It Is Going To Get Worse

FreeinChrist

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I've seen a black man (whom I was freinds with in RL) be called a racist for his political views, I have been told by someone who has never so much as read a Qur'an that I don't know Islam (keep in mind this is my former religion prior to being saved, and I was told this when I was still a practicing Muslim) and I've seen my husband be called a "white nationalist" for his political views by ignorant people online..(he is anything but I can assure you)

Now that we have this thing called the internet and we can speak to all manner of people without seeing the person your speaking to, everything and everyone seems to be getting all these crazy labels, all because we disagree.

The most dangerous thing of all is to label all who disagree with your ideology as hateful racist bigots because it takes away their very humanity in your mind, and then anything to oppose their ideas becomes acceptable.

And I've seen it time and time again, and see it in all these articles posted on the first page.. it's about labeling the other side of the political spectrum as something evil, and making you fear and hate them.

It is dangerous, and is itself evil being perpetrated on you.. and you all seem to feed on it instead of truth.

How is ignoring white nationalist rhetoric helping anything?
 
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FreeinChrist

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A myth at best.

Yahuweh says not to seek to do things the way the heathen nations/ other peoples (not led by Yahuweh) do things. Israel was punished when they decided to anyway.

Americans are punished A LOT for turning away from Yahuweh, trusting in themselves or some ungodly system. Greatly increased oppression of the poor, increased sexual perversion, increased abortion, increased divorce which God hates, increased lies in politics and religious groups, increased deception en masse for TRILLIONS OF DOLLARS ....
This is not the topic of the thread.
 
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Hazelelponi

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No, it is about labeling a problem viewpoint that is hateful to others, whom God loves, as evil, and it is not a viewpoint that is held by most Republicans. It is inspiring extremists to commit awful acts though.

"A problem viewpoint that is hateful"

I'm sorry, would that have anything to do with our national sovereignty? Is that what is problematic?

That's only problematic to those who desire to overthrow our nation.

Seriously, you all have fun hating all who disagree with your ideas I guess ... I tried only to interject some sanity into the thread.

I've seen too many misplaced accusations to believe in the lie.
 
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FreeinChrist

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"A problem viewpoint that is hateful"

I'm sorry, would that have anything to do with our national sovereignty? Is that what is problematic?

That's only problematic to those who desire to overthrow our nation.

Seriously, you all have fun hating all who disagree with your ideas I guess ... I tried only to interject some sanity into the thread.

I've seen too many misplaced accusations to believe in the lie.
Do you think white nationalism is a problem view?
 
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bekkilyn

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"A problem viewpoint that is hateful"

I'm sorry, would that have anything to do with our national sovereignty? Is that what is problematic?

That's only problematic to those who desire to overthrow our nation.

Seriously, you all have fun hating all who disagree with your ideas I guess ... I tried only to interject some sanity into the thread.

I've seen too many misplaced accusations to believe in the lie.

So you're saying that white people deserve national sovereignty over everyone else, and those who oppose white nationalism are desiring to overthrow the nation? I'm not sure that's what you're intending to argue, but that's how it's coming across.
 
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redleghunter

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So you're saying that white people deserve national sovereignty over everyone else, and those who oppose white nationalism are desiring to overthrow the nation? I'm not sure that's what you're intending to argue, but that's how it's coming across.
How did you conclude the above from what she posted?
 
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Hazelelponi

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So you're saying that white people deserve national sovereignty over everyone else, and those who oppose white nationalism are desiring to overthrow the nation? I'm not sure that's what you're intending to argue, but that's how it's coming across.

In the United States there are people of all races. There are black people, brown people, red people, yellow people, white people even a couple blue ones..

So caring about, and being desirous of the enforcement of our national sovereignty has nothing to do with race at all.

There are people, such as the articles posted on page 1 of this thread show, that would like you to believe this topic only matters to racist white people who are full of hate, but that is a lie.

The sovereignty of our nation matters to, and should matter to, every single American citizen regardless of ethnicity.

There are lots of people from all races that support limited immigration over open borders who are, quite frankly, sick of the lie that we are racist white people..

This lie is being promulgated because online you can't see the race of the people you speak to.. so they say to fear these ideas because we are "white supremacists".. but we aren't white supremacists, many aren't even white. And there is nothing hateful being espoused.
 
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FreeinChrist

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In the United States there are people of all races. There are black people, brown people, red people, yellow people, white people even a couple blue ones..

So caring about, and being desirous of the enforcement of our national sovereignty has nothing to do with race at all.

There are people, such as the articles posted on page 1 of this thread show, that would like you to believe this topic only matters to racist white people who are full of hate, but that is a lie.

