LDS The strange eternal consequences of Polygamy and Polyamory

I have known many people in relationships of this nature. Men initiate or request to open the relationship to others over 95% of the time. The lone instances where a woman takes the lead are in homosexual pairings or if she’s acting on behalf of her companion. They undergo immense emotional and psychological strain over time. Some learn to cope and others deaden themselves to make it work.

The ideal for most is a single woman. They are commonly referred to as unicorns and expected to embrace both in a joined or separate household. Some create a hierarchy where the wife is given authority over others. In these scenarios she’s considered the alpha. The other option is a flat structure where all have equal status.

Insecurity and passive aggressiveness are common downsides of relating this way. Some women have sought others like themselves on the Internet. But in many cases, sharing has taken something away and created a fracture within them that rarely heals without acceptance or separation.

I have never encountered a woman who undertook this willingly and didn’t struggle with the vetting (which some men expect her to do) and the challenges of getting their needs met as the number grows. Most are responsible for working out differences and keeping the peace. The facade many wear hides an ugly truth.

The truth of Polygamy can be found easily in the bible. The bible started as monogamy with Adam and Eve:

Genesis 2:24

24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.

As we all can read, polygamy somehow got into the picture. But Jesus made it known his law in the New Testament:

Luke 16:18

18 Anyone who divorces his wife and marries another woman commits adultery, and the man who marries a divorced woman commits adultery.

Monogamy is further required for any that lead in the church of Jesus the Christ:

1 Timothy 3:2

2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;

I've been married to the same woman in a monogamous relationship for 22 years and never practiced polygamy. I've known Mormon and non-mormon who have practiced plural marriage (wives). It is a stressful life and two of the men practicing such that I knew have passed on. YHVH (God of Abraham Isaac and Jacob and scripture) had two wives, Israel and Judah and he divorced Israel (that Christ could remarry her after he died according to the law of Moses there had to be a death to be eligible for remarriage and thus Christ resurrected and remarried the lost 10 tribes of Israel that had scattered to Europe after the Assyrian captivity and deportation circa 721 BC. The apostle Paul preached to fertile hearts and ground as Christ came seeking the lost sheep of the House of Israel as his ministry mission... remember Paul tried to E. to India but was directed instead to NW Europe) But back to topic..... Timothy 3:2 actually directly implies plural marriage was practiced. Do the math on the 400 year exile/captivity to the children of Israel and their near 430 year sojourn in Egypt (and how many came out at the time of Moses, remember they started as 70 which numerically symbolizes restoration) as well as archeology and it will confirm without a doubt that polygamy was practiced. I find it interesting that Islam can practice polygamy and gets a free pass (they took London in about 20 years this way) and White Christians are called out immediately for such practice. The kingdom age also prophesied of polygamy IMHO...Isaiah 4:1 "And in that day seven women shall take hold of one man, saying, We will eat our own bread, and wear our own apparel: only let us be called by thy name, to take away our reproach." When the church accepts Gay marriage, sodomy, transvestites but rejects children and families and building the kingdom with more babies then something is amiss. I also encourage study on the concepts of the male headship and covering even as Christ is the covering for the church. The patriarchs in their polygamous marriages actually are symbolic of the atomic model and the elements even at the smallest fractal examples. Confirmation exists from the natural to the spiritual.

Pilgrim Making Progress said:

I've been married to the same woman in a monogamous relationship for 22 years and never practiced polygamy. I've known Mormon and non-mormon who have practiced plural marriage (wives). It is a stressful life and two of the men practicing such that I knew have passed on. YHVH (God of Abraham Isaac and Jacob and scripture) had two wives, Israel and Judah and he divorced Israel (that Christ could remarry her after he died according to the law of Moses there had to be a death to be eligible for remarriage and thus Christ resurrected and remarried the lost 10 tribes of Israel that had scattered to Europe after the Assyrian captivity and deportation circa 721 BC. The apostle Paul preached to fertile hearts and ground as Christ came seeking the lost sheep of the House of Israel as his ministry mission... remember Paul tried to E. to India but was directed instead to NW Europe) But back to topic..... Timothy 3:2 actually directly implies plural marriage was practiced. Do the math on the 400 year exile/captivity to the children of Israel and their near 430 year sojourn in Egypt (and how many came out at the time of Moses, remember they started as 70 which numerically symbolizes restoration) as well as archeology and it will confirm without a doubt that polygamy was practiced. I find it interesting that Islam can practice polygamy and gets a free pass (they took London in about 20 years this way) and White Christians are called out immediately for such practice. The kingdom age also prophesied of polygamy IMHO...Isaiah 4:1 "And in that day seven women shall take hold of one man, saying, We will eat our own bread, and wear our own apparel: only let us be called by thy name, to take away our reproach." When the church accepts Gay marriage, sodomy, transvestites but rejects children and families and building the kingdom with more babies then something is amiss. I also encourage study on the concepts of the male headship and covering even as Christ is the covering for the church. The patriarchs in their polygamous marriages actually are symbolic of the atomic model and the elements even at the smallest fractal examples. Confirmation exists from the natural to the spiritual.

