Where is the biblical proof for a private prayer language in tongues?

Hillsage said:

You are very close to the truth that no one here sees.

It isn't water baptism and it isn't accepting Christ either. There is nothing in that verses list pertaining to us 'in context'.

EPH 4:4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;

Does this verse refer to our "body" or His? Your Spirit" or His?

What is the "hope of your calling" you or Him?

4:5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,

Are you Lord" or Him? Is "faith" in you or Him? Now we have this "one baptism" which nobody understands because they all apply it to US. So let's skip it for a minute and continue.

6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

Are you God and Father or is He?

So, keeping with every 'in context' point I made above, just exactly what "ONE BAPTISM" could there be that also is not of us but Him? A baptism which has provided the opportunity for Spirit which in ALL of us who are Christians?

And the SCRIPTURAL answer is NOT the Baptism of the Holy Spirit. Not water baptism. Not even baptism for the dead. So what's even left? It's the ONE BAPTISM which Jesus still had not undergone AFTER He was 'water baptized and "Holy Spirit baptized by John. There is only one left, and that is the baptism of Jesus death on the cross.

LUK 12:50 "But I have a baptism to undergo, and how distressed I am until it is accomplished!

His death is the only "ONE BAPTISM" which has appropriated the availability of Spirit of Christ to even be 'in every born again Christian' there is.

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Having the Spirit is crucial to overcoming grievous sin, and plays a part in our salvation. The believer is empowered by the Holy Spirit.

Believers can obey the Spirit (Ezekiel 36:27).
Believers put to death sin in their lives by the Spirit (Romans 8:13).
Believers are sanctified by the Spirit (2 Thessalonians 2:13).

The key here is the glorification of God and not self.
We cannot obey without God.
While there is a baptism of death, to glorify a baptism of death (without the baptism of the Spirit) signifies that a person can do it all themselves without God. They can be the masters of their own destiny. While we do have free will, the glory goes to God for our cooperating with the good work that God desires to do through us. So I don't see the "one baptism" in the way that you do.
Both John the Baptist, and Jesus referred to how we will be baptized in the Spirit. This is true baptism above any other. For it is a baptism that glorifies God and not self.

DamianWarS said:

what does this mean? and do you use 1 Cor 13:10 as your support?

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When I say "Partial Cessationism" I am not referring to 1 Corinthians 13 exactly but I am referring to the gifts given to us by the Spirit as a whole. I believe the miraculous gifts given by the Spirit have ceased, but the non-miraculous gifts have not ceased.

But what about 1 Corinthians 13:10?
Well, it is written:

8 "Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.
9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.
10 But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away."
(1 Corinthians 13:8-10).

So what is done away with when the perfect comes?


These things would pass away when the perfect (the canon of Scripture) comes.
NT Scripture is referred to as the perfect law of liberty (See James 1). It is also compared to a glass / mirror in both James 1 and in 1 Corinthians 13. We see Christ face to face by looking in the mirror / glass of the Bible when we conform to His image by obeying His Word. The reflection we see in the Bible / mirror is the reflection of Christ.

Carl Emerson said:

I have never argued that we should do this, but I do state quite clearly that the complete bible does not render the Holy Spirit silent within. Also as an aside, what was the scripture that Timothy was referring to as some of the letters was not written when He stated that. I suspect he was referring to the OT because the idea if a NT was not conceived at that time. This adds weight to my claim that scripture is not exhaustive and was never meant to replace His voice within in the new Covenant. We have let the fear of deception to legislate a bible only position, when the truth is that when we function as a body in unity the checks and balances are there along with the bible and discernment to keep us on track - and this is how the very elect will not be deceived - not because we refer to bible scholars but because we collectively refer to Him in mutual submission.

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Your position sounds contradictory to me, my friend.
You say on the one hand that we are not to add to the Bible, and then you say that we can receive new things by God. I don't believe you can have it both ways. It's either Bible alone or it's not Bible alone. Yes, I believe we need the Anointing to understand the Bible alone, but this is not new words given to us, but it is a confirmation of what the Bible already says. You were talking before about how there are different classifications of tongues revealed to you outside of the Bible. Again, what makes this different than folks who think God desires them to work with snakes in their worship?

Ricky M said:

Just on the chance I may be wrong, Here's the link to the thread 1 Corinthians 14 decoded

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"For anyone who speaks in a tongue does not speak to people but to God. Indeed, no one understands them; they utter mysteries by the Spirit." (1 Corinthians 14:2).

According to the context, Paul is not recommending private prayer tongue languages, but he is criticizing the Corinthians for the misuse of tongues.

