Why high food prices are good for the poor.

OldWiseGuy · Oct 1, 2019

timewerx said:
We may have made a good lives for ourselves but being tough on others and we ourselves have not done our best to be selfless with our gifts, talents, skills, opportunities, resources, time for the sake of the Lord, we might account this to God one day.

Anything meaningful is out of our hands considering the sheer numbers and the problems we're dealing with. If those experts we are paying and that have the authority to address these problems are unable to be successful how can we as individuals? If I tried to help the poor with my ideas I would be arrested.

timewerx · Oct 1, 2019

OldWiseGuy said:
If those experts we are paying and that have the authority to address these problems are unable to be successful how can we as individuals? If I tried to help the poor with my ideas I would be arrested.

We may never solve these problems but what matters is we tried our best. There are other ways than helping the poor directly. We can be creative about it.

But it will always cost you something like free time, strength, or even money.

Anything meaningful is out of our hands considering the sheer numbers and the problems we're dealing with.

This is a very good (4 minute) illustration of the problem from a Christian perspective:

Be sure to watch to the end when the speaker gives the $100 price!

OldWiseGuy · Oct 1, 2019

timewerx said:
We may never solve these problems but what matters is we tried our best. There are other ways than helping the poor directly. We can be creative about it.

But it will always cost you something like free time, strength, or even money.

This is a very good (4 minute) illustration of the problem from a Christian perspective:

Be sure to watch to the end when the speaker gives the $100 price!

Wouldn't it better for the black kids to emulate the parents and grandparents of those white kids, who worked and sacrificed to put them in a position of advantage? What the video doesn't say is that those black kids are in the same economic situation that the parents and grandparents of those white kids were when they were starting to build family wealth and security and opportunity for their children. It is dishonest to equate them as the white kids are two or three generations of growth ahead of the black kids.

Also the video simply portrays in an interesting way what is already well known, but is an oversimplification of the problems that minorities face. It attempts to place the blame for minority failure on the success of white people while at the same time illustrating the weaknesses found in the minority culture.

The only equitable aspect is that it laid a guilt trip on both groups.

timewerx · Oct 1, 2019

OldWiseGuy said:
Wouldn't it better for the black kids to emulate the white kids rather than guilt trip everyone?

Better, if they can.

It worked for me. But then I never had to deal with gangs, dysfunctional family, and poverty while growing up.

I don't think it's fair to have the same expectations from them.

Have you read these verses?

Matthew 7:1-2
Do not judge, or you too will be judged. 2 For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.

If you're expecting the poor to succeed in life against all odds.....Are you also doing your best to help the least of our brothers and sisters, working for the Lord's cause against all odds, even at the expense of your own family?

OldWiseGuy · Oct 1, 2019

timewerx said:
It worked for me. But then I never had to deal with gangs, dysfunctional family, and poverty while growing up.

Nor did I, so I have no personal basis to understand their problems.

timewerx said:
I don't think it's fair to have the same expectations from them.

I don't.

timewerx said:
Have you read these verses?

Matthew 7:1-2
Do not judge, or you too will be judged. 2 For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.

Don't mistake discernment for condemnation.

timewerx said:
If you're expecting the poor to succeed in life against all odds.....Are you also doing your best to help the least of our brothers and sisters, working for the Lord's cause against all odds, even at the expense of your own family?

Individuals can nibble around the edges but in todays world only the government can provide the support structures needed to address these problems. Of course it takes a willingness on their part to adopt effective policies. Too often the good one agency might do is sabotaged by another. The criminal justice system for example turns out thousands of people that become poor or homeless that should remain in prison for much longer periods of time.

Seriously mentally ill people should also be institutionalized for longer periods as well.

These two groups alone insure that there aren't enough resources to be effective.

Most people of 'good will' aren't aware of the problems these people cause to the greater community and thus resist these down-to-earth remedies.

timewerx · Oct 2, 2019

OldWiseGuy said:
Individuals can nibble around the edges but in todays world only the government can provide the support structures needed to address these problems. Of course it takes a willingness on their part to adopt effective policies. Too often the good one agency might do is sabotaged by another. The criminal justice system for example turns out thousands of people that become poor or homeless that should remain in prison for much longer periods of time.

