Donald Trump Jr. Shares, Then Deletes, a Tweet Questioning Kamala Harris’s Race

Hank77 · Jul 2, 2019

FaithLife1 said:
The Cherokee Nation described the DNA test as "useless," adding that there are legal requirements for tribal citizenship.

"Using a DNA test to lay claim to any connection to the Cherokee Nation or any tribal nation, even vaguely, is inappropriate and wrong," Cherokee Nation Secretary of State Chuck Hoskin, Jr., said in a statement. "It makes a mockery out of DNA tests and its legitimate uses while also dishonoring legitimate tribal governments and their citizens, whose ancestors are well documented and whose heritage is proven. Senator Warren is undermining tribal interests with her continued claims of tribal heritage."

The Republican National Committee mocked Warren's disclosure, saying the test revealed only a "minuscule percentage" of Native American ancestry that still leaves unanswered questions.

The RNC also jumped on a correction from The Boston Globe. The paper originally reported that the probability of Warren's Native American ancestry ranges from 1/32 to 1/512, but now reports the low end of that range is actually 1/1,024.

What difference does it make? She believed the family stories and DNA proved she has American Indian markers.

My in-laws have traced both sides of the family. On grandma's side everyone is documented all the way back to the 1600's. The line that she is from goes back to a North Carolina Cherokee family member, he is buried in TN. We had a guy call from PA and his line was the same but from a different son of this native man. Is he on the Dawes Roll, not that I could find. But then not all of them were.

FaithLife1 · Jul 2, 2019

Hank77 said:
What difference does it make? She believed the family stories and DNA proved she has American Indian markers.

My in-laws have traced both sides of the family. On grandma's side everyone is documented all the way back to the 1600's. The line that she is from goes back to a North Carolina Cherokee family member, he is buried in TN. We had a guy call from PA and his line was the same but from a different son of this native man. Is he on the Dawes Roll, not that I could find. But then not all of them were.

Good luck to her for trying to join a tribe. I believe you have to have at least 50% in order to join one.

Brightmoon · Jul 2, 2019

FaithLife1 said:
Good luck to her for trying to join a tribe. I believe you have to have at least 50% in order to join one.

you don’t leave your lineage . Whether or not she is a member of the tribe she has that ancestry . She didn’t lie and trump , as usual made a big deal out of nothing.

As an aside I see that Republicans and conservatives have the same problem with common descent. The name changes and they think it’s something else . Humans are apes , apes are Primates therefore humans are Primates. Warren is part Cherokee because one of her ancestors was. That’s her dna lineage . She is not part of the Cherokee tribe which is a social construct

Hank77 · Jul 2, 2019

FaithLife1 said:
Good luck to her for trying to join a tribe. I believe you have to have at least 50% in order to join one.

Who is trying to join a tribe?

Shiloh Raven · Jul 2, 2019

FaithLife1 said:
Good luck to her for trying to join a tribe. I believe you have to have at least 50% in order to join one.

That's incorrect. Actually each tribal nation has its own requirements for tribal membership. The Cherokee Nation of Oklahoma, for example, requires a person to provide documentation that they have at least one Cherokee ancestor who was listed on the Dawes Indian Rolls for tribal membership and for a CDIB card (Certificate of Degree of Indian Blood). If Warren provides that documentation, then she would qualify for tribal membership with the Cherokee Nation and have a CDIB card.

FaithLife1 · Jul 2, 2019

Shiloh Raven said:
That's incorrect. Actually each tribal nation has its own requirements for tribal membership. The Cherokee Nation of Oklahoma, for example, requires a person to provide documentation that they have at least one Cherokee ancestor who was listed on the Dawes Indian Rolls for tribal membership and for a CDIB card (Certificate of Degree of Indian Blood). If Senator Warren does that, then she would qualify for tribal membership with the Cherokee Nation and have a CDIB card.

