Questions About the Sabbath? Ask Me.

D.A. Wright said:

You must either be retired or have a really great job.

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I'm retired and have a great job. I work for the Lord of Lords and King of Kings. The benefits and retirement plan are out of this world. I love the work He has given me to do. Our Lord and Saviour has led me to share the Good News of the Gospel of the Grace of God.

1 Corinthians 12:12-14 KJV 12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ. 13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. 14 For the body is not one member, but many.

Titus 3:4-7 KJV But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared, 5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; 6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour; 7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

Romans 10:17 KJV So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Romans 10:8-10 KJV But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach; 9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. 10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Ephesians 2:8-10 KJV For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

Titus 3:4-7 KJV But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared, 5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; 6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour; 7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV 1. Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; 2. By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. 3. For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; 4. And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

Christ claims to be the Lord of the Sabbath (Matthew 12:8; Mark 2:28; Luke 6:5) and God, in the Old Testament calls the Sabbath His own (Exodus 20:10; Deuteronomy 5:14). Mark 2:27 seems to point to God as the Maker of the Sabbath. Clearly, then, God is the only One who has the authority to make days, Sabbath or otherwise. It stands to reason then that He is, indeed, Lord over all days, which goes without saying since He is indeed Lord over all things.
But if man comes along and proclaims to make every day the Sabbath (although, in one sense, a logical impossibility, considering it would render each day without distinction), wouldn't this be assuming the prerogative of God, thus risking blasphemy (John 10:33), and possibly even the spirit of antichrist (Daniel 7:25)?

nChrist said:

You're most welcome. You're welcome to join our group hoping to make the Sabbath a Tuesday or Thursday. I make every day the Sabbath because Jesus Christ is the Lord over all days.

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Interesting that your group would like to make its own sabbath Tuesday.

Now lets talk about God's Sabbath - what God calls "The Sabbath of the LORD (YHWH)" - because for all of us - the Word of God matters.

In Ex 16 God says "Tomorrow is the Sabbath" when it comes to God's Sabbath.

Ex 20
8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

Genesis 2
Thus the heavens and the earth, and all the host of them, were finished. 2 And on the seventh day God ended His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done. 3 Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested from all His work which God had created and made.

No wonder then that God says that for all eternity in the New Earth "from Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL mankind come before Me to worship" Is 66:23

BobRyan said:

Nope - they are made up of the TEN Commandments and this is the moral law of God written on the heart

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You have no idea what you are proclaiming is really true. The fourth commandment was moral as in moral or immoral and that is the only way it is moral. The fourth commandment is a ritual law and proclaimed by Jews as being ritual. You like to quote Baptists, so I get to quote the Jews to whom the Sabbath was given.

Shabbat is the most important ritual observance in Judaism. It is the only ritual observance instituted in the Ten Commandments. It is also the most important special day, even more important than Yom Kippur. This is clear from the fact that more aliyot (opportunities for congregants to be called up to the Torah) are given on Shabbat than on any other day. Judaism 101: Shabbat

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Bob S said:

The ten commandments were made up of nine commands concerning morality. .

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Nope - the Ten Commandment are mad up of TEN Commandments and this is the moral law of God written on the heart
all TEN written on stone...
all TEN kept inside the ark of the covenant
all TEN spoken directly by God himself to all the nation of Israel ...
all TEN still held as a single using such that Paul can say of that unit that the 5th commandment "is the first commandment with a promise" Eph 6:2.
all TEN included in the moral law of God known to Jeremiah and his readers in Jer 31:31-33 where we find the NEW Covenant with the LAW of God written on the heart.

Details that are freely admitted by almost every Christian denomination on planet Earth - including the Catholic Catechism, the Baptist Confession of Faith sectn 19 and the Westminster Confession of Faith sectn 19.

Not saying you don't have the right to make up your own stuff - but reality being what it is...

Bob S said:

You have no idea what you are proclaiming is really true.

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Please be serious.

Bob S said:

The fourth commandment was moral

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I simply point out that all the major Christian denominations have some form of document admitting that fact about all TEN of the TEN commandments.

