Is the land restoration to the nation of Israel found in the new covenant?

Status
Not open for further replies.

Contenders Edge

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
May 13, 2019
2,615
370
43
Hayfork
✟167,447.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Thayer connected the demolition with the resurrection of the dead and the last judgment.

What happens to the world after the last judgment?


After the last judgment, comes the new heavens and the new earth, but that does not happen until after the thousand year reign as written in Revelation chapter 20.
 
Upvote 0

Contenders Edge

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
May 13, 2019
2,615
370
43
Hayfork
✟167,447.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Can you show a reference to the earthly city of Jerusalem after Revelation chapter 11, which will confirm your statement above?

.


Revelation chapter 14: Where is Mount Zion located?
 
Upvote 0

BABerean2

Newbie
Site Supporter
May 21, 2014
20,614
7,484
North Carolina
✟893,665.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Revelation chapter 14: Where is Mount Zion located?

Rev 14:1 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.


Heb 12:22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,
Heb 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,
Heb 12:24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

.
 
Upvote 0

Contenders Edge

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
May 13, 2019
2,615
370
43
Hayfork
✟167,447.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Rev 14:1 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.


Heb 12:22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,
Heb 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,
Heb 12:24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

.


What was the name of the mount that the Temple of God was last located?
 
Upvote 0

keras

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy
Feb 7, 2013
13,675
2,491
82
Thames, New Zealand
Visit site
✟293,158.00
Country
New Zealand
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Married
Revelation chapter 14: Where is Mount Zion located?
The question of where exactly the new Temple will be located is irrelevant. It is enough to know that there WILL be a new Temple and it will be greater that any of the former ones. Haggai 2:9

However, having been to Jerusalem and seen the Temple Mount and the remains of Davids city; way below it, then where the new Temple will be sited, must be where the Dome of the Rock stands now, or close to it.
As the Rock which the DoR stands over, is very likely the Rock that Abraham went to sacrifice Isaac on, then the new Temple will be built over it.
The DoR will be gone on the Day of the Lord's fiery wrath. Amos 2:5

Waiting for a response to #1418.
 
Upvote 0

BABerean2

Newbie
Site Supporter
May 21, 2014
20,614
7,484
North Carolina
✟893,665.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
What was the name of the mount that the Temple of God was last located?

Gal 4:26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.


Rev_3:12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.


Rev 11:19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Contenders Edge

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
May 13, 2019
2,615
370
43
Hayfork
✟167,447.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Right, but I'm specifically talking about the 613 commandments of moses and the nation of Israel's agreement to obey them in order to receive earthly blessing from God.
Part of the old covenant agreement was WHEN Israel repented after the curses had been poured out THEN God would restore them to land and circumcise their hearts.


The circumcision of the heart is not confined to the Old Covenant but is carried over to the New Covenant thus testifying to the unchanging nature of our God. (Mal. 3:6) Land restoration could just as easily be carried over into the New Covenant as well as proof of God's faithfulness. (Heb. 10:23)


I know many does not mean all, that's why I used many and not all. But I'm glad we agree that the 613 commandments of Moses have changed.


Except for those laws carried over.


Again, a covenant is an agreement between 2 parties, with responsibilities on both sides. Israel's responsibilities were to follow the 613 commands of moses. God's responsibilities were to bless or curse Israel CONDITIONAL to their obedience or disobedience of the 613 commandments of moses (deuteronomy 28). So while the law/promises are not themselves the agreement, the are intimately a part of that agreement.


But because they are not the agreement there are still laws and promises carried over from one covenant to another.



Right, Christ did not come destroy the law and prophets. If He came to destroy the law and prophets, then everything they pointed to would have been in vain.

If I promised to have a pizza delivered at 7pm to your residence, but instead a basket of laundry shows up, my promise is destroyed. However, if the pizza is delivered right at 7pm, the promise is fulfilled.

Christ came to bring the law and prophets to fulfillment or completion. The greek word fulfill is pleroo and it means: accomplish, complete, fulfill

Thus, Christ fulfilled/completed the law and the prophets, perfectly. Everything they had pointed to was found fulfilled in his ministry, death, resurrection, ascension, and sending of the Spirit.


