Is the land restoration to the nation of Israel found in the new covenant?

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keras

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Isaiah 62:1-5 foretells Israel's eventual exaltation above all other nations and what John saw in Revelation 7:9 had nothing to do with land possession. What he did see was a multitude of saints who had died during the tribulation and were now standing before Christ and worshipping Him.
Those who are called hephzibah, Isaiah 62:4, are not dead people and cannot be anyone other than people who have freely accepted Jesus now. The Christian nation of Beulah, in all of the holy Land; the culmination of God's Plan for His faithful believers, Jew, ten Northern tribe member, or Gentile.

Re Revelation 7, that chapter sets an earthly scene and there is no mention of any change of venue. You are making a wild assumption to say that the vast multitude are in heaven. Jesus will be revealed to them, 2 Thessalonians 1:10, Revelation 14:1, but not to the rest of the world until after all that is prophesied up to Revelation 19:11, is fulfilled.
 
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jgr

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All things will be fulfilled when the New Heavens and Earth are created and the New Jerusalem descends upon the earth.

The cited Scriptures declare Christ to be the beginning and the end.
 
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jgr

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Murder starts from within before it is manifested in the outward action, but everyone at some point in their lives has committed murder in their hearts. But do they who reject Christ even now crucify Him over again in their hearts?

Scripture declares that Caiaphas et al literally killed the Prince of Life. (Acts 3:15)

Does Scripture declare that those who reject Christ literally kill Him again?

If Zechariah 12:10 is referring to those who metaphorically pierced Christ, then it certainly also must include those who literally pierced Christ.

That would be Caiaphas et al.

Dispensationally.
 
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jgr

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The national day of remorse foretold to follow in that same verse did not happen then. It is a further fulfillment yet to come of which Caiaphas clearly will not be a part. He is not alive anymore.

The soul of Caiaphas is alive and awaiting reunion with his body when he is granted dispensational salvation in fulfillment of Zechariah 12:10.
 
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There is no implication that it refers to land restoration. There is only your subjective interpretation that it does.
Paul tell us exactly what their acceptance is: life from the dead. It does not mention land restoration.

Romans 11:15 For if their rejection is the reconciliation of the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead?

Romans 11 does not clearly or explicitly mention land restoration. As the OP is about land restoration being found in the new covenant it would be profitable for you to show scriptures that actually mention land restoration in the NT....Please provide 1 NT passage that clearly and explicitly mentions land restoration. If you can't I don't know why you are responding on this thread.


Your claim that Romans 11:12 does not imply land restoration is just as subjective of an interpretation on your part as you have said my claim of land restoration by implication to be, yet you have not been able to prove my claim be just that. Every New Testament scripture that I have cited as implication of land restoration, you have rejected and dismissed as baseless interpretation despite providing evidence from scripture to support my claim.

We know what life from the dead means for the individual person who receives Jesus as their Savior and Lord, but what about for an entire nation like Israel? What evidence would we expect to accompany a nation brought back from the dead, if not a re-establishment as an independent nation in their own homeland? What evidence can we expect to accompany Israel's fullness upon their acceptance of Christ if not restored blessings by which the rest of the world would benefit and bring praise and glory to God?

As long as you decide to continue this debate and discussion with me, I will continue it as well.


What did Peter call his audience? I'll highlight it for you

1 peter 2:9 But you are a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for God’s own possession,


Peter's audience, as is indicated by his salutation, was a Gentile audience because the people to whom he was writing were called strangers. The people of Israel are never called strangers. Like Israel, they are a chosen people. But unlike Israel whose priesthood was confined to the tribe of Levi, everyone who is a part of the Church is a priest. The Church is called a holy nation, but unlike Israel with territory and borders defined, the Church is a nation within all existing nations.


Ephraim was already mixing with the nations during the time of hosea
Hosea 7:8 Ephraim mixes with the nations; Ephraim is an unturned cake.

Ephraim was prophesied to become a fullness of nations
Genesis 48:19 But his father refused and said, “I know, my son, I know. He also shall become a people, and he also shall be great. Nevertheless, his younger brother shall be greater than he, and his offspring shall become a multitude of nations.


Paul applies a passage about the northern kingdom of israel in hosea 1 to the gentiles in romans 9:23-26, does he not?


What Paul revealed was that the cited passage from Hosea was an invitation to the Gentiles to turn to the Lord and away from their wickedness, but he never called the Northern Kingdom Gentiles and neither does Hosea, even when they were intermarrying with Gentiles. Despite their mixing, the ten northern tribes still retained their distinctiveness as a people.


And the hardened hearts of part of Israel served a purpose: the crucifixion. And through the crucifixion, the riches and mercy of God went to the nations.