It's too bad, many honest and dependable Christians who has been given many opportunities shy away from politics.

And there's nothing in the Bible against pursuing a career in politics as long as you keep doing an honest job and remain a good steward. It's rather the opposite - many verses speak against running after an easy life.

OldWiseGuy · Oct 2, 2019

timewerx said:
It's too bad, many honest and dependable Christians who has been given many opportunities shy away from politics.

And there's nothing in the Bible against pursuing a career in politics as long as you keep doing an honest job and remain a good steward. It's rather the opposite - many verses speak against running after an easy life.

The government operates on expediency, not moral imperative. Too many disparate demands are placed on it. One problem government faces is an uncooperative public. With just a little help they could deal with most of our problems handily. Of course the biggest problem in government is that everyone wants to be reelected, mainly by not offending anyone. You can't solve problems without goring someone's ox. So there's built-in gridlock. No one wants to cast the first stone.

In view of this I don't think an honest Christian would seek, or be elected to, a second term.

timewerx · Oct 2, 2019

OldWiseGuy said:
Of course the biggest problem in government is that everyone wants to be reelected, mainly by not offending anyone. You can't solve problems without goring someone's ox.

I get what you're saying, but then there's so few of good people in power. There's creative ways around that problem. Of course, without breaking laws and without breaking our moral principles.

Dave-W · Oct 2, 2019

timewerx said:
It's too bad, many honest and dependable Christians who has been given many opportunities shy away from politics.

Since at least the 1970s, "honest and dependable Christians" have been taught from the pulpits of many evangelical and fundamental churches that politics is evil and we should stay FAR AWAY.

OldWiseGuy · Oct 2, 2019

Dave-W said:
Since at least the 1970s, "honest and dependable Christians" have been taught from the pulpits of many evangelical and fundamental churches that politics is evil and we should stay FAR AWAY.

There's that darn old 1st Amendment (and the interpretations thereof).

OldWiseGuy · Oct 2, 2019

timewerx said:
I get what you're saying, but then there's so few of good people in power. There's creative ways around that problem. Of course, without breaking laws and without breaking our moral principles.

Without access to the Treasury?

I think NGO's are doing a pretty good job considering.

timewerx · Oct 2, 2019

Dave-W said:
Since at least the 1970s, "honest and dependable Christians" have been taught from the pulpits of many evangelical and fundamental churches that politics is evil and we should stay FAR AWAY.

It's also evil doing nothing. And Ironically, that answers the question why politics is evil. Because "good" people don't do anything about it. Fish and golf in the weekends, that's as much they care about.

OldWiseGuy · Oct 2, 2019

timewerx said:
It's also evil doing nothing. And Ironically, that answers the question why politics is evil. Because "good" people don't do anything about it. Fish and golf in the weekends, that's as much they care about.

Wage earners already support government efforts through their taxes. We also donate to many NGO's, many of which also receive government assistance. The private sector is a very significant part of charitable efforts here, even without mandates and government oversight (the only real oversight being to validate their tax-exempt status).

I admit to being emotionally influenced by the needs of special groups, thus organizations like Smile Train, Doctors Without Borders, and St. Jude, are at the top of my list of charities. Those that aid the 'able bodied poor' are near the bottom, just ahead of Trees For Tomorrow, and The Arbor Day Foundation.

timewerx · Oct 2, 2019

OldWiseGuy said:
Wage earners already support government efforts through their taxes. We also donate to many NGO's, many of which also receive government assistance. The private sector is a very significant part of charitable efforts here, even without mandates and government oversight (the only real oversight being to validate their tax-exempt status).

I admit to being emotionally influenced by the needs of special groups, thus organizations like Smile Train, Doctors Without Borders, and St. Jude, are at the top of my list of charities. Those that aid the 'able bodied poor' are near the bottom, just ahead of Trees For Tomorrow, and The Arbor Day Foundation.

That's good but not usually enough.

