Supreme Court Leaves Citizenship Question Blocked For Now From 2020 Census

SummerMadness

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Yes, that's too much to ask, the thread is not about you.
The question was to be included to depress immigrant participation in the census in order to increase the voting power of non-Hispanic whites.

Trump, 'not backing down' in effort to count citizens amid census fight, announces executive order

What this means is that the citizenship question isn't going to be on the 2020 Census, because the Supreme Court completely screwed that with their ruling, so fair enough. Everyone could sit around and scream about how unfair it was or how dumb the ruling was, but that doesn't change the outcome either way. With this executive order, that doesn't really matter now.

Every department and agency in the federal government will need to provide the Department of Commerce with all requested records regarding the number of citizens and non-citizens in the country, and then the Census Bureau can use this information--along with information collected through the questionnaire--to create the official census. This basically means that the functionality of the question is going to be a part of the census whether they like it or not, it won't even need to be a part of the actual questionnaire to do it, and it will actually be more accurate for it, since it's very easy to just lie or fail to hand in the census.

So, the real question is, if they could always do it this way, why not do it before?
Because they wanted to cause an undercount in immigrant communities in order to artificially increased the voting power of non-Hispanic whites. They took the hard L on this one.
 
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Rion

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The question was to be included to depress immigrant participation in the census in order to increase the voting power of non-Hispanic whites.

Because they wanted to cause an undercount in immigrant communities in order to artificially increased the voting power of non-Hispanic whites. They took the hard L on this one.

Is that the latest conspiracy theory?
 
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Rion

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"latest"? No, not the latest. Just the stated intention of the architect of the plan.

They literally said that they wanted to artificially inflate white people's voting power by undercounting legal immigrants? Or was that translated into Wokenese from "We want to know if illegals are voting"?
 
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Speedwell

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They literally said that they wanted to artificially inflate white people's voting power by undercounting legal immigrants? Or was that translated into Wokenese from "We want to know if illegals are voting"?
Doesn't seem possible, as the census question would not really tell us how many illegal aliens were voting.
 
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Rion

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Doesn't seem possible, as the census question would not really tell us how many illegal aliens were voting.

It would have 'looked' that way to the average voter, but done little. Now that they blocked that, but declared that getting that info is legal, just not as a census question, they're going to get the info on illegals in a much better manner. Won't tell us who is voting, but it will give us legit numbers on how many and where.
 
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iluvatar5150

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They literally said that they wanted to artificially inflate white people's voting power by undercounting legal immigrants?

Yes, that is literally what they said.

Or was that translated into Wokenese from "We want to know if illegals are voting"?

Yes, skeptical snarkiness is such a good look when it's obvious you've read absolutely nothing about the suit, the question, or the rationale behind it.

Deceased G.O.P. Strategist’s Hard Drives Reveal New Details on the Census Citizenship Question
The documents cited in the Thursday court filing include an unpublished August 2015 analysis by Mr. Hofeller, who was hired by The Washington Free Beacon, a conservative news outlet financially backed by Paul Singer, a billionaire New York hedge fund manager and major Republican donor. Mr. Hofeller’s charge was to assess the impact of drawing political maps that were not based on a state’s total population — the current practice virtually everywhere in the nation — but on a slice of that population: American citizens of voting age.

At the time, the study’s sponsor was considering whether to finance a lawsuit by conservative legal advocates that argued that counting voting-age citizens was not merely acceptable, but required by the Constitution.

Mr. Hofeller’s exhaustive analysis of Texas state legislative districts concluded that such maps “would be advantageous to Republicans and non-Hispanic whites,” and would dilute the political power of the state’s Hispanics.

The reason, he wrote, was that the maps would exclude traditionally Democratic Hispanics and their children from the population count. That would force Democratic districts to expand to meet the Constitution’s one person, one vote requirement. In turn, that would translate into fewer districts in traditionally Democratic areas, and a new opportunity for Republican mapmakers to create even stronger gerrymanders.


The strategy carried a fatal flaw, however: The detailed citizenship data that was needed to draw the maps did not exist. The only existing tally of voting-age citizens, Mr. Hofeller's study stated, came from a statistical sample of the population largely used by the Justice Department to verify that the 1965 Voting Rights Act was ensuring the voting rights of minority groups.

“Without a question on citizenship being included on the 2020 Decennial Census questionnaire,” Mr. Hofeller wrote, “the use of citizen voting age population is functionally unworkable.”