And that post above gives a list of "all ten" that you failed to refute while at the same time wanting to claim that there is some flaw in that list. How "instructive" for the unbiased objective reader.

Bob S said:

I get to quote the Jews to whom the Sabbath was given.

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I thought about quoting the Jews at the trial of Christ but decided against it.

Jesus replied, “And why do you, by your traditions, violate the direct commandments of God? For instance, God says, ‘Honor your father and mother,’ and ‘Anyone who speaks disrespectfully of father or mother must be put to death.’ But you say it is all right for people to say to their parents, ‘Sorry, I can’t help you. For I have vowed to give to God what I would have given to you.’ In this way, you say they don’t need to honor their parents.c And so you cancel the word of God for the sake of your own tradition. You hypocrites! Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you, for he wrote,
‘These people honor me with their lips,
but their hearts are far from me.
Their worship is a farce,
for they teach man-made ideas as commands from God.’”
(Matthew 10:3-9) NLT

Bob S said:

The fourth commandment is a ritual law and proclaimed by Jews as being ritual.

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Of course it is the most important ritual to them, because they don't recognize all the other ones as being representative of Christ.

More from "The Nature of Shabbat" at the "Judaism 101" web site:

• • Shabbat is a joyful day of rest
  • Shabbat is two commandments: to remember and to observe
  • • A traditional dish is cholent, slow-cooked stew

The Sabbath (or Shabbat, as it is called in Hebrew) is one of the best known and least understood of all Jewish observances. People who do not observe Shabbat think of it as a day filled with stifling restrictions, or as a day of prayer like the Christian Sabbath. But to those who observe Shabbat, it is a precious gift from G-d, a day of great joy eagerly awaited throughout the week, a time when we can set aside all of our weekday concerns and devote ourselves to higher pursuits. In Jewish literature, poetry and music, Shabbat is described as a bride or queen, as in the popular Shabbat hymn Lecha Dodi Likrat Kallah (come, my beloved, to meet the [Sabbath] bride). It is said "more than Israel has kept Shabbat, Shabbat has kept Israel."

Shabbat is primarily a day of rest and spiritual enrichment. The word "Shabbat" comes from the root Shin-Beit-Tav, meaning to cease, to end, or to rest.

What does the Exodus have to do with resting on the seventh day? It's all about freedom. As I said before, in ancient times, leisure was confined to certain classes; slaves did not get days off. Thus, by resting on Shabbat, we are reminded that we are free. But in a more general sense, Shabbat frees us from our weekday concerns, from our deadlines and schedules and commitments. During the week, we are slaves to our jobs, to our creditors, to our need to provide for ourselves; on Shabbat, we are freed from these concerns, much as our ancestors were freed from slavery in Egypt.

Bob S said:

The ten commandments were made up of nine commands concerning morality. The fourth command was concerning the day of rest. They were the "if" covenant given to Israel. Israel broke the covenant so it and its laws are now defunct. see 3Cor3: 6-11 We are under the new covenant that has better laws.

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Keep fighting the good fight of faith and God bless you brother!

Quick Intro to SDA

Danthemailman said:

Keep fighting the good fight of faith and God bless you brother!

Quick Intro to SDA

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Of course, the content of a web site named "exadventist.com" wouldn't be biased at all.

Interesting how discussions about the Sabbath and the ten commandments always turn into a game of "Let's all pile up on top of the Adventists," brother.

BobRyan said:

But not on this board. Members on this board at least - are informed to the point of knowing which day of the week is the 7th day - as a result it is pretty hard to find someone who will claim that Sunday is the 7th day of the week no matter if they keep Saturday or Sunday as their day of worship.

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Since there is no command in the new covenant to "keep" any day new covenant Christians use a day that is convenient to worship corporately. The admonition given in Hebrews is we should not forsake assembling ourselves together. Those who teach we are going to Hell because we worship on, what they believe, the wrong day are straddling the old and new covenants. The old covenant never indicated one would go to Hell if they didn't observe Sabbath to the letter of the law. Israelites were not saved by keeping the Law. Israelites were saved by faith the same way Abraham was and we are.