But there are other things foretold that have not yet come to pass and must come to pass in order for all things to be fulfilled such as the redemption of our bodies, His return and all things pertaining thereto, the redemption of creation from the curse, the resurrection of the just and then the unjust for judgment, the receiving of eternal rewards and everlasting treasures on the basis of what we have done for the Lord in this life, the elimination of death, the creation of the new Heaven and new earth, and the arrival of the New Jerusalem; all prophecies concerning the fate of this present world and humanity

The fulfillment of all things is not symbolic, but must be literal in order for fulfillments to be declared. That is a rule of prophecy.


so what is the law that written on the hearts and minds of the house of Israel and Judah under the new covenant?


The same law God gave them under the Old Covenant, only under the New Covenant they do not obey the law for salvation or to obtain God's favor, but they obey the law out of love for the Lord and out of gratitude for the grace and mercy bestowed upon them, just as the rest of us who have entered into the New Covenant do, only the greater part of the house of Israel (Judah included) have not yet entered into the New Covenant. That will one day change. (Rom. 11:26)


So let's get something straight. I believe ALL the promises of God find their yes in Christ.

The promises (plural) were to abraham and his offspring, who is Christ (galatians 3:16). As paul uses the plural form of promise, then the promises (plural) made to abraham and the singular from of offspring in Genesis are to Christ. This would include the land. And thus because the earth is the Lord's and the fullness there of (1 corinthians 10:26), and Christ was made Lord (acts 2:36), then the earth his His, which includes the land of Israel and thus fulfilling the promise to Abraham.

So, with that understanding we turn to the old covenant, which came 430 years after the promises given to Abraham. 1.) The old covenant prophesied of blessing and curses being poured out on the nation of Israel (Deuteronomy 30:1). 2.) The old covenant then prophesied of land restoration following the curses being poured out (deuteronomy 30:2-4). 3.) The old covenant then prophesied of circumcised hearts (deuteronomy 30:5-6).


1.) the blessings were poured out on Israel when they obeyed and curses when they disobeyed
1 kings 8:56 Blessed be the LORD, who has given rest to His people Israel according to all that He promised. Not one word has failed of all the good promises He made through His servant Moses.


Daniel 9:13 Just as it is written in the Law of Moses, all this disaster has come upon us, yet we have not sought the favor of the LORD our God by turning from our iniquities and giving attention to Your truth


2.) The fortunes of Jacob were restored
Psalm 85:1 you showed favor to Your land, O LORD; You restored the fortunes of Jacob.


3.) Circumcision of the heart was/is performed by God himself, in the ministry, death, resurrection, ascension, and sending of the Spirit

Colossians 2:11 In him also you were circumcised with a circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ,


Romans 2:29 But a Jew is one inwardly, and circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter. His praise is not from man but from God.


So we can see that land restoration from Babylon was meant solely for the purpose of the coming of Christ in the flesh, so that he could fulfill everything that was written about him (luke 24:44) in the law, the psalms, the prophets, the dreams, visions, and riddles. If the nation of Israel had not been in the land of Israel in the 1st century, then Christ could not have fulfilled what was written about him.


The land being an "everlasting possession" to Abraham's offspring is not fulfilled in the nation of Israel, but in Christ who has all authority ON EARTH and in heaven.



Even though the fortunes of Jacob were declared restored, Israel still did not obtain the status as a nation and people that it has been foretold that they will for a number of reasons and which is destined to be fulfilled under Christ.


There are other prophecies yet to be fulfilled pertaining to the coming judgments upon the world, the return of Christ, and His coming reign on the earth in which the nation of Israel plays a central role and which requires land restoration to be in effect and since God said that a day would come in which Israel would be restored as a nation, never to be driven out of their land again, (Ezek. 37:25, Am. 9:15) in upholding His faithfulness, (Heb. 10:23) He cannot change His mind for if we are to trust in the greatest of promises, even the least of all promises must meet their fulfillment.


I'm glad you can admit that land restoration is not explicitly mentioned in the NT.


But I never said that there were not passages in the New Testament that gave indication of such.


Is land restoration a part of the old covenant?


Yes but that does not mean it was confined to the Old Covenant.


Was land restoration a part of the old covenant? yes: deuteronomy 30:1-6. Scripture literally tells us the old covenant is obsolete in hebrews 8:13. What more evidence do we need?