Surely they still take some DNA percentages into consideration, I don't see the whole process working if they completely disregard it but sometimes information on websites is incomplete.

https://www.powwows.com/much-percentage-native-american-enrol-tribe/

Tribal Blood Quantum Requirements
50 Percent / One-Half Blood Quantum (One Parent)

Kialegee Tribal Town
Miccosukee Tribe of Indians of Florida
Mississippi Band of Choctaw Indians, Mississippi
St. Croix Chippewa Indians of Wisconsin
White Mountain Apache Tribe, Arizona
Yomba Shoshone Tribe, Utah

25 Percent / One-Fourth Blood Quantum (One Grandparent)

Absentee-Shawnee Tribe of Indians
Cheyenne and Arapaho Tribes
Confederated Tribes and Bands of the Yakama Nation, Washington
Oneida Tribe of Indians, Wisconsin
Kickapoo Tribe of Oklahoma
Pascua Yaqui Tribe, Arizona
Kiowa Tribe of Oklahoma
Prairie Band Potawatomi Nation, Kansas
Navajo Nation, Arizona, Utah and New Mexico
Shoshone Tribe of the Wind River Reservation, Wyoming
Fort McDowell Yavapai Nation, Arizona
Standing Rock Sioux Tribe, North and South Dakota
Utu Utu Gwaitu Paiute Tribe, California
Havapai-Prescott Tribe, Arizona
United Keetoowah Band of Cherokee Indians, Oklahoma
Fort Peck Assiniboine and Sioux Tribes, Montana
St. Regis Mohawk Tribe, New York, Canada

Shiloh Raven · Jul 2, 2019

Brightmoon said:
you don’t leave your lineage . Whether or not she is a member of the tribe she has that ancestry . She didn’t lie and trump , as usual made a big deal out of nothing.

As an aside I see that Republicans and conservatives have the same problem with common descent. The name changes and they think it’s something else . Humans are apes , apes are Primates therefore humans are Primates. Warren is part Cherokee because one of her ancestors was. That’s her dna lineage . She is not part of the Cherokee tribe which is a social construct

Like I said earlier on in this thread...

I have been an NDN activist for nearly three decades and I must say that it astonishes me to hear so many conservative non-NDNs suddenly so concerned about tribal issues like blood quantum status and tribal membership. It's a shame that these same conservatives have never extended their indignation beyond Senator Warren though. They usually just mock liberal NDN activists and call them SJWs.

Shiloh Raven · Jul 2, 2019

FaithLife1 said:
Surely they still take some DNA percentages into consideration, I don't see the whole process working if they completely disregard it but sometimes information on websites is incomplete.

https://www.powwows.com/much-percentage-native-american-enrol-tribe/

Tribal Blood Quantum Requirements
50 Percent / One-Half Blood Quantum (One Parent)

Kialegee Tribal Town
Miccosukee Tribe of Indians of Florida
Mississippi Band of Choctaw Indians, Mississippi
St. Croix Chippewa Indians of Wisconsin
White Mountain Apache Tribe, Arizona
Yomba Shoshone Tribe, Utah

25 Percent / One-Fourth Blood Quantum (One Grandparent)

Absentee-Shawnee Tribe of Indians
Cheyenne and Arapaho Tribes
Confederated Tribes and Bands of the Yakama Nation, Washington
Oneida Tribe of Indians, Wisconsin
Kickapoo Tribe of Oklahoma
Pascua Yaqui Tribe, Arizona
Kiowa Tribe of Oklahoma
Prairie Band Potawatomi Nation, Kansas
Navajo Nation, Arizona, Utah and New Mexico
Shoshone Tribe of the Wind River Reservation, Wyoming
Fort McDowell Yavapai Nation, Arizona
Standing Rock Sioux Tribe, North and South Dakota
Utu Utu Gwaitu Paiute Tribe, California
Havapai-Prescott Tribe, Arizona
United Keetoowah Band of Cherokee Indians, Oklahoma
Fort Peck Assiniboine and Sioux Tribes, Montana
St. Regis Mohawk Tribe, New York, Canada

As I said in my previous post... each tribal nation has different requirements for tribal membership.