The sovereignty of our nation matters to, and should matter to, every single American citizen regardless of ethnicity.

There are lots of people from all races that support limited immigration over open borders who are, quite frankly, sick of the lie that we are racist white people..

This lie is being promulgated because online you can't see the race of the people you speak to.. so they say to fear these ideas because we are "white supremacists".. but we aren't white supremacists, many aren't even white. And there is nothing hateful being espoused.
So you are going to ignore that there are groups who actively hate non-whites, and inspire people like them to drive cars into crowds, or take a AK 47 to Walmart, or to a theater, or to a concert, and kill people? And all because they fear a white genocide or replacement?

Ever read the junk at Stormfront?

For readers, check out:
Fourteen Words - Wikipedia
Right-Wing Extremism Linked to Every 2018 Extremist Murder in the U.S., ADL Finds


Denying their existence is why they are allowed to grow unimpeded.
 
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redleghunter

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I'm having difficulty seeing how you got this....
So you are going to ignore that there are groups who actively hate non-whites, and inspire people like them to drive cars into crowds, or take a AK 47 to Walmart, or to a theater, or to a concert, and kill people? And all because they fear a white genocide or replacement?

Ever read the junk at Stormfront?

From this....
In the United States there are people of all races. There are black people, brown people, red people, yellow people, white people even a couple blue ones..

So caring about, and being desirous of the enforcement of our national sovereignty has nothing to do with race at all.

There are people, such as the articles posted on page 1 of this thread show, that would like you to believe this topic only matters to racist white people who are full of hate, but that is a lie.

The sovereignty of our nation matters to, and should matter to, every single American citizen regardless of ethnicity.

There are lots of people from all races that support limited immigration over open borders who are, quite frankly, sick of the lie that we are racist white people..

This lie is being promulgated because online you can't see the race of the people you speak to.. so they say to fear these ideas because we are "white supremacists".. but we aren't white supremacists, many aren't even white. And there is nothing hateful being espoused.
 
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FreeinChrist

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I'm having difficulty seeing how you got this....


From this....


This lie is being promulgated because online you can't see the race of the people you speak to.. so they say to fear these ideas because we are "white supremacists".. but we aren't white supremacists, many aren't even white. And there is nothing hateful being espoused.

Lots of white Americans are not nationalists or supremacists and while wanting border controls, do not approve of the abuse of immigrants.
But this thread is about the FACT that there are white supremacists types in the US, that the extremism on the right is growing, and denying it does not make it go away.

Conservative Christians should dislike white nationalism intensely.
 
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redleghunter

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Lots of white Americans are not nationalists or supremacists and while wanting border controls, do not approve of the abuse of immigrants.
Agreed.

But this thread is about the FACT that there are white supremacists types in the US, that the extremism on the right is growing, and denying it does not make it go away.
I don't think anyone has denied this. Especially the poster who I quoted. I have seen nothing but Christian love in her posting history across this site. Extremism on the right and left is growing and very concerning. White supremacists notably more in the most recent domestic terror shootings.

Conservative Christians should dislike white nationalism intensely.
Yes of course and I agree wholeheartedly. White nationalism is hate and the heart of man is desperately wicked and those who harbor hate have already murdered in their hearts. And some actually do murder reflecting the hateful heart. That right there is a sermon which needs to be heard, as everyone examines what is harbored in their heart is the true intentions of our fallen nature.

I think the issue comes up as @Hazelelponi pointed out (as did you above) there are loving Christians and Conservatives and Moderates and Liberals who want our government enforcing the law. Having a law abiding ethic for the government to enforce the sovereignty of our country seems to be attacked by some (not you) as a 'dog whistle' for anti-immigration and racism.

And we Christians can be both law abiding citizens, expect our government to enforce the laws our elected representatives passed and also answer the call to the humanitarian crisis at our border in Christian love. These are not exclusive with the others, as some in the press seem to portray.

Speaking as a Christian who like you has been around this world a bit...The dire picture the Apostle Paul paints for us in Romans chapters one through three has been at work since the fall of mankind. It gets worse as there are more of us in this world. And I think that is why in another thread @Hammster was imploring us all to preach the Gospel.

When the Pharisees were what we would call "virtue signaling" today about keeping the outside clean Jesus focused on the inner person and indicts fallen humanity (bear with me, I like to put the context of the passage out there)

Mark 7: NASB

1The Pharisees and some of the scribes gathered around Him when they had come from Jerusalem, 2and had seen that some of His disciples were eating their bread with impure hands, that is, unwashed. 3(For the Pharisees and all the Jews do not eat unless they carefully wash their hands, thus observing the traditions of the elders; 4and when they come from the market place, they do not eat unless they cleanse themselves; and there are many other things which they have received in order to observe, such as the washing of cups and pitchers and copper pots.) 5The Pharisees and the scribes asked Him, “Why do Your disciples not walk according to the tradition of the elders, but eat their bread with impure hands?”