The evidence needed would be scriptures declaring land restoration canceled. There is none.


I could say the destruction of the temple is evidence of the coming judgment of Christ on the nation of Israel, and yet you'll still disagree, so how is a modern day nation of Israel that has no verifiable connection to pre-desolation hebrews supposed to convince me?


They had to have received their traditions, culture, and customs from somewhere. They had to receive their history from somewhere. If not from the pre-desolation Hebrews, then from where? Genetic evidence has repeatedly shown that Jews retain a bloodline distinct from all other peoples. Where did that bloodline come from if not from the pre-desolation Hebrews? It did not just appear all of a sudden. Even you yourself said you had Jewish DNA. That did not just appear in you or your ancestors out of no where.

If further proof is needed, God is capable of providing it and in time, as He sees fit, it will be.

And despite the judgment that came upon Jerusalem which resulted in the destruction of the Temple, this clearly was not the end as is pointed out in Matthew 23:39 in which Jesus told the people that after He had pronounced judgment, they would not see Him again until they said "Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord."

They might have been set aside throughout most of history between the destruction of Jerusalem and their re-establishment as a nation in 1948, but we have entered a time in which they are destined to play a more pivotal role in the events that are destined to transpire but which require that they be regathered to their land.



You are attempting to new wine in an old wine skin. Romans 11:15 tells us exactly what their "fullness" is: life from the dead. It doesn't mention land restoration.


But evidence of their fullness has always been made manifest. As a nation, they appear to be alive, but most of the people are spiritually dead. But that is destined to change. (Rom. 11:26) When they do receive Messiah, in that day will we witness the fullness that pertains to them as a nation.

If I were attempting to reconcile two things that are contrary to one another, then you could say that I am attempting to place new wine in an old wine skin, but there is no reason to believe that land restoration is contrary to the greater things to come.


But what is clear, as written by a Jew, the true promise land is not an earthly one, but a heavenly


But just as our earthly bodies will be changed into heavenly bodies, even the earthly promised land can be changed so as to be made part of the greater promised land when that day comes for the passing of this present earth and the creation of the new earth to which the Heavenly Jerusalem will descend.
 
Upvote 0

Contenders Edge

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
May 13, 2019
2,615
370
43
Hayfork
✟167,447.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Sure; there is a distinction between the Jewish State of Israel, those apostate, LGBT, Jesus rejecting people and the faithful Christian Church; His true Israelites by faith, Romans 1:29 makes that perfectly clear.


The Jewish state of Israel will not continue to be the apostate, LGBT Jesus rejecting people that they are now.


Re Jeremiah 12:14-16, I did condense that passage, that did not change the message in any way.
As over 100 other prophesies tell us; there is soon to happen a terrible Judgment/punishment by fire, that will clear and cleanse all of the holy Land. Rejecting this warning is a serious mistake and leaves you unready for the great things the Lord has planned for His people.


Jeremiah 12:14-17 contextually, in its uncondensed format, was directed more towards the surrounding nations of Israel than it was towards Israel. It was a warning to them to not exploit their punishment.

It is one thing to quote passages or even parts of passages relevant to a particular topic, but the "condensing" as you call it, did make what the scripture was communicating to appear different than what it actually was.

There is no way to put a spin on what you did, but when you deliberately resorted to altering scripture to support the doctrine you follow, you committed an act of both theological and intellectual dishonesty and made your case to appear weak in the eyes of your detractors and objective skeptics giving them all the more reason to doubt the credibility of the case you try to present.




Here is another prophecy about what will happen, in the order of events:
The Great Chapter of Isaiah 29:1-24:
Suddenly, in an instant punishment will come from the heavens. The Lord will act in His wrath against all those who make war against Jerusalem, all those who surround Israel. With a great noise amid flames of devouring fire, earthquakes and powerful storms, they will disappear like a dream, like a vision of the night – gone when you awake. So it will be with the horde of nations who attack the holy Land. They will crumble into dust and be blown away like chaff. Psalms 83, Micah 4:11-12, Revelation 6:12-17 This is quite a different event from Armageddon, it is the many prophesied Day of the Lord’s vengeance and wrath, a literal day of a Coronal Mass Ejection sunspot explosion. Isaiah 30:26, Malachi 4:1, 2 Peter 3:7


Actually, the events you cited happen within roughly the same time-frame as Armageddon. Armageddon, when we actually come to understand everything that takes place on that day, is really about Israel against the rest of the world and it will be a battle so fierce and destructive, that it will require the return of the Lord or else both Christian and non-Christian, Jew and Gentile will all be destroyed.