This page has Common Cause's filings in both NY & MD along with the documents for the NY filings:
New Evidence Exposes GOP Census Rigging - Common Cause

Hofeller's report is Exhibit D of "NY Documents"

The goal was to re-draw the districts in a way that disadvantaged Democrats. Hispanics served as a proxy for Democrats.
 
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Speedwell

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It would have 'looked' that way to the average voter, but done little. Now that they blocked that, but declared that getting that info is legal, just not as a census question, they're going to get the info on illegals in a much better manner. Won't tell us who is voting, but it will give us legit numbers on how many and where.
The census question asked if the respondent was a citizen. A non-citizen is not necessarily an illegal alien.
 
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Goonie

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Rion

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Yes, that is literally what they said - though by undercounting Hispanics, not legal immigrants.



Yes, skeptical snarkiness is such a good look when it's obvious you've read absolutely nothing about the suit, the question, or the rationale behind it.

Deceased G.O.P. Strategist’s Hard Drives Reveal New Details on the Census Citizenship Question


This page has Common Cause's filings in both NY & MD along with the documents for the NY filings:
New Evidence Exposes GOP Census Rigging - Common Cause

Hofeller's report is Exhibit D of "NY Documents"

The goal was to re-draw the districts in a way that disadvantaged Democrats. Hispanics served as a proxy for Democrats.

That sounds like he's conflating hispanics with illegals, and talking about excluding all illegals. It does not sound like he's talking about removing legal immigrants. Still stupid, but of a different flavor.
 
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iluvatar5150

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That sounds like he's conflating hispanics with illegals, and talking about excluding all illegals. It does not sound like he's talking about removing legal immigrants. Still stupid, but of a different flavor.

They're conflating "Hispanic" with "Democrat". I'm not going to dig up the documents now, but the Census Bureau already knows that the citizenship question will scare off some legal immigrants from filling out the census form. Undercounting those groups (legal or not) is advantageous to Republicans, and also to white people. The whole fight had nothing to do with counting illegals and everything to do with getting better data to facilitate gerrymandering.
 
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Rion

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They're conflating "non-citizen" (which, probably also means Hispanic, especially in Texas) with "Democrat". I'm not going to dig up the documents now, but the Census Bureau already knows that the citizenship question will scare off some legal immigrants from filling out the census form. Undercounting those groups (legal or not) is advantageous to Republicans, and also to white people. The whole fight had nothing to do with counting illegals and everything to do with getting better data to facilitate gerrymandering.

I know it had little, if anything, to do with actually counting illegals. The question is, isn't it also gerrymandering to count illegals in a census for US Citizens? Why should a state or county get more political power for hosting a bunch of non-citizens?

And yes, it's obvious they're conflating that with the Democrats. After the last debate where almost all of the people up on stage were talking about opening the borders and giving illegals free health care, I can't imagine why anyone would do that. /sarcasm
 
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Speedwell

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I know it had little, if anything, to do with actually counting illegals. The question is, isn't it also gerrymandering to count illegals in a census for US Citizens? Why should a state or county get more political power for hosting a bunch of non-citizens?
The Constitution specifies that the census is to be an "actual enumeration" of all persons in the country, not just citizens.
 
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Rion

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The Constitution specifies that the census is to be an "actual enumeration" of all persons in the country, not just citizens.

Yes, count them, but not to give proportional representation to the places holding them. These politicians want them counted for representation purposes for the same reason the slave owners wanted their slaves counted, and it has nothing to do with caring about these people.
 
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cow451

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Is that the latest conspiracy theory?
No. The latest is that Obama wasn’t Kenyan after all.

The administration pretty much admitted it. President Subtle said so in public.
 
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Rion

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No. The latest is that Obama wasn’t Kenyan after all.

The administration pretty much admitted it. President Subtle said so in public.

So... you're saying that by 2027 the Russia Conspiracy Nuts should be over their TDS?
 
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cow451

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There are subversive powers within America that want to break the country as founded. Remake it in their own image. Flooding and overwhelming systems with illegal aliens would help do that.
True that. The Landscapers and Land Developers of America are in cahoots with the Golf Course and Hospitality Cabal to undermine the very fabric this country was swaddled in.
 
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cow451

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That sounds like he's conflating hispanics with illegals, and talking about excluding all illegals. It does not sound like he's talking about removing legal immigrants. Still stupid, but of a different flavor.
True. It is hard to figure out the President mashup of the week.
 
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