To Believers, Is This Evidence For Satan?

I ended up in a heated discussion with someone, whom I think was an evolutionist, who exclaimed birds came from dinosaurs. I said that I didn't think little, tiny birds evolved from great, big, gigantic dinosaurs and that Oregon State University research showed that a bird's lung development was different from a dinosaur's, i.e. a bird would not be able to breathe and fly if they had lungs like dinosaurs. He came back and insisted, "BIRDS ARE DINOSAURS!" and went on to explain in a rant like fashion. I thought he wanted to throw down, since I was contradicting him as he thundered on, so I just humored him until he calmed down.

Later, I looked at my six days of creation chart and saw that birds were created on the 4th day while land animals were created on the 5th. Now, I didn't tell him this, but it dawned on me that whatever atheists/evolutionists believe contradicts what God stated in the first two books of Genesis.

Isn't this evidence for Satan? First, Satan doesn't want you to believe he exists, so people usually do not want proof of Satan nor does anyone even bring him up for discussion. Non-believers want proof of God when there isn't any proof for an unproveable God. When you end up discussing God with them, you find they usually blame God for something such as evil in the OT or why does he allow babies to suffer? Whatever evidence you present is not good enough. One atheist said if he opened the ground in front of him and gave him a brand new car of his choice, then he'll believe. Um... it takes faith... but you do not even get to that point.

What I am getting at using in regards to Satan that he exists... because we have God created the heavens and Earth from nothing, but evolutionary thinking says it was the big bang which caused it from nothing. Before that it was the eternal universe. God created Adam and Eve as adult humans and animals as adult animals. Instead, the naysayers say, no, we had the egg before the chicken and abiogenesis, so this is how life came into existence and evolved. And so on. It turned out that everything I could think of between creation and atheist/evolutionary beliefs contradicted each other. All of these debates have come down throughout the centuries, so there could be no collaboration as to what the people who came up with the atheist/evolutionary hypothesis wrote. These writers were in different fields of work and it was written at different times. It wasn't put together in a book like the Bible, but if it was, then it was as if Satan had wrote an antiGenesis.

These contradictions goes beyond that, too. It isn't just evolution, but moral values such as not killing a fetus vs. abortion and a woman's rights, homosexuality vs. man and woman marriage, and even how the world is going to end -- global fire vs. AGW/huge asteroid hits the earth causing a catastrophic chain reaction. It turns out that everything that God stated in the Bible is contradicted by Satan. Maybe that's just his rebellious nature and he can't help himself.

Thus, when you add all the contradictions up, is this evidence for Satan? Does this convince you that Satan is causing it? Bad stuff usually does not happen by coincidence.

Here are some things that are opposite off the top of my head.

GOD >>>>> SATAN
Said it first (can't change) >>>>> Said it throughout the years (hypothesis and theories can change)
Universe >>>>> Multiverse
Creation ex nihilo (supernatural creation in 6 days) >>>>> Universe ex nihilo, i.e. big bang (defies laws of physics, infinite temp and density, all is set up in 20 mins); Before this, it was eternal universe
6,000 yrs old Earth and universe >>>>> 4.5 B yrs old Earth and 13.7 B yrs old universe
Created Adam and Eve >>>>> Humans evolved from monkeys
Created birds 4th day; dinosaurs 5th day >>>>> birds evolved from dinosaurs
Clear explanation of how universe and Earth formed and science backs it up >>>>> Wild hypothesis of infinitely hot and dense unseen particle called singularity; Some event called big bang triggered a cosmic expansion in microseconds that formed the basis for our universe; not clear explanation of what happened
Life can only create life >>>>> Life forms through abiogenesis (based on spontaneous generation that was proven false by creation scientist Dr. Louis Pasteur)
Started with void >>>>> Started with infinitely hot and dense unseen quantum particle
God is timeless and spaceless >>>>> Quantum particles pop in and out of existence
God is light, i.e. EMS or light >>>>> Things happen through dark energy, dark matter
Universe is bounded and has a center >>>>> Universe is boundless and does not have a center
Earth is special >>>>> There is nothing special about the Earth
Heaven (upward direction) >>>>> Hell (downward direction)

Sorry for the poor formatting. It did not take my spaces/tabs.

Brightmoon said:

Maybe if your friend had been a life scientist instead of just your buddy you would have understood that he was correct. Dinosaurs had bones with air sacs long before birds evolved. Dinosaurs had feathers before birds evolved , dinosaurs had beaks long before birds evolved.

