Baptism

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Before anyone, especially the moderators, accuse me of promoting the Oneness view over the Trintarian view - I am not.

The OP asked the question, "Do you believe baptism should be performed only in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit?"

By highlighting the word only the OP was saying in effect that all other formulas were unacceptable (i.e. heretical).

I pointed out that the disciples baptized in the name of Jesus in spite of the words of the Lord. This indicates to me that they might have understood something more about the incarnation of the Father and the Holy Spirit that many others here do.

Most people who object to the formula used by Oneness proponents present a false picture of what they believe.

I'm merely pointing out that they are not promoting Arienism or full on modalism or Sebelianism or some other heresy as is often charged - but merely trying to understand these things in what they consider a more biblical manner than do Trinity proponents - namely that the "Son" was begotten at the incarnation as the scriptures say rather than eternally as the Nicene Creed insists we believe.

I.e. - Baptizing with the words "in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit" is not the "only" acceptable formula to use. The one used by the apostles is also acceptable and indeed that many insist that it is more proper than the former formulation may have some validity.

I'm (reluctantly) OK with the insistence in the Forum that all posts be coming from a Trinity based belief system (as mine are). But then it would best if they didn't allow O.P.s which require that people address the question of the Trinity as this one does.
There's no actual "formula". Being baptised in the name of Jesus is the act of identifying with His death and resurrection. Being baptised in the name of Jesus is equivalent to being baptised in the name of the Father and the Holy Spirit, because they are all in unity with each other.

I know that the Oneness folk insist on people being baptised in the name of Jesus and not in any other name, because they believe that there is no Father or Holy Spirit, only Jesus. They require anyone already baptised in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit to be re-baptised in the name of Jesus in order to be saved. That is their false gospel which puts them under the curse of God.
 
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GodLovesCats

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What does the Bible say about man's "reason" of the flesh? Hint: the heart of man is deceitful more than anything else and his mind is in darkness in the flesh - i.e. not helpful.

Yahuweh's Reason is LIGHT ENTIRELY HELPFUL, and is as high above man's as heaven is above the earth.

You are totally off topic here. That has absolutely nothing to do with baptism. So I wll not talk to you in a thread about baptism anymore.
 
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On the day of Pentecost the apostles did not utter some unintelligible gibberish that someone else "interpreted" for them. When they spoke, each person in the audience heard their voice simultaneously in his own native language. That's a whole different ball game than what most who claim to speak in tongues are doing.
I didn't think this thread was set up to flame Pentecostals who pray in tongues. Maybe you should acquaint yourself with the forum rules about flaming and demeaning the particular faith of others.
 
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GodLovesCats

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I didn't think this thread was set up to flame Pentecostals who pray in tongues. Maybe you should acquaint yourself with the forum rules about flaming and demeaning the particular faith of others.

It definitely was not. I recommend to the people who do not understand Pentecostalism they also acquaint themselves with the denomination.
 
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JM

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Element: Do you believe baptism should be performed only with water?

Yes

Formula: Do you believe baptism should be performed only in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit?

Yes

Mode: Do you believe baptism should be performed only by immersion?

Well, that's what baptism means so, yes.

Recipient: Do you believe baptism should be performed only to believers?

To only those who confess faith, there's no way of knowing who actually believes, so in a way Yes. We baptize on the profession of faith not on some gnostic idea of knowing they are the elect.

And finally, do you believe baptism should be performed only by an ordained minister?

Yes, ordained Elders.
 
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112358

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I didn't think this thread was set up to flame Pentecostals who pray in tongues. Maybe you should acquaint yourself with the forum rules about flaming and demeaning the particular faith of others.
Sorry the comment wasn’t intended to be offensive, demeaning, or flaming. I was only trying to make a point about HS baptism. My personal beliefs aside, surely we can agree that there are those who abuse certain aspects of the faith in all denominations.

In any case, please accept my apologies for the way I worded the comment. It could have been more sensitive.
 
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Albion

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Despite 1Peter 3:21, which I confess I do not fully understand in light of the rest of NT teachings, I don't see baptism as an essential to salvation (see the thief on the cross).
The truth is that hardly anyone does.

I see no basis for calling a sprinkling or pouring baptism invalid if the one baptized is a believer.
Still opposed to baptizing children, then??
 
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Not David

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Please explain how this is related to baptism.
It can go both ways:
1) Because since babies cannot profess their faith they are not technically members of the Church.
2) You would believe baptism is just symbolic instead of giving grace to the believer.
 
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Albion

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Babies can't profess their faith because they don't have it. Obivously no babies are believers.
I wonder how many baptised adults actually understand the nature of God, sin, repentance, faith, etc. It's shockingly few.

But you know what?--hardly any pastor who, although refusing to baptize a child, ever makes sure that these adults do!

No, it's considered sufficient for them merely to say they do. How is that any better than an infant?.
 
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Albion

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Have you ever met someone who does not believe Jesus is our Lord and Savior and says he/she does and wants to be baptized while lacking the faith?
I have met a number who were baptized merely because they thought it was how you get to be a member of some church's congregation. Or thought it was basically an initiation ceremony and nothing more than that. Or went through the motions because a relative wanted them to be "a Christian."
 
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GodLovesCats

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I have met a number who were baptized merely because they thought it was how you get to be a member of some church's congregation. Or thought it was basically an initiation ceremony and nothing more than that. Or went through the motions because a relative wanted them to be "a Christian."

The same is true for babies. Parents just go through the motions when they get their infants baptized.
 
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iLearn

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Are you saying that it is not considered to be part of the Bible in your household?
At least for me. The original verse for Matthew 28:19 is "Go and make disciples of all nations in My name". This can be confirmed from the writings of Eusebius. Nothing about water baptism at all.

And also according to Zac Poonen, one should never create a doctrine out of the book of Acts, because it is only a historical book. IMO, if one wants to make a new doctrine use only the 4 gospels of Mark, Luke, Matthew and John.
 
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Not necessarily.
They may know something experientially with the Father and with the Son that others do not yet know.....
There will be many in hell who will know that!
 
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Sorry the comment wasn’t intended to be offensive, demeaning, or flaming. I was only trying to make a point about HS baptism. My personal beliefs aside, surely we can agree that there are those who abuse certain aspects of the faith in all denominations.

In any case, please accept my apologies for the way I worded the comment. It could have been more sensitive.
Fair enough. You are forgiven. You have every right to your personal beliefs, and speaking in tongues is definitely not essential for salvation or effective development in sanctification. If we look at tongues in prayer as a tool that an intercessor can use so he can pray in the Spirit, in the same way that a woodworker uses a plane to smooth out a piece of wood, then we see that different people use different tools to get the job they want done. A mechanic will not use a woodworking plane, and a woodworker will not use a plumber's pipe wrench. Tongues is a valuable prayer tool for me and I use the facility based on my faith, and I will be more than happy to explain it to anyone who feels that it is God's will for them; but there is no value in forcing it on to anyone who doesn't.
 
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