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One of the more interesting posts I've seen. Thank you for your thoughts.

Ignatius the Kiwi said:

What made my response to your comments uninteresting?

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It had too many wrong statements and wrong assumptions. When you use words like 'cuckoldry" I know you are not interested in anything I say, you just want to expose what you think is a monstrous fallacy of Mormonism.

Your final statement was indicative of your overall expose attitude whether you get the facts right or wrong.

So no, I am not interested. We have talked before and you don't listen well. You have your agenda, and that is all you care about.

Pilgrim Making Progress said:

I've been married to the same woman in a monogamous relationship for 22 years and never practiced polygamy. I've known Mormon and non-mormon who have practiced plural marriage (wives). It is a stressful life and two of the men practicing such that I knew have passed on. YHVH (God of Abraham Isaac and Jacob and scripture) had two wives, Israel and Judah and he divorced Israel (that Christ could remarry her after he died according to the law of Moses there had to be a death to be eligible for remarriage and thus Christ resurrected and remarried the lost 10 tribes of Israel that had scattered to Europe after the Assyrian captivity and deportation circa 721 BC. The apostle Paul preached to fertile hearts and ground as Christ came seeking the lost sheep of the House of Israel as his ministry mission... remember Paul tried to E. to India but was directed instead to NW Europe) But back to topic..... Timothy 3:2 actually directly implies plural marriage was practiced. Do the math on the 400 year exile/captivity to the children of Israel and their near 430 year sojourn in Egypt (and how many came out at the time of Moses, remember they started as 70 which numerically symbolizes restoration) as well as archeology and it will confirm without a doubt that polygamy was practiced. I find it interesting that Islam can practice polygamy and gets a free pass (they took London in about 20 years this way) and White Christians are called out immediately for such practice. The kingdom age also prophesied of polygamy IMHO...Isaiah 4:1 "And in that day seven women shall take hold of one man, saying, We will eat our own bread, and wear our own apparel: only let us be called by thy name, to take away our reproach." When the church accepts Gay marriage, sodomy, transvestites but rejects children and families and building the kingdom with more babies then something is amiss. I also encourage study on the concepts of the male headship and covering even as Christ is the covering for the church. The patriarchs in their polygamous marriages actually are symbolic of the atomic model and the elements even at the smallest fractal examples. Confirmation exists from the natural to the spiritual.

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I have been married 45 years to the same woman, and am a card carrying member of the Church of Jesus Christ. So keep going you will eventually make it to 45. But 22 is a good start.

devin553344 said:

The truth of Polygamy can be found easily in the bible. The bible started as monogamy with Adam and Eve:

Genesis 2:24

24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.

As we all can read, polygamy somehow got into the picture. But Jesus made it known his law in the New Testament:

Luke 16:18

18 Anyone who divorces his wife and marries another woman commits adultery, and the man who marries a divorced woman commits adultery.

Monogamy is further required for any that lead in the church of Jesus the Christ:

1 Timothy 3:2

2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;

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It is interesting in your history you did not give any of the 20 plural marriage scriptures in the OT, where God allowed plural marriage to thrive and even wrote into the law of Moses statutes that pertained to plural marriage families.

So when you quote bible history, be a little more all inclusive, it will teach you better.

LaBèlla said:

I have known many people in relationships of this nature. Men initiate or request to open the relationship to others over 95% of the time. The lone instances where a woman takes the lead are in homosexual pairings or if she’s acting on behalf of her companion. They undergo immense emotional and psychological strain over time. Some learn to cope and others deaden themselves to make it work.

The ideal for most is a single woman. They are commonly referred to as unicorns and expected to embrace both in a joined or separate household. Some create a hierarchy where the wife is given authority over others. In these scenarios she’s considered the alpha. The other option is a flat structure where all have equal status.

Insecurity and passive aggressiveness are common downsides of relating this way. Some women have sought others like themselves on the Internet. But in many cases, sharing has taken something away and created a fracture within them that rarely heals without acceptance or separation.

I have never encountered a woman who undertook this willingly and didn’t struggle with the vetting (which some men expect her to do) and the challenges of getting their needs met as the number grows. Most are responsible for working out differences and keeping the peace. The facade many wear hides an ugly truth.