6And He said to them, “Rightly did Isaiah prophesy of you hypocrites, as it is written:
‘THIS PEOPLE HONORS ME WITH THEIR LIPS,
BUT THEIR HEART IS FAR AWAY FROM ME.


7‘BUT IN VAIN DO THEY WORSHIP ME,
TEACHING AS DOCTRINES THE PRECEPTS OF MEN.’


8“Neglecting the commandment of God, you hold to the tradition of men.”

9He was also saying to them, “You are experts at setting aside the commandment of God in order to keep your tradition. 10“For Moses said, ‘HONOR YOUR FATHER AND YOUR MOTHER’; and, ‘HE WHO SPEAKS EVIL OF FATHER OR MOTHER, IS TO BE PUT TO DEATH’; 11but you say, ‘If a man says to his father or his mother, whatever I have that would help you is Corban (that is to say, given to God),’ 12you no longer permit him to do anything for his father or his mother; 13thus invalidating the word of God by your tradition which you have handed down; and you do many things such as that.”

14After He called the crowd to Him again, He began saying to them, “Listen to Me, all of you, and understand: 15there is nothing outside the man which can defile him if it goes into him; but the things which proceed out of the man are what defile the man. 16[“If anyone has ears to hear, let him hear.”]

17When he had left the crowd and entered the house, His disciples questioned Him about the parable. 18And He said to them, “Are you so lacking in understanding also? Do you not understand that whatever goes into the man from outside cannot defile him, 19because it does not go into his heart, but into his stomach, and is eliminated?” (Thus He declared all foods clean.) 20And He was saying, “That which proceeds out of the man, that is what defiles the man. 21“For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed the evil thoughts, fornications, thefts, murders, adulteries, 22deeds of coveting and wickedness, as well as deceit, sensuality, envy, slander, pride and foolishness. 23“All these evil things proceed from within and defile the man.”

Bold red underlined just above is what each generation deals with. We are no different other than each generation has their white supremacists, Marxist genocidal maniacs, violent religious extremists, and dehumanizing government policies and unjust practices. Yes we need to call it out, speak and teach against it and fight it. This evil proceeds from the fallen sinful human heart. Only One can change that, and we as Christians need to be equipped to pronounce the Hope that is in us, that Hope is Jesus Christ our sure and steady anchor.
 
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rambot

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Or maybe a dog-whistle to Liberals about something they could do? Just imagine if someone who identified as liberal went on a shooting spree after seeing that movie! It would be so interesting to watch the MSM and Hollywood try to defend making the movie afterwards.
I like that with liberals you still have to say " just imagine if someone who identified as liberal went on a shooting spree"..
 
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redleghunter

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I like that with liberals you still have to say " just imagine if someone who identified as liberal went on a shooting spree"..
I think he was clear in saying "after seeing that movie." ;)
 
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Agreed.


I don't think anyone has denied this. Especially the poster who I quoted. I have seen nothing but Christian love in her posting history across this site. Extremism on the right and left is growing and very concerning. White supremacists notably more in the most recent domestic terror shootings.
I disagree in that when a member misunderstands what is being said with the deflection (and some insult) that the left is referring to all the right as racists, she is also denying the FACT that White nationalism is a growing issue in this country. The right needs to also stand up against it.
Recognizing the existence of those groups is not "drinking iniquity" as was suggested (and is highly insulting),nor is it listening to puppets.
It is reality and Christians on both sides of the aisle need to resist its growth.
And it is comments like this that show that rather than deal with the truth of the existence of white nationalists, it is easier to deny it:

The most dangerous thing of all is to label all who disagree with your ideology as hateful racist bigots because it takes away their very humanity in your mind, and then anything to oppose their ideas becomes acceptable.

And I've seen it time and time again, and see it in all these articles posted on the first page.. it's about labeling the other side of the political spectrum as something evil, and making you fear and hate them.

It is dangerous, and is itself evil being perpetrated on you.. and you all seem to feed on it instead of truth.
Feeding on the TRUTH means recognizing the groups exist and not turning a blind eye to them. I t means standing up for Christian truths like God loves everyone so much He sent His Son to die for their sins. His Son did not advocate mistreating foreigners.


Yes of course and I agree wholeheartedly. White nationalism is hate and the heart of man is desperately wicked and those who harbor hate have already murdered in their hearts. And some actually do murder reflecting the hateful heart. That right there is a sermon which needs to be heard, as everyone examines what is harbored in their heart is the true intentions of our fallen nature.

