How America's Vast Racial Wealth Gap Grew

SummerMadness · Aug 25, 2019

Goonie said:
Tell me were these new citizens kept as slaves for generations before hand? Were they property to be sold? Then when freed faced numerous laws and prejudices that ensured that they were not allowed to prosper?

There seems to be this idea that African Americans were not murdered and bombed out of existence for a century before they were actually allowed to make a living; and even then, there was still de jure and de facto segregation carried out across the country. The comparison to immigrants, as if Africans are merely immigrants coming to the United States is rich too. That's the main reason they have been given much greater scrutiny and oppression; after the Civil War, there is a contingent of the population (both North and South) that did not like the idea of the "lowest human species" living along the higher species, hence things like the Black Codes in the 1870s up to discriminating against "black-sounding" names in the 2000s.

mindlight · Aug 25, 2019

SummerMadness said:
Yeah, I did read what you wrote, and you made a ridiculous argument that calls the black mind "late to arrive." You completely ignored the terrorism and discrimination that prevented the owning of property, instead repeating the language used by whites during and after the Civil War that proposes that black want to be dependent on the government because they are used to their master's providing them with everything. That racist idea has been around since the 19th century, it's a pity some people still repeat it despite the data ad history showing that black people are no different than white people. There is nothing wrong with the "black mind", but there is something wrong with legalized racial discrimination and terrorism targeting people based on their skin color.

There has been a black president. Racist actions like those of Koch foods have been closed down , their illegal use of unregistered Hispanics also. There are black entrepreneurs that are now succeeding in more open sectors than agriculture. But statistically there should be more. The biggest drag on black success is themselves, there is little but history now stopping them from being just as successful as everyone else.

grasping the after wind · Aug 25, 2019

Goonie said:
Tell me were these new citizens kept as slaves for generations before hand? Were they property to be sold? Then when freed faced numerous laws and prejudices that ensured that they were not allowed to prosper?

The oppression of the past that those immigrant's forbearers were subject to ( and most of them were decedents of serfs and slaves who were intentionally kept down by a ruling class) did not stop them from prospering. Why does it stop anyone today that had a forbearer that was oppressed? Unless the oppression is current I cannot accept that it is a cause, let alone the sole cause of failure to prosper. Dwelling on past injustices and conditions of oppression that no longer apply is counter productive to future success. Find out what the current roadblocks are and address them instead.

TheBear · Aug 25, 2019

grasping the after wind said:
The oppression of the past that those immigrant's forbearers were subject to ( and most of them were decedents of serfs and slaves who were intentionally kept down by a ruling class) did not stop them from prospering. Why does it stop anyone today that had a forbearer that was oppressed? Unless the oppression is current I cannot accept that it is a cause, let alone the sole cause of failure to prosper. Dwelling on past injustices and conditions of oppression that no longer apply is counter productive to future success. Find out what the current roadblocks are and address them instead.

Exactly.

iluvatar5150 · Aug 25, 2019

TheBear said:
I look at all the success stories from 1st and 2nd generation American citizens of all races and countries of origin, who came to this country flat broke, and are now accomplished, achieved and thriving members of our society.

Then I look at all the whining, complaining and blaming, in race-centered threads like this.

Do you think the successful 1st and 2nd generation American citizens would be where they are today, if they were in a perpetual mindset of victim-hood?

Have you read any American history that covers 1900-1965? Because it doesn’t sound like you have.

The immigrants pf which you speak weren’t shut out of society and forced into poverty in the manner or degree to which blacks were. White society literally forced blacks into ghettos and blocked them from improving their conditions. The avenues by which the white middle class was created were largely not available to blacks until much later, and at that point, much of the damage had been done.

SummerMadness · Aug 25, 2019

grasping the after wind said:
The oppression of the past that those immigrant's forbearers were subject to ( and most of them were decedents of serfs and slaves who were intentionally kept down by a ruling class) did not stop them from prospering. Why does it stop anyone today that had a forbearer that was oppressed? Unless the oppression is current I cannot accept that it is a cause, let alone the sole cause of failure to prosper. Dwelling on past injustices and conditions of oppression that no longer apply is counter productive to future success. Find out what the current roadblocks are and address them instead.

Because those practices did not end in a past long ago, they still occur today, like not providing blacks with the same access to lending in housing. It's simple, the racial discrimination and treating blacks like they are different and inferior needs to stop, we still have that occurring today.

The 2000s and 2010s is not long ago.

iluvatar5150 · Aug 25, 2019

grasping the after wind said:
The oppression of the past that those immigrant's forbearers were subject to ( and most of them were decedents of serfs and slaves who were intentionally kept down by a ruling class) did not stop them from prospering. Why does it stop anyone today that had a forbearer that was oppressed? Unless the oppression is current I cannot accept that it is a cause, let alone the sole cause of failure to prosper. Dwelling on past injustices and conditions of oppression that no longer apply is counter productive to future success. Find out what the current roadblocks are and address them instead.