Again, as I have mentioned before, the context of Isaiah 30:26 does not depict the sun as a destructive instrument. Revelation 16:8, however does.


But, disaster will come to those who live in the Land, there will be mourning and tears when the Lord makes Jerusalem His fire altar. He will bring those people down, the survivors will hide underground, their voices will squeak out of the earth. Isaiah 31:5, Zechariah 13:8-9


Trouble will come, but the cited passages are about deliverance.


On that Day, [NOT the Return, but at the next prophesied event.] the Lord will exert His power a second time to recover the remnant of His people from wherever they are scattered around the world. Isaiah 49:12-13, Isaiah 66:20 He will make a sign to the nations and gather those dispersed of the House of Israel, [now the Christian peoples] He will assemble Judah’s scattered people and the enmity between Israel and Judah will cease. Ezekiel 37:13-28


The enmity between Judah and the other tribes was put away since the end of their captivity in Babylon. As for the rest of the events mentioned, if the completion of their regathering does not transpire when the Lord returns, when else would it?
 
Upvote 0

BABerean2

Newbie
Site Supporter
May 21, 2014
20,614
7,484
North Carolina
✟893,665.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
The Jewish state of Israel will not continue to be the apostate, LGBT Jesus rejecting people that they are now.

You are re-defining the word "remnant" again, to mean a whole nation.

See Romans 9:8, and Romans 9:27, and Romans 11:1-5.


.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Contenders Edge

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
May 13, 2019
2,615
370
43
Hayfork
✟167,447.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Gal 4:26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.


Rev_3:12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.


Rev 11:19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

.


Mount Zion may one day become a part of the heavenly Jerusalem, but is not necessarily depicted as presently being so. It is still located in Jerusalem on earth and that the Lamb and the 144,000 appear on Mount Zion seems to give indication that Mount Zion may be the place where Christ establishes His throne when He reigns upon the earth. Why else would He choose to make an appearance there?
 
Upvote 0

Contenders Edge

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
May 13, 2019
2,615
370
43
Hayfork
✟167,447.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
You are re-defining the word "remnant" again, to mean a whole nation.

See Romans 9:8, and Romans 9:27, and Romans 11:1-5.


.


I was not redefining "remnant." What I was stating is that the current state of unbelief in the nation of Israel will not last, yet before they turn from their unbelief, many of them will sadly die, leaving only the repentant to abide as a nation.
 
Upvote 0

Contenders Edge

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
May 13, 2019
2,615
370
43
Hayfork
✟167,447.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
The question of where exactly the new Temple will be located is irrelevant. It is enough to know that there WILL be a new Temple and it will be greater that any of the former ones. Haggai 2:9

However, having been to Jerusalem and seen the Temple Mount and the remains of Davids city; way below it, then where the new Temple will be sited, must be where the Dome of the Rock stands now, or close to it.
As the Rock which the DoR stands over, is very likely the Rock that Abraham went to sacrifice Isaac on, then the new Temple will be built over it.
The DoR will be gone on the Day of the Lord's fiery wrath. Amos 2:5

Waiting for a response to #1418.


The Dome of the Rock could be gone even sooner than that if the Lord should decide. But the next Temple will be located exactly where the previous two were. There is no reason to believe otherwise.
 
Upvote 0

BABerean2

Newbie
Site Supporter
May 21, 2014
20,614
7,484
North Carolina
✟893,665.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Mount Zion may one day become a part of the heavenly Jerusalem, but is not necessarily depicted as presently being so. It is still located in Jerusalem on earth and that the Lamb and the 144,000 appear on Mount Zion seems to give indication that Mount Zion may be the place where Christ establishes His throne when He reigns upon the earth. Why else would He choose to make an appearance there?

The woman at the well agrees with you.
Did you miss the part where Christ corrected her?


Joh 4:20 Our fathers worshipped in this mountain; and ye say, that in Jerusalem is the place where men ought to worship.
Joh 4:21 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father.
Joh 4:22 Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews.
Joh 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
Joh 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

.
 