I provided the direct link to the Cherokee Nation website, which provides the legal requirements for its tribal membership. DNA tests to prove NDN ancestry can be inaccurate and therefore are unreliable.

Shiloh Raven · Jul 2, 2019

Cherokee Nation Tribal Registration Frequently Asked Questions

Who is eligible for citizenship in the Cherokee Nation?

Cherokee Nation is comprised of the descendants of Cherokees and Cherokee Freemen who removed here to Indian Territory (present-day northeastern Oklahoma) in the 1800s, either as “Early Settlers” prior to 1830 or through forced federal relocation commonly known as the “Trail of Tears.” Cherokees who established themselves in this new land were listed on several tribal censuses. A final federal census called the Dawes Rolls was taken of tribal citizens living here from 1898-1906. To be eligible for Cherokee Nation citizenship, a person must have one or more direct ancestors listed on Dawes.

(emphasis added)

FaithLife1 · Jul 2, 2019

Hank77 said:
Who is trying to join a tribe?

Why hasn't Sen. Warren tried joining? Perhaps because she knows she or her ancestor if she has one doesn't have enough Cherokee blood and she'll get rejected. She has less than 0.1% of Indian blood like most Americans have.

FaithLife1 · Jul 2, 2019

FaithLife1 said:
The Cherokee Nation described the DNA test as "useless," adding that there are legal requirements for tribal citizenship.

"Using a DNA test to lay claim to any connection to the Cherokee Nation or any tribal nation, even vaguely, is inappropriate and wrong," Cherokee Nation Secretary of State Chuck Hoskin, Jr., said in a statement. "It makes a mockery out of DNA tests and its legitimate uses while also dishonoring legitimate tribal governments and their citizens, whose ancestors are well documented and whose heritage is proven. Senator Warren is undermining tribal interests with her continued claims of tribal heritage."

The Republican National Committee mocked Warren's disclosure, saying the test revealed only a "minuscule percentage" of Native American ancestry that still leaves unanswered questions.

The RNC also jumped on a correction from The Boston Globe. The paper originally reported that the probability of Warren's Native American ancestry ranges from 1/32 to 1/512, but now reports the low end of that range is actually 1/1,024.

Shiloh Raven · Jul 2, 2019

FaithLife1 said:
Why hasn't Sen. Warren tried joining? Perhaps because she knows she or her ancestor if she has one doesn't have enough Cherokee blood and she'll get rejected. She has less than 0.1% of Indian blood like most Americans have.

Round and round we go, where we stop nobody knows. It's her choice whether or not she will join the tribe and it's no one's business but her own and her family. The requirements for membership with the Cherokee Nation of Oklahoma has been repeatedly posted. Continuing to ignore the requirements for tribal membership in order to keep pushing the criticism against her for her blood quantum status and for not joining the tribe won't negate those requirements. As anyone can read and plainly see from the information provided below: To be eligible for Cherokee Nation citizenship, a person must have one or more direct ancestors listed on Dawes. And as anyone can plainly see from the information that there is no requirement to have a specific amount of Indian blood quantum to register for citizenship with the Cherokee Nation. The requirement is documentation of a direct ancestor on the Dawes Indian Roll.

Cherokee Nation Tribal Registration Frequently Asked Questions

Who is eligible for citizenship in the Cherokee Nation?

Cherokee Nation is comprised of the descendants of Cherokees and Cherokee Freemen who removed here to Indian Territory (present-day northeastern Oklahoma) in the 1800s, either as “Early Settlers” prior to 1830 or through forced federal relocation commonly known as the “Trail of Tears.” Cherokees who established themselves in this new land were listed on several tribal censuses. A final federal census called the Dawes Rolls was taken of tribal citizens living here from 1898-1906. To be eligible for Cherokee Nation citizenship, a person must have one or more direct ancestors listed on Dawes.