I think the issue comes up as @Hazelelponi pointed out (as did you above) there are loving Christians and Conservatives and Moderates and Liberals who want our government enforcing the law. Having a law abiding ethic for the government to enforce the sovereignty of our country seems to be attacked by some (not you) as a 'dog whistle' for anti-immigration and racism.

I already said there is folks on both sides wanting the law enforced. However, it needs to be enforced and not abused which is what is happening. I like how you are borrowing the "dogwhistle" term - are you recognizing the dogwhistles of white supremacists. Why isn't the right more outraged at mistreatment at the border?





And we Christians can be both law abiding citizens, expect our government to enforce the laws our elected representatives passed and also answer the call to the humanitarian crisis at our border in Christian love. These are not exclusive with the others, as some in the press seem to portray.

Speaking as a Christian who like you has been around this world a bit...The dire picture the Apostle Paul paints for us in Romans chapters one through three has been at work since the fall of mankind. It gets worse as there are more of us in this world. And I think that is why in another thread @Hammster was imploring us all to preach the Gospel.

When the Pharisees were what we would call "virtue signaling" today about keeping the outside clean Jesus focused on the inner person and indicts fallen humanity (bear with me, I like to put the context of the passage out there)

Mark 7: NASB

1The Pharisees and some of the scribes gathered around Him when they had come from Jerusalem, 2and had seen that some of His disciples were eating their bread with impure hands, that is, unwashed. 3(For the Pharisees and all the Jews do not eat unless they carefully wash their hands, thus observing the traditions of the elders; 4and when they come from the market place, they do not eat unless they cleanse themselves; and there are many other things which they have received in order to observe, such as the washing of cups and pitchers and copper pots.) 5The Pharisees and the scribes asked Him, “Why do Your disciples not walk according to the tradition of the elders, but eat their bread with impure hands?”

6And He said to them, “Rightly did Isaiah prophesy of you hypocrites, as it is written:
‘THIS PEOPLE HONORS ME WITH THEIR LIPS,
BUT THEIR HEART IS FAR AWAY FROM ME.


7‘BUT IN VAIN DO THEY WORSHIP ME,
TEACHING AS DOCTRINES THE PRECEPTS OF MEN.’


8“Neglecting the commandment of God, you hold to the tradition of men.”

9He was also saying to them, “You are experts at setting aside the commandment of God in order to keep your tradition. 10“For Moses said, ‘HONOR YOUR FATHER AND YOUR MOTHER’; and, ‘HE WHO SPEAKS EVIL OF FATHER OR MOTHER, IS TO BE PUT TO DEATH’; 11but you say, ‘If a man says to his father or his mother, whatever I have that would help you is Corban (that is to say, given to God),’ 12you no longer permit him to do anything for his father or his mother; 13thus invalidating the word of God by your tradition which you have handed down; and you do many things such as that.”

14After He called the crowd to Him again, He began saying to them, “Listen to Me, all of you, and understand: 15there is nothing outside the man which can defile him if it goes into him; but the things which proceed out of the man are what defile the man. 16[“If anyone has ears to hear, let him hear.”]

17When he had left the crowd and entered the house, His disciples questioned Him about the parable. 18And He said to them, “Are you so lacking in understanding also? Do you not understand that whatever goes into the man from outside cannot defile him, 19because it does not go into his heart, but into his stomach, and is eliminated?” (Thus He declared all foods clean.) 20And He was saying, “That which proceeds out of the man, that is what defiles the man. 21“For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed the evil thoughts, fornications, thefts, murders, adulteries, 22deeds of coveting and wickedness, as well as deceit, sensuality, envy, slander, pride and foolishness. 23“All these evil things proceed from within and defile the man.”

Bold red underlined just above is what each generation deals with. We are no different other than each generation has their white supremacists, Marxist genocidal maniacs, violent religious extremists, and dehumanizing government policies and unjust practices. Yes we need to call it out, speak and teach against it and fight it. This evil proceeds from the fallen sinful human heart. Only One can change that, and we as Christians need to be equipped to pronounce the Hope that is in us, that Hope is Jesus Christ our sure and steady anchor.

If you honestly believe that we need to call out dehumanizing and unjust practices and fight it, then stop denying the existence of White Nationalism, and its growth in the country, and the mistreatment at the border and stop mocking those who do see these problems and want to fight it.
That is what I see from the right. No one here has shown me differently.

copyChkboxOn.gif
Mat 7:12


“In everything, therefore, [fn]treat people the same way you want [fn]them to treat you, for this is the Law and the Prophets.
 
