JESUS and the APOSTLES OBEYED GOD'S LAW and the SABBATH!

Status
Not open for further replies.

ralliann

christian
Jun 27, 2007
6,112
1,696
✟201,659.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed
I was not dismissing, I was stating a fact. There are some of the commandments that pertain to men, some to women, meaning women don't keep commandments made for men and vis-versa. Also there are ones for priests, the Levites, etc. theres ones pertaining to certain times a year and theres ones that are strictly for when they are in the land and some for wherever you are. There are also ones for the Israelites and also for the Gentiles who have joined them.
And there were commandments that applied to the patriachs.
 
Upvote 0

Lulav

Y'shua is His Name
Aug 24, 2007
34,141
7,243
✟494,938.00
Country
United States
Faith
Unorthodox
Marital Status
Married
Then Passover is a land or temple commandment as well. So is firstfruits and weeks. Without the temple they are not applicable either.
Le 23:37 These are the feasts of the LORD, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, to offer an offering made by fire unto the LORD, a burnt offering, and a meat offering, a sacrifice, and drink offerings, every thing upon his day:
I'm not sure how you are deducing that but it is clear in the torah that Passover, or the remembrance of it can be kept anywhere.

Ex 12
“This is a day to remember. Each year, from generation to generation, you must celebrate it as a special festival to the Lord. This is a law for all time. 15 For seven days the bread you eat must be made without yeast. On the first day of the festival, remove every trace of yeast from your homes. Anyone who eats bread made with yeast during the seven days of the festival will be cut off from the community of Israel. 16 On the first day of the festival and again on the seventh day, all the people must observe an official day for holy assembly. No work of any kind may be done on these days except in the preparation of food.

17 “Celebrate this Festival of Unleavened Bread, for it will remind you that I brought your forces out of the land of Egypt on this very day. This festival will be a permanent law for you; celebrate this day from generation to generation. 18 The bread you eat must be made without yeast from the evening of the fourteenth day of the first month until the evening of the twenty-first day of that month. 19 During those seven days, there must be no trace of yeast in your homes. Anyone who eats anything made with yeast during this week will be cut off from the community of Israel. These regulations apply both to the foreigners living among you and to the native-born Israelites. 20 During those days you must not eat anything made with yeast. Wherever you live, eat only bread made without yeast.”


Firstfruits needs to be in the land and with a temple to present. However even without the temple the omer is still counted so that commandment can be done outside the land.
 
Upvote 0

Lulav

Y'shua is His Name
Aug 24, 2007
34,141
7,243
✟494,938.00
Country
United States
Faith
Unorthodox
Marital Status
Married
So, do you have a spade which you use daily to bury your excrement outside of the camp?
Since no one has lived in the wilderness camp for over 3,500 years that commandment is moot.

Which is all the more reason they need the perfect sacrifice for sin as described in Hebrews, the One who has completely fulfilled all of the Law.
Who are 'they'?
And Jesus fulfilled what he was supposed to but not all the law as I said before there are different laws for different parts of Israel. He did not for instance fulfill the laws for women, nor married men.

I agree. None apply to Gentiles who have not converted to Judaism. Because I am a Gentile through and through, none of those commandments apply to me.
So you do not consider yourself grafted into Israel? So you are not part of the New Covenant then. And if none of those commandments pertain to you whose rules of morality do you follow?

And there were commandments that applied to the patriachs.
Yes, there were commandments given to them alone before Israel was formed as a nation. The Torah was given on the mountain in the wilderness to the People, the children of Israel (Jacob) and the rules were for a nation and a people.
 
Upvote 0

eleos1954

God is Love
Supporter
Nov 14, 2017
9,698
5,614
Utah
✟713,703.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
If we sin we are under the law and guilty before God?

So if the Christian fails to observes the law/ commits sin, they are under the law and guilty before God.

Thanks for confirming that is your belief.

Observe the law or you are under the law and guilty
So you are In a righteous/ justified state if you observe the law

It's about what motivates you to keep the law ... love ... His work in you guiding you to be conformed to His image ...

Colossians 3:10

And have put on the new self, which is being renewed in knowledge after the image of its creator.

Ephesians 4:24

And to put on the new self, created after the likeness of God in true righteousness and holiness.