Well, the version you quote is the King James. While I believe the KJV to be the perfect word of God for our day, it is not always the clearest Bible to understand because it is written in 1600's English. The NLT (New Living Translation) is a little more clear on understanding this portion of Scripture. It says:

2 "For if you have the ability to speak in tongues, you will be talking only to God, since people won’t be able to understand you. You will be speaking by the power of the Spirit, but it will all be mysterious.
3 But one who prophesies strengthens others, encourages them, and comforts them.
4 A person who speaks in tongues is strengthened personally, but one who speaks a word of prophecy strengthens the entire church." (1 Corinthians 14:2-4) (NLT).

In other words, Paul is saying that if you speak in tongues without an interpreter, only God will be able to understand what you are truly saying in that foreign language (that is gifted by the Spirit), and nobody will be able to understand you because it will appear that you are speaking mysteries to them by an unknown tongue without an interpreter. Paul is criticizing them for not speaking in tongues publicly without an interpreter, and he is not commending the private use of tongues here.

You said:

I would have copied/pasted it here, but color coding doesn't carry over and I don't have the time at the moment to re-edit it all again.

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If you hit "edit" on your post, and then select the text you like, and then copy and paste it, the colored text should carry over.

His student said:

You're assuming that praying in the Holy Spirit (the subject of the O.P.) is a spiritual gift. It is not - it is an order.

"but if there is no interpreter, he must keep silent in the church; and let him speak to himself and to God." 1 Corinthians 14:29

"These are the ones who cause divisions, worldly-minded, devoid of the Spirit. But you, beloved, building yourselves up on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Spirit, keep yourselves in the love of God, waiting anxiously for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ to eternal life." Jude 19-21

Look - I wish all "you guys" the best in your prayer life and that you will be mightily built up by praying in the Holy Spirit (what ever you construe that to be).

I also pray that you will not suffer loss at the Judgment Seat of Christ because of your undermining of the faith of many of your brothers and sisters.

See you guys on the other side.

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1 Corinthians 12:30 says,
"Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret?"

The obvious answer to the question is... "no."

His student said:

I thought that was understood since this is a Christian forum and all of the guys I have referred to have so identified themselves.

If it will sooth your sensibilities I'll endeavor to call you all "brothers" from now on out.

Let's get this straight since you seem to be a bit mixed up about it.

You are the one who says that biblical tongues were all real languages. I have not said that nor have those who practice tongues either in the bringing of messages from God or in their prayer closet claimed that they have been real languages.

In fact I don't believe that the tongues spoken in Acts 2 were known languages - only that many people heard those tongues in their own language. We've been over this before. I have been very clear about what I believe about the nature of tongues. Please don''t say things about what I believe that are not so.

Or "lack of experience" for that matter.

Often IMO because certain people have not experienced tongues - their jealousy or their pride in their ability to form correct doctrine causes them to attack the views and practices of others - rather than leave them alone as they should.

I do. Pentecost may well have been like the tower of Babel only in reverse.

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Yes, I know you believe that tongues are not foreign languages. This is the view of some Continuationists. I am aware of this. I am telling you what I think tongues are according to Scripture. I believe they are real foreign languages.

Okay. So you are you saying that tongues is not a real language at all?
Is it at least a heavenly language?
If so, there needs to be some kind of structure and order to it to be recognized as a language that could actually function normally. For God is not the author of confusion.

Ricky M said:

I'm sorry, no offense, but I and several others here see nothing more than an agenda. None of your responses to any of the scriptures presented here show thought and consideration thereof, on the contrary they show a pre-planned response and effort to prove others wrong. And I don't think this is one of the 'certain' portions of scripture you're willing to reconsider. And leaving 1% doubt just in case? That's just cya.

I suspect you already saw my thread on the subject of 1 Cor 14, your copy cat colorizing of one cherry picked scripture here again says you are looking to make a point, not to learn. If I thot you were truly open to questioning and learning I would make the effort to share it with you. But so far, that's not what I see here. Not at all.

Again, no offense intended, but I've been thru this rodeo many many times before. You're not looking to learn anything. If you were, my 1 Cor 14 thread would CLEARLY show you the difference between prophecy and tongues.

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Well, I don't believe what you said is true of me. But this thread is not about me, but it is about the truth of what the Word of God says on if there is a private prayer language in tongues (behind closed doors). So far, I do not see any clear good evidence for it. The verses that believers use to defend their viewpoint on private tongues can easily be interpreted to talking about something else.

We need a clear verse or passage that says something like:


But no such verse or passage exists like this in the Bible.

Ricky M said:

Just on the chance I may be wrong, Here's the link to the thread 1 Corinthians 14 decoded

I would have copied/pasted it here, but color coding doesn't carry over and I don't have the time at the moment to re-edit it all again.