How much more so when Israel returns to Him (Rom. 11:12)


According to Ezekiel's vision, the land is the inheritance. It is divided up between the tribes of Israel. The foreigner is to be treated as native born and is allotted inheritance (land) in whatever tribe they dwell. If one is treated as native born, there is no distinction one they are joined to Israel.


But we do not know what inheritance in the land they will be allotted. We just know they will be given an inheritance as the people of Israel will be. We do know what the allotted portions will be for each of the twelve tribes.


It literally mentions the word covenant in regards to circumcision, so I don't know what you are talking about.

Genesis 17:10 This is My covenant with you and your descendants after you, which you are to keep: Every male among you must be circumcised.


Circumcision was associated with Abrahamic Covenant made by God as a reward for Abraham's faith and obedience. But it was not, in and of itself, the covenant. Circumcision was established as an outward sign of entering into that covenant.


If Jesus descended from levi, then no change in the law would need to occur. But Hebrews is very clear that Jesus did not descend from levit, thus the law was changed.

Hebrews 7:12-14 For when the priesthood is changed, the law must be changed as well. He of whom these things are said belonged to a different tribe, from which no one has ever served at the altar. For it is clear that our Lord descended from Judah, a tribe as to which Moses said nothing about priests.


Then how is it that Mary has a cousin (Lk. 1:36) who is a descendant of Aaron? (Lk. 1:5) That is not possible unless both lines had intermarried at some point in their history which means it appears that there is a serious problem; a contradiction between the writer of Hebrews and the Gospel of Luke that needs to be addressed.

No one is denying that Jesus descended through the line of Judah. No one is disputing that a priest had never arisen out of the line of Judah before, but how are Mary's family relations with the tribe of Levi explained? An analysis of this and the seventh chapter of Hebrews would help to explain a number of things:


1. How the priesthood of Aaron is able to abide like God had said it would and yet be obsolete.

2. How the law could be fulfilled and changed a the same time since Jesus Himself said that He did not come to destroy the law and the prophets. (Mt. 5:17)

3. How a priest could still arise from Judah when his mother has family ties to the tribe of Levi.


I disagree.

So you believe Jesus will literally hold a sword in his mouth, spinning his head around to literally cut down the nations? No explanation is given in revelation for sword in Jesus' mouth, so it must be literal right?


What does the book of Revelation say about the sword that will be in the mouth of Christ?


My question was what did David speak about when he foresaw that God would place one of his descendants on his throne?

A.) You answered "that his descendant is Christ", which isn't found in scripture.


B.) My answer is " the resurrection of Christ", which is found in scripture


We are both saying that Christ will be that descendant who will forever reign on the throne of David. We are both referring to the resurrected Christ which makes your above statement self contradictory.


Sperma is the root word. Paul does not use the root word "sperma" in galatians 3:16, so I don't know where you are getting your information from.

From the following link provided we can see that Paul uses the singular form spermati in galatians 3:16 in regards to whom the promises were spoken to.

Galatians 3:16 Greek Text Analysis



My information comes from Strong's Exhaustive Concordance in which only "Sperma" is found. "Spermati" is not found although both "Sperma" and "Spermati" are attached to the same Greek lettering. How can we possibly determine which word is being used? The contextual evidence of Galatians 3:16 points to the use of the word "Sperma" instead of "Spermati"

But what is important is that Paul did make clear what Seed he was referring to in that chapter and verse and that it was not lost in translation.


Regardless of what John thought, we know he was because Jesus said so.


In a figurative sense.


That would be impossible. There is not one person on earth who can trace their genealogy back 3,000 years.


Then we cannot declare a prophecy yet fulfilled, but I believe without a doubt that it will happen as it was written. We may not know how it will happen, we just know it will.


Is the great commission related to the new covenant? The new covenant is found in the same passage as God sowing Israel with man and beast in Jeremiah.


The New Covenant is foretold by Jeremiah, but he does not say anything about the great commission although that is a theme that we periodically find throughout the Old Testament. It is not unique to the New Testament. It is just that in the New Testament, more emphasis is placed on it because the focus of the New Testament is upon the world in general whereas in the Old Testament, Israel is a central focus, yet in the book of Revelation, Israel regains more of a central role than they had throughout much of the rest of the New Testament.
 
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What you are describing is not found as a part of the New Covenant, which requires individual repentance, and faith. It is not like the Old Covenant with the nation of Israel.

It is a figment of the imagination for those promoting your form of Dual Covenant Theology, based on race, or geographic location.

First you try to ignore the fulfillment of Zechariah 12:10 at Calvary, and on the Day of Pentecost spoken by two Apostles of Christ, and now you are re-writing the Bible to make your doctrine work.

Do you think you know more about what Zechariah meant in comparison to the Apostles John, and Peter?


