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Um, because they are already dead? God does not save those who still hated Him when they died.
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Why does hell exist?
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Um, because they are already dead? God does not save those who still hated Him when they died.
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Cause they're no longer rebels, they've been saved. He's made the vows - every knee, every tongue. Do you say He'll fail?
Again, it is abundantly clear that the same nations who surround Jerusalem to attack it then are devoured by fire in Rev 20 are the ones who come in to the New Jerusalem purified and alive in Rev 21.
Worms eat dead things, not living matter. Who's to say it's literal anyway? And where are these worms mentioned in Revelation?
The same word in Greek for 'fire' and 'pure', So it's the lake of pure ie purification. This is proven by the fact that the nations must be pure and alive in order to enter the City. (Rev 21:26-27)
Glad you're not in charge, boss.
Right, so who's the invitation to in 22:17 - those who are thirsty. Why are they thirsty? Cause they're in the fire. Why are the City gates always open? Because those in Guhunna are welcome into the Kingdom anytime so long as they stop being vile and wash up in the Lamb's blood (the lake of pure). Overcomers get welcomed in, God never shuts the door. There's always hope.
Why's that so hard to understand? It's a very straightforward story told there. Maybe you think you're special and are harbouring ill-will towards others.
If you're in the City, your job is to encourage those outside to enter by the straight gate. Be a fisher of men on the river banks as per Ezekiel 47:9-10.
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Er, ever heard of resurrection, restoration, renewal, regeneration, renovation, revivication? God destroys death, therefore there is only life thereafter. It's not hard.
Great, I'll just put down the Bible and listen to you from now on then.
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Are the bodies of people who were not Christians at the times they died also restored and regenerated?
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Death and Hell give up the dead that were in them (don't hold them back!), so yes I believe so.
Plus
Jesus loves everyone.
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Tyler52
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No, I'm saying he will send them to Gahanna
Then why be good, if everyone goes to Heaven.
These worms are mentioned by Jesus in the Gospels. How else might one interpret worm that eat your flesh never die. Furthermore, why don't you believe that God can make worms that eat living things.
But they're not, so they experience the second death, which is how Jesus describes the lake of fire. How can you enter the city when you've been thrown into the fire that swolled up hell.
I'm sorry that you have a problem with the way God runs things.
The ones who enter the kingdom are thirsty for Christ, if you're right then why be good? Furthermore, how are you going to get out of Gahanna
I have no I'll will toward others, I want everyone to be saved, but without God no one wants to be saved. Why would you prejudge me like that and all of conservative Christianity?
Then why be good, why believe if everyone goes to heaven. Why be a child of the kingdom of you don't have to believe to get into the kingdom.
Are you a Jehovah's Witness
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Heaven VIA Gahunna.
For the glory of God and to stay out of Guhanna.
I certainly do if He can't be trusted.
So they didn't make it to the eschaton.
It says 'their worm shall not die'. Whose worm? It could be speaking of your soul. Nobody can agree as to what this phrase means, it's idiomatic metaphor.
The death of unbelief, cowardice, sin etc - see the list. You and I are on it.
Because it's not a literal fire.
By the grace of God Almighty.
Because I follow Jesus, who warns us of the prodigal brother, the disgruntled day labourers, those who compare themselves to their neighbour. How will you escape the wrath to come?
With respect, that's the wrong perspective. It's not being good to buy ourselves out of hell. That's simony and wrongheadedness.
No. But I get that a lot. JWs are annihilationists.
Well I can back mine up with weight of scripture, for starters.
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Tyler52
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Give me scripture that says God will pull you out of Gahanna
He's the king, he clearly can be trusted and knows what he is doing
No, the nations are Jugded and condemned there
Does your soul eat your flesh?
Of course, but we have been saved from our sins and there wages.
Give me scriptures that say it's not literal
Luke 16:23-24
"In Hades he lifted up his eyes, being in torment, and saw Abraham far away and Lazarus in his bosom. "And he cried out and said, 'Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus so that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool off my tongue, for I am in agony in this flame."
(Sounds literal, and that's just lower Sheol)
The grace is only extended to those who trust in Jesus
I plan escaping it the same way as you, through the grace of our savior Jesus Christ. If we are being honest, I try not to compare myself to others, because most people are more righteous than me. If me and you are saints, then you are probably ten times the saint I am. I am the worse sinner I know In my own eyes, no matter how hard I try not to. So, no I can't compare myself to others, because I can't match their righteousness without Jesus. I spent my entire youth in sin, but I have been saved by Jesus, and now he is my only hope.
I'm sorry if I can off way, that's not what I was trying to say, rather why believe and please God if you get the reward of the righteous anyway.