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Thanks Belle for the modern look at plural marriage and lesbian activity.

Peter1000 said:

Thanks Belle for the modern look at plural marriage and lesbian activity.

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You’re welcome. Most of the relationships I’ve encountered were heterosexual. Not lesbians. I’ve had intimate contact with both. Hence my comments.

LaBèlla said:

I have known many people in relationships of this nature. Men initiate or request to open the relationship to others over 95% of the time. The lone instances where a woman takes the lead are in homosexual pairings or if she’s acting on behalf of her companion. They undergo immense emotional and psychological strain over time. Some learn to cope and others deaden themselves to make it work.

The ideal for most is a single woman. They are commonly referred to as unicorns and expected to embrace both in a joined or separate household. Some create a hierarchy where the wife is given authority over others. In these scenarios she’s considered the alpha. The other option is a flat structure where all have equal status.

Insecurity and passive aggressiveness are common downsides of relating this way. Some women have sought others like themselves on the Internet. But in many cases, sharing has taken something away and created a fracture within them that rarely heals without acceptance or separation.

I have never encountered a woman who undertook this willingly and didn’t struggle with the vetting (which some men expect her to do) and the challenges of getting their needs met as the number grows. Most are responsible for working out differences and keeping the peace. The facade many wear hides an ugly truth.

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My Father in the Sextons had the flat structure for family.

Peter1000 said:

It is interesting in your history you did not give any of the 20 plural marriage scriptures in the OT, where God allowed plural marriage to thrive and even wrote into the law of Moses statutes that pertained to plural marriage families.

So when you quote bible history, be a little more all inclusive, it will teach you better.

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Deuteronomy 17:17 Good News Translation (GNT)
17 The king is not to have many wives, because this would make him turn away from the Lord; and he is not to make himself rich with silver and gold.

Daniel Marsh said:

Deuteronomy 17:17 Good News Translation (GNT)
17 The king is not to have many wives, because this would make him turn away from the Lord; and he is not to make himself rich with silver and gold.

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You still did not give any of the 20 scriptures that are positive for plural marriage, why would you not give all the information, so that intelligent people can come to an understanding?

Ignatius the Kiwi said:

How would you describe what Joseph did then? He spiritually married other men's wives so he could have their company In the next life while they are deprived of their one wife's company?

You haven't actually demonstrated I have understood anything wrong. You merely cannot accept my conclusions because they make Joseph Smith look bad.

If I am wrong explain how it is so. To me it's obvious that Joseph marrying faithful mormon men's wives is something Indefensible and it's no wonder you want to avoid talking about it.

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You would have JS not only marrying other Mormon men's wives for eternity and then have him sleeping with them when he wanted in this time. That did not happen. When he married a woman for eternity (you call it spiritually) their Mormon husbands were usually at the sealing and agreed with the marriage after death. Otherwise JS would have been killed by one of these men. In a marriage only for eternity, the woman lived with her husband through this life. The husband, if he stayed faithful, which they usually did, were promised that they too would have a wife or wives throughout eternity too.

There was a situation with one woman that JS married for eternity, but after he died, the woman did not want to live with her husband any more, and so BY took her into his family. Eventually, he did marry her for time on earth. It was a rare occasion that this happened, and did strain the practice as it became known. But again, JS did not sleep with women that he married just for eternity.

Since you do not believe in marriage after death anyway, why would you be so concerned about a man being deprived of their one wife's company. Besides, that faithful man will be given another or other wives that he will love throughout eternity.

Peter1000 said:

You still did not give any of the 20 scriptures that are positive for plural marriage, why would you not give all the information, so that intelligent people can come to an understanding?

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The texts you referred to are peoples' actions. That does not mean God approved of that.

So, lets look at the results of purl marriage in the Bible shall we.

Genesis 16:4 Abram slept with Hagar, and she became pregnant. When Hagar realized this, she became very proud and began to feel that she was better than Sarai her owner.

Genesis 16:11Then the angel of the Lord said, “Hagar, you are now pregnant, and you will have a son. You will name him Ishmael, because the Lord has heard that you were treated badly.

Hagar was never married to Abraham, and the union cause nothing but discord and strife.