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Why is there is no such thing as a private prayer in tongues behind closed doors (When nobody is looking)? Because Paul says tongues are for unbelievers (1 Corinthians 14:22). They were a sign of judgment to the Jews. Think... Tower of Babel. Think.... Jewish Exile.

DamianWarS said:

then you take a very typical cessationist view and I wouldn't call it a partial.

Paul is referring to us lacking and in need of spiritual gifts to make us not lacking (hence the need of these gifts). the context starts in ch 12 which is all spiritual gifts. Paul begins to isolate certain gifts as it is his way of introducing the isolated correction to come of said gifts, he concludes, however, saying not to "forbid speaking in tongues". The framework Paul constructs seems to allow a place for tongues in some sort of self-edifying context, although interpretation is still stressed and it is admittingly sparse in teaching.

I suspect you would reject this but no matter, the crux of the issue you're presenting is the "when" which is isolated in 13:10 referring to when the perfect comes and holding to a view that the perfect has already come (hence the cessationist view). somehow you don't include this as "dangerous to build a spiritual belief or practice based on such scant biblical evidence" and to that, I ask, why is your controversial scant biblical evidence better than someone else?

tongues or even self edifying tongues are at least explicitly mentioned in scripture but this magic unknown time that apparently was sometime in or after the 1st century is completely uncommented. the eschatology view for "the perfect" is the only responsible way of interpreting this passage if we want to keep to sola scriptura concepts. otherwise we are just reverse translating scripture based on history and personal bias. Let's answer this question in a biblical vacuum first then ask is it valid today still using the same biblical principals but let's keep the "scant biblical evidence" out of it.

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Here are several points in Scripture in defense of the ceasing of the miraculous gifts:

#1. Both 1 Corinthians 13 and James 1 describe something that is “perfect” and “looking into a mirror.” In 1 Corinthians 13, that which is “perfect” fits the reference to the “Perfect law of liberty” (James 1:25). The law of the Lord is “perfect” (Psalms 19:7). All Scripture (the Bible) is profitable so that the man of God may be “perfect” unto every good work (2 Timothy 3:16-17). James 1:23 and 1 Corinthians 13:12 both describe the Bible as a mirror/glass that we see our reflection in. Some people look into a mirror and forget their physical appearance. Some people look into the Bible mirror and forget their spiritual appearance. Therefore, Glass / Mirror = Perfect = The Word of God. 1 Corinthians 13:12 describes the "perfect" as a glass mirror, just as James 1:23 does. 2 Corinthians 3:18 also shows the glass, and hence the perfect to be the Word of God, which transforms us. It says: "But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord" (Also see verse 15 in the same chapter). As we look into God's Word and we see Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit transforms us into the very image of Jesus Christ. "We all" means all believers, seeing in the Bible/glass, the glory of the Lord. "Open face" means that we can hide nothing from God; We must be open and honest with Him.

#2. The three greatest prophets and miracle workers in the Bible are Moses, Elijah, and Jesus. We see that the miracles that they performed were a way to authenticate them as a messenger from GOD and the Word of God that they provided (that would be immortalized into Scripture). We notice that after each of these prophets, there was a time of silence where no miracles were done. Just like with the prophets Moses, Elijah, and Jesus, miracles authenticated the apostles' message as from God. "And they (apostles) went forth, and preached everywhere, the Lord working with them, and confirming the Word with signs (tongues, prophecies, healing, etc.) following. Amen." Mark 16:20. Today the need for tongues and miracles has ceased. God has authenticated the apostles and the New Testament that they penned. This proves the temporary nature of tongues and miracles.

#3. We can see that after the book of Acts, the gifts no longer operated in Paul’s life like they once had. The sign gifts, tongues, prophecy, the gift of healing, etc. were operating all through the Book of Acts, and these gifts are mentioned in the letters that Paul wrote during the Acts period. But when we turn to the letters written after the Book of Acts—the 4 Prison Epistles, and the 3 Pastoral Epistles, we find that the sign gifts either aren’t mentioned at all or we see—as with the gift of healing—that they were no longer operating in Paul’s life. What he could do in Acts 28, he could no longer do in Philippians, or in 1 and 2 Timothy. He could heal all the sick on the island in Acts 28:9, but he couldn’t heal any of his closest co-workers—Timothy, Epaphroditus, Trophimus—after the close of the Book of Acts (See this article here for the full explanation).

