LDS LDS Jesus Could Have Lost His Godhood

He is the way said:

(New Testament | John 14:28)

28 Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.

(New Testament | 1 Corinthians 8:5 - 6)

5 For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,)
6 But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.
(New Testament | John 20:17)

17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

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"my Father is greater than I" has two basic meanings one of rank within the godhead, see Acts 1, As Man the Father is greater in rank too.

He is the way said:

It is not against the Bible, Elohim is plural.

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Anyone who knows Hebrew knows that "Elohim is plural" has to do with grammar, not number.

examples:

French Noun Ending in E + Double Consonant + E are Feminine

• La pelle (shovel), une selle (saddle), la chaussette (the sock), la fillette (the little girl), La tristesse (sadness), la terre (earth), la femme (woman)…
• An exception is le squelette (the skeleton)

https://www.google.com/search?ei=JE...hUKEwjTsrLU_IDkAhVQOs0KHXGtDLMQ4dUDCAo&uact=5

Metaphorical gender can be applied to ships (1) and many other entities, such as stock prices (2):

(1) Is she on an even keel?
(2) She’s off $2 today. ...

Vehicles, including ships, cars, trains and even engines often take the feminine gender, especially in informal contexts and when spoken of by men (“My car, she’s a beauty.”). Feminizing ships is a markedly entrenched practice,

...
Metaphorical Gender in English: Feminine Boats, Masculine Tools and Neuter Animals | Druide

He is the way said:

Yes Jesus is a God and God the Father is His God and our God:
(New Testament | John 20:17)

17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

There are other Gods and Lords, but God the Father is our God and Father:

(New Testament | 1 Corinthians 8:5 - 6)

5 For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,)
6 But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.

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1 Corinthians 8 Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)
About Food Offered to Idols
8 Now I will write about meat that is sacrificed[a] to idols. It is certainly true that “we all have knowledge,” as you say. But this knowledge only fills people with pride. It is love that helps the church grow stronger. 2 Those who think they know something do not yet know anything as they should. 3 But whoever loves God is known by God.

4 So this is what I say about eating meat: We know that an idol is really nothing in the world, and we know that there is only one God. 5 It’s really not important if there are things called gods in heaven or on earth—and there are many of these “gods” and “lords” out there. 6 For us there is only one God, and he is our Father. All things came from him, and we live for him. And there is only one Lord, Jesus Christ. All things were made through him, and we also have life through him.

7 But not all people know this. Some have had the habit of worshiping idols. So now when they eat meat, they still feel as if it belongs to an idol. They are not sure that it is right to eat this meat. So when they eat it, they feel guilty. 8 But food will not bring us closer to God. Refusing to eat does not make us less pleasing to God, and eating does not make us closer to him.

9 But be careful with your freedom. Your freedom to eat anything may make those who have doubts about what they can eat fall into sin. 10 You understand that it’s all right to eat anything, so you can eat even in an idol’s temple. But someone who has doubts might see you eating there, and this might encourage them to eat meat sacrificed to idols too. But they really think it is wrong. 11 So this weak brother or sister—someone Christ died for—is lost because of your better understanding. 12 When you sin against your brothers and sisters in Christ in this way and you hurt them by causing them to do things they feel are wrong, you are also sinning against Christ. 13 So if the food I eat makes another believer fall into sin, I will never eat meat again. I will stop eating meat, so that I will not make my brother or sister sin.

Ironhold said:

You cite this here, when in the purpose-made thread you did on the Tanners I showed at length that their stuff is based on wrenching material out of context?!

Really?

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yes, really look for the quotes from bom with my comments.

Daniel Marsh said:

Anyone who knows Hebrew knows that "Elohim is plural" has to do with grammar, not number.

examples:

French Noun Ending in E + Double Consonant + E are Feminine

• La pelle (shovel), une selle (saddle), la chaussette (the sock), la fillette (the little girl), La tristesse (sadness), la terre (earth), la femme (woman)…
• An exception is le squelette (the skeleton)

https://www.google.com/search?ei=JE...hUKEwjTsrLU_IDkAhVQOs0KHXGtDLMQ4dUDCAo&uact=5

Metaphorical gender can be applied to ships (1) and many other entities, such as stock prices (2):

(1) Is she on an even keel?
(2) She’s off $2 today. ...