The oppression that those groups faced was not as comprehensive, not as severe, and not as long lasting as what blacks faced. It was only 50 years ago that it became illegal to discriminate against blacks, while the practice itself continued much longer in many places. No other group has had to deal with as much, for as long, or as recently.

Ana the Ist · Aug 25, 2019

DaisyDay said:
How many 1st and 2nd generation American citizens had their middle-class businesses and houses destroyed in massacres?

Best numbers put all post civil war lynching of blacks at about 4000. The number of black people murdered in 2016 and 2017? Over 5000.

You're barking up the wrong tree.

TheBear · Aug 25, 2019

These kind of th

Goonie said:
Tell me were these new citizens kept as slaves for generations before hand? Were they property to be sold? Then when freed faced numerous laws and prejudices that ensured that they were not allowed to prosper?

THIS IS 2019! None of that is happening today. To make it sound as if these things happened just last week, is totally disingenuous. Shall I point out the multitudes of African-Americans who are doing quite well today, many of them being millionaires? Do you really want to go there?

SummerMadness · Aug 25, 2019

TheBear said:
These kind of th

THIS IS 2019! None of that is happening today. To make it sound as if these things happened just last week, is totally disingenuous. Shall I point out the multitudes of African-Americans who are doing quite well today, many of them being millionaires? Do you really want to go there?

This is the argument that was also made in the 1960s, there have been rich black people throughout the 20th century, that did not mean there was no racism or segregation.

iluvatar5150 · Aug 25, 2019

TheBear said:
These kind of th

THIS IS 2019! None of that is happening today. To make it sound as if these things happened just last week, is totally disingenuous. Shall I point out the multitudes of African-Americans who are doing quite well today, many of them being millionaires? Do you really want to go there?

Let’s say that there’s a group who has spent a couple centuries being enslaved and openly oppressed on a large scale, forced into poverty en masse, denied opportunities for advancement and wealth creation. And let’s say that they finally manage to obtain the legal rights to participate fully in society (even though the practical reality may be much less rosy). How long after they acquire those legal rights do you think it should take that group to close the wealth gap that exploded during the period in which they were oppressed?

TheBear · Aug 25, 2019

SummerMadness said:
This is the argument that was also made in the 1960s, there have been rich black people throughout the 20th century, that did not mean there was no racism or segregation.

All I'm saying is - As long as you stay in the victim mindset, (and "you" is a general use), as long as you keep pointing your fingers and blaming others for your own situation, as long as you don't look in the mirror and take personal accountability and responsibility for your own life, choices and actions, and as long as you never set goals for your life and put forth personal effort towards those goals, you will never amount to anything.

You are better than that! I believe in you, and so should you.

iluvatar5150 · Aug 25, 2019

Ana the Ist said:
Best numbers put all post civil war lynching of blacks at about 4000. The number of black people murdered in 2016 and 2017? Over 5000.

You're barking up the wrong tree.

Lynchings weren’t the only assaults on people and their wealth. The Cicero race riots, for example, don’t count as a lynching.

Ana the Ist · Aug 25, 2019

iluvatar5150 said:
Lynchings weren’t the only assaults on people and their wealth. The Cicero race riots, for example, don’t count as a lynching.

Ok? Your point?

Mountainmanbob · Aug 25, 2019

SummerMadness said:
How America's Vast Racial Wealth Gap Grew

A lot of people in the know
are now blaming the Democrats for that gap?
M-Bob

iluvatar5150 · Aug 25, 2019

Ana the Ist said:
Ok? Your point?

Your reply implied that lynchings were the totality of how black homes and businesses were destroyed.

iluvatar5150 · Aug 25, 2019

Mountainmanbob said:
A lot of people in the know
are now blaming the Democrats for that gap?
M-Bob

The only people doing that are disingenuous, self-serving partisans.

jacks · Aug 25, 2019

Any discussion on economic racial inequity needs to include an explanation of why Asians do so well, given they weren't even allowed to be citizens until the 1940's for Chinese and not until 1952 for Japanese. There history also includes many social and legal barriers in the United States. What's the secret to their success? My guess is it is their hard work, as well as their strong family and cultural values.

SummerMadness · Aug 25, 2019

We're not talking about a long ago past, racial discrimination continued into the 1970s, 1980s, 1990s, 2000s and 2010s.

Recent: Black farmers win $1.25 billion in discrimination suit - Reuters

Thousands of black farmers who were discriminated against by the U.S. Agriculture Department will be eligible to receive $1.25 billion in a settlement, the government said on Thursday.

There would be more prosperity without the racial discrimination, it is not based on the racist idea of hardworking Asians and lazy Black people.

jacks · Aug 25, 2019

SummerMadness said:
We're not talking about a long ago past, racial discrimination continued into the 1970s, 1980s, 1990s, 2000s and 2010s.

Are you saying that there hasn't been racial discrimination against Asians since 1970? I don't think you will find many Asians who would agree with that.

How America's Vast Racial Wealth Gap Grew

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