The Bible says "the 7th day is the Sabbath" Ex 20:10 and most people here admit it - no matter which side of the debate they may be on.

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The Bible also says not to cut your sideburns or if there is mold in your home tear it down. The Bible says there are feast days that must be kept and new moon celebrations to be observed.

The Bible also says: 14 For he himself is our peace, who has made the two groups one and has destroyed the barrier, the dividing wall of hostility, 15 by setting aside in his flesh the law with its commands and regulations. Eph2

6 He has also qualified us to be ministers of a new promise, a spiritual promise, not a written one. Clearly, what was written brings death, but the Spirit brings life.

7 The ministry that brought death was inscribed on stone. Yet, it came with such glory that the people of Israel couldn’t look at Moses’ face. His face was shining with glory, even though that glory was fading. 8 Won’t the ministry that brings the Spirit have even more glory? 9 If the ministry that brings punishment has glory, then the ministry that brings God’s approval has an overwhelming glory. 10 In fact, the ministry that brings punishment lost its glory because of the superior glory of the other ministry. 11 If that former ministry faded away despite its glory, how much more does that ministry which remains continue to be glorious? 2Cor3
If those verses are not telling us that the 10 commandments have been replaced by the Holy Spirit then please tell us what it does say. The Holy Spirit surely isn't telling mankind to observe the Sabbath of the old covenant. Sabbath observing churches are spending millions and more millions trying to convince us we have to observe the day they observe or, as some teach, we will go to Hell and be, according to Is 66, be there for the Sabbath-keepers to walk around after the Sabbath service.

On this board almost everyone agrees not only that we are under the New Covenant but also that the New Covenant is found in the Old Testament in Jeremiah 31:31-33 and also found unchanged .. in the NT in Hebrews 8.

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If in fact, the old covenant is the new one and nary a jot is changed (you wrote it I didn't) what is the purpose of the new one? Why did God even reveal it to Jeremiah.

What makes you believe the account of the new covenant in Heb 8 is not unchanged from the old covenant?
“The days are coming, says the Lord, when I will make a new promise to Israel and Judah. 9 It will not be like the promise that I made to their ancestors when I took them by the hand and brought them out of Egypt. They rejected that promise, so I ignored them, says the Lord. 10 But this is the promise that I will make to Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put my teachings inside them, and I will write those teachings on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people. 11 No longer will each person teach his neighbors or his relatives by saying, ‘Know the Lord.’ All of them from the least important to the most important will all know me 12 because I will forgive their wickedness and I will no longer hold their sins against them.”

13 God made this new promise and showed that the first promise was outdated. What is outdated and aging will soon disappear.

Is Jesus God Bob? Have you read my post so far? Did Jesus give us new teachings in Jn 15 or were His words just ramblings? Jesus tells us He kept the commands of His Father, old covenant, and asks us to keep His teachings. 19 This is how we will know that we belong to the truth and how we will be reassured in his presence....... believe in his Son, the one named Jesus Christ, and to love each other as he commanded us. 24 Those who obey Christ’s commandments live in God, and God lives in them. We know that he lives in us because he has given us the Spirit.

Does that sound like it is referring to the old covenant Bob? Why would John write those facts if we are under the old system. What caused us to be under the old covenant if indeed we are? Acts 15 surely makes it clear that Gentiles becoming Christians are not under the laws of the old covenant, so why would you try to declare that we really are? Where do you get that information?

On this board it is very hard to find someone who will stand up for "taking God's name in vain" or who will argue that doing such a thing is not a sin anymore... no matter which side of the debate they may be seen to argue for.

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What do you mean by "very hard"? Have you found one person that believes it is okay to take Our God's name in vain? If we love God and our fellow man as Jesus loves us would we ever take our Savior's name in vain? That is such an unintelligent thing to even mention. Morality is forever Bob. Not one command throughout the whole Bible that deals with morality has ever changed. Morality is how we deal with God, our fellow man and ourselves, period. Morality is not related to ritualism.

I for one do not go to restaurants for the very reason you state and it is pretty hard to find any SDA church that will "have a catered meal" on Sabbath as potluck.

