should that inform us about anything regarding the significance God places on baptism, or our obedience unto the same, especially in light of what the rest of the NT reveals on the subject?

Not something I had put much thought into until recently. Interested in others thoughts.
Yahuweh Knew All Along Perfectly , as also Yahushua His Son Knew all along perfectly,
all that would occur. They eternally, always, are "echad", one, and the Son Always Knew the Father's Glory and What His Good Pleasure Entailed Completely.

That which happened, as planned, and is written, as planned, is for our benefit, (or judgment for those who disobey or reject Jesus' Way), and is pure and wise and good and true for teaching, edifying, building up in Christ Jesus, and perhaps for tearing down strongholds of the enemy (false teachings/ practices, lies) ....

Seek the Father, and Do His Word - this is the family, the brothers and sisters and mother, everywhere, of Jesus, as Jesus Himself Says/ as written.
 
Upvote 0

ViaCrucis

Confessional Lutheran
Oct 2, 2011
37,339
26,780
Pacific Northwest
✟728,053.00
Country
United States
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
US-Others
Baptism is definitely misunderstood. The Bible seems to contradict itself on baptism but we know Jesus is not the author of confusion.

It doesn't though. The Bible is actually pretty clear on the subject. What is confusing and contradictory are certain theologies which do not align with the rather plain statements which Scripture make.

Scripture isn't always very clear, sometimes Scripture is confusing, even presenting paradoxes. But on the subject of Baptism, it's straightforward. The Bible says what Baptism is, what Baptism is for, and what Baptism does.

What I see here on CF is people are unsure what Holy Spirit baptism is and if they get that while being dunked in a pool at church. The answer is no, baptism is a Holy Spirit gift.

You're right, there are lots of people who are unsure what baptism with the Holy Spirit is. Because they make up their own definitions for it, and completely ignore anything the Bible says.

So here's a challenge for you: Read the Bible, look at where baptism with the Holy Spirit is mentioned. And I mean, where it is very explicitly mentioned.

You'll be pretty surprised I imagine that what the Bible means by "baptism with the Holy Spirit" isn't what you've been told it means.

-CryptoLutheran
 
  • Winner
Reactions: charsan
Upvote 0

112358

Well-Known Member
Mar 1, 2018
511
160
Southeast
✟43,977.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Yahuweh Knew All Along Perfectly , as also Yahushua His Son Knew all along perfectly,
all that would occur. They eternally, always, are "echad", one, and the Son Always Knew the Father's Glory and What His Good Pleasure Entailed Completely.
Yes, agreed.

That which happened, as planned, and is written, as planned, is for our benefit, (or judgment for those who disobey or reject Jesus' Way), and is pure and wise and good and true for teaching, edifying, building up in Christ Jesus, and perhaps for tearing down strongholds of the enemy (false teachings/ practices, lies) ....
And what does this particular event teach us?
 
Upvote 0

yeshuaslavejeff

simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua
Jan 6, 2005
39,944
11,098
okie
✟214,996.00
Faith
Anabaptist
Yes, agreed.

And what does this particular event teach us?
"us" ?
It teaches most people nothing at all.

For Yahuweh's Ekklesia, born again ones, called out and set apart by Yahuweh for Himself,
Yahuweh Himself "Reveals Salvation and everything concerning Salvation to little children" so we can KNOW....
 
Upvote 0

GodLovesCats

Well-Known Member
Mar 16, 2019
7,401
1,328
47
Florida
✟117,917.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
So here's a challenge for you: Read the Bible, look at where baptism with the Holy Spirit is mentioned. And I mean, where it is very explicitly mentioned.

You'll be pretty surprised I imagine that what the Bible means by "baptism with the Holy Spirit" isn't what you've been told it means.

Baptism of the Holy Spirit is on the list of 7 Holy Spirit gifts sent to the saved. I never used the word with (which produces a totally different meaning).
 
Upvote 0

112358

Well-Known Member
Mar 1, 2018
511
160
Southeast
✟43,977.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Baptism of the Holy Spirit is on the list of 7 Holy Spirit gifts sent to the saved. I never used the word with (which produces a totally different meaning).
Would you mind sharing the specific scripture(s) on which these statements are based? I have made the mistake of being presumptuous before and am trying not to be a repeat offender.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: Tigger45
Upvote 0

GodLovesCats

Well-Known Member
Mar 16, 2019
7,401
1,328
47
Florida
✟117,917.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
Believer baptism:

Acts 10:47 - "Surely no one can stand in the way of their being baptized with water. They have received the Holy Spirit just as we have."

Baptism with the Holy Spirit:

Luke 3:16 - John answered them all, "I baptize you with water. But one who is more powerful than I will come, the straps of whose sandals I am not worthy to untie. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.

Acts 11:16 - Then I remembered what the Lord had said: "John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit."
 
Upvote 0

112358

Well-Known Member
Mar 1, 2018
511
160
Southeast
✟43,977.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Believer baptism:

Acts 10:47 - "Surely no one can stand in the way of their being baptized with water. They have received the Holy Spirit just as we have."

