Should the world have kept slavery? Why or why not?

RaymondG · Sep 3, 2019

LaBèlla said:
That is why I am mindful of sharing my desires and concerns with wise counselors operating in wisdom and intercession.

Since you seem to not understand the laws of Asking and receiving....it is wise that you keep your desires to yourself.

LaBèlla said:
That is not a slight against you. But there are things I’ve desired that were not the Lord’s will for me. To support that or pray in agreement would be wrong.

Words cannot make me feel any slight, for my heart and mind is guarded. And I was not offering you my prayers....sorry for the confusion.

If you've asked God for something and did not receive it....it is because you do not understand how to ask.

If you are ok with receiving "Nos" You should continue with your current methods and not research this matter any further.

LaBèlla said:
That has not been my experience with the Lord. He wants my will aligned with His.

He wants you to know you already have everything and need to ask for nothing. A lesson I've learned by asking for things I did not need.....and receiving them. A lesson I would of never learned if I was content with "no"s........

bèlla · Sep 3, 2019

RaymondG said:
Since you seem to not understand the laws of Asking and receiving....it is wise that you keep your desires to yourself.

Why do you assume I am ignorant of how to pray and receive the things I seek from God?

Words cannot make me feel any slight, for my heart and mind is guarded. And I was not offering you my prayers....sorry for the confusion.

I didn’t think that was the case. My comment was meant to show that it wasn’t directed to you personally.

If you've asked God for something and did not receive it....it is because you do not understand how to ask.

I think my deliverance, two physical healings, and other manifestations of His grace and favor would suggest otherwise.

If you are ok with receiving "Nos" You should continue with your current methods and not research this matter any further.

I am interested in His perfect will. Not satisfying my flesh.

He wants you to know you already have everything and need to ask for nothing. A lesson I've learned by asking for things I did not need.....and receiving them. A lesson I would of never learned if I was content with "no"s........

Why do you assume He said no? There are some blessings I do not speak of on this site. Especially the material ones.

But here is a recent event you may appreciate. My labors for someone’s salvation and the Lord’s grace and engagement of another on his behalf from this site.

RaymondG · Sep 3, 2019

LaBèlla said:
Why do you assume I am ignorant of how to pray and receive the things I seek from God?

It seemed that you were stating that one could know how to pray, and ask for something and not get it because it is outside of the will of God. If this is not the case, then my assumption is wrong.

LaBèlla said:
I think my deliverance, two physical healings, and other manifestations of His grace and favor would suggest otherwise.

I am happy for you if you know your Father and receive of Him what you desire. to me, your desire matters not....whether it be healing....a car....or indentured servitude.

LaBèlla said:
I am interested in His perfect will. Not satisfying my flesh.

That sounds good. However, God doesnt judge our desires like man does. We see an immodestly dress woman/man asking for things they dont need....He see His Child following the command to ask....that there joy may be full.

I dont feel holier, asking God for a new bible to read than the one who ask for money for a second pair of sneakers.

LaBèlla said:
Why do you assume He said no? There are some blessings I do not speak of on this site. Especially the material ones.

Again, I thought you were stating that God tells you "no" or "wait" or "not now"

It is wise to give alms in secret.

LaBèlla said:
But here is a recent event you may appreciate. My labors for someone’s salvation and the Lord’s grace and engagement of another on his behalf from this site.

If you are doing something or giving something that makes you and/ or someone else happy.....I appreciate it.

May God continue to bless on your journey to heaven.

Jonaitis · Sep 3, 2019

If I lived in the Bronze and Iron Age, I may have owned a slave and several wives.

However, I am not for owning another human being as property (nor polygamy). It degrades the image they were made in.

PizzaAddict · Sep 4, 2019

Neostarwcc said:
Before everybody rages at me all at once, let me explain. I'm talking about keeping slavery as it existed before the Americans enslaved the African Americans and treated them like cattle ...etc.

I am NOT saying we should have kept enslaving the blacks and I think that the Civil war was a push in the right direction and exposed the awful way in which Americans used to enslave the blacks. But, merely that we should have kept slavery as it existed since the beginning of time from before that. We shouldn't have abolished slavery just the way people treated their slaves and people are varying color at the time.

Technically slavery as it existed in Biblical times existed as the rich or middle class providing housing and food to the poor class was not only biblical but it was the way society ran for several thousands of years. They also used to treat their slaves with kindness and respect and treated them like one of their own and definitely not like the way Americans used to treat the African Americans. Once America came around slavery took a turn for the worse and I don't blame Lincoln one bit for starting the civil war. I'm not saying change the world and bring back slaves I'm just asking "should we have kept the slaves?"