2 Corinthians 3:18
And we all, with unveiled face, beholding the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from one degree of glory to another. For this comes from the Lord who is the Spirit.

1 Corinthians 6:19
Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, whom you have from God? You are not your own

John 14

15 “If you love me, keep my commands.
16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever
17 the Spirit of truth.

1 John 2:3-5

And by this we know that we have come to know him, if we keep his commandments. Whoever says “I know him” but does not keep his commandments is a liar, and the truth is not in him, but whoever keeps his word, in him truly the love of God is perfected. By this we may know that we are in him:

2 John 1:6

And this is love, that we walk according to his commandments; this is the commandment, just as you have heard from the beginning, so that you should walk in it.

If the Holy Spirit is working in you and changes your heart and mind to keep the commandments then you respond out of love and are to do so ...

The 10 commandments are laws of LOVE.

Matthew 22:36-38

“Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?” And he said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the great and first commandment.

If you do not respond and (continue transgressing the law - sin) that is blasphemy and that is the only sin that is not forgivable.
 
Upvote 0

ralliann

christian
Jun 27, 2007
6,112
1,696
✟201,659.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed
I'm not sure how you are deducing that but it is clear in the torah that Passover, or the remembrance of it can be kept anywhere.
So which is it? The remembrance or the Passover that you are talking about?
The Passover is a sacrifice...…..
Ex 12:3 Speak ye unto all the congregation of Israel, saying, In the tenth day of this month they shall take to them every man a lamb, according to the house of their fathers, a lamb for an house:
5 Your lamb shall be without blemish, a male of the first year: ye shall take it out from the sheep, or from the goats: {of … : Heb. son of a year }
It is to be eaten.....
8 And they shall eat the flesh in that night, roast with fire, and unleavened bread; and with bitter herbs they shall eat it.

6 And ye shall keep it up until the fourteenth day of the same month: and the whole assembly of the congregation of Israel shall kill it in the evening.
Ex 12
“This is a day to remember. Each year, from generation to generation, you must celebrate it as a special festival to the Lord. This is a law for all time. 15 For seven days the bread you eat must be made without yeast. On the first day of the festival, remove every trace of yeast from your homes. Anyone who eats bread made with yeast during the seven days of the festival will be cut off from the community of Israel. 16 On the first day of the festival and again on the seventh day, all the people must observe an official day for holy assembly. No work of any kind may be done on these days except in the preparation of food.

17 “Celebrate this Festival of Unleavened Bread, for it will remind you that I brought your forces out of the land of Egypt on this very day. This festival will be a permanent law for you; celebrate this day from generation to generation. 18 The bread you eat must be made without yeast from the evening of the fourteenth day of the first month until the evening of the twenty-first day of that month. 19 During those seven days, there must be no trace of yeast in your homes. Anyone who eats anything made with yeast during this week will be cut off from the community of Israel. These regulations apply both to the foreigners living among you and to the native-born Israelites. 20 During those days you must not eat anything made with yeast. Wherever you live, eat only bread made without yeast.”
feasts as holy convocations
1 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,
2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of the LORD, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my feasts.

14th...The Passover sacrifice

5 In the fourteenth day of the first month at even is the LORD’S Passover.

First day of the 15th 7 days bring sacrifices to the priests.

6 And on the fifteenth day of the same month is the feast of unleavened bread unto the LORD: seven days ye must eat unleavened bread.


7 In the first day ye shall have an holy convocation: ye shall do no servile work therein.
8 But ye shall offer an offering made by fire unto the LORD seven days: in the seventh day is an holy convocation: ye shall do no servile work therein.

Le 23:37 These are the feasts of the LORD, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, to offer an offering made by fire unto the LORD, a burnt offering, and a meat offering, a sacrifice, and drink offerings, every thing upon his day:
Josephus makes an interesting statement about the sin sacrifices offered on these days saying they are intended as a feast for the priests on those days.
Only the priest of course are commanded or allowed to eat the sacrifices for sin.