#4. Believers were built upon the foundation of the apostles. “For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father. Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellow-citizens with the saints, and of the household of God; And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief cornerstone;” (Ephesians 2:18-20). We are said to have access by one Spirit unto the Father that is built upon the “foundation” of the apostles and prophets. Being an apostle is a gift (See 1 Corinthians 12:28-31). The qualifications of being an apostle was to have seen the risen Lord Jesus Christ (See Acts of the Apostles 1:22-26). Paul said he met the qualifications as being an apostle because he had seen the risen Lord. 1 Corinthians 9:1 “…Am I not an apostle? Have I not seen Jesus our Lord?” Paul called himself the “last prophet.” (1 Corinthians 15:8-9). Paul says that God has set forth the apostles last (1 Corinthians 14:9). This shows the temporary nature of one of the gifts because the gift of apostleship is a foundation that was already laid already with the saints being built upon such a foundation.

#5. Jesus suggested that there would be the kind of believer who would not see, and yet they would believe anyways. For Jesus said, "blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed." (John 20:29). This suggests that there would be believers who would not need miracles in order to believe. Jesus showed proof that the miracle of His resurrection was real to Thomas in the fact that he had him feel his side, etc. He wanted to physically have proof in order to believe. But Jesus said there will be those who will not see and yet they will believe. Jesus says they are more blessed because of this. It suggests that believers will not need of the continued operation of the working miracles of God in their life in order to continually believe. In other words, there will be a time when believers will walk by faith, and not by sight.

DamianWarS said:

then you take a very typical cessationist view and I wouldn't call it a partial.

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But from my perspective, I would call it Partial Cessationism because that is how I describe my belief in what the Scriptures say on this matter. I believe the non miraculous gifts by the Spirit have continued, and the miraculous gifts have ceased.

Carl Emerson said:

The scripture is the scripture. It is not the sum total of God's Word. When the 'perfect' comes is not a reference to the canon. The scripture has been seriously idolised if it replaces the Holy Spirit.
What a bizzare comment about snakes in worship... what are you on about???

I get led to a particular house at a particular time to pray for a Pastor (who I had never met before or seen since) he was in bondage and you tell me the Holy Spirit is no longer leading folks. How arrogant is that ??? His ministry was transformed as a result.

He led me to another house at a critical time to pray for a lady actually having a heart attack and she is completely healed. I tracked this couple for years after, and can name them.

You want me to ignore His voice within because it doesn't fit your theology?

I have walked a tough road to get to where I am and you want me to question my Loving Lord's guidance because it doesnt fit your theology?

I prayed for a dear Brother one morning and as the Lords power touched him you could physically hear the bones cracking as his back was healed.

Many folks were healed in a prostitutes rooms that became our chapel for inner city folk.

He guided me and a dear friend to a complete stranger in a park who was shot in the legs having served in the RCMP. It was very specific - two tracks met and there he was alongside of us. We said do you believe the Lord can heal you - and He said yes but I've been waiting a long time. He hadn't walked flat on his feet for 11 years. His healing was instantaneous - walking up and down on the grass trying out his new walk while we were literally jumping for joy and praising God.

A couple saw me at a church and they said to me that their son who suffered badly with Grand Mal seizures never had another after I prayed for him, and that was 18 years earlier.

We have lived by faith for years, we prayed for $1000 at one stage, and a brother we hadn't spoken to for a couple of years rang up and asked for our bank account and deposited the exact amount within a few days.

I was guided to get on a plane for Israel with only $150 and was away for 14 weeks, strangers were giving me support, it was an appointed journey, I also went to China. Everything was paid for by God's hand through folks I had never met before.

I have no standing in the church and am a nobody apart from Jesus. I could go on about more but frankly when folks talk about God not guiding and displaying His miraculous love through healing it astounds me like I am on another planet.

I love you all, and dont want to cause problems, but I can't contain the deep thankfulness for His Love and purposes.

Forgive me if I have said too much.

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Again, this thread is not about personal experience to validate tongues as a private prayer language behind closed doors. I am looking for Bible verses to prove this. Experiences are not on the same level as Scripture when it come to the faith. For faith comes by hearing, and hearing the Word of God.

Carl Emerson said:

That's what I am hearing...

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Well, it's the topic of the thread.

Carl Emerson said:

The problem is, that in dismissing those who are hearing the Word of God within, you are judging those who have given up all, to walk 'in the Way' - this is a serious matter.

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I am not God to honestly know what power you worked by. I believe the Bible teaches that men (I am not referring to you exactly) are able to do miracles by the working of the enemy. We see this with the Pharaoh's servants in the story of Moses, and in Acts 8 with Simon the sorcerer, etc.; So give me a Bible over a person's experiences or working of miracles any day of the week. My trust is in God's Word alone with the Anointing in 1 John 2:27 giving me the understanding of it. While I believe God can do miracles, I believe it is in His timing and choosing.

In any event, may you be blessed by the Lord Jesus Christ today.