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This isn't the main point of the thread, but the bones would get in the way of the birds lung system. Do you need the OSU research link? No one has seen a feathered dinosaur. The huge dinosaurs had skin, not feathers. How can gigantic dinosaurs become smaller into birds?

Brightmoon said:

Creationists think their dislike of a fact somehow disproves it.

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Facts are something we can all use. Your facts seem to be what was made up to fit your evolutionary theory of macroevolution. The facts are birds exist. Dinosaurs may exist today (witness accounts), but the existed in the past. Birds existed in the past. The Bible theory tells us that birds were created before the dinosaurs.

I can understand one difference or a few differences from what God said in the Bible, but not for all things he said. This is no coincidence.

pdudgeon said:

Short answer for a long post: no, it is NOT evidence of satan. It is however, evidence of God's creativeness.

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Sure, it is. We cannot have everything God said in the Bible (written over a period of 1500 years by peoples from different walks of life). While we do not have an antiBible or antiGenesis in tablet or book form, we have all of science and evolution written throughout the years since the 1850s from peoples from different walks of life contradict everything that God wrote. It cannot be a coincidence. These people did not get together and state we'll just contradict the Bible. That's ridiculous.

pdudgeon said:

Satan existed before birds were created, but satan cannot create anything.
Only God creates.

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Lucifer created sin by rebelling against God. This changed everything for the angels in heaven. God created hell in order to punish Lucifer and his followers. Later, we have Jesus witness Lucifer's fall from heaven to Earth as lightening. More on this later.

I agree birds were created, but the day before dinosaurs.

Brightmoon said:

that’s ok . I’ve got a biology degree and I base my understanding of evolution/ common descent on the fact that I understand the subject and I understand the evidence for it. I don’t “believe” in evolution because beliefs are for religions . Evolution is a fact , the evidence supports it and I just accept that.

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Biology, as well as geology, paleontology, and zoology, are fields where ToE is ingrained. However, the basis of ToE is not fact. It's a theory. What if one of your colleagues disagrees on ToE, i.e. this limb formation didn't lead to that? What would happen to them?

Brightmoon said:

you do understand that what you believe is only a belief not evidence. Science doesn’t work on beliefs. It does depend on evidence.

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What you believe of ToE is also "fath-based" belief. It's based on false assumptions. I can argue your limb formations, but would have to look it up. Also, we'll agree on natural selection/microevolution on variations of a kind or family. The disagreement would be on macroevolution of birds from dinosaurs and humans from monkeys. We will also disagree on tree of life or common ancestor. Limb formation would be based on common ancestor. It's not the point of this thread.

That said, do you think all of the differences between what God said in the Bible are a coincidence with what scientists wrote over the years? It would be crazy if you did. It is evidence for rebellious Satan.

I couldn't see the PJ Myers vid as your link did not work.

With limb formation, there was some fake embryo illustrations by Ernest Haeckel after he read Darwin. Darwin used what Haeckel wrote in his second book The Descent of Man. Haeckel misled a generation about embryos. Before we even get to limb formation, we are misled.

Anyway, Darwin did not come up with ToE despite what many people believe. I believed it, too. There were many scientists who believed in evolutionary thinking before that (I knew that even in ancient times). What Darwin came up was an explanation of how evolution worked. The evolutionists did not know how it worked even though they could see it based on their thinking, different from creationists, and describe it. Darwin claimed the characteristics acquired by diet, exercise, and climate, were inherited by the offspring. Natural selection preserved the most favorable characteristics because more offspring were produced than would survive long enough to reproduce. However, we have discovered Darwin was wrong about inheritance, as he was wrong about many of his hypothesis. I think today, we still do not know how evolution happens, but you may have something Brightmoon.

Do you believe in embryology? If I see anything to contradict God's word, I'll bring it up as was it Satan? So far, we got Haeckel being tempted into making up stuff and misleading a generation of people after reading Darwin's famous book.

To the lay people here, this is what Ernst Haeckel did in in fraudulent drawings. He took what Darwin wrote about how evolution worked and created his drawings to fit it. Then Darwin used his drawings to explain further how evolution worked in his second book, The Descent of Man. This is circular thinking of what evolution is based on. In relation to this thread, clearly this is evidence for Satan as Haeckel was tempted into committing fraud to make a name for himself. A whole generation of people were fooled and some evolution textbooks today still use his drawings. Embryology may not even be real science.

Thanks, Brightmoon, for bringing up limb formation.