.


Where does it say in the New Covenant that individual repentance cannot turn into repentance on a national scale? And if there is any imaginary figment at work, it is that you insist that I am promoting some form of Dual Covenant Theology. You may very well have heard John Hagee say that the Jewish people do not need Jesus to be saved, but you will never find a single post of mine on this thread or any other in which I ever have said anything like that.

John no doubt applied Zechariah 12:10 as it pertained to the manner in which Christ was killed. But he never mentioned anything about nationwide remorse for His death in that generation.
Perhaps it is you who thinks he knows more about that prophecy than the one who gave it to begin with.
 
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But only a remnant of the nation will be saved (Isaiah 10:22; Romans 9:27).

Are the unsaved of the nation promised everlasting existence?

Other than in hell?


It is very clear you do not understand what the scripture is saying. If Israel is promised everlasting existence, of whom do you think the nation of Israel will consist of in the end? The Israelites who have rejected Christ, or they who have repented and received Him?
 
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The soul of Caiaphas is alive and awaiting reunion with his body when he is granted dispensational salvation in fulfillment of Zechariah 12:10.


Zechariah 12:10 was applied and fulfilled as it pertained to the manner in which Christ was destined to die, but the vast majority of that generation felt no remorse. If they had, they would have repented and avoided the devastation that came upon them in 70 A.D. Caiaphas was a part of that generation. National repentance is still yet to come.
 
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Scripture declares that Caiaphas et al literally killed the Prince of Life. (Acts 3:15)

Does Scripture declare that those who reject Christ literally kill Him again?

If Zechariah 12:10 is referring to those who metaphorically pierced Christ, then it certainly also must include those who literally pierced Christ.

That would be Caiaphas et al.

Dispensationally.


What does Hebrews 6:4-6 say about they who reject our Lord, especially verse six?
 
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BABerean2

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Where does it say in the New Covenant that individual repentance cannot turn into repentance on a national scale?

How is a man's salvation changed by what another ordinary man in his nation does?
Can my neighbor save me?



Act_3:19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;

Act 17:30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:


Do you see the word "nation" in the verses above?

.
 
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But the recipients of that Promise is not the citizens of existing Jewish State of Israel.
Read 1 John 5:1-5 for a clear explanation of who is a child of God, the Overcomers for Him and the Victorious ones; literally the Israelites of God.


That passage applies to both Jew and Gentile who receive Christ. Zechariah 13:9 says that there will be those among the present state of Israel who will also come to find their victory in Christ as well.


The people who ‘won’t take correction and trust their Creator’, is the Jewish State of Israel.


They will eventually, though many of them will die before repentance comes from those who remain.


Judah has been punished and exiled before; by Babylon and by Rome. But as Ezekiel 21:14 tells us, there will be a third time.


Consider that that exile by the Babylonians did not take place all at once but in three stages as written in 2 Kings chapters 24-25 and 2 Chronicles chapter 36.


Zephaniah 3:11-13 On that Day, Jerusalem, I shall wipe away your shame for all the transgressions committed in you, for I shall remove all your proud and arrogant citizens, only the humble and peaceful people will remain and those who never practise evil or speak lies, they will settle in the Land and nothing will disturb them.
This is the great Second Exodus of all of God’s people into all of the holy Land. Every faithful Christian: a vast multitude from every tribe, race, nation and language. Isaiah 66:18-21, Ezekiel 34:11-31, Romans 9:24=26, Revelation 7:9


The passage out of Zephaniah you cited says nothing about a great exodus to any place or from any place but is only about who is left in the land after the judgment is passed, but the other passages you cited to foretell a regathering of the people back to their homeland and with Gentile assistance as pointed out in Isaiah 66:20.

What is also most notable in that chapter is that God will make Himself known among all nations which is consistent with the great commission Christ commanded to be carried out and in verse 21 is that they who are not of the tribe of Levi, will be taken for priests and Levites which is consistent with the priesthood of all believers.


Zephaniah 3:9-10 They will all know a pure language, so everyone will know the true Name of the Lord and will praise Him with one accord. My worshippers, all the righteous people will come from afar to worship the Lord and bring offerings to Him. People from every race, nation and language, all the born again Christian people, will travel there to live, in the new nation of Beulah, Isaiah 62:1-5, while the rest of the world is ruled by a One World Government. Daniel 7:23, Revelation 17:12


I am afraid this One World Government will attempt to destroy this nation of Beulah before it is called Beulah as is made clear by various passages of scripture and it will take the return of Christ to keep that nation from being destroyed.


