The rapture
- Thread starter Childofgodharrison
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The following verse connects chapter 5 to chapter 4, and in so doing kills the pretrib removal of the Church.
1Th 5:10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him.
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Douggg
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Why so?
The video does not take into account that the world will be saying peace and safety before the Day of the Lord suddenly catches them off guard, 1Thessalonians5.
The video has the Day of the Lord "beginning" at the end of the great tribulation - which would not correspond to the world saying peace and safety at that time. It is just a mistake in the video.
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The problem is that the video doesn't understand that the Day of the Lord has no end to it.
There as milestones of the Day of the Lord once it begins. The key is that it begins when the world is saying peace and safety.
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Apparently, you do not understand "the day of the Lord", if you do not know that it begins with the destruction of this rotten, sin-cursed world.
2Pe 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
2Pe 3:11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
2Pe 3:12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
See also 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10.
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Douggg
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I understand the Day of the Lord, but you don't.
The Day of the Lord is eternity long. The time events you are talking about being the beginning of it are minuscule in comparison.
What is a thousand years in eternity?
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Rev 10:6 And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer:
Rev 10:7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.
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Douggg
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Instead of just copying and pasting verses, bolding certain parts. You should add your comments of why the bolded parts are pertinent to the discussion. No one can read your mind.
I am guessing that there should be time no longer: , you are suggesting that time ceases to exist.
If so, that's is not what it means. It means without further delay.
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How many days come after the "last day"?
Joh_6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
Joh_6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
Joh_6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
Joh_6:54 Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
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Joh 5:27 And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.
Joh 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
Joh 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
Joh 5:30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.
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AntiVillain
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And how is the idea of no-Rapture not supposed to make more-troubled Believers contemplate suicide ahead of time?
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iamlamad
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Just teach the truth of scripture, and let the dogs bark. (I am not calling anyone here a dog! It is just a saying. Anything anyone writes here will certainly be challenged.)
What is truth? The great crowd, too large to number - was seen in heaven BEFORE the 70th week starts. Period and end of story.
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keras
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THAT statement is a lie!
Nowhere does Revelation 7 say that vast multitude of people from every tribe, race, nation and language are in heaven. They are all the faithful Christians, in all of the holy Land, who trusted in the Lord to protect them during the just occurred Day of the Lord's fiery wrath; the Sixth Seal.
The last Day of this age, will be the great Day of Almighty God, Revelation 16:14, the Day Jesus Returns to the earth for His millennium reign.
The OT saints are not raised at that time, only those who will be martyred during the Great Trib. Revelation 20:4
This; I and the Bible; do agree with
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christiansoccerplayer
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Please explain about the multitude standing before the throne and the Lamb. Is the throne and Lamb not in heaven?
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iamlamad
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Whoa back! Let's just read it, shall we?
Rev. 7:9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;
10 And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb.
11 And all the angels stood round about the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts, and fell before the throne on their faces, and worshipped God,
I think one would have to have very thick, preconceived glasses on to place this great crowd anywhere else but in the throne room of heaven. If you have doubts, refer back to chapter 4 where John saw the throne room. Note: "the throne room" has always been in heaven.
I refer you to chapter 4:
4 After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.
2 And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne.
Note the highlighted words. Any questions?
in all of the holy Land That statement is in error! (I am being nice: I could have quoted you.)
Note: try removing all preconceptions and read these verses as if you never saw them before - as if with an empty slate. They are in heaven. Period and end of story.
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William Lefranc
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The great tribulation is made up by people who don't understand the context of the scriptures.
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