Ex 29:33 And they shall eat those things wherewith the atonement was made, to consecrate and to sanctify them: but a stranger shall not eat thereof, because they are holy.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Lulav

Y'shua is His Name
Aug 24, 2007
34,141
7,243
✟494,938.00
Country
United States
Faith
Unorthodox
Marital Status
Married
So which is it? The remembrance or the Passover that you are talking about?
The Passover is a sacrifice...…..
Ex 12:3 Speak ye unto all the congregation of Israel, saying, In the tenth day of this month they shall take to them every man a lamb, according to the house of their fathers, a lamb for an house:
5 Your lamb shall be without blemish, a male of the first year: ye shall take it out from the sheep, or from the goats: {of … : Heb. son of a year }
It is to be eaten.....
8 And they shall eat the flesh in that night, roast with fire, and unleavened bread; and with bitter herbs they shall eat it.

I was just specifying the Holy Day, not offering two different things. There was only ONE Passover and that happened in Egypt, To keep the Passover is the remembrance of it and how the LORD brought us out of Egypt and to pass it down to our children. It's part of and the beginning of the whole Salvation story told in the Feasts of the LORD, the moedim.

14 And this day shall be unto you for a memorial; and ye shall keep it a feast to the LORD throughout your generations; ye shall keep it a feast by an ordinance for ever.​


Yes the word Pasche can be used to mean various things depending on the context.

For instance if you said 'eat the Passover' then it would refer to the Paschal Lamb but to 'keep the Passover' would mean to have the telling of the story and a reenactment of sorts, accompanied by the matzah and bitter herbs and cups of wine.


feasts as holy convocations
1 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,
2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of the LORD, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my feasts.

14th...The Passover sacrifice

5 In the fourteenth day of the first month at even is the LORD’S Passover.

First day of the 15th 7 days bring sacrifices to the priests.

6 And on the fifteenth day of the same month is the feast of unleavened bread unto the LORD: seven days ye must eat unleavened bread.


7 In the first day ye shall have an holy convocation: ye shall do no servile work therein.
8 But ye shall offer an offering made by fire unto the LORD seven days: in the seventh day is an holy convocation: ye shall do no servile work therein.

Le 23:37 These are the feasts of the LORD, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, to offer an offering made by fire unto the LORD, a burnt offering, and a meat offering, a sacrifice, and drink offerings, every thing upon his day:
Josephus makes an interesting statement about the sin sacrifices offered on these days saying they are intended as a feast for the priests on those days.
Only the priest of course are commanded or allowed to eat the sacrifices for sin.

Ex 29:33 And they shall eat those things wherewith the atonement was made, to consecrate and to sanctify them: but a stranger shall not eat thereof, because they are holy.

I'm not sure what your point is but that last part is not complete but it really has nothing to do with Passover. I won't post the whole chapter but the whole chapter was about the ordination of Aaron and his sons.

31 And thou shalt take the ram of the consecration, and seethe his flesh in the holy place. 32 And Aaron and his sons shall eat the flesh of the ram, and the bread that is in the basket, by the door of the tabernacle of the congregation. 33 And they shall eat those things wherewith the atonement was made, to consecrate and to sanctify them: but a stranger shall not eat thereof, because they are holy.


If you are posting that as a rebuttal to what I said about Gentiles being included in the Passover you can find that here.


14 If a foreigner dwelling among you wants to observe the Passover to the LORD, he is to do so according to the Passover statute and its ordinances. You are to apply the same statute to both the foreigner and the native of the land.”
 
Upvote 0

ralliann

christian
Jun 27, 2007
6,112
1,696
✟201,659.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed
I was just specifying the Holy Day, not offering two different things. There was only ONE Passover and that happened in Egypt, To keep the Passover is the remembrance of it and how the LORD brought us out of Egypt and to pass it down to our children. It's part of and the beginning of the whole Salvation story told in the Feasts of the LORD, the moedim.

14 And this day shall be unto you for a memorial; and ye shall keep it a feast to the LORD throughout your generations; ye shall keep it a feast by an ordinance for ever.​


Yes the word Pasche can be used to mean various things depending on the context.

For instance if you said 'eat the Passover' then it would refer to the Paschal Lamb but to 'keep the Passover' would mean to have the telling of the story and a reenactment of sorts, accompanied by the matzah and bitter herbs and cups of wine.
Here's the biblical context of retelling of the story. The sacrifice of Lord's Passover is the meaning of the service.
Ex 12:25 And it shall come to pass, when ye be come to the land which the LORD will give you, according as he hath promised, that ye shall keep this service.
26 And it shall come to pass, when your children shall say unto you, What mean ye by this service?
27 That ye shall say, It is the sacrifice of the LORD’S passover, who passed over the houses of the children of Israel in Egypt, when he smote the Egyptians, and delivered our houses. And the people bowed the head and worshipped.


