Offence

Carl Emerson said:

I have on occasion delivered a 'hard' word to a brother who has taken offence as a result.

Six months later he comes back and thanks me for the rebuke.

Godly indignation must not be stifled but fear of causing offence.

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Proverbs 27:5

"Open rebuke is better
Than love carefully concealed."

Just thought of this, which fits into what you did as well with your brother.

Sometimes we may feel offended by something said by a close one or by someone who cares, just because we heard it the wrong way, or misinterpret what we hear. Though after some prayers and more thoughts of consideration, we may come to realize it wasn't meant in a bad way, or we understand it was a good correction to get.

This is again why this is important to do too: James 1:19

"So then, my beloved brethren, let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath;"

The Bible calls Jesus Christ the "rock of offense":
1Pet 2:8 And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.

If you remove the offense of the gospel of Jesus Christ you remove him. That is why the seeker friendly gospel does not save, because they removed the offense.

Johan_1988 said:

The Bible calls Jesus Christ the "rock of offense":
1Pet 2:8 And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.

If you remove the offense of the gospel of Jesus Christ you remove him. That is why the seeker friendly gospel does not save, because they removed the offense.

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Excellent point. The offense is a necessary component of the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Many things have been said already; But there is no surprise that true Christians will be offensive to those who belong to the world system.

In these times they have been working on modernizing "Christianity", so when we who wants to live and speak as God's Word says to us, even when this is all done in love, it will be seen as very offensive! We know that the truth sets us free, because we have experienced this! But for those who do not know Christ nor have understood the power of God through His Son Jesus Christ's salvation, for them truth is seen as offensive!

I remember an earlier friend of mine asked me when I was younger that if I saw my old sister's boyfriend cheat on her, would I have told her the truth? I told her "Yes". And she meant she thought it would be better telling a white lie, just to protect her from more pain. Telling a lie would 'cause more pain because the longer the truth is kept hidden from the person, the more painful it will become once it is found out! Knowing the truth at once may hurt a lot, but then you will have a possibility of healing, which may also happen faster than if you found out about this years after!

As others have stated already; Jesus warned us about how people might react to us when being followers of His! He didn't mention that it was going to be easy for us, He did mention we would be persecuted and be having tribulations! But all of it will be worth it, when we stay faithful to Him, as well as do what He wants us to do!

IDK... A lot of these complaints seem to me like people equating not getting their way all the time/having to be attentive to the needs of people of other faiths (because we do protect religious freedom for all in the US) and true oppression.

If you are looking for the faith that exists where people don’t offend somebody, it hasn’t been created that. I mean, Christians are routinely offended by other Christians interpretation of the faith, so obviously there will never be universal lack of disagreement.

But disagreement and moderation and considering the needs and rights of other faiths doesn’t equal oppression. Nor does it even necessarily mean people are offended. It just means we live in a free and equal society where all faiths are protected equally.

Carl Emerson said:

Jesus offended many. Jesus was sinless.

Sinners were offended.

Our faith is offensive to sinners.

The offended cry foul when offended, they demand immunity from offence.

Thus they demand our faith is silenced. They press for our confession to be hate speech.

****** DISUSS *****

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Hi Carl, agree wholeheartedly and our Master tells us to rejoice when these things happen.

I am really touched by Hebrews 11 which most people call the great faith chapter. Then one day I was reading Hebrews 11 to be refreshed and I was moved to read the 12th chapter in conjunction. I realized they are like Romans and James one the faith but Hebrews 12 deals with okay now what your thoughts

A society without offence is dead and corrupt. It is because haters will cause offence and escalate the smallest thing into murder and then kill someone claiming execution rights. It is this that destroys Islamic society and is like a cancer.
Equally so.e things need to be offensive because they are truly evil. Hatred of a group of people rather than an idiology. People can change, but some idiologies are like gangrey, need to be opposed.
We will cause offence in Christ because God haters are the world, so it is inevitable a sinners hates their end.

Carl Emerson said:

Jesus offended many. Jesus was sinless.

Sinners were offended.

Our faith is offensive to sinners.

The offended cry foul when offended, they demand immunity from offence.

Thus they demand our faith is silenced. They press for our confession to be hate speech.

****** DISUSS *****

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Well I will respond to the OP and some other comments. I do really hate a lot of the hate speech stuff, political correct stuff, but I will probably be somewhat disagreeing with the OP.