1 Kings 11:1-6 Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)

11 King Solomon loved many foreign women, including the daughter of Pharaoh and women from Moab, Ammon, Edom, Sidon, and the Hittites. 2 In the past the Lord had said to the Israelites, “You must not marry people from other nations. If you do, they will cause you to follow their gods.” But Solomon fell in love with these women. 3 He had 700 wives who were the daughters of leaders from other nations. He also had 300 slave women who were like wives to him. His wives caused him to turn away from God. 4 When Solomon was old, his wives caused him to follow other gods, so he did not follow the Lord completely as his father David did. 5 Solomon worshiped Ashtoreth, the goddess of Sidon, and Milcom, the horrible god of the Ammonites. 6 So Solomon did what the Lord said was wrong. He did not follow the Lord completely as his father David did.

1. Lamech (a descendant of Cain) had two wives (Genesis 4:19).
2. Abraham had more than one wife (Genesis 16:3-4, 25:6 (some were called concubines)).
3. Nahor (Abraham’s brother) had both a wife and a concubine (Genesis 11:29, 22:20-24).
4. Jacob was tricked into polygamy (Genesis 29:20-30) and later received two additional wives bringing the grand total of four wives (Genesis 30:4, 9).
5. Esau took a third wife to please his father Isaac (Genesis 28:6-9).
6. Ashur had two wives (1 Chronicles 4:5).
7. Obadiah, Joel, Isshiah, and those with them had multiple wives (1 Chronicles 7:3-4).
8. Shaharaim had at least four wives, two of whom he “sent away” (1 Chronicles 8:8-11).
9. Caleb had two wives (1 Chronicles 2:18) and two concubines (1 Chronicles 2:46, 48).
10. Gideon had many wives (Judges 8:30).
11. Elkanah is recorded as having two wives, one of whom was the godly woman Hannah (1 Samuel 1:1-2, 8-2:10).
12. David had at least 8 wives and 10 concubines (1 Chronicles 1:1-9; 2 Samuel 6:23, 20:3).
13. Solomon had 700 wives and 300 concubines (1 Kings 11:1-6).
14. Rehoboam had eighteen wives and sixty concubines (2 Chronicles 11:21) and sought many wives for his sons (1 Chronicles 11:23).
15. Abijah had fourteen wives (2 Chronicles 13:21).
16. Ahab had more than one wife (1 Kings 20:7).
17. Jehoram had multiple wives (2 Chronicles 21:17).
18. Jehoiada the priest gave king Joash two wives (2 Chronicles 24:1-3).
19. Jehoiachin had more than one wife (2 Kings 24:15).

Above is the list, I know from experience that plural marriage always goes badly. Each of those that give details proves that plural marriage is a bad idea and it is never endorsed by God in the Bible.

The silence of God does not connote approval!!!!

Polygamy, whenever prominently dealt with in Scripture (i.e., mentioned more than just noted in passing), always spelled trouble with a capital T!

Consider some of the following internecine conflicts and tragedies:

Jacob had four wives whom he clearly loved unequally: Leah (whom he considered unattractive and felt himself “stuck with”), Rachel (his first love), Bilnah (Rachel’s maid), and Zilpah (Leah’s maid). Leah bore him six sons and a daughter: Reuben, Simeon, Levi, Judah, Issachar, Zebulan, and Dinah. Rachel was infertile for many years, but finally gave birth to Joseph and later Benjamin. Bilnah bore him Naphtali and Dan, while Zilpah bore him Gad and Asher.

All these sons by different mothers created tension, the greatest of which surrounded Joseph, whose brothers grew jealous and began to hate him, for their father, Jacob, favored Joseph as Rachel’s son. The brothers hatched a plot to kill Joseph, but due to a combination of their desire for monetary gain and the intervention of Reuben, he was instead sold into slavery. At the root of this sad story of this bitter conflict was a polygamous mess. The clear teaching (among others) is this: Don’t do polygamy.

Gideon had many wives and by them many sons. Scripture tells the story of violence and death that resulted from this situation, with the sons all competing for kingship and heritage.

Now Gideon had seventy sons, his direct descendants, for he had many wives. His concubine who lived in Shechem also bore him a son, whom he named Abimelech. At a good old age Gideon, son of Joash, died and was buried in the tomb of his father Joash in Ophrah of the Abiezrites. Abimelech, son of Jerubbaal (i.e., Gideon), went to his mother’s kinsmen in Shechem, and said to them and to the whole clan to which his mother’s family belonged, “Put this question to all the citizens of Shechem: ‘Which is better for you: that seventy men, or all Jerubbaal’s sons, rule over you, or that one man rule over you?’ You must remember that I am your own flesh and bone.” When his mother’s kin repeated these words to them on his behalf, all the citizens of Shechem sympathized with Abimelech, thinking, “He is our kinsman.” They also gave him seventy silver shekels from the temple of Baal of Berith, with which Abimelech hired shiftless men and ruffians as his followers. He then went to his ancestral house in Ophrah, and slew his brothers, the seventy sons of Jerubbaal (Gideon), on one stone. Only the youngest son of Jerubbaal, Jotham, escaped, for he was hidden (Judges 9:1-5).