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Does not eating out on Sabbath make you more righteous than the ones that do? At least the ones who are eating out are doing it openly. It is the ones who hide the fact that they do seek their own pleasures in other ways and yet tell us we have to "keep" the Sabbath or go to Hell according to the church's teaching.

More importantly - have you chosen to ignore or keep the Sabbath in God's Ten Commandments?

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The fact is we are not under the 10 commandments. The 10 commandments were the ministry of death and have been replaced by the ministry of the Holy Spirit. 2Cor 3:6-11

Notice how Paul drags the Ten into his text in Rom 13 and in Eph 6:2 even though it was not required that he do so?

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Is that a question or a statement? Why wouldn't Paul write that admonition? It is part of the Royal Law of Love Jesus taught us in Jn 15. The Royal Law of Love includes every aspect of morality.

AskAnAdventist said:

Thank you for your question

As far as food goes, we don’t cook on the Sabbath. We’ll prepare the meal on Friday and then heat it up on the Sabbath, but we won’t spend hours in the kitchen cooking or putting food together. Friday is preparation day for us, where we get everything ready so that we can spend the entire Sabbath with the Lord and with our families and church family and visiting the sick or those who need us.

The Bible tells us how to keep the Sabbath. The Israelites gathered their food on Friday and received a double portion; they did not gather food on the Sabbath. They were also instructed not to kindle a fire on the Sabbath, or to buy or sell.

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Hmmm! how do you get your food warm if you don't have some sort of heat? If you were in the Israelite camp you would surely get reprimanded for starting a fire for heating your food. Why are you allowed to do it now? One thing I still remember from an Adventist pastor during the worship service is that cooking frozen peas on the Sabbath is a sin. Would that be enough to send me to Hell if I never confessed and asked for forgiveness? According to the teachings of that church it would be enough.

Jesus showed us by his life on earth that the Sabbath is a day or worship and a day of healing. We want to live our lives like Jesus’ lived his, so we go to corporate worship services just as He did and worship together with our church family. And then the rest of the day we do things like visit a sick friend on the Sabbath and encourage them and pray over them, Take our families out into nature and show them object lessons in God’s Creation and talk with them about the love of their Creator and Redeemer, really make it personal for them, visit those in prison (it’s a great day for prison ministry) or those in the hospital.

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Did Jesus really teach us to attend church and heal others on the old covenant Sabbath? Is attending church service and healing others keeping the fourth commandment of the old covenant? Did Jesus teach that we should take our children on nature walks on Sabbath? If not, where do those teachings come from? Are doing nature walks actually doing your own pleasure? Is 58:If you stop trampling on the day of rest and doing as you please on my holy day, if you call the day of rest a delight
and the Lord’s holy day honorable, if you honor it by not going your own way, by not going out when you want, and by not talking idly, 14 then you will find joy in the Lord.

The Sabbath is a day of ministry. It’s a holy day so any sacred activity fulfills the purpose of the Sabbath. It’s the common, every day things that go against God’s design for the Sabbath.

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Actually, the fourth commandment, made for Israel, had four objectives:

1. Work six days

2. Keep the day Holy

3. Remember the flight out of Egypt Deut 5

4. No work

Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath, so He could do as He needed to do. Those who cling to the old covenant command are to do as the command requires.

Sorry to say, I have never met anyone that lived up to the requirements. When I believed I had to "keep" the Sabbath I came away each and every Sabbath wanting. I could never keep my thoughts and conversations on Holy things. I certainly didn't work the six days required by the command and I had no special reason to remember the flight of the Israelites out of Egypt every Sabbath. Do you all do any better than I did?

One thing for certain, since I am a new covenant Christian I don't have to worry about keeping days. There is no law forbidding me from all the prohibitions the Israelites had to keep from doing. I am free in Christ who did away with: even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; Eph 2:15 and the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones 2Cor3:6-11

D.A. Wright said:

Of course, the content of a web site named "exadventist.com" wouldn't be biased at all.