Vehicles, including ships, cars, trains and even engines often take the feminine gender, especially in informal contexts and when spoken of by men (“My car, she’s a beauty.”). Feminizing ships is a markedly entrenched practice,

...
Metaphorical Gender in English: Feminine Boats, Masculine Tools and Neuter Animals | Druide

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It is not all about grammar as an examples:

(Old Testament | Psalms 82:1)

1 GOD standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.


(Old Testament | Psalms 82:6)

6 I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.

He is the way said:

Of course we are children of God and brothers:
(New Testament | Matthew 23:7 - 9)

7 And greetings in the markets, and to be called of men, Rabbi, Rabbi.
8 But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren.
9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.


(New Testament | John 20:17)

17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

(New Testament | Hebrews 12:9)

9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?

(Old Testament | Psalms 82:6)

6 I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.

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We are His children by adoption, not by right of birth. There is no need for adoption when you are the natural child. The prodigal son did not need to be adopted when he came home---a child can leave, not come back for 40 years and still not need to be adopted--noth8ng can rake away from the fact of a natural birth. Jesus ALONE is His |natural Son, He needs no adoption! He adopts us to be inheritors with His Son---but no matter what, we are not the offspring of some apathetic creature that can not even produce children of His own substance and some unknown heavenly mother. We know who our creator God is and are joint heirs with His Son. We know we can not attain to what God is, we can only emulate His character.
You do not comprehend the use of the original Hebrew words and when shown you reject them for the fairy tales of JS. There is no salvation through his made up stories, only a separation from the real God for you can not comprehend who He truly is or His great love for us with the lies you have been indoctrinated with. YOU NEED TO BE ONE WITH GOD IN THOUGHT, YOU CAN NOT BE WHEN YOU REFUSE TO ACKNOWLEDGE WHO HE REALLY IS. THAT IS CALLED GREIVING THE HOLY SPIRIT.

He is the way said:

It is not all about grammar as an examples:

(Old Testament | Psalms 82:1)

1 GOD standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.


(Old Testament | Psalms 82:6)

6 I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.

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When it comes to being accurate about the bible---it most definitely is all about the right meaning of words IN THEIR ORIGIANAL LANGUAGE!---Something JS knew very little about, and it shows.
The book was inspired by God to the Jews, dictated to at times by God Himself--all in their own language and use of that language. When God gives a message to a Chinese person, He doesn't tell them in KJV English! He talks to them in the language they know and understand in it's present usage. He wouldn't talk to a Chinese person at this time, in the Chinese spoken 5,000 years earlier. Such a basic concept that you guys can not seem to grasp! There is no way that He is going to speak to me in an ancient, long dead Egyptian language now! I wouldn't understand and the whole idea is for us to understand His mind.
1Co 14:27 If any man speak in an unknown tongue, let it be by two, or at the most by three, and that by course; and let one interpret.
1Co 14:28 But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church; and let him speak to himself, and to God.

God is not the author of confusion. Your believes are confusion.

mmksparbud said:

We are His children by adoption, not by right of birth. There is no need for adoption when you are the natural child. The prodigal son did not need to be adopted when he came home---a child can leave, not come back for 40 years and still not need to be adopted--noth8ng can rake away from the fact of a natural birth. Jesus ALONE is His |natural Son, He needs no adoption! He adopts us to be inheritors with His Son---but no matter what, we are not the offspring of some apathetic creature that can not even produce children of His own substance and some unknown heavenly mother. We know who our creator God is and are joint heirs with His Son. We know we can not attain to what God is, we can only emulate His character.
You do not comprehend the use of the original Hebrew words and when shown you reject them for the fairy tales of JS. There is no salvation through his made up stories, only a separation from the real God for you can not comprehend who He truly is or His great love for us with the lies you have been indoctrinated with. YOU NEED TO BE ONE WITH GOD IN THOUGHT, YOU CAN NOT BE WHEN YOU REFUSE TO ACKNOWLEDGE WHO HE REALLY IS. THAT IS CALLED GREIVING THE HOLY SPIRIT.