I'm not sure what your point is but that last part is not complete but it really has nothing to do with Passover. I won't post the whole chapter but the whole chapter was about the ordination of Aaron and his sons.
The point is in the text I posted.
Moses was addressing the people concerning the feasts as a holy convocation to offer sacrifices each of those days

Lev 22:33 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,
34 Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, The fifteenth day of this seventh month shall be the feast of tabernacles for seven days unto the LORD.
35 On the first day shall be an holy convocation: ye shall do no servile work therein.
36 Seven days ye shall offer an offering made by fire unto the LORD: on the eighth day shall be an holy convocation unto you; and ye shall offer an offering made by fire unto the LORD: it is a solemn assembly; and ye shall do no servile work therein. {solemn … : Heb. day of restraint }
37 These are the feasts of the LORD, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, to offer an offering made by fire unto the LORD, a burnt offering, and a meat offering, a sacrifice, and drink offerings, every thing upon his day:
38 Beside the sabbaths of the LORD, and beside your gifts, and beside all your vows, and beside all your freewill offerings, which ye give unto the LORD.


31 And thou shalt take the ram of the consecration, and seethe his flesh in the holy place. 32 And Aaron and his sons shall eat the flesh of the ram, and the bread that is in the basket, by the door of the tabernacle of the congregation. 33 And they shall eat those things wherewith the atonement was made, to consecrate and to sanctify them: but a stranger shall not eat thereof, because they are holy.


If you are posting that as a rebuttal to what I said about Gentiles being included in the Passover you can find that here.


14 If a foreigner dwelling among you wants to observe the Passover to the LORD, he is to do so according to the Passover statute and its ordinances. You are to apply the same statute to both the foreigner and the native of the land.”
No I did not mention it for that reason.
it is interesting that the high priest said this on the first day of unleavened bread.
Joh 18:28 Then led they Jesus from Caiaphas unto the hall of judgment: and it was early; and they themselves went not into the judgment hall, lest they should be defiled; but that they might eat the Passover.
As you said...
"Yes the word Pasche can be used to mean various things depending on the context".
In light of what Josephus says, the priests Passover feast was to feed on the sin offerings on everyone of those days. That was why the goat for sin added to all the rest.They were intended for a feast for the priest
The Passover sacrifice of the 14th day, was not a sin offering. That was what I was getting at.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Bob S

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Dec 5, 2015
4,584
2,203
88
Union County, TN
✟657,084.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
It's about what motivates you to keep the law ... love ... His work in you guiding you to be conformed to His image ...
Love is the Christian law, my friend.

Colossians 3:10

And have put on the new self, which is being renewed in knowledge after the image of its creator.
Love

Ephesians 4:24
And to put on the new self, created after the likeness of God in true righteousness and holiness.
Love

2 Corinthians 3:18
And we all, with unveiled face, beholding the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from one degree of glory to another. For this comes from the Lord who is the Spirit.
2Cor3:7-11 The ministry of death (10 commandments) came with glory faded and replaced with the glory of the Holy Spirit.

10 commandments, Israel's guide
Holy Spirit, Christian's guide

1 Corinthians 6:19
Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, whom you have from God? You are not your own
Amen!

John 14

15 “If you love me, keep my commands.
16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever
17 the Spirit of truth.
See 2Cor3:7-11

1 John 2:3-5

And by this we know that we have come to know him, if we keep his commandments. Whoever says “I know him” but does not keep his commandments is a liar, and the truth is not in him, but whoever keeps his word, in him truly the love of God is perfected. By this we may know that we are in him:
1Jn319-24
19 Here is how we will know that we are from the truth and will set our hearts at rest in his presence: 20 if our hearts know something against us, God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything. 21 Dear friends, if our hearts know nothing against us, we have confidence in approaching God; 22 then, whatever we ask for, we receive from him; because we are obeying his commands and doing the things that please him.

23 This is his command: that we are to trust in the person and power of his Son Yeshua the Messiah and to keep loving one another, just as he commanded us. 24 Those who obey his commands remain united with him and he with them.

