The Russian hoax is over now it's time to hold people responsible

expos4ever · Jul 27, 2019

Mountainmanbob said:
Some just don't appreciate the truth.

M-Bob

Indeed. And there is clear evidence you are one of those with little regard for the truth. You started a thread off with a deliberately deceptive title.

Thus has been pointed out to you and you have not retracted. If you had retracted, you could have legitimately claimed to have made an honest mistake.

But, you did not retract. So the evidence is right there in the open - you do not respect truth.

Mountainmanbob · Jul 27, 2019

The title of this thread is correct with evidence of proff.

But, the blind will not see.

M-Bob

Shiloh Raven · Jul 27, 2019

Mountainmanbob said:
Some just don't appreciate the truth.

M-Bob

Yeah, I know what you mean, Bob. It's kind of like not appreciating the uncomfortable truth that the U.S. government is also guilty of interfering in the national elections of other countries for decades.

Has America ever been held responsible for interfering in foreign elections or for arming terrorists?

America Created Al-Qaeda and the ISIS Terror Group

The long history of the U.S. interfering with elections elsewhere

The U.S. Needs to Face Up to Its Long History of Election Meddling

The U.S. is no stranger to interfering in the elections of other countries

Shiloh Raven · Jul 27, 2019

A_Thinker said:
The article is an OPINION piece. That makes it no more significant than if Mountainmanbob wrote it ...

We should repeat that... the article is an OPINION piece.

expos4ever · Jul 27, 2019

Mountainmanbob said:
The title of this thread is correct with evidence of proff.

But, the blind will not see.

M-Bob

Nice try.

I was not talking about this thread, but about the Omar thread. Your title was deceptive.

Foxfyre · Jul 27, 2019

Kaon said:
Then romanticize us humans, and be surprised by what's next as we always are in history. At some point we have to be realists, and see the world for what it was. Ignoring and/or romanticizing the world is what got us here in the first place.

We let the corrupt win by denying that they can be so diabolical that their tendrils reach all facets of the system of subjugation. We scoff at what they are capable of, and in the same breath talk about how they control everything.

Humans in our undying predictability and susceptibility to psychological programming have the audacity to act like corrupt politicians are the fault when we have stayed silent and blind to all of it when it was happening to the least of us. We nurtured our nationalism and genocidal history as "invictus" while ignoring the results and people affected. We simply denied it and called the ones who told us before liars - until we decided to pay attention.

Now we want to make a change as if the same "corrupt" people aren't expecting every single passive and active strategy from our predictable, aimless selves? We still let prejudice and racism control us because we love submitting to authority and the way they influence our fragile minds. Meanwhile, those same corrupt entities are enjoying themselves as they discuss how they orchestrate the demise of a bunch of lemmings.

You are considered a commodity, a resource and a fool - do you care? You are repeatedly called a consumer and expected to work all of your life, then die. The credit systems are a farce, and there isn't enough imagination in people to realize the how controlled they are.

As said, we have people who proudly own entire small cities of land, resources and property while in the same "great country" there are people who live outside on streets in increasing matter.

And, we have the audacity to say we are "honorable"? That is why we deserve what happens next.

Well Abraham persuaded God to spare Sodom if 10 righteous men could be found there. Apparently they failed to find the 10 but God did spare Lot and his family.

I have to believe there are enough people with sufficient righteousness left in America that God might be of a mind to spare us. That is my prayer.

Foxfyre · Jul 27, 2019

FreeinChrist said:
US Customs and Border Control was established in 1924. Homeland was established in 2002. Yes, it is now an arm of Homeland. ICE was established in 2002.

I personally do not expect ICE to be ended. Don't really want it ended. But it seems there is a need for more oversight of both. Could post links to problems but can't right now

There is no endeavor of humankind, however righteous, that does not involve some human error, miscalculations, bad choices, and that will be even more true when there are intentionally unrighteous people involved. But all of us have sinned and fallen short. Perfection is pretty much God's prerogative to achieve, not ours. All we can do is the best we can with what we have to work with. So yes there will be good results and some unintended negative consequences along the way.

But from what I have seen of the huge majority of the people who make up ICE and CBP, these are good, honest, caring, hard working, dedicated people who deserve all the support and help that America can give them. And an occasional bad egg now and then--there will almost be one or some in EVERY human institution--should not be pointed to as the sin of all.

mothcorrupteth · Jul 27, 2019

Shiloh Raven said:
We should repeat that... the article is an OPINION piece.

