White Supremacy Is Terrorism, Not a Difference of Opinion

SummerMadness

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White Supremacy Is Terrorism, Not a Difference of Opinion
Police and local governments routinely create and legitimize legal rationales for aggressively targeting some groups—the homeless, people of color, anti-hate activists, people in possession of recreational drugs—yet when white nationalism and racism are involved, they feign powerlessness until the situation grows out of hand. When the community organizes counterprotests, law enforcement rediscovers its confidence to act. The protesters, not the people they protest, are defined as the problem.

This is where law enforcement, elected officials, the media, and much of the country get it wrong about white supremacy. The ideology is violence, and its adherents are by definition a threat. Their presence makes other people—people of color, people of targeted religions—unsafe. White supremacy is treated as a difference of political opinion instead of as terrorism. People who devote their lives to purging "their" country of nonwhites are a threat; their presence at a community event makes others unsafe. People may reasonably differ on political issues; whether or not people of color have a right to exist is not one such issue.
 

Ana the Ist

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mothcorrupteth

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Maybe we wouldn't create as many "white supremacists" if we weren't busy blurring the line between Adolf Hitler and someone who merely said in a forum once that they liked Ronald Reagan.

Politics are like methadone. If you take the Puritanical stance that you will not tolerate even one step toward the "wrong" side of centrism, all you're doing is backing people up against the wall. If being even slightly conservative is enough for people to start calling you "racist," why the heck not go full bore? What have you got to lose? That's not to shift all the blame for genuine terrorist attacks from genuine white supremacists onto the Left. But it is to say: If the situation really is as bad as they claim, then why the h-e-double-hockey-sticks does their political strategy seem to consist of making the problem worse?

Oh, and regarding the sig... I'm three-quarters Palatine German, one quarter from an English family that was historically Quakers. Anglo-Americans treated us like crap, too. Didn't enslave us, but definitely treated us like crap, even lynched us on occasion. We got over it. Dad is a retired state trooper who hosted his black colleague's wedding reception in Alabama, in the 1980's, same as our PA Dutch relatives would have for the blacks who migrated up the PA Dutch country and learned German after the Civil War. Blue lives matter. All lives matter. Black lives matter? That's just nationalism of a different color. You're an American. If you got my back on the job, I got yours. Don't matter your color. That's what Blue Lives is about.
 
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Cimorene

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mala

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Maybe we wouldn't create as many "white supremacists" if we weren't busy blurring the line between Adolf Hitler and someone who merely said in a forum once that they liked Ronald Reagan.
nobody is calling someone who likes ronald reagan a white supremacist. now was reagan a racist. he was a product of his time so more than likely yes as recent information has gone towards confirming. but the way you present it is not just unrealistic it's just overly sensitive defensive nonsense of someone who seems to be spoiling for a persecution complex.

Oh, and regarding the sig... I'm three-quarters Palatine German, one quarter from an English family that was historically Quakers. Anglo-Americans treated us like crap, too. Didn't enslave us, but definitely treated us like crap, even lynched us on occasion. We got over it. Dad is a retired state trooper who hosted his black colleague's wedding reception in Alabama, in the 1980's, same as our PA Dutch relatives would have for the blacks who migrated up the PA Dutch country and learned German after the Civil War. Blue lives matter. All lives matter. Black lives matter? That's just nationalism of a different color. You're an American. If you got my back on the job, I got yours. Don't matter your color. That's what Blue Lives is about.
nobody asked you about your signature...
and no it's not nationalism of a different color. it's just that you are actively refusing to acknowledge a problem for the sake of your pride. does that make you a racist? no (regardless of your "i've got a black friend" message in this paragraph). your phrasing does make you needlessly obstinate though.
 
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KCfromNC

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Politics are like methadone. If you take the Puritanical stance that you will not tolerate even one step toward the "wrong" side of centrism, all you're doing is backing people up against the wall. If being even slightly conservative is enough for people to start calling you "racist," why the heck not go full bore?

Seems like it would be easy not to if one didn't really hold racist views.
 
