Too far left?

Shiloh Raven said:

In reality Christians have lost no rights and are not threatened in any meaningful way. In Canada and the USA Christians are certainly not being persecuted.

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There are people who are perfectly at home with force to advance their cause. Christians and non believers fall in that camp. I don’t expect an unbeliever to demonstrate a godly response in their behavior. But I’m wholly at odds with those who profess a belief in God who are willing to impress their will by any means necessary.

They are worse than the one who walks in darkness. Weaponizing their faith and expecting society to bow to its ideals is wrong. God didn’t threaten or oppress me into service and I don’t believe we can force others who haven’t agreed to live under God’s principles to do so.

This is the kind of behavior that’s prevalent in cults and extreme groups. We may share a thought. We can voice our concerns. But we can’t bludgeon anyone into seeing things from our perspective.

God never promised us a utopia. It’s easy to be Christian when everything goes your way and life is comfortable. The minor challenges we’re experiencing don’t compare to the horrors others suffer in His name.

Our comfort has been disturbed. Our ease is no more. We have to walk this out. That’s the issue. It’s time to work.

Speedwell said:

It's not a one-dimensional scale.

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Then you are disagreeing with what we have already read about moving left or right? Or being in the center.

whatbogsends said:

It was rather dry wit.

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Dry wit or not, your statement had some truth in it.

archarios said:

Uh, no. The GOP has not moved far right, and the democrats have not moved to the center. How laughable.

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I think a lot of voters are to right and to left. Which makes it harder for politicians. I'm more the middle on some issues.

People claimed to vote for the lesser evil. There were to lesser evils. That was running against Hillary and Trump.

Speedwell said:

Fiscal conservatism hasn't changed much, so in that respect the GOP is about where it was.

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Heh heh, talking about it until they are in the white house then doing the opposite? It's not really been an inflation problem much since 2008 though to have large deficits because of systemic price deflating forces, like automation.

CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN said:

People claimed to vote for the lesser evil. There were to lesser evils. That was running against Hillary and Trump.

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I didn't vote for either Trump or Clinton. I voted Third Party during the last presidential election.

Albion said:

Then you are disagreeing with what we have already read about moving left or right? Or being in the center.

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I'm saying that a one-dimensional continuum oversimplifies.

Speedwell said:

I'm saying that a one-dimensional continuum oversimplifies.

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I think you mean two-dimensional (left or right), but in any case, the point is probably correct. However, it doesn't really deal with the issue here -- unless, that is, you are willing to give us your assessment of how each of the two parties overall have moved, shifted, in recent years.

Albion said:

I think you mean two-dimensional (left or right), but in any case, the point is probably correct. However, it doesn't really deal with the issue here -- unless, that is, you are willing to give us your assessment of how each of the two parties overall have moved, shifted, in recent years.

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Are you familiar with the Overton Window?

Consider Nixon and the clean water act, the EPA, the continuation of Johnson's war on poverty, the crazy high tax rates.

Consider the economic priorities of the Reagan budget in 1986 as well as the substantial increases in tax rates that came about. Consider how commercial real estate about died when Reagan took away the huge tax advantages it had back then.

Todays Dems are to the right of old school Republicans when it comes to fiscal matters... an upcoming person with Reagan's value set would not stand a chance in the GOP, as they'd be considered an extreme leftist.

whatbogsends said:

Can't we Make America Great Again and get back to the time when American Christians could discriminate freely?

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Like 1949?

archarios said:

And again, no, this country has not been moving farther right, and the republicans have not been moving farther right.

How can you look at every politically-left gain and believe that the country is more conservative than ever?

In what concrete ways is trump any more right than any other repub prez? What, Buzzfeed said so so it's true? No evidence required?

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Well, I here conservatives say "these aren't our kids" as justification for their mistreatment. Never in my wildest dreams would I have thought that lack of appropriate treatment of kids; even incarcerated ones, was something ANYONE could get behind. I guess you just had to have an extreme enough ideology that anyone could get behind it.
Note: This includes the republicans who say "kids can just leave when they want"; "shouldn't have tried to cross"; "they're illegal, so...."; "let 'em rot".
It ALSO includes left wingers who want to boycott wayfair who was going to get a contract to actually get beds build FOR these asylum seekers. I find that beyond a poor response from an extreme mindset.

archarios said:

Thats why we're trying to speak up and make noise against the atheist left who is doing what it can to make American Christians get the same treatment as Chinese Christians.