Baptism with the Holy Spirit:

Luke 3:16 - John answered them all, "I baptize you with water. But one who is more powerful than I will come, the straps of whose sandals I am not worthy to untie. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.

Acts 11:16 - Then I remembered what the Lord had said: "John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit."
Thank you. And did you have a scripture(s) in mind regarding “the list of 7 Holy Spirit gifts sent to the saved”?
 
Upvote 0

112358

Well-Known Member
Mar 1, 2018
511
160
Southeast
✟43,977.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
"us" ?
It teaches most people nothing at all.

For Yahuweh's Ekklesia, born again ones, called out and set apart by Yahuweh for Himself,
Yahuweh Himself "Reveals Salvation and everything concerning Salvation to little children" so we can KNOW....
Ok, I see your point. What might it teach the sincere soul earnestly seeking the truth of God’s word who has not yet come to obey the Gospel? Anything?
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

ViaCrucis

Confessional Lutheran
Oct 2, 2011
37,339
26,780
Pacific Northwest
✟728,053.00
Country
United States
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
US-Others
Baptism of the Holy Spirit is on the list of 7 Holy Spirit gifts sent to the saved. I never used the word with (which produces a totally different meaning).

Which list of gifts mentions baptism of the Holy Spirit?

Are you referring to 1 Corinthians 12:4-13

"Now there are varieties of gifts, but the same Spirit; and there are varieties of service, but the same Lord; and there are varieties of activities, but it is the same God who empowers them all in everyone. To each is given the manifestation of the Spirit for the common good. For to one is given through the Spirit the utterance of wisdom, and to another the utterance of knowledge according to the same Spirit, to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healing by the one Spirit, to another the working of miracles, to another prophecy, to another the ability to distinguish between spirits, to another various kinds of tongues, to another the interpretation of tongues. All these are empowered by one and the same Spirit, who apportions to each one individually as he wills.

For just as the body is one and has many members, and all the members of the body, though many, are one body, so it is with Christ. For in one Spirit we were all baptized into one body—Jews or Greeks, slaves or free—and all were made to drink of one Spirit.
"

"καὶ γὰρ ἐν ἑνὶ πνεύματι ἡμεῖς πάντες εἰς ἓν σῶμα ἐβαπτίσθημεν εἴτε Ἰουδαῖοι εἴτε Ἕλληνες εἴτε δοῦλοι εἴτε ἐλεύθεροι καὶ πάντες εἰς ἓν πνεῦμα ἐποτίσθημεν" (verse 13)

"and for in one Spirit we all into one body were baptized whether Jews whether Greeks whether slaves whether freemen and all into one Spirit we received drink."

Because it doesn't mention baptism of or with the Holy Spirit. It says "in one Spirit we were all baptized into one body".

Since by Baptism we are baptized into the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Even as we read in other places that we have been baptized into Christ. For we were baptized in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. So here the Apostle says that we were baptized into one Spirit, since there is only one Spirit. Even as we were baptized into one Lord, since there is only one Lord. Even as we have been baptized into one Father, for there is one Father. As we read in St. Paul's letter to the Ephesians,

"There is one body and one Spirit—just as you were called to the one hope that belongs to your call— one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all." - Ephesians 4:4-6

-CryptoLutheran
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

112358

Well-Known Member
Mar 1, 2018
511
160
Southeast
✟43,977.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
I must be mixed up on that one. Baptism of the Holy Sprit is confusing.
It's really not. Those with their own agenda on the matter (not you) have made it so. Pretty much every place where water baptism is mentioned, especially in association with salvation, they cry "that's not water!", and they replace what is clearly water baptism with HS baptism to fit their "faith/grace alone" false doctrine. There Mark 16:16 remains. It says what it says.
 
Upvote 0

yeshuaslavejeff

simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua
Jan 6, 2005
39,944
11,098
okie
✟214,996.00
Faith
Anabaptist
I must be mixed up on that one. Baptism of the Holy Sprit is confusing.
Did you ever see over time a particular sports fanatic who really 'gets into' their most favorite sport and knows all there is to know about it - every player, every play, every piece of equipment, every rule, every public occurrence (good and bad), in other words they immerse themselves in watching and listening to and reading and learning everything about the sport they possibly can ?
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

yeshuaslavejeff

simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua
Jan 6, 2005
39,944
11,098
okie
✟214,996.00
Faith
Anabaptist
That has nothing to do with hte subject Yeshua.
It has everything to do with understanding something you said you did not understand.
"Being IMMERSED in something". The whole life devoted to, dedicated to, surrounded in and by who or what is honored. As Ekklesia are totally, our whole life in every way, immersed in Yahushua Hamashiach.

People see sports enthusiasts often 'immersed' in their sport for entertainment or for employment.
They RARELY see anyone immersed in Yahushua as written in His Word and shown by the lives of the first century Ekklesia/ Apostles and disciples/.
 
Upvote 0