So the article is an opinion piece. But if that's the entire size of your point, you're poisoning the well.

mothcorrupteth · Jul 27, 2019

Look, all I know is that the side that spent years dramatizing the McCarthy era and spent the 80's crapping out at least three peace songs per album, and the movie Abyss, is suddenly suspiciously xenophobic with respect to Slavs after losing an election they should have won. And meanwhile, Slavs are actually protecting Christians in the Middle East. Entirely out of self-interest, to be sure, just as all human behavior ultimately is. But also in our interest. Genuinely in our interest, unlike the neocon wars and Clinton and Obama's "humanitarian" wars. Putin didn't hack your election. But if he did, I wouldn't care. A hungry dog does not care who's filling the food dish.

Alien Lotus · Jul 27, 2019

A_Thinker said:
This is garbage thinking.

There were seven (count them) ... criminal convictions of Trump campaign associates garnered from Mueller's investigation.

It no longer is even denied that Trump campaign associates met with Russians for the purpose of obtaining an edge in the American electoral process.

None of those results have any counterpart for either Obama, Hilary, or Comey.

The same Trump supporters who want to lock Hilary up for maintaining a private e-mail server at home (from which no negative consequences have been demonstrated for the nation) ... are willing to give Trump a pass for working with the Russians to subvert the will of American voters in the 2016 presidential campaign.

Talk about garbage thinking.

Kaon · Jul 27, 2019

Foxfyre said:
Well Abraham persuaded God to spare Sodom if 10 righteous men could be found there. Apparently they failed to find the 10 but God did spare Lot and his family.

I have to believe there are enough people with sufficient righteousness left in America that God might be of a mind to spare us. That is my prayer.

Then believe it. But your Father has already told you what world will be before He sends His Son back to rule this plane of existence with an iron rod.

Abraham, from his own human WANT to overcome the WILL of the Most High God asked for conditions - as if the Most High God didn't consider 50, 10 or 5 people of righteousness for the city.

We handicap ourselves with our romanticism and logic (yes, logic) - especially when the Truth is simplistic.

If you think the Most High God is back in the business of sparing nations because of people who live in them (despite what He has said) - after His Son was murdered, and His prophets are humiliated and murdered daily - then you may be in for a surprise. The Most High God is saving remnants, but they have to go through everything just like the Hebrews in Egypt, and Noah. He will protect them, but our Father is tired.

We murdered His son.

We murder His prophets who try to warn us and bring us to repentance.

We murder the least of men among us - enslave them, rape them and subjugate them while calling them liars when they cry out.

We do a good deed a day as a ritual to appease our ego (the god most of us follow).

We isolate and judge people by skin color and country of origin, and use statistics we [should] know are inflated to justify our treatment and psychology.

You are a sovereign adult under the Most High God; keep faith in humanity if you like. But, don't be surprised when these judgments befall America, and the world. We built this New World, we nurtured it with our prejudice and ignorance. We let our enemies distract us with rudimentary psychological division tactics. We ignored the warnings and scoffed at the possibility of our own demise.

Snoder · Jul 28, 2019

Mountainmanbob said:
And then, after the most extensive investigation in modern American history, we found the truth. And so, we can say conclusively, once again, what we told you the day this all started, the whole thing is a crock. It never happened. They were lying to you. That's clear now. The debate is over.

Just because Trump says "no collusion" over and over again, which is weird, that does not mean the report found there was no collusion or no crimes.
Trump's play at innocence is based on the fact those who put the report together lacked the ability to charge him for crimes.
Impeachment is impossible due the Republican controlled Senate. As Trump has said, he can shoot someone in the middle of Times Square and he'd get away with it.
We know he goes through wives, sleeps with prostitutes, and brags about sexual assault. Yet many evangelicals hail him as their savior.
We know he lied when he said he wouldn't release his tax returns because of an audit. He doesn't even deny or play lawyer games. He just blatantly lies, constantly. No one cares.

He can do whatever he want because he is probably the last of his kind to be President. America has had two centuries of white men that did whatever they wanted. Trump is punishment, or fear, of many Americans who realized the era is over when Barrack Obama served 8 years and a woman would win the popular vote.