This chapter of Zephaniah encapsulates the soon to happen end times story.
It tells how Jerusalem is denigrated by its ungodly inhabitants and will rejoice when they are gone. How those enemies of the Lord, the evil neighbors, Jeremiah 12:14, and all who reject the Salvation of Jesus, will be uprooted and gone, then the holy Land resettled by the Lord’s faithful believers. Ezekiel 34:11-31 tells it plainly.


Zechariah 13:9 says that a third of the people of Israel will be left in the land and Zechariah 14:2 will not be made empty of all of its inhabitants. But then again, not all of the inhabitants will continue in their ungodliness. Eventually, all the wicked people will be gone from the face of the earth, but Jeremiah 12:14 is a declaration to the enemies of Israel of how God will pluck the people of Israel out from among them.


We Christians are told by Paul in 1 Thessalonians 5:4-5, that we should know God’s plans for what will happen in the near future. Zephaniah 3 gives it to us, confirmed by the sequence of Revelation chapters 6-7.

What is presented to you in these scriptures, is God’s Promises to His faithful people, His blessings of peace and prosperity, of joy and happiness, of security and long life, as all who love Him and keep the Commandments; will live in His Land.

It is the prophetic parallel of ancient Israel, where Jesus led the people through the desert and how most of them refused to accept the Promise. 1 Corinthians 10:6-13

Ezekiel 20:34-38 tells how, once again, some of His people will revolt and rebel and they will not be allowed to enter the Land of Israel.


1 Thessalonians 5:4-5 is about who we are in Christ, Revelation 6-7 is mostly about the judgments to come upon an evil and unbelieving world, and Zephaniah 3 is about both judgment and restoration. There is both good news and bad news in the passages you cite but unfortunately, judgment is a part of the purification process which leads to the wicked amongst the people of Israel being purged from the nation, which will result in the death of two thirds of the nation.(Zechariah 13:9)

1 Corinthians 10:6-13 was written as a warning to the Church which and increasing number among its members are not heeding.


In today’s situation, we have many who have accepted the Gospel, but who have chosen their own beliefs about what God intends to do for His people and during this forthcoming test, 1 Peter 4:12, they may fail to stand firm in their trust that the Lord will protect them. This won’t lose their salvation, but it will be a serious disadvantage, 1 Corinthians 3:13-15

As the great chapter of Isaiah 35:1-10, one of the many prophesies that describe the Lord’s faithful Christian people entering the holy Land, says: ...no one unclean will go there....The Lord’s people, set free: will enter Zion with shouts of triumph.


The cited passages of 1 Peter 4:12 has to do with suffering that pertains to our faith in Christ, 1 Corinthians 3:13-15 is about a fire that determines what rewards a person in Christ will receive at the end of this present age or if they will receive any rewards at all. Isaiah 35:1-10 simply gives us insight into the forthcoming condition of the world when the Lord reigns upon the earth.
 
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How is a man's salvation changed by what another ordinary man in his nation does?


Act_3:19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;

Act 17:30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:


Do you see the word "nation" in the verses above?

.


When did I say that a man's salvation is changed by what another man does? And aren't nations made of men? If all men are commanded to repent, would this not include nations which consist of men?
 
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BABerean2

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When did I say that a man's salvation is changed by what another man does? And aren't nations made of men? If all men are commanded to repent, would this not include nations which consist of men?

Once again you are redefining the word "remnant", found in Romans 9:27.
See Romans 11:1-5.


.
 
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Once again you are redefining the word "remnant", found in Romans 9:27.
See Romans 11:1-5.


.


Once again, I am not redefining anything. The remnant spoken of in Romans 9:27 is spoken in terms of the nation of Israel and in the future tense and what will remain of the nation when it finally accepts Jesus as its Savior. The remnant in Romans 11:1-5 is spoken of in the present tense of those believing Jews and those Jews coming to Christ within a largely unbelieving nation because that is what the respective context of both passages reflect. Nothing more and nothing less.
 
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Those who are called hephzibah, Isaiah 62:4, are not dead people and cannot be anyone other than people who have freely accepted Jesus now. The Christian nation of Beulah, in all of the holy Land; the culmination of God's Plan for His faithful believers, Jew, ten Northern tribe member, or Gentile.

Re Revelation 7, that chapter sets an earthly scene and there is no mention of any change of venue. You are making a wild assumption to say that the vast multitude are in heaven. Jesus will be revealed to them, 2 Thessalonians 1:10, Revelation 14:1, but not to the rest of the world until after all that is prophesied up to Revelation 19:11, is fulfilled.


There is nothing to suggest that the vast multitude that John saw was on the earth. That they had come out of great tribulation suggests that they had died during that time. They will live again and no longer be dead and therefore will qualify for the Hephzibah and the other passages you cite are in reference to the second coming of our Lord who will destroy the wicked from the earth and receive honor and glory from those saints remaining on the earth when He returns.
 
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