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redleghunter

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Why isn't the right more outraged at mistreatment at the border?
I think most Christians have identified the humanitarian crisis at the border much earlier than the politicians and media denying there is a crisis. If I remember correctly, the narrative up until June when members of Congress actually went to the border was "manufactured crisis." But I'm glad they went and saw that our border facilities and US customs and border patrol personnel were overwhelmed beyond capacity. I am also glad the previous administration had the foresight to build additional facilities, even though they did so with indoor fencing.

And Christians are acting:

Samaritan’s Purse Continues To Help Migrants and Ministry Partners at US-Mexico Border

Samaritan’s Purse Responds to the US-Mexico Border Crisis

Pro-life women deliver semi-truck full of supplies, $72,000 to the border

:: RespiteCenter ::
 
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Hazelelponi

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I like that with liberals you still have to say " just imagine if someone who identified as liberal went on a shooting spree"..

You don't have to imagine it - 1 of the last 3 mass shootings was left politically, Connor Betts, the Ohio shooter was pro-Antifa, pro-Bernie Sanders and anti-ICE, The California shooter, Santino William Legan had mixed Iranian decent and posted his distaste for white people:

santino-legan.jpg

and the El Paso shooter is questionable considering he supported plenty of left leaning policies such as Medicare for all...

But if you notice, due to his "manifesto" and the inability to place white supremacist beliefs on the others the El Paso shooter is now the only one you hear about in the news.. the Antifa member was never mentioned more than once, even on Fox news..
 

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FreeinChrist

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You don't have to imagine it - 1 of the last 3 mass shootings was left politically, Connor Betts, the Ohio shooter was pro-Antifa, pro-Bernie Sanders and anti-ICE, The California shooter, Santino William Legan had mixed Iranian decent and posted his distaste for white people:

View attachment 260939

and the El Paso shooter is questionable considering he supported plenty of left leaning policies such as Medicare for all...

But if you notice, due to his "manifesto" and the inability to place white supremacist beliefs on the others the El Paso shooter is now the only one you hear about in the news.. the Antifa member was never mentioned more than once, even on Fox news..
The Dayton shooter was not antifa even if he was pro-antifa in his views. He had serious mental issues for a long time. There was no manifesto. There were concerns. And he killed his own sister. There is more to it.

In contrast:
All of the extremist killings in the US in 2018 had links to right-wing extremism, according to new report

Every extremist killing in the US in 2018 had a link to a right-wing extremism, according to a January 2019 report from the Anti-Defamation League's Center on Extremism.

The report zeroes in on incidents such as the high school shooting in Parkland, Florida, in February 2018, and the mass shooting at the Tree of Life synagogue in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, in October 2018.

There were at least 50 extremist-related killings in the US in 2018, according to the report, making it the fourth-deadliest year on record for domestic extremist-related killings since 1970.​


I would love to see some on the right actually acknowledge there is problem and help resist it.
 
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bekkilyn

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In the United States there are people of all races. There are black people, brown people, red people, yellow people, white people even a couple blue ones..

So caring about, and being desirous of the enforcement of our national sovereignty has nothing to do with race at all.

There are people, such as the articles posted on page 1 of this thread show, that would like you to believe this topic only matters to racist white people who are full of hate, but that is a lie.

The sovereignty of our nation matters to, and should matter to, every single American citizen regardless of ethnicity.

There are lots of people from all races that support limited immigration over open borders who are, quite frankly, sick of the lie that we are racist white people..

This lie is being promulgated because online you can't see the race of the people you speak to.. so they say to fear these ideas because we are "white supremacists".. but we aren't white supremacists, many aren't even white. And there is nothing hateful being espoused.

The issue though is that white people have institutionalized and ingrained sovereignty over these black, brown, red, yellow, and possibly even the couple of blue people within our nation. Yes, we all live here physically, but we cannot deny that today there is still a large amount of hatred, bigotry, and oppression directed towards people of color and other minority groups, and the problem seems to be worsening with "immigration" being used as an excuse to promote to an even greater degree a white nationalist agenda.

There is really no such thing as "limited immigration" in this issue because if you don't agree with the white nationalist agenda, then you automatically are accused of wanting completely open borders with no limitations whatsoever.

There is no real immigration discussion. There are only people being herded into concentration camps, abused, and starved under the excuse of "national sovereignty" which is little more than a code word for white nationalism in actual practice, and current political environment does nothing whatsoever to discourage white nationalist ideology, but in fact, works to deliberately encourage it.

And it's even worse that it's oftentimes encouraged in the name of Christ. Utterly horrifying, in fact.
 
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