1) Earning the Right to be heard. When I read the thread at work, I seem to recall @LaBèlla brought up my first point here. I'm currently working on some different Blog or video projects but one of them deals with. Christians tend to spend a lot of time hand-wringing about the rise of post-Christian society but I really think that half of that is on the Church/Christianity. I say this because during my late teens and early twenties I was post-Christian. I had some bad experiences going to Christian parochial school in my youth, and my local church also had problems. Later on things got better churchwise but by my teens I began to expect more from my faith. Basically by then, I didn't think I could gain anything positive with prayer (based on experience it didn't seem that prayer could really help me with my problems) and as a teenager I was very much consumed by my problems (I had on and off problems academically that came probably with undiagnosed learning disorders that tended to get into trouble in spite of studying etc). Besides that there was an issue with if much of Christianity was real or just a slogan. I noticed that while Christians talk a lot about agape, I realized I had rarely seen it! So all there was left was the fear of going to hell, but after being so unhappy I decided to roll the dice on that because it seemed like it might be a kind of boogeyman and I was looking for a better future so I decided to embark on a path of self improvement and self help. That sort of thing didn't last long. I actually did find positive things in Eastern Philosophy etc. actually more helpful stuff than I did as a Christian, but it wasn't enough so I went back to Christianity but joined a different end of it, basically I joined the Charismatic movement in grad school in 1990.


Anyway I don't think my experience is unique. At different times I've looked at biographies of famous celebrities and it seems like they are hints that other folks have had similar kinds of stories. There is a good book that I recommend called "Finding Common Ground", which is about Evangelism in a post-Christian society, and one of the major points of it is the ground is harder now than in the past. Essentially Christians need to earn the right to heard because in many ways culturally speaking they lost credibility with the society.

https://www.amazon.com/Finding-Common-Ground-Communicate-Christian/dp/0802440967


OK I have another answer point that I will be working on...

Carl Emerson said:

Jesus offended many. Jesus was sinless.

Sinners were offended.

Our faith is offensive to sinners.

The offended cry foul when offended, they demand immunity from offence.

Thus they demand our faith is silenced. They press for our confession to be hate speech.

****** DISUSS *****

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2) On Jesus and him offending etc.

I actually have a theory on how Jesus operates. In my early days, I dabbled in the martial arts. I did it as a diversion from school, to blow off steam etc. But I did go to some dojos that were really into sparring, my first dojo in my hometown especially. Anyway I observed what I call "The rule of the Dojo" Basically, it was the unwritten social rule that you generally met your opponent with the same level of energy that they met you. There were some people that wanted a real serious fight, if they hit you it really hurt, so you tried to do the same to them. And there were other folks (often women) who were just the opposite they wanted the fight to be as light as possible and you likewise complied with that. And some people like myself, were ideally in the middle (a punch or kick should hurt, but not enough to really damage you).

Anyway, I think if you take a good look at the Gospels you will find that Jesus operated the same way. He was sweet and nice to the shy, faint hearted types. To the hard nosed Pharisees eventually likewise began to chew them out, overturn the money changer tables (who were grievously breaking the established rules of hospitality and holiness of the temple) etc. But Jesus militant actions did not take place until after he had already faced a certain amount of provocation. The first time when the Pharisees questioned him on eating with "sinners" he actually gives a diplomatic answer "That only the sick need a physician". It was of course a veiled criticism (everybody is sick) but nevertheless polite since the Pharisees thought they were above it all.


Anyway as far as the offense giving thing it should only really be done for a specific kind of reason. Otherwise the default setting should be set to not to offend. I also think some people might have a specific calling in this area. David Wood is such a person when it comes to in your face Apologetics against Islam. He has good reason to be based on his personal background, but it would hurt my conscience to do what he does and I think for most people this is a counter productive path.

Carl Emerson said:

Jesus offended many. Jesus was sinless.

Sinners were offended.

Our faith is offensive to sinners.

The offended cry foul when offended, they demand immunity from offence.

Thus they demand our faith is silenced. They press for our confession to be hate speech.

****** DISUSS *****

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I think that what you say is very true... Words may be said.. but none of them are rebuked as quickly and aggressively as those that are perfectly true and point out faults and vices.

Carl Emerson said:

Jesus offended many. Jesus was sinless.

Sinners were offended.

Our faith is offensive to sinners.

The offended cry foul when offended, they demand immunity from offence.

Thus they demand our faith is silenced. They press for our confession to be hate speech.

****** DISUSS *****

Click to expand...

This is something I have been wondering about . Paul said to preach the word in season , out of season , correct, rebuke and exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine for the time will come when men will not endure sound doctrine but heap to their selves teachers having itching ears . These are believers .
Jesus was crucified by believers . Here in the US , there seems to be the christian right trying to pass laws which are unsavory to unbelievers . This is where the "persecution" comes from . But is that scriptural ? Unbelievers can not understand until they become believers . How many laws must be passed before they become believers ? We may pass a zillion but it will not change their heart .
In revelation , Jesus tells believers to repent . Paul was writing to believers when he wrote ..Awake thou that sleepest , arise from the dead and Christ shall give thee light . To believers . Ephesians 5:14
My fear is here in the US , we compare ourselves with unbelievers and it has caused us to be proud and self righteous.