Please notice John was not referring to the 10 commandments in 1Jn 2. In 1Jn3 he explains what the commandments Christians are under

2 John 1:6

And this is love, that we walk according to his commandments; this is the commandment, just as you have heard from the beginning, so that you should walk in it.
Notice that there is no 10 to identify "His commandments". Anyone who tries to add 10 to any of the verses that have the commandments are adding to scripture. When you refer that the verses with commandments are the 10 commandments like you are doing deceives those who read your post.

If the Holy Spirit is working in you and changes your heart and mind to keep the commandments then you respond out of love and are to do so ...
The commands of love

The 10 commandments are laws of LOVE.
There is absolutely nothing in the 10 commandments about love. Those commands were totally about the duty of the Israelites. If an Israelite loved God he/she would keep all of those commands. But the fact is they all of them could be kept out of duty. I ask that you read them and then tell me thy are about love.

Matthew 22:36-38
“Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?” And he said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the great and first commandment.
Amen! Remember that command from Jesus is not from the first of the 10 commandments;

If you do not respond and (continue transgressing the law - sin) that is blasphemy and that is the only sin that is not forgivable.
Again, you are referring to the 10 commandments and the scripture from the New Testament makes it very clear the transgressing the law is not the 10 commandments. I believe Paul makes that very clear in Gal 5:19 And it is perfectly evident what the old nature does. It expresses itself in sexual immorality, impurity and indecency; 20 involvement with the occult and with drugs; in feuding, fighting, becoming jealous and getting angry; in selfish ambition, factionalism, intrigue 21 and envy; in drunkenness, orgies and things like these. I warn you now as I have warned you before: those who do such things will have no share in the Kingdom of God!

Those are just a few of the many ways we can hurt God, our selves and our fellow man, Moral laws are eternal. The 9 commands of the 10 deal with morality. The Law of Loves deals with every law concerning morality.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Danthemailman
Upvote 0

thomass

Member
Aug 11, 2019
16
3
53
sydney
✟7,847.00
Country
Australia
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed
It's about what motivates you to keep the law ... love ... His work in you guiding you to be conformed to His image ...

Colossians 3:10

And have put on the new self, which is being renewed in knowledge after the image of its creator.

Ephesians 4:24

And to put on the new self, created after the likeness of God in true righteousness and holiness.

2 Corinthians 3:18
And we all, with unveiled face, beholding the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from one degree of glory to another. For this comes from the Lord who is the Spirit.

1 Corinthians 6:19
Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, whom you have from God? You are not your own

John 14

15 “If you love me, keep my commands.
16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever
17 the Spirit of truth.

1 John 2:3-5

And by this we know that we have come to know him, if we keep his commandments. Whoever says “I know him” but does not keep his commandments is a liar, and the truth is not in him, but whoever keeps his word, in him truly the love of God is perfected. By this we may know that we are in him:

2 John 1:6

And this is love, that we walk according to his commandments; this is the commandment, just as you have heard from the beginning, so that you should walk in it.

If the Holy Spirit is working in you and changes your heart and mind to keep the commandments then you respond out of love and are to do so ...

The 10 commandments are laws of LOVE.

Matthew 22:36-38

“Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?” And he said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the great and first commandment.

If you do not respond and (continue transgressing the law - sin) that is blasphemy and that is the only sin that is not forgivable.
Some good scriptures, but with misunderstanding sadly.

John 14:15 If you love me keep my commandments

I am sure you do not even try and obey each and every command of Christ

The Ten Commandments

The fact you appear to believe you obey the Ten Commandments shows your lack of understanding as to what that entails. So as you, alongside everyone else fails to obey the law, I assume you are condemning yourself according to your last paragraph.

Your main problem is referring to a written law. It is not a written law, ie the ten commandments under the new covenant. A law written in ink is not applicable for the believer:

You show that you are a letter from Christ, the result of our ministry, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts. 2Corinthians3:3

There is quoting selectively the letter, and understanding the message. There is a way to understand the true message. The majority seem to want to ignore it. Acts ch2 is a good read, alongside other chapters and verses
BTW
I have always found, love, mercy and compassion are casualties amongst those who insist you must obey the Ten Commandments(or perish)
 
Last edited:
  • Useful
Reactions: Danthemailman
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

eleos1954

God is Love
Supporter
Nov 14, 2017
9,698
5,614
Utah
✟713,703.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
Love is the Christian law, my friend.