I mean you could argue that slavery is out of date now and there isn't much for slaves to do anymore. But there is PLENTY that a slave could do for their master including things that a butler or a maid can do for us. And we don't have to pay like $200,000 a year for those services. Do you agree? Why or why not?

Slavery exist almost everywhere in this world it's just that we have better things than they did 2000 years ago and we produce more crops but in the end everybody is slave anyways.

Just think about it :
- world is so big you could have everybody live in Texas alone with a villa and enought field to feed family of 20 just living in villa which has only basement and floor no upper floors yet everybody has to "buy" property from goverment because goverment said so , and even if you "buy" it you have to still pay tax on it lol so you actually aren't buying it they just lend it to you for fee

-slaves are taxed on everything multiple times , you go to work ? money taxed okay it is needed but why is the money taxed again when I buy stuff with it ? so it's taxed twice ... Tha's not the end it's taxed third time when you die it's called inheritance tax and even your family can't inherit what you did it's to keep slaves always poor for their masters

-your money is literally worthless , it's debt a piece of paper , goverment can simply decide to have few numbers in computer and they made money out of thin air so they don't even have to print it nowdays , bank can make loans keeping only few % inside of bank , so out of like 1000$ deposit in bank they could lend 15k $ legally , where the 15k comes from ? Digit numbers in pc

timewerx · Sep 4, 2019

Neostarwcc said:
Technically slavery as it existed in Biblical times existed as the rich or middle class providing housing and food to the poor class was not only biblical but it was the way society ran for several thousands of years.

Jesus said, how we treat the least (poorest, most misfortunate) of our brethren is how we treat Him.

Is it enough to treat Jesus as a well-taken care of slave?

We can also implement tax laws that takes higher % for increasing incomes to increase welfare funds (which eventually helps the poor, reduces financial burden for everyone).

This is how some countries have managed to eliminate poverty... It's harder to get rich but nobody is poor, isn't that great??? Well if you don't love money (as Jesus teaches), it isn't a bad thing right?

Jude1:3Contendforthefaith · Sep 4, 2019

Slavery Is Evil Period :

Tropical Wilds · Sep 4, 2019

Light of the East said:
You mean the part where St. Paul admonishes slaves to obey their masters?

Do you REALLY need me to explain what metaphors are and what we as Christians are called to do as believers in Christ and how we are commanded to treat those around us, and how slavery completely contradicts every one of those demands of us?

It is 2019. The fact that people use the Bible to justify things like class elitism, racism, and demeaning of other human beings for personal gratification is beyond gross.

Yekcidmij · Sep 4, 2019

joshua 1 9 said:
Some people treated their slaves right and some people did not.

I would say that one person treating another person as a slave is never right.

Some people treat their animals right and some people abuse them.

And the fact that you are comparing slavery with animal ownership makes my point.

A good man takes good care of what has been entrusted to him.

A good man doesn't treat another person as his property.

Yekcidmij · Sep 4, 2019

RaymondG said:
What if the OP desire to be a slave? Would you say it would be wrong for him to pursue that goal?

I'll say it's probably immoral. As a general principle, it's immoral for one to try to sell themselves into slavery.

RaymondG · Sep 4, 2019

jdiana said:
Huh? what are you talking about

Please feel free to ignore that which you do not yet, understand.

RaymondG · Sep 4, 2019

Yekcidmij said:
I'll say it's probably immoral. As a general principle, it's immoral for one to try to sell themselves into slavery.

Is it moral to prevent another from doing what they would like to do because it does not agree with your moral standard? e.g. if you wanted to do something, would you be ok if someone else prevented it because it was view as immoral to them?

Yekcidmij · Sep 4, 2019

RaymondG said:
Is it moral to prevent another from doing what they would like to do because it does not agree with your moral standard?

I would say it violated an objective moral standard, not a standard I've concocted.

I think people own themselves inalienably. I can no more posses your life than you could posses mine as seems evidenced by the observational fact that we each are the ones living out our own lives. The principle of self-ownership looks to be a feature of humanity and so must be a part of God's design. Violation of this principle of self-ownership requires violence from one person on another.

So, I don't think it's my moral standard. I think the principle of self ownership is an objective principle that's true regardless of what I, or any one particular person, may think about it.

e.g. if you wanted to do something, would you be ok if someone else prevented it because it was view as immoral to them?