Thats why we speak up against being forced to cater to sin.

You may think that American Christians are not a target, you may think America's view of Christians is perfect, and you may think America will stand eternally as a haven for Christians, but you're wrong.

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archarios said:

Thats why we're trying to speak up and make noise against the atheist left who is doing what it can to make American Christians get the same treatment as Chinese Christians.

Thats why we speak up against being forced to cater to sin.

You may think that American Christians are not a target, you may think America's view of Christians is perfect, and you may think America will stand eternally as a haven for Christians, but you're wrong.

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I am yet to find one single example in the New Testament where Christ himself or his disciple fought against other groups so Christians can worship freely.

As I said , these kind of fake persecution only highlight how shallow the faith in Christ. Instated of finding strength and safety in Christ and Holy Spirit , American Christian put their faith on elected government.

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archarios said:

Thats why we're trying to speak up and make noise against the atheist left who is doing what it can to make American Christians get the same treatment as Chinese Christians.

Thats why we speak up against being forced to cater to sin.

You may think that American Christians are not a target, you may think America's view of Christians is perfect, and you may think America will stand eternally as a haven for Christians, but you're wrong.

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I often wonder , what would Jesus do if he had lived in American in 2019. I admit , I can’t presume to know what Jesus would do. But looking at the scripture, reading about the life Jesus lived when he was on earth I think I can guess what he would do.

Jesus would dine with the Lefty Liberal atheist who wants to kill him, he would break bread with homosexual and other sinner who wants to take away freedom to worship him. He would say to them “ my father has a better place for you, come with me, I will take you there”.

On the other hand, the “Christians” who are so righteous and fight for unborn children , fight to have freedom to worship Jesus , they would be sanding outside and say “ This Jesus claim to be ‘Sone of God’, he claim to be the “Holy man”, yet he dine and socialize with the sinner who wants to kill us, he is not from God, he is destroying the faith we belive”.

Jesus will turn his face to these “Christian” and say “ you the children of serpent, I never knew you , go away”. “I didn’t come back for you , but I came back for these sinners, and my father send me so these sinner have eternal life”

archarios said:

Can you please point me to the chapter and verse in which Jesus orders the 12 to supply bread and wine to a brothel, proclaim that no sin occurs at the brothel, and pray that the place remains open and successful until the Second Coming?

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He would say , I would give you “living water”

Jesus answered her, “If you knew the gift of God and who it is that asks you for a drink, you would have asked him and he would have given you living water.”

[Post edited to avoid offending persons of a particular political viewpoint.]

Tiberius Lee said:

Instated of finding strength and safety in Christ and Holy Spirit , American Christian put their faith on elected government.

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I don’t understand the fixation but after reading your comment I’m convinced it’s a hobby. If you really felt your life was at risk and feared the threats routinely discussed. Would you spend you time chatting on the Internet or making preparations for a safe exit?

For what it’s worth I live in the U.S. and I’m not persecuted. Nor do I live in fear of loss of rights or threats of any sort. God has blessed me with a good life and I plan to enjoy it.

archarios said:

And in following Jesus:

The atheist would need to repent of his atheism and his desire to kill Jesus.
The homosexual would need to repent of his homosexuality.
The other sinner would need to repent of his desire to take away the freedom to worship Jesus.

The world and liberal Christians say "You can be an atheist Christian! Don't repent!"
The world and liberal Christians say "There's no sin in homosexuality! Don't repent!"
The world and liberal Christians say "Christians are bigots! When they want freedom to worship, it means they want to oppress and kill non-Christians! Don't repent of your efforts to restrict them!"

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You are right, the atheist needs to repent, homosexual needs to repent and accept Christ and turn from their sin. But it is not your and my job to punish them , attack them if they don’t.

Your and my job is very simple - Mark 16:15 "“He said to them, ‘Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation."

And if they don’t repent , then the job is even more easier

Matthew 10:14-15 If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, leave that home or town and shake the dust off your feet. 15 Truly I tell you, it will be more bearable for Sodom and Gomorrah on the day of judgment than for that town.

No where in new testament it says if any one deny Christ or persecute you , you should fight back. As a matter of fact Jesus said this those who persecute Christians

Matthew 5:43-48

43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor[a] and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45 that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. 46 If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? 47 And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? 48 Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.