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Willie T

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Are we talking about a handful of White nuts across this nation of 350 million who act out in their deranged mental state, or are we talking about hundreds and thousands of others who routinely riot, firebomb, loot, and physically attack innocent bystanders, politicians and police?

Show me the incontrollable mobs of White Supremists on TV almost every week. Isn't it strange that the media can't find any to film.... except when a small group of them might be confronting a Liberal mob? From what is being said, you'd think they were on every street corner turning cars over or looting stores. (Oh...… I think that's another group.)
 
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Gigimo

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Show me the incontrollable mobs of White Supremists on TV almost every week. Isn't it strange that the media can't find any to film....

That's why they show pictures of Trump rallies and claim they're all white supremacists. Just think what would have happened if someone did that to Obama and claimed "look at all the black supremacists" :doh:

There was a KKK rally in Dayton, Ohio a few months back exactly 9 of them showed up and they were from Indiana. Quite a few counter protesters showed up and some of them were armed (One was the Oregon District shooter) I wonder what they planned on doing with those firearms :scratch:
 
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SummerMadness

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Are we talking about a handful of White nuts across this nation of 350 million who act out in their deranged mental state, or are we talking about hundreds and thousands of others who routinely riot, firebomb, loot, and physically attack innocent bystanders, politicians and police?

Show me the incontrollable mobs of White Supremists on TV almost every week. Isn't it strange that the media can't find any to film.... except when a small group of them might be confronting a Liberal mob? From what is being said, you'd think they were on every street corner turning cars over or looting stores. (Oh...… I think that's another group.)
White supremacist terrorism is a problem in the United States... it's not just a "handful of nuts." It's an ideology that is as extreme as shooting up a mall to "kill all the Mexicans" to targeting Latino immigrants by demanding they show their papers or separate their families. Terrorist violence is not the only form of white supremacist violence, and it easier to not resort to terrorism when you can enact policy, like the woman running for city council that wants to keep her town white as possible by keeping out blacks and "foreign-born" people. That attitude is not merely a thought, it holds implicit violence.
 
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Larniavc

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Maybe we wouldn't create as many "white supremacists" if we weren't busy blurring the line between Adolf Hitler and someone who merely said in a forum once that they liked Ronald Reagan.
That’s not how it works. Good people don’t get into the white supremacyimg because someone called them out for white supremacyimg.

They get into it because for some unfathomable they see white supremacyimg as normal behaviour they were inculcated into as kids by their folks and the media and seem genuinely confused to be called white supremacists.

Decent folks don’t engage in white supremacyimg. I’m not saying all bad folk are white supremacists (that would be bigoted in the extreme- I know several bad people who don’t have a white supremacist bone in their bodies) but all white supremacists are bad people.
 
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rambot

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Folks claim "control thought".

I don't know about you but it is a pretty rare thing where when my thought don't line up with my actions

The presumption is they never do anything that isn't meant to terrorize and demean. Foolish assumption I think.
 
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mothcorrupteth

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nobody asked you about your signature...
That's why I was talking about the OP's signature.
and no it's not nationalism of a different color. it's just that you are actively refusing to acknowledge a problem for the sake of your pride.
Ad hominem. It is nationalism of a different color. I'm very familiar with the history of German nationalism, and this is exactly how it started following the Napoleonic wars. We can discuss that, if you'd like. Or we can discuss motives of mine that are invisible to you.
 
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mothcorrupteth

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That’s not how it works. Good people don’t get into the white supremacyimg because someone called them out for white supremacyimg.
That's not my argument. My argument is that when you treat an opposing position as completely intolerable to you, in every minutia, then you de-incentivize moderation and compromise. You don't have to call center-rightists white supremacists; you just have to call anybody who believes in meritocracy a racist.
 
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Larniavc

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you just have to call anybody who believes in meritocracy a racist.
Nobody calls people who believe in a meritocracy racist.

Some people do label their racist views as meritocracying but anyone who actually wants a meritocracy isn’t going to be a racist.

And there is a difference between wanting a meritocracy and believing we live in one.