It depends on exactly what I was trying to do doesn't it? Obviously people shouldn't be allowed to go around doing whatever they so desire since those desires may not be conducive to everyone else's peace. Initiation of violence on people seems to be something that's objectively immoral.

Light of the East · Sep 4, 2019

ByTheSpirit said:
no human should own another human. period.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!! You don't even realize that you are owned right now, do you!!!!!

The BANK owns you.
Your CREDIT CARDS own you.
Your JOB owns you.
Your COUNTRY and the lying politicians running it definitely own you.

You (and I) are so owned it ain't funny!!!!

Norbert L · Sep 4, 2019

Albion said:
I can only think that someone has sold you a 'bill of goods' about the nature of slavery in Biblical times!

Tyler52 said:
Slavery in ancient times was just as terrible if not more than that of the Africans. Thatvis why God regulated it.

So what about people in ancient times who willingly became life long slaves? If it was so terrible why is there a record of this kind of behavior between employers and their workers? I believe it's a complex issue and not as simple as people make it out to be.

The way I understand it there is a major reason why mankind adopted slavery as a way that their civilization could survive. It was the environment. The population at that time in relation to the size of the Earth was completely different. Looking at those ancient population statistics compared to today's, it's like the world is turned upside down. Basically the resulting economic models between the two conditions is different.

Mankind wasn't concerned with Greenpeace and the protection of species. There was no concept of global warming and charging people a carbon emission tax. Their system of doing business would be unlike our own because we're different.

Also given my workplace experience today and looking at the varied employers I had. Some of them would have no problem taking a whip to your back if we lived back then but at the same time there were others who would practically include you as part of their family.

So I don't believe slavery automatically meant all enslaved people were treated like trash.

ByTheSpirit · Sep 4, 2019

Light of the East said:
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!! You don't even realize that you are owned right now, do you!!!!!

The BANK owns you.
Your CREDIT CARDS own you.
Your JOB owns you.
Your COUNTRY and the lying politicians running it definitely own you.

You (and I) are so owned it ain't funny!!!!

No not quite, and besides I entered into that agreement/contract on my own will. As did you if you have a Credit Card/Bank Acct/etc.

Hardly the same thing as being sold by one human to another and put into forced labor against your will at the pain of a whip.

Brightmoon · Sep 4, 2019

NO, NO,
No, and no! Anyone who’s ever dealt with a narcissistic family member can tell you that being over controlled like that found in slavery , is not good for you mentally and in children can cause lifelong problems with abusive relationships.

RaymondG · Sep 4, 2019

Yekcidmij said:
I would say it violated an objective moral standard, not a standard I've concocted.

I think people own themselves inalienably. I can no more posses your life than you could posses mine as seems evidenced by the observational fact that we each are the ones living out our own lives. The principle of self-ownership looks to be a feature of humanity and so must be a part of God's design. Violation of this principle of self-ownership requires violence from one person on another.

So, I don't think it's my moral standard. I think the principle of self ownership is an objective principle that's true regardless of what I, or any one particular person, may think about it.

But who makes these objective standards? Who would you be ok with matter universal standards for you?

If you are for self ownership.....wouldnt that mean that you should allow the OPer to sell himself if he likes? Wouldnt you prohibiting this be taking some of his ownership away and giving it to yourself?

Yekcidmij said:
It depends on exactly what I was trying to do doesn't it? Obviously people shouldn't be allowed to go around doing whatever they so desire since those desires may not be conducive to everyone else's peace. Initiation of violence on people seems to be something that's objectively immoral.

Yes I was only referring to actions that does no harm to anyone else. I did not see the OPers selling himself into slavery as harming anyone else.

However, trying to make slavery universal, to affect those who do not want it, could be harmful.......similar to your preventing the OPer from doing so, if he so desires it.

Albion · Sep 4, 2019

Norbert L said:
So what about people in ancient times who willingly became life long slaves?

What about those Africans who were trusted house workers in Plantation times?

The fact is that some slaves were treated well (if being a slave at all can be termed "well")...in both ancient times and in more recent times.

But also, many were treated savagely. I assure you that if you looked closely at the condition of slaves in the Roman Empire (which included the Holy Lands), you would find accounts so terrifyingly inhuman as to curl your hair. The categorically rosy picture that was painted in the OP here is in error.

A Realist · Sep 4, 2019

The key word here is "property". If the slaves were considered property by law (civic law, not moral), then the slave owner could do pretty much anything they wanted to do with them....beat them, starve them, sell them, kill them.

Should the world have kept slavery? Why or why not?

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