Upvote 0

BABerean2

Newbie
Site Supporter
May 21, 2014
20,614
7,484
North Carolina
✟893,665.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
The Dome of the Rock could be gone even sooner than that if the Lord should decide.

First century eyewitness Josephus said Fort Antonia was built upon a gigantic rock.
That gigantic rock still bears witness today to the location of the Roman fort.

On the day Titus destroyed the Jewish temple, he was using Fort Antonia as his base of operation. If the fort remained on the day the temple was destroyed, where is the Roman fort now? Look for the gigantic rock and you will have your answer.

See the link below.

The Temple Mount and Fort Antonia

.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Contenders Edge

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
May 13, 2019
2,615
370
43
Hayfork
✟167,447.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
The woman at the well agrees with you.
Did you miss the part where Christ corrected her?


Joh 4:20 Our fathers worshipped in this mountain; and ye say, that in Jerusalem is the place where men ought to worship.
Joh 4:21 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father.
Joh 4:22 Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews.
Joh 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
Joh 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

.


What I said had to do with where on earth Jesus will rule, not whether or not people will be required to go to Jerusalem to worship Him on a daily basis. However when He does establish His reign, the nations of the world will be required to travel to Jerusalem periodically to pay Him homage as is written in Zechariah chapter 14.
 
Upvote 0

Contenders Edge

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
May 13, 2019
2,615
370
43
Hayfork
✟167,447.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
First century eyewitness Josephus said Fort Antonia was built upon a gigantic rock.
That gigantic rock still bears witness today to the location of the Roman fort.

On the day Titus destroyed the Jewish temple, he was using Fort Antonia as his base of operation. If the fort remained on the day the temple was destroyed, where is the Roman fort now? Look for the gigantic rock and you will have your answer.

See the link below.

The Temple Mount and Fort Antonia

.


What we do know is that the next Temple will be established in the same location as the previous two.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: keras
Upvote 0

keras

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy
Feb 7, 2013
13,675
2,491
82
Thames, New Zealand
Visit site
✟293,158.00
Country
New Zealand
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Married
The new Temple will be built over the Rock that was called Mt Moriah.
All the buildings there now will be gone:

Isaiah 6:11-12 How long, Lord? Until the Land is desolate and cities are deserted, houses vacant.
Jeremiah 4:7 The Destroyer comes, cities will lay waste and empty.
Hosea 8:14 You have forgotten your Maker, I shall send fire to burn your cities.
Micah 5:10-11 On that Day, I will devastate your cities.
Jeremiah 9:21-22 Death has come to our towns, corpses lie like dung in the streets.
Jeremiah 4:26 Your Holy cities are ruined, Jerusalem is burned by fire, all that we treasured has been destroyed.
 
Upvote 0

keras

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy
Feb 7, 2013
13,675
2,491
82
Thames, New Zealand
Visit site
✟293,158.00
Country
New Zealand
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Married
The Jewish state of Israel will not continue to be the apostate, LGBT Jesus rejecting people that they are now.

Jeremiah 12:14-17 contextually, in its uncondensed format, was directed more towards the surrounding nations of Israel than it was towards Israel. It was a warning to them to not exploit their punishment.

It is one thing to quote passages or even parts of passages relevant to a particular topic, but the "condensing" as you call it, did make what the scripture was communicating to appear different than what it actually was.

There is no way to put a spin on what you did, but when you deliberately resorted to altering scripture to support the doctrine you follow, you committed an act of both theological and intellectual dishonesty and made your case to appear weak in the eyes of your detractors and objective skeptics giving them all the more reason to doubt the credibility of the case you try to present.

Actually, the events you cited happen within roughly the same time-frame as Armageddon. Armageddon, when we actually come to understand everything that takes place on that day, is really about Israel against the rest of the world and it will be a battle so fierce and destructive, that it will require the return of the Lord or else both Christian and non-Christian, Jew and Gentile will all be destroyed.

Again, as I have mentioned before, the context of Isaiah 30:26 does not depict the sun as a destructive instrument. Revelation 16:8, however does.

Trouble will come, but the cited passages are about deliverance.