At the heart of this murderous conflict was polygamy. The sons competed for kingship, power, and inheritance. They had little love for one another because they had different mothers. Abimelech’s loyalty was not to his half-brothers but to his mother and her clan; he did not hesitate to slaughter them to gain power.

Among other things evident in this terrible tale is that polygamy leads to chaos and hatred. The story is cautioning, “Don’t do polygamy.”

King David had at least eight wives (Michal, Abigail, Ahinoam, Eglah, Maacah, Abital, Haggith, and Bathsheba) and ten concubines. Trouble erupts in this “blended” (to put it mildly) family when Absalom (David’s third son, whose mother was Maacah) sought to move to the head of the line of succession. When his older brother Chileab died, only his half-brother Amnon stood in the way. The tension between these royal sons of different mothers grew intense. Amnon raped Absalom’s sister Tamar, and Absalom later had Amnon murdered for it (cf 2 Sam 13).

Absalom fled and over time nourished hatred for his father David, eventually waging a war against him in an attempt to overthrow his power. Absalom is killed in the war, and David can barely forgive himself for his role in his son’s death (2 Sam 18:33). The family intrigue wasn’t over, however.

David’s son Solomon (by Bathsheba, David’s last wife) would eventually become king but only through the machinations of his mother. As David lay dying, his oldest son Adonijah (by Haggith), who was the expected heir (1 Kings 2:15), was proclaimed king in a formal ceremony. Bathsheba conspired with Nathan the Prophet and deceived David into thinking that Adonijah was mounting a rebellion. She also reminded David of a secret promise he had once made to her that Solomon would one day be king. As a result, David intervened and sent word that Solomon would be king. Adonijah fled, returning only after Solomon assured his safety. Despite this he was later killed by Solomon.

What a messy situation! We have sons of different mothers hating one another, wives playing for favor and conspiring behind the scenes, and so forth. Once again, the implicit teaching is this: Don’t do polygamy.

Solomon, it is said, had 700 wives and 300 concubines. Again, nothing but trouble came from this. Scripture says,

King Solomon, however, loved many foreign women. … He had seven hundred wives of royal birth and three hundred concubines, and his wives led him astray. As Solomon grew old, his wives turned his heart after other gods, and his heart was not fully devoted to the Lord his God, as the heart of David his father had been. He followed Ashtoreth the goddess of the Sidonians, and Molech the detestable god of the Ammonites. So Solomon did evil in the eyes of the Lord (1 Kings 11:1-6).

The tolerance of pagan religious practices encouraged by these wives, along with other policies, led to great hostility and division in the kingdom. After Solomon’s death, the northern kingdom of Israel seceded from Judah. They were never reunited, and both kingdoms were eventually destroyed by surrounding nations.

Lurking in the mix of this mess is polygamy and this lesson: Don’t do polygamy.

Abraham’s sexual relations with his wife Sarah’s maid, Hagar, while a case of adultery rather than polygamy, also led to serious trouble. Although Hagar became pregnant with Ishmael at Sarah’s behest, Sarah grew jealous and mistreated her, causing her to flee (Gen 16). Hagar eventually returned and gave birth to Ishmael. Later, when Sarah finally bore a child (Isaac), she decided that Ishmael was a threat and had Abraham drive him and Hagar away (Gen 21).

Ishmael went on to become the patriarch of what we largely call the Arab nations; Isaac’s line would be the Jewish people. The rest, as they say, is history.

Once again, polygamy is lurking behind a whole host of problems. Don’t do polygamy.

So, the Bible does teach on polygamy. Through stories, we learn of its problematic nature. We ought not to be overly simplistic and conclude that polygamy was the only problem or that such tragedies never occur in other settings, but it clearly played a strong role.

It would seem that in the Old Testament God tolerates polygamy, as he does divorce, but nowhere does He approve of it.

In Matthew’s Gospel, Jesus signals a return to God’s original plan and excludes divorce.

Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard. But it was not this way from the beginning. I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, unless the marriage is unlawful, and marries another woman commits adultery (Matt 19:8-9).

http://blog.adw.org/2019/07/problems-produced-polygamy-patriarchs/

Peter1000 said:

You would have JS not only marrying other Mormon men's wives for eternity and then have him sleeping with them when he wanted in this time. That did not happen. When he married a woman for eternity (you call it spiritually) their Mormon husbands were usually at the sealing and agreed with the marriage after death. ...

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It is well documented that did in fact happen.