Love

Love


2Cor3:7-11 The ministry of death (10 commandments) came with glory faded and replaced with the glory of the Holy Spirit.

10 commandments, Israel's guide
Holy Spirit, Christian's guide


Amen!

See 2Cor3:7-11


1Jn319-24
19 Here is how we will know that we are from the truth and will set our hearts at rest in his presence: 20 if our hearts know something against us, God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything. 21 Dear friends, if our hearts know nothing against us, we have confidence in approaching God; 22 then, whatever we ask for, we receive from him; because we are obeying his commands and doing the things that please him.

23 This is his command: that we are to trust in the person and power of his Son Yeshua the Messiah and to keep loving one another, just as he commanded us. 24 Those who obey his commands remain united with him and he with them.

Please notice John was not referring to the 10 commandments in 1Jn 2. In 1Jn3 he explains what the commandments Christians are under


Notice that there is no 10 to identify "His commandments". Anyone who tries to add 10 to any of the verses that have the commandments are adding to scripture. When you refer that the verses with commandments are the 10 commandments like you are doing deceives those who read your post.


The commands of love


There is absolutely nothing in the 10 commandments about love. Those commands were totally about the duty of the Israelites. If an Israelite loved God he/she would keep all of those commands. But the fact is they all of them could be kept out of duty. I ask that you read them and then tell me thy are about love.


Amen! Remember that command from Jesus is not from the first of the 10 commandments;


Again, you are referring to the 10 commandments and the scripture from the New Testament makes it very clear the transgressing the law is not the 10 commandments. I believe Paul makes that very clear in Gal 5:19 And it is perfectly evident what the old nature does. It expresses itself in sexual immorality, impurity and indecency; 20 involvement with the occult and with drugs; in feuding, fighting, becoming jealous and getting angry; in selfish ambition, factionalism, intrigue 21 and envy; in drunkenness, orgies and things like these. I warn you now as I have warned you before: those who do such things will have no share in the Kingdom of God!

Those are just a few of the many ways we can hurt God, our selves and our fellow man, Moral laws are eternal. The 9 commands of the 10 deal with morality. The Law of Loves deals with every law concerning morality.

Strange how people carve out the 7th day Sabbath that is right in the heart of of law.

Strange how people think the 10 commandments are just for the Jews ... or that 9 of them are for everybody, just not the 4th

Strange how people don't see the 10 commandments as the broad view ... and that what Jesus taught didn't change those laws ... He provided much more detail about them .... magnified them.

Strange how people have the Holy Spirit who through Him working in the believer helps us to keep the Law ... we can't do it without Christs's holy Sprit in us.

Strange how sin is defined as transgression of the law, and when one transgresses the law, the Holy Spirit leads one to repentance and through the work of the Holy Spirt helps one fight against and overcome sin (which is transgression of the law)

So what then .... when we are convicted by the Holy Spirit that we have transgressed the law are we to ignore it? Do we not respond to the Holy Spirit teaching us that we have transgressed the law? Do we not ask for forgiveness and repent (turn away from sin)?

Through Christ's great sacrifice those who receive Him are not condemned to eternal death and that is His free gift ... but one has to choose to receive that gift.

I am the Lord they God, I change not.

He does not change ... but He does provide more detail.

Matthew 5

The Fulfillment of the Law

17Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets. I have not come to abolish them, but to fulfill them. 18For I tell you truly, until heaven and earth pass away, not a single jot, not a stroke of a pen, will disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.

19So then, whoever breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do likewise will be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever practices and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20For I tell you that unless your righteousness exceeds that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.

Are these just for the Jews

Proverbs 4:4

Then he taught me and said to me, "Let your heart hold fast my words; Keep my commandments and live;

Leviticus 18:5

'So you shall keep My statutes and My judgments, by which a man may live if he does them; I am the LORD.

Romans 10:5

For Moses writes that the man who practices the righteousness which is based on law shall live by that righteousness.

Deuteronomy 7:9

Know therefore that the Lord your God is God, the faithful God who keeps covenant and steadfast love with those who love him and keep his commandments, to a thousand generations,

Matthew 19:17

And He said to him, "Why are you asking Me about what is good? There is only One who is good; but if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments."