For example: many politicians were born wealthy and remain wealthy.

That is the opposite of meritocracying.
 
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mothcorrupteth

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It is not amazing at all, white supremacy is arguing that one group of workers is superior to another group of workers. That's racism in a nutshell, grouping and attributing skill to a race.
But he didn't attribute skill to race. He attributed it to environment.

White supremacy is arguing that one group is inherently superior to another. Plain and simple. This is not a mere difference of opinion, it's an attitude replete with prejudice, bigotry and violence.
White supremacy is arguing that whites are superior in many, if not all, ways to non-whites and that this justifies white sociopolitical dominance. Someone who says that whites are superior in some ways and inferior in others is not a white supremacist. Someone who says that whites are superior in most ways because of chance and circumstance is not a white supremacist. (Actually, this is pretty much the thesis of Jared Diamond's famous book.) Someone who says that whites are inherently superior in most ways but that this does not justify exploitation or authority over non-whites is not a white supremacist. Mere white nationalism is not white supremacy (although some white nationalists are white supremacists). Not all white-cultural nationalists are white ethno-nationalists. It's not plain and simple. It's a complex web of nuance that Leftists regularly conflate, usually in ignorance, but sometimes in bad faith--same as Rightists like to conflate communists, state socialists, and anarcho-socialists.
 
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SummerMadness

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Yes. That’s it! Applying anecdotal evidence to draw that kind of global conclusion.

You got it! Well done, you. Now that you have identified your unconscious biases you can strive to be better.
I think one of the issues with white supremacy is that those that espouse those views are angered if they are labeled racist because racist means "bad person." However, they still happily espouse racist beliefs based on a premise of white supremacy. One attitude that has been around since the end of slavery was the belief that Black people were lazy, hence the need for slavery as it gave them order and structure. We still see those views being expressed in spite of the claim that white supremacy is a thing of the past.

I think we need to follow the cue of William Lloyd Garrison who transformed a complex system like slavery and distilled it down to a single point: Slavery was evil; and those racists justifying or ignoring slavery were evil, and it was the moral duty of the United States to eliminate that evil. We must have the same attitude about white supremacy. White supremacy is evil; and those who support or ignore white supremacy are evil, and it is the moral duty of the United States to eliminate that evil.

White supremacy is violence.
 
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mothcorrupteth

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I think we need to follow the cue of William Lloyd Garrison who transformed a complex system like slavery and distilled it down to a single point: Slavery was evil; and those racists justifying or ignoring slavery were evil, and it was the moral duty of the United States to eliminate that evil. We must have the same attitude about white supremacy. White supremacy is evil; and those who support or ignore white supremacy are evil, and it is the moral duty of the United States to eliminate that evil.
"There are times when men’s passions are much more trustworthy than their principles. Since opposed principles, or ideologies, are irreconcilable, wars fought over principle will be wars of mutual annihilation. But wars fought over principle will be wars of mutual annihilation. But wars fought for simple greed will be far less destructive, because the aggressor will be careful not to destroy what he is ghting to capture. Reasonable–that is, human–men will always be capable of compromise, but men who have dehumanized themselves by becoming the blind worshipers of an idea or an ideal are fanatics whose devotion to abstractions makes them the enemies of life." (Alan Watts, 1957, The Way of Zen, Ch. II)

If you try to play the game of thrones from the standpoint of "moral duty," you will lose. It is why the Democrats are losing ground right now. It is why Southern liberals will never come around to the way most of us pro-lifers argue. Because everyone knows that ideologues can't be reasoned with or bargained with. Everyone knows that ideologues are existential threats. Understand, I'm not justifying white supremacy. As my sidebar says, I'm an Old Whig monarchist--what I care about is preserving traditional British-American culture through libertarian-conservative government; I could care less if it's blacks or whites doing the preserving. Rather, I'm saying it's in the interest of all factions, especially your own, to start from your opponents' practical incentives rather than from "moral duty." The natural consequences of fighting out of moral duty can be seen in the collateral damages caused by the Thirty Years' War.
 
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