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Of course, you would say it is biased. If I were a believing Adventist I would think the same thing. The proof that it is biased is to critique the statements made on the website. Telling us it is biased and not showing us where means nothing.

Interesting how discussions about the Sabbath and the ten commandments always turn into a game of "Let's all pile up on top of the Adventists," brother.

Bob S said:

Since there is no command in the new covenant to "keep" any day new covenant Christians use a day that is convenient to worship corporately.

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That must be why many think nothing of taking the Lord's name in vain as well.

Bob S said:

The old covenant never indicated one would go to Hell if they didn't observe Sabbath to the letter of the law.

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No, just put to death. (Exodus 31:15)

The old covenant never indicated hell as a result of any offense, did it?

Bob S said:

Israelites were not saved by keeping the Law. Israelites were saved by faith the same way Abraham was and we are.

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Who said otherwise?

Bob S said:

If those verses are not telling us that the 10 commandments have been replaced by the Holy Spirit then please tell us what it does say.

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Ephesians 2:15 is not referring to the moral law.
The chapter is about conversion and the brotherhood of man.

2 Corinthians 3:6-11 is about the irony of how Israel's reception of the glory of God brought death to them and How the new covenant emphasizes the mercy of which Israel were, largely, too proud to avail themselves, even though it was so vitally essential, since mortals sin before they even know what sin is.

Contrary to popular belief and clamoring desire, it does not say "Thou shalt now break the commandments of God freely, and teach others to do so."

Bob S said:

The Holy Spirit surely isn't telling mankind to observe the Sabbath of the old covenant.

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The passage doesn't refer to the Sabbath commandment at all. But the Spirit convicts all of sin--the transgression of the law--which includes the fourth commandment.

Bob S said:

Sabbath observing churches are spending millions and more millions trying to convince us we have to observe the day they observe or, as some teach, we will go to Hell and be, according to Is 66, be there for the Sabbath-keepers to walk around after the Sabbath service.

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Those who are alive to see the second coming of Jesus will either be commandment-keepers (all ten) or hopeless infidels. That is what the Bible, as a whole (all 3/4 million words, not merely 2Cor3) teaches.

Bob S said:

What makes you believe the account of the new covenant in Heb 8 is not unchanged from the old covenant?

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Hate to speak for someone else, but I'm pretty sure he didn't claim anything of the sort.
Try to remain calm.

Bob S said:

Is Jesus God Bob?

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Bob S said:

Did Jesus give us new teachings in Jn 15 or were His words just ramblings?

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Why do you say such irreverent things?

Bob S said:

Why would John write those facts if we are under the old system.

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Isolated, cherry-picked, misinterpreted texts are not "facts."

Bob S said:

Have you found one person that believes it is okay to take Our God's name in vain?

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People who call themselves Christians do it all the time... All the time.

Bob S said:

That is such an unintelligent thing to even mention.

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Why are you so insulting? Do you think it makes your case more valid?

Bob S said:

It is the ones who hide the fact that they do seek their own pleasures in other ways and yet tell us we have to "keep" the Sabbath or go to Hell according to the church's teaching.

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The oft-used (mainly by atheists, by the way) hypocrite card. More insults.

Bob S said:

Of course, you would say it is biased. If I were a believing Adventist I would think the same thing. The proof that it is biased is to critique the statements made on the website. Telling us it is biased and not showing us where means nothing.

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I don't have time to critique all of the material opposing the truth. If I discovered I was wrong in my basic beliefs, I would hope my influence would be based upon Christ and His teachings of love, not baiting people with obvious-sounding negative labels.

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Since there is no command in the new covenant to "keep" any day new covenant Christians use a day that is convenient to worship corporately.

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D. A. responded:

That must be why many think nothing of taking the Lord's name in vain as well.

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I make a true statement and you respond with something that isn't relative and probably is not true. Is that the best answer you could come up with?
Great debating. The remainder of your remarks to my post are not worth my time to respond.

Bob S said:

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D. A. responded:

I make a true statement and you respond with something that isn't relative and probably is not true. Is that the best answer you could come up with?
Great debating. The remainder of your remarks to my post are not worth my time to respond.

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Don't let me trouble you.