Deuteronomy 4:2

You shall not add to the word that I command you, nor take from it, that you may keep the commandments of the Lord your God that I command you.

Galatians 3:12

However, the Law is not of faith; on the contrary, "HE WHO PRACTICES THEM SHALL LIVE BY THEM."

Galatians 3:21

Is the Law then contrary to the promises of God? May it never be! For if a law had been given which was able to impart life, then righteousness would indeed have been based on law.

God does not change.

Hebrews 13:8
Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever.

James 1:17

Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights with whom there is no variation or shadow due to change.

Psalm 119:89

Forever, O Lord, your word is firmly fixed in the heavens.

It is not legalistic to keep any of the commandments of God because it is God working in the believer ... doing what? Being conformed to His image (His character) becoming more Christ like.

Christ's work in the believer IS helping them to keep the law. Christ's work in the believer is helping them to understand the far reaching depth and details of the law.

Romans 2:13

For it is not the hearers of the law who are righteous before God, but the doers of the law who will be justified.

Romans 3:31

Do we then overthrow the law by this faith? By no means! On the contrary, we uphold the law.

Keeping the law .... it's NOT our work .... it's His work.

and because we love him we respond to HIS work.

Did Jesus keep the Sabbath because He was a Jew ... or because He was/is God and it is in His commandments He gave on mount Sinai?

Again ... nothing new ...... many more details given about the depth of the law through Christ's ministry on earth.
 
Upvote 0

eleos1954

God is Love
Supporter
Nov 14, 2017
9,698
5,614
Utah
✟713,703.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
Some good scriptures, but with misunderstanding sadly.

John 14:15 If you love me keep my commandments

I am sure you do not even try and obey each and every command of Christ

The Ten Commandments

The fact you appear to believe you obey the Ten Commandments shows your lack of understanding as to what that entails. So as you, alongside everyone else fails to obey the law, I assume you are condemning yourself according to your last paragraph.

Your main problem is referring to a written law. It is not a written law, ie the ten commandments under the new covenant. A law written in ink is not applicable for the believer:

You show that you are a letter from Christ, the result of our ministry, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts. 2Corinthians3:3

There is quoting selectively the letter, and understanding the message. There is a way to understand the true message. The majority seem to want to ignore it. Acts ch2 is a good read, alongside other chapters and verses
BTW
I have always found, love, mercy and compassion are casualties amongst those who insist you must obey the Ten Commandments(or perish)

JESUS and the APOSTLES OBEYED GOD'S LAW and the SABBATH!
 
Upvote 0

thomass

Member
Aug 11, 2019
16
3
53
sydney
✟7,847.00
Country
Australia
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed
Upvote 0

thomass

Member
Aug 11, 2019
16
3
53
sydney
✟7,847.00
Country
Australia
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed
Strange how sin is defined as transgression of the law, and when one transgresses the law, the Holy Spirit leads one to repentance and through the work of the Holy Spirt helps one fight against and overcome sin (which is transgression of the law)

.

You can only be a Christian if the Holy Spirit dwells in you(Rom8:9)
You accept as christians(people who have the Holy Spirit dwelling in them) I assume people who are not convicted by the Holy Spirit they sin by failing to observe a Saturday sabbath.

There must be something errant in your theology
 
Upvote 0

eleos1954

God is Love
Supporter
Nov 14, 2017
9,698
5,614
Utah
✟713,703.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
You can only be a Christian if the Holy Spirit dwells in you(Rom8:9)
You accept as christians(people who have the Holy Spirit dwelling in them) people who are not convicted by the Holy Spirit they sin by failing to observe a Saturday sabbath.

There must be something errant in your theology

You can only be a Christian if the Holy Spirit dwells in you(Rom8:9)

This is true .... and what does His holy spirit DO in the believer? Helps them to keep His law. Helps them to overcome sin, which is transgression of the law.

Strange how some are convicted to keep the Sabbath and some not. Each of us can only respond to the Holy Spirit working in each of us. Each of us are being sanctified through the work of the Holy Spirit and this lasts throughout our lifetime.

Someday all will keep the sabbath, ever wonder why that is?