The enmity between Judah and the other tribes was put away since the end of their captivity in Babylon. As for the rest of the events mentioned, if the completion of their regathering does not transpire when the Lord returns, when else would it?
You simply don't see how the Jewish State of Israel will be gone after the Day of the Lord's fiery wrath. Just as Jeremiah 12:14-16 says: Only the Christian Jews will be allowed back. As Ezekiel 20:34-38 proves.

The enmity between Judah and Israel continues today.
The Jews hate Christians, they are not allowed to become citizens and those that are face abuse and persecution.
Christian people are in the main; descendants of the ten Northern tribes. If you and others who like to think the Jews are all of Israel deny this truth, then you deny the success of Jesus' mission. Matthew 15:24

Re; Isaiah 30:26a, this prophecy plainly states that the sun will suddenly shine 7 times brighter. Paralleled by Psalms 50:1-3, Malachi 4:1
You think this wouldn't be destructive to us on earth? I am in wonderment at your naivety and denial. Also that verse is in the context of earthly punishments by fire. Isaiah 30:30....His arm descends in fierce anger with devouring flames of fire.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

BABerean2

Newbie
Site Supporter
May 21, 2014
20,614
7,484
North Carolina
✟893,665.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
What we do know is that the next Temple will be established in the same location as the previous two.

Since the Temple Institute in Jerusalem, has decided that Fort Antonia is the site, it looks like you are mistaken.

They have lied about what Josephus said to make their site work.

I have heard them make the claim that Josephus said Fort Antonia was "razed to the ground", when in reality he said no such thing.
(Time 29:00 in the video below.)


The Romans did attack the foundation of the fort in order to break through and gain access to the fort.
We see below, on the day the temple was burned Fort Antonia was still standing.

The man in the hat claims to be a Christian, who is helping with the rebuilding of the temple.






From War of the Jews, by Josephus, Book 6, Chapter 4, sections 4-5.

"4. Now it is true that on this day the Jews were so weary, and under such consternation, that they refrained from any attacks. But on the next day they gathered their whole force together, and ran upon those that guarded the outward court of the temple very boldly, through the east gate, and this about the second hour of the day. These guards received that their attack with great bravery, and by covering themselves with their shields before, as if it were with a wall, they drew their squadron close together; yet was it evident that they could not abide there very long, but would be overborne by the multitude of those that sallied out upon them, and by the heat of their passion. However, Caesar seeing, from the tower of Antonia, that this squadron was likely to give way, he sent some chosen horsemen to support them. Hereupon the Jews found themselves not able to sustain their onset, and upon the slaughter of those in the forefront, many of the rest were put to flight. But as the Romans were going off, the Jews turned upon them, and fought them; and as those Romans came back upon them, they retreated again, until about the fifth hour of the day they were overborne, and shut themselves up in the inner [court of the] temple.

5. So Titus retired into the tower of Antonia, and resolved to storm the temple the next day, early in the morning, with his whole army, and to encamp round about the holy house. But as for that house, God had, for certain, long ago doomed it to the fire; and now that fatal day was come, according to the revolution of ages; it was the tenth day of the month Lous, [Ab,] upon which it was formerly burnt by the king of Babylon; although these flames took their rise from the Jews themselves, and were occasioned by them; for upon Titus’s retiring, the seditious lay still for a little while, and then attacked the Romans again, when those that guarded the holy house fought with those that quenched the fire that was burning the inner [court of the] temple; but these Romans put the Jews to flight, and proceeded as far as the holy house itself. At which time one of the soldiers, without staying for any orders, and without any concern or dread upon him at so great an undertaking, and being hurried on by a certain divine fury, snatched somewhat out of the materials that were on fire, and being lifted up by another soldier, he set fire to a golden window, through which there was a passage to the rooms that were round about the holy house, on the north side of it. As the flames went upward, the Jews made a great clamor, such as so mighty an affliction required, and ran together to prevent it; and now they spared not their lives any longer, nor suffered any thing to restrain their force, since that holy house was perishing, for whose sake it was that they kept such a guard about it."

All of this provides tremendous evidence that the Dome of the Rock is the true location of Fort Antonia.


If at least part of Fort Antonia remained on the day the temple was destroyed, where is that part of Fort Antonia now?


Watch the YouTube video… The “Temple Mount” is Roman Fort Antonia, by Leeland Jones, to see the truth with your own eyes.
.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.