Haeckels embryo drawings are fraudulent - Harun-yahya.net

Brightmoon said:

. Did you even read my post? . I said that I couldn’t link , that this was a photo and that you’d have to google that PZ Myers video. Here’s the info . it’s on YouTube. The title is EXAPTATION BRICOLAGE AND DEEP HOMOLOGY.
No one gives a rat’s behind about Darwin because he’s 150 years out of date. Modern biologists know so much more than he did .

I’ll see if I can find a better picture of the embryonic pharygula stage Some of those have the yolk or the amnion attached and it’s confusing to a layman View attachment 261333View attachment 261334View attachment 261335the last picture has drawings with the yolk sac and amnion removed and the embryo stretched out a little. In that second picture you can’t even tell which one is human

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Did you read mine? This isn't what this thread is about. It's asking whether Satan is involved as the antiChrist and I provided what God wrote in the Bible and what evolution and evolutionary thinking and history has come up with. It isn't a coincidence. I even looked into your "limb formation" and found Ernst Haeckel which you ignored. You mentioned gill pouches. Did he draw gills on his embryos when there weren't any? Or made it to look like gills on humans? Like the Piltdown Man, he, too, fooled an entire generation. His fake drawings are still being used today. I think Ernst Mayr, the elder statesman of evolution, used it in his noted book, What Evolution Is.

My argument to you for what you want to discuss is science depends upon the scientific method for determining truth. Can you provide something from ToE that I can observe and perform an experiment? Instead what I found was a lie or fraud when looking up "limb formation." I believe in natural selection, artificial selection, and microevolution. That is observable, testable, falsifiable, and is the truth. However, that isn't birds from dinosaurs or humans from monkeys or macroevolution.

Anyway, Satan isn't a popular topic as more people would rather discuss God. It does that Satan masquerades as the angel of light. Maybe the only ones really interested are Satanists and The Satanic Temple.

SkyWriting said:

Some scientists do consider birds to be the last of the great lizards.
Many do not make that connection.
All historical events are Faith based and impossible to repeat.

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Yes, I read that birds evolved from reptiles before the recent birds from dinosaurs thing. It goes to show that God's word cannot change while science can because of best theory.

When did the steady state theory begin to be taught? Do you know? It was something I remember as the universe was eternal. This contradicted Genesis in the Bible during my early life. Afterward, we found the CMB and how it radiated everywhere, so there was a beginning. What do you believe happened?

What I do not want is for science to go back to the eternal universe. The big bang theory may have its weaknesses, so some scientists are saying the eternal universe was better.

I'm not sure what you mean by your last statement. We find that history repeats itself.

SkyWriting said:

The days of Creation week are not scientific days and do not
apply to scientific investigation. If it were a scientific description
then the sun and stars would have been created before the days
started being counted. You know......"Morning and evening"?
that works better with a sun. Plants like sun as well.

No, none of the worlds woes are caused by evolution theory.

The scriptures encourage scientific investigation. Don't let any
cults tell you otherwise.

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What are scientific days? And how does the following chart which I use not apply to scientific investigation?



The above days refer to one day as twenty-four hours. Where the days do not follow this is in the prophecies. There one day could mean one year. One needs to do some interpretation of time there, but not in Genesis. In the beginning, God created the heavens and earth or universe and Earth. He created EMS on the first day. Thus, he was able to fill the void (nothing) and spacetime started. What we learned from science fits his creation.

What doesn't fit is origins based on evolutionary thinking. At first, there was a quantum particle that needed space and time. It kept popping in and out of existence. We also had infinite temperature and infinite density in this particle. All of this a violation of physics laws. Next, we had some trigger and cosmic expansion. No explanation of how spacetime came into existence, how EMS was created, how the Higgs field started to exist, let alone the CMB. However, in around 20 minutes time all that we discover today was set into motion. It took billions of years for the rest to form as it is today. Today's evolutionary thinking forms in 20 mins what took God six days and you are criticizing that.

Now, we can test some of what God wrote about his creation by experiment such as life only begats life.

SkyWriting said:

"Morning and evening"?
that works better with a sun. Plants like sun as well.

No, none of the worlds woes are caused by evolution theory.

The scriptures encourage scientific investigation. Don't let any
cults tell you otherwise.

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God didn't create the sun on the first day. He did that on the 4th.

I beg to differ on the world's woes. We had the genocide and the holocaust caused by Darwin and his cousin Galton. We had socialDarwinism (survival of the fittest) and still have Planned Parenthood today.

What cults are you talking about?