Isaiah 66:23

…22“For just as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, will endure before Me,” declares the LORD, “so your descendants and your name will endure. 23From one New Moon to another and from one Sabbath to another, all mankind will come to worship before Me,” says the LORD.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

thomass

Member
Aug 11, 2019
16
3
53
sydney
✟7,847.00
Country
Australia
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed
You can only be a Christian if the Holy Spirit dwells in you(Rom8:9)

This is true .... and what does His holy spirit DO in the believer? Helps them to keep His law. Helps them to overcome sin, which is transgression of the law.

Strange how some are convicted to keep the Sabbath and some not. Each of us can only respond to the Holy Spirit working in each of us. Each of us are being sanctified through the work of the Holy Spirit and this lasts throughout our lifetime.

Someday all will keep the sabbath, ever wonder why that is?

Isaiah 66:23

…22“For just as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, will endure before Me,” declares the LORD, “so your descendants and your name will endure. 23From one New Moon to another and from one Sabbath to another, all mankind will come to worship before Me,” says the LORD.
If you wish to respond to a post, you should address the point made. If you accept as Christians people who are not convicted they sin by failing to observe a Saturday sabbath, you have to accept the Spirit is not convicting them of sin regarding this.
 
Upvote 0

eleos1954

God is Love
Supporter
Nov 14, 2017
9,698
5,614
Utah
✟713,703.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
If you wish to respond to a post, you should address the point made. If you accept as Christians people who are not convicted they sin by failing to observe a Saturday sabbath, you have to accept the Spirit is not convicting them of sin regarding this.

One sin is not greater than another one, and we all sin, and our sins are covered by the blood of Jesus.

Someday all will keep Sabbath - ever wonder why that is?

Isaiah 66:23

22“For just as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, will endure before Me,” declares the LORD, “so your descendants and your name will endure. 23From one New Moon to another and from one Sabbath to another, all mankind will come to worship before Me,” says the LORD.
 
Upvote 0

thomass

Member
Aug 11, 2019
16
3
53
sydney
✟7,847.00
Country
Australia
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed
One sin is not greater than another one, and we all sin, and our sins are covered by the blood of Jesus.

Someday all will keep Sabbath - ever wonder why that is?

Isaiah 66:23

22“For just as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, will endure before Me,” declares the LORD, “so your descendants and your name will endure. 23From one New Moon to another and from one Sabbath to another, all mankind will come to worship before Me,” says the LORD.

You stated:

Strange how sin is defined as transgression of the law, and when one transgresses the law, the Holy Spirit leads one to repentance and through the work of the Holy Spirt helps one fight against and overcome sin (which is transgression of the law)
Unquote

According to your statement, you must believe the Holy Spirit is not doing the work you state he does in people in whom he dwells
 
Upvote 0

eleos1954

God is Love
Supporter
Nov 14, 2017
9,698
5,614
Utah
✟713,703.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
You stated:

Strange how sin is defined as transgression of the law, and when one transgresses the law, the Holy Spirit leads one to repentance and through the work of the Holy Spirt helps one fight against and overcome sin (which is transgression of the law)
Unquote

According to your statement, the Holy Spirit is not doing the work you state he does in people in whom he dwells

perhaps He is and people are willfully ignoring it or being deceived ... happens all the time ... deceived by ourself and/or deceived by satan.

Romans 1:20

For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse.

Genesis 2 - creation the 7th day

3Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because on that day He rested from all the work of creation that He had accomplished.

Is He the Lord of nothing?

Matthew 12 - (Jesus speaking)

8 For the Son of Man is Lord of the Sabbath

Why did He state this?
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

thomass

Member
Aug 11, 2019
16
3
53
sydney
✟7,847.00
Country
Australia
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed
perhaps He is and people are willfully ignoring it or being deceived ... happens all the time ... deceived by ourself and/or deceived by satan.

Romans 1:20

For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse.
Romans1:20 does not refer to born again Christians in whom the Holy Spirit dwells!!

I actually agree with you, the Holy Spirit is the convictor of sin, which I am afraid, shows your beliefs to be contradictory. And if you believe you obey the ten commandments, that is testimony to you not understanding what obeying those commands entails. So why would the Holy Spirit not convict you, you fail to obey them?

I will repeat, it is not a law written in ink under the new covenant, but for you it is
 
Last edited:
  • Prayers
Reactions: eleos1954
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.