Ah thank you for the info, I'm guessing you don't subscribe to any named theology, am I right?
We've been feeding you scriptures for awhile but if you insist:
2 Thessalonians 1:5-10
5 It is a clear evidence of God’s righteous judgment that you will be counted worthy of God’s kingdom, for which you also are suffering, 6 since it is righteous for God to repay with affliction those who afflict you 7 and to reward with rest you who are afflicted, along with us. This will take place at the revelation of the Lord Jesus from heaven with His powerful angels, 8 taking vengeance with flaming fire on those who don’t know God and on those who don’t obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. 9 These will pay the penalty of eternal destruction from the Lord’s presence and from His glorious strength 10 in that day when He comes to be glorified by His saints and to be admired by all those who have believed, because our testimony among you was believed.
James 2:13 13because judgment without mercy will be shown to anyone who has not been merciful. Mercy triumphs over judgment.
(So we can see that there is no mercy for the merciless)
Matthew 7:13
"Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it.
(The broad gate clearly doesn't lead to good things)
37 He replied: “The One who sows the good seed is the Son of Man; 38 the field is the world; and the good seed—these are the sons of the kingdom. The weeds are the sons of the evil one, 39 and the enemy who sowed them is the Devil. The harvest is the end of the age, and the harvesters are angels. 40 Therefore, just as the weeds are gathered and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of the age. 41 The Son of Man will send out His angels, and they will gather from His kingdom everything that causes sin and those guilty of lawlessness. 42 They will throw them into the blazing furnace where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. 43 Then the righteous will shine like the sun in their Father’s kingdom. Anyone who has ears should listen!"
(Weeds don't come out of the furnace, also why would God want the seed of the devil in his kingdom)
Like 12:5
"But I will warn you whom to fear: fear the One who, after He has killed, has authority to cast into hell; yes, I tell you, fear Him!
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I gave you all the 'exit from the lake of fire' scriptures in Rev 21-22. Are you saying Gahunna is somewhere else?
Have it your own way, go bathe in lamb's blood.
Lower Sheol. Our Lord is telling a story to the Pharisees to illustrate what will happen to them if they keep telling poor outsiders they're doomed to hell.
If it is literal Hades, then it's all over by Rev 20:13 when Hades gives up its dead. God decommissions Hades for good.
Yes, and ALL will eventually trust in Jesus, when as Revelation teaches the deceiving devil and sorceries of Babylon are dealt with, and the true gospel in proclaimed on Jesus' return..most will. But still there will be many who need cleansing of their sin and restoring from death, and that's what the GWTJ and lake of fire is for.
Because it's about retrieving that every last one lost sheep on the mountain. Until the whole of humanity is made one under the good shepherd.
I try to consider as many different viewpoints as are available and not do harm to who I know God to be. This is why I cannot but uphold God as ultimately the Great Father, Physician, Restorer of Life for all mankind. Sure sinners get a taste of their own medicine, but it leads them to repentance and contrition.
How about you - aren't most Pentecostalists default Calvinists with a hyper-grace front-end?
Yes all these scriptures are about destruction of the rubbish. So that we can be renewed in Christ. Crucified with Christ, die to self, the whole false identity will have to go. This is why the second death in the lake of fire and the nations emerging repentant is consistent. You understand that we need to make allowances for how they spoke and interpreted things in those days. There are many examples of idiom and hyperbole for rhetorical purposes that we often miss. But if you follow the actual narrative (rather than just pulling out scary-sounding verses), you see what will transpire. Praise God, for He doesn't leave us guessing on these important points.
Sure, but aren't 2 sparrows sold for a buck? You're much more valuable than a sparrow, and God has infinite care for even a bird. So He's not going to burn you alive - is what Jesus explains to the disciples.
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Dear Christian: WOW!
Evidently the love of God has an expire date on it & ultimately fails?
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What is so hard to understand? This is the whole basis of Christianity, why Jesus came down to save us!
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What does your mom think about pedophiles, rapists, murderers, thieves, drug dealers, etc? Should a "loving God" allow them to go to heaven when they die?
Do you have any idea what true definition of love is? Let me know if you want to have a better understanding of the true character of God.
Cheers,
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The only thing that matters is did they love God and accept Jesus as their Savior before they died? She is with me on this one, except for her nonsensical belief in baptizing babies.
Why would you suspect I don't know what love is? If that was true, "Christian" would not be the first part of my username.
The graphic is incorrect. Jesus is 1/3 of the Trinity.
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My mom thought they all needed Jesus. And she died sitting in the rocking chair she prayed in every morning.
Luke 23:33. And Jesus said, Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do.
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