I'm talking bigger, way bigger. There's lots of huge holes in military spending on top of incredibly expensive contracts that doesn't bring results. Many billions / trillions of dollars of taxpayers money wasted. A huge sum of money that could have made a huge difference.

Now many of these politicians come from the ranks of the Armed forces. The sector many good Christians also shy away from.

Lots of bad propaganda being spread around to keep the good people away from places they could matter and tons of worldly distractions on top of that.

OldWiseGuy · Oct 2, 2019

timewerx said:
That's good but not usually enough.

I'm talking bigger, way bigger. There's lots of huge holes in military spending on top of incredibly expensive contracts that doesn't bring results. Many billions / trillions of dollars of taxpayers money wasted. A huge sum of money that could have made a huge difference.

Now many of these politicians come from the ranks of the Armed forces. The sector many good Christians also shy away from.

Lots of bad propaganda being spread around to keep the good people away from places they could matter and tons of worldly distractions on top of that.

The whole social order is falling apart. There is little hope for solutions short of the return of Christ.

timewerx · Oct 2, 2019

OldWiseGuy said:
The problem is the government mismanagement of the problems of the poor, not the military budget.

Allocation of funds.

Actually, this is similar to your OP about food.

Maybe if there's significant budget cuts to the military, the sector would be forced to get wise about spending and instill efficiency and practicality in their methods, including their private contractors.

Not really sacrificing defense capabilities, just getting wiser about it. And a trillion dollars must make a dent.

OldWiseGuy · Oct 2, 2019

timewerx said:
Allocation of funds.

Actually, this is similar to your OP about food.

Maybe if there's significant budget cuts to the military, the sector would be forced to get wise about spending and instill efficiency and practicality in their methods, including their private contractors.

Not really sacrificing defense capabilities, just getting wiser about it. And a trillion dollars must make a dent.

I agree, but it's not going to happen. The poor will just have to keep tightening up their belt.

One big problem with dealing with the poor is that no matter how much we spend we don't seem to make any progress, unless you call bloated bureaucracies a success.

timewerx · Oct 2, 2019

OldWiseGuy said:
I agree, but it's not going to happen. The poor will just have to keep tightening up their belt.

One big problem with dealing with the poor is that no matter how much we spend we don't seem to make any progress, unless you call bloated bureaucracies a success.

Some countries have managed to eliminate poverty.

Sure, they still have drug addiction problems, and many jobless living entirely on gov't assistance but conditions are a lot less desperate and a lot better.

For instance, crime rates are lot less and prostitution is almost nonexistent (that's a very good thing). Politics is a lot nicer and corruption is negligible or doesn't exist. They spend significantly less on the military though and higher tax rates to the rich. About the opposite of how things are done in USA....

They do have a lots of good people in power. They have clean politics. Strange huh?

I do understand USA's great need to constantly keep an edge on its defense / military capabilities. It just needs to start doing things wisely and probably reconsider some of their principles in terms of "playing it safe" or start considering ideas that are real game changers for once with huge ROI.

Problem is when politics get in the way and great ideas are turned aside for the love of money.... That is to be expected if we don't have enough good people in power.

Don't buy into the propaganda that good people should avoid positions of influence. It's probably true...Power corrupts....BUT BUT BUT it could also be the enemy talking to keep us weak and insignificant in this world.

OldWiseGuy · Oct 3, 2019

timewerx said:
Some countries have managed to eliminate poverty.

You'll find that many of those countries are awash in trade surplus American dollars, and are under the protective umbrella of our military.

timewerx · Oct 3, 2019

OldWiseGuy said:
You'll find that many of those countries are awash in trade surplus American dollars, and are under the protective umbrella of our military.

That's why I said previously I understand America's need to keep its military capabilities up to date.

It's also the sector where huge amounts of money are wasted for inferior results. Money that could have been saved if things are done right.

Why high food prices are good for the poor.

Wake me when it's soup.

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Wake me when it's soup.

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Wake me when it's soup.

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Welcoming grandchild #7, Arturus Waggoner!

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Wake me when it's soup.

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Wake me when it's soup.

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Wake me when it's soup.

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Wake me when it's soup.

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Wake me when it's soup.

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