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We are God's sons but we can become orphans:

(New Testament | Hebrews 12:5 - 14)

5 And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children, My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him:
6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.
9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?
10 For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness.
11 Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby.
12 Wherefore lift up the hands which hang down, and the feeble knees;
13 And make straight paths for your feet, lest that which is lame be turned out of the way; but let it rather be healed.
14 Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord:

Those who are subject to the will of God maintain their status as God's children.

mmksparbud said:

When it comes to being accurate about the bible---it most definitely is all about the right meaning of words IN THEIR ORIGIANAL LANGUAGE!---Something JS knew very little about, and it shows.
The book was inspired by God to the Jews, dictated to at times by God Himself--all in their own language and use of that language. When God gives a message to a Chinese person, He doesn't tell them in KJV English! He talks to them in the language they know and understand in it's present usage. He wouldn't talk to a Chinese person at this time, in the Chinese spoken 5,000 years earlier. Such a basic concept that you guys can not seem to grasp! There is no way that He is going to speak to me in an ancient, long dead Egyptian language now! I wouldn't understand and the whole idea is for us to understand His mind.
1Co 14:27 If any man speak in an unknown tongue, let it be by two, or at the most by three, and that by course; and let one interpret.
1Co 14:28 But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church; and let him speak to himself, and to God.

God is not the author of confusion. Your believes are confusion.

Click to expand...

For some it is given to understand the word of God:

(New Testament | Luke 8:10)

10 And he said, Unto you it is given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God: but to others in parables; that seeing they might not see, and hearing they might not understand.

He is the way said:

We are God's sons but we can become orphans:

(New Testament | Hebrews 12:5 - 14)

5 And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children, My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him:
6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.
9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?
10 For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness.
11 Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby.
12 Wherefore lift up the hands which hang down, and the feeble knees;
13 And make straight paths for your feet, lest that which is lame be turned out of the way; but let it rather be healed.
14 Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord:

Those who are subject to the will of God maintain their status as God's children.

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And? We are still not His natural children.

He is the way said:

For some it is given to understand the word of God:

(New Testament | Luke 8:10)

10 And he said, Unto you it is given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God: but to others in parables; that seeing they might not see, and hearing they might not understand.

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It is for everyone who listens to the Holy Spirit and reads it. It is those who do not wish to understand because they are not listening to the Holy Spirit.

Luk_11:13 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?

He doesn't hide His word from those who want the truth.

mmksparbud said:

It is for everyone who listens to the Holy Spirit and reads it. It is those who do not wish to understand because they are not listening to the Holy Spirit.

Luk_11:13 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?

He doesn't hide His word from those who want the truth.

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He gives understanding to those who seek Him and His rightness:

(New Testament | Matthew 6:33)

33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.

He is the way said:

He gives understanding to those who seek Him and His rightness:

(New Testament | Matthew 6:33)

33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.

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Yes--to all who seek Him. Mormonism teaches a burning chest and the doctrines of JS over seeking the Holy Spirit and the word of God. It is not righteousness and the truth of His word that is sought after, but the JS concept of exaltation.

mmksparbud said:

Yes--to all who seek Him. Mormonism teaches a burning chest and the doctrines of JS over seeking the Holy Spirit and the word of God. It is not righteousness and the truth of His word that is sought after, but the JS concept of exaltation.

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We do seek the Holy Spirit and righteousness, we know thar righteousness is seeking the will of the Father and keeping the commandments.

Phoebe Ann said:

Matthew 6:33 isn't about understanding; it's about trusting God to provide for us.

Do Not Worry

Matthew 6
25 Therefore I say unto you, Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat, or what ye shall drink; nor yet for your body, what ye shall put on. Is not the life more than meat, and the body than raiment?
....31 Therefore take no thought, saying, What shall we eat? or, What shall we drink? or, Wherewithal shall we be clothed? 32 (For after all these things do the Gentiles seek) for your heavenly Father knoweth that ye have need of all these things. 33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.

34 Take therefore no thought for the morrow: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself. Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof.

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It is about trusting God and before that Jesus said:

(New Testament | Matthew 6:19 - 23)

19 ¶ Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal:
20 But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:
21 For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.
22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.
23 But if thine eye be evil, thy whole body shall be full of darkness. If therefore the light that is in thee be darkness, how great is that darkness!

Phoebe Ann said:

His righteousness, not ours!

2 Cor. 5
21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Romans 10
1 Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved. 2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. 3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God. 4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

Galatians 3
11 But that no one is justified by the law in the sight of God is evident, for “the just shall live by faith.”

Romans 3
20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: 23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; 24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: 25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; 26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

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2 Cor. 5
21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Those who repent of their sins and thereafter keep the commandments will be saved. Once we know the way of righteousness we should NOT sin:

(New Testament | Romans 6:1 - 12)

1 WHAT shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.
8 Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:
9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
10 For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.

Phoebe Ann said:

We don't maintain our status; He does!

Romans 8
37 Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. 38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, 39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

John 10
27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: 28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.

Sheep never become goats!

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(New Testament | John 15:14)

14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.

(New Testament | John 14:23 - 24)

23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.
24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.