(emphasis added)

Shiloh Raven · Jul 2, 2019

FaithLife1 said:
{snip}

Yes, we all know. I posted the information on DNA tests a couple of days ago (Sunday) in post #54.

Shiloh Raven said:
As I said before, these DNA tests to determine someone's Native American blood quantum status are about as reliable as an aspirin curing someone of cancer. DNA tests are useless and don't work.

"In a public statement, the Cherokee Nation of Oklahoma basically said the same thing: "A DNA test is useless to determine tribal citizenship. Current DNA tests do not even distinguish whether a person’s ancestors were indigenous to North or South America. Sovereign tribal nations set their own legal requirements for citizenship, and while DNA tests can be used to determine lineage, such as paternity, to an individual it is not evidence for tribal affiliation. Using a DNA test to lay claim to any connection to the Cherokee Nation or any tribal nation, even vaguely, is inappropriate and wrong. It makes a mockery out of DNA tests and its legitimate uses while also dishonoring legitimate tribal governments and their citizens whose ancestors are well documented and whose heritage is proven."

Source: Strike Against Sovereignty? Sen. Warren asserts Native American ancestry via DNA

FaithLife1 · Jul 2, 2019

Shiloh Raven said:
It's her choice whether or not she will join the tribe and it's no one's business but her own and her family.

She sure talked about it in the media a lot. If she joins and gets accepted and proves us wrong then that's a different story.

Shiloh Raven · Jul 2, 2019

FaithLife1 said:
She sure talked about it in the media a lot. If she joins and gets accepted and proves us wrong then that's a different story.

It's still her personal choice. I don't know what her reasons are for not joining the tribe since it's none of my business. In fact, I personally don't care what her reasons are for not joining the tribe.

Shiloh Raven · Jul 2, 2019

As an NDN activist, it really amuses me to see all of this sudden conservative interest in tribal issues like NDN blood quantum status and tribal membership just because of Warren's claim of Cherokee ancestry. I'm sure if she eventually joined the Cherokee Nation that these conservatives would start griping that she isn't "Indian enough" to be accepted and the tribe was wrong to accept her. I can also envision them fervently insisting that the tribal leaders should change the membership requirements.

FaithLife1 · Jul 2, 2019

Shiloh Raven said:
As an NDN activist, it really amuses me to see all of this sudden conservative interest in tribal issues like NDN blood quantum status and tribal membership just because of Warren's claim of Cherokee ancestry. I'm sure if she eventually joined the Cherokee Nation that these conservatives would start griping that she isn't "Indian enough" to be accepted and the tribe was wrong to accept her. I can also envision them fervently insisting that the tribal leaders should change the membership requirements.

Uh..huh.

Hank77 · Jul 3, 2019

FaithLife1 said:
Why hasn't Sen. Warren tried joining? Perhaps because she knows she or her ancestor if she has one doesn't have enough Cherokee blood and she'll get rejected. She has less than 0.1% of Indian blood like most Americans have.

Have you read @Shiloh Raven 's posts? Dawes Roll

Shiloh Raven · Jul 3, 2019

Hank77 said:
Have you read @Shiloh Raven 's posts? Dawes Roll

I have repeated the requirements for tribal membership with the Cherokee Nation SEVERAL times in this thread and yet we have gone round and round about Warren's NDN blood quantum status. There isn't a requirement of a certain amount of blood quantum to register for citizenship with the Cherokee Nation of OKLA. The requirement is documentation of a direct ancestor on the Dawes Indian Roll.

Hank77 · Jul 3, 2019

Shiloh Raven said:
I have repeated the requirements for tribal membership with the Cherokee Nation SEVERAL times in this thread and yet we have gone round and round about Warren's NDN blood quantum status. There isn't a requirement of a certain amount of blood quantum to register for citizenship with the Cherokee Nation of OKLA. The requirement is documentation of a direct ancestor on the Dawes Indian Roll.

Some people are either not reading every post or they don't understand what they are reading.

Donald Trump Jr. Shares, Then Deletes, a Tweet Questioning Kamala Harris’s Race

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