Decades of isolating Russia and playing them off as an enemy to China has ended. They've essentially announced they are going to be the new world power while our President makes decisions about attacking Iran based on Tucker Carlson. Allies are being insulted and buying weapons from Russia and China while our President tweets for hours on end about the Mueller report after saying he doesn't care about it.

It's as if we'd rather see America destroyed than hand it over to a woman President or a minority.

Mountainmanbob · Jul 28, 2019

Snoder said:
It's as if we'd rather see America destroyed than hand it over to a woman President or a minority.

We had a black president and he was a dud.

A woman almost became president but, she was a crook.

Been there done that.

M-Bob

Gigimo · Jul 28, 2019

FreeinChrist said:
What I see is an inability to actually argue your view.

Anyone can make remarks with no substance. pfft

You know that's something I've noticed about this place that's kinda strange is some folks put more stock into how well you argue a point than the accuracy/factualness of said point/subject. It's as if you argue a point long enough/hard enough it adds legitimacy/validity to said point/subject when there may not be any to begin with :scratch:

Yarddog · Jul 28, 2019

Mountainmanbob said:
We had a black president and he was a dud.

If he was a dud then Trump doesn't exist. Obama certainly could have been better but he was a far better person than Trump has the possibility of obtaining.

A woman almost became president but, she was a crook.

Been there done that.

M-Bob

And you support a bigger crook, bigger liar, and far more corrupt president than Hillary could have been.

Mountainmanbob · Jul 28, 2019

Yarddog said:
And you support a bigger crook, bigger liar, and far more corrupt president than Hillary could have been.

And she still ain't out of trouble.

Amazing how after she lost the election people and countries stopped giving to her charity. I guess that there is no reason to bribe somebody that is not in power.

M-Bob

Yarddog · Jul 28, 2019

Mountainmanbob said:
And she still ain't out of trouble.

Amazing how after she lost the election people and countries stopped giving to her charity. I guess that there is no reason to bribe somebody that is not in power.

M-Bob

Those crooks giving to Hillary just found a more crooked person, in Trump, who was happy to accept their money.

Albion · Jul 28, 2019

Who would they be? We know all about the Clinton Foundation's operations.

Shiloh Raven · Jul 28, 2019

mothcorrupteth said:
So the article is an opinion piece. But if that's the entire size of your point, you're poisoning the well.

Opinions are like armpits, everyone has one. I consider the source when I hear another opinion. I also consider whether or not that opinion was given with a right wing bias and reported by Fox News.

Shiloh Raven · Jul 28, 2019

Yarddog said:
If he was a dud then Trump doesn't exist. Obama certainly could have been better but he was a far better person than Trump has the possibility of obtaining.

If Obama had demonstrated even the slightest hint of the sinful behavior that Trump is guilty of, then he would have been repeatedly judged and condemned by the conservatives who support Trump.

If Obama had been twice divorced, in his third marriage to his former mistress, and had fathered five children with three different women, then he would have been repeatedly judged and condemned by the conservatives who are loyally supporting Trump. He would have been shunned and shamed.

If Obama had had an affair with a inappropriate content star and later paid her off to silence her, then he would have been repeatedly judged and condemned by the conservatives who are loyally supporting Trump.

If Obama had boastfully bragged about sexually groping multiple women, then he would have been repeatedly judged and condemned by the conservatives who are loyally supporting Trump.

The conservatives who support Trump never would have called his bragging locker room banter or macho talk. They never would have insisted "Don't judge him for his sins!" or "His sins are between him and God!" or "Who among us is without sin?" or "People voted for a President, not a Pastor!"

Yarddog said:
And you support a bigger crook, bigger liar, and far more corrupt president than Hillary could have been.

I have no doubt that this is why there has been so much negative reaction toward his supporters. There are accusations like: (1) Evangelical convictions for sell, (2) the great Evangelical compromise, and (3) Evangelicals abandon their principle. There are several articles with titles that aren't allowed to be posted because of their scathing titles. Personally speaking, that's also the reason why I don't take the preaching against sin or the preaching about morality or the judgmental finger pointing and pompous outrage toward some liberal politician for his or her immoral and/or unethical behavior.

How has President Trump changed white Christians' views of 'morality'?

How could Christians support Trump’s lies? It depends on what you mean by ‘truth.’

The Russian hoax is over now it's time to hold people responsible

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