"Obviously, the Egg Came First!"

Caliban · Jun 25, 2019

Occams Barber said:
According to his tagline, Mr Taylor is both Creationist and Flerfer:

Gods created Creation
Heaven and Earth
Is Flat and Stationary

Looking at his posts, Mr Taylor does not do humour.
OB

A real Flat Earther in the wild--I feel like an anthropologist.

Occams Barber · Jun 25, 2019

R.Miller said:
A real Flat Earther in the wild--I feel like an anthropologist.

Go carefully.

They are an exotic and endangered species.
OB

Shemjaza · Jun 26, 2019

Chesterton said:
Instead of "the chicken or the egg", we could amend the dilemma by more precisely asking "the chicken or the chicken egg".

I think there are a couple of philosophical points to decide first.

If we take a strict definition of what a chicken is by morphology or genetics, then there might be a specific individual who first had enough traits to be "chicken" rather than "whatever wild ground hen population".

So we now have a bird that is a chicken hatching from an egg laid by a bird that is not quite a chicken.

The philosophical question is that is an egg a wild-hen egg because a wild-hen laid it, or is it a chicken egg because a chicken hatched from it?

Occams Barber · Jun 26, 2019

Shemjaza said:
I think there are a couple of philosophical points to decide first.

If we take a strict definition of what a chicken is by morphology or genetics, then there might be a specific individual who first had enough traits to be "chicken" rather than "whatever wild ground hen population".

So we now have a bird that is a chicken hatching from an egg laid by a bird that is not quite a chicken.

The philosophical question is that is an egg a wild-hen egg because a wild-hen laid it, or is it a chicken egg because a chicken hatched from it?

Philosophically speaking I contend that:

If an almost-chicken lays an egg
and
If a bona fide chicken (based on the modern genetic understanding of "chickenness") hatches from said egg
Then said chicken can be said to be the First Chicken and claim precedence over The Egg

Thus is the dilemma resolved.
OB

Ophiolite · Jun 26, 2019

Oscarr said:
My view is that life is so serious that we shouldn't take it seriously.

The John McEnroe school of philosophy.

Presbyterian Continuist · Jun 26, 2019

Ophiolite said:
The John McEnroe school of philosophy.

FrumiousBandersnatch · Jun 26, 2019

A chicken is simply an egg's way of making another egg.

Our insistence on using snapshots in time to categorise segments of continua continues to cause us problems... OTOH, given our relatively short span, it is a convenient simplification.

Occams Barber · Jun 26, 2019

FrumiousBandersnatch said:
A chicken is simply an egg's way of making another egg.

Our insistence on using snapshots in time to categorise segments of continua continues to cause us problems... OTOH, given our relatively short span, it is a convenient simplification.

Piffle & Flapdoodle Mr Bandersnatch

Unless we are prepared to accept that a continuum is made up of infinitely small units of continua, we are left with the conclusion that continua are not, in fact, continuous, but break down to a series of discontinuous discontinuities.

The alternative would only be true if we accept the principle of infinitely discontinuous discontinuity. Something I am not prepared to accept.
OB

Strathos · Jun 26, 2019

Occams Barber said:
Go carefully.

They are an exotic and endangered species.
OB

They've been making a comeback recently. I can name half a dozen just on these forums.

xianghua · Jun 26, 2019

R.Miller said:
To finally end the debate: get on Amazon; order a chicken and an egg--see which arrives first.

according to this article the chicken came first:

Which came first? The chicken or the egg? – Scientific Scribbles

". This is the reason chickens form shell (6g per 24h) faster than any other species. Therefore according to this research an egg can only form if it has been inside a chicken."

its also fit with the creation scenario but not so much with the evolutionery one.

Ophiolite · Jun 26, 2019

Occams Barber said:
Piffle & Flapdoodle Mr Bandersnatch

Unless we are prepared to accept that a continuum is made up of infinitely small units of continua, we are left with the conclusion that continua are not, in fact, continuous, but break down to a series of discontinuous discontinuities.

The alternative would only be true if we accept the principle of infinitely discontinuous discontinuity. Something I am not prepared to accept.
OB

And yet, the hare wins.

FrumiousBandersnatch · Jun 26, 2019

Occams Barber said:
Piffle & Flapdoodle Mr Bandersnatch

Unless we are prepared to accept that a continuum is made up of infinitely small units of continua, we are left with the conclusion that continua are not, in fact, continuous, but break down to a series of discontinuous discontinuities.

The alternative would only be true if we accept the principle of infinitely discontinuous discontinuity. Something I am not prepared to accept.
OB

Hmm. There may be something in what you say, but it is elusive...

A Russian-doll atomism would be a more invigorating conception - an infinite recursive hierarchy of indivisible entities; indeed, I shall alert Mr Cantor!

Meanwhile, I continue my work on the Hackenthorpe Vacuum, in which he proposes we take a flask containing a normal vacuum and suck all the vacuum out...

Chesterton · Jun 26, 2019

Shemjaza said:
I think there are a couple of philosophical points to decide first.

If we take a strict definition of what a chicken is by morphology or genetics, then there might be a specific individual who first had enough traits to be "chicken" rather than "whatever wild ground hen population".

So we now have a bird that is a chicken hatching from an egg laid by a bird that is not quite a chicken.

The philosophical question is that is an egg a wild-hen egg because a wild-hen laid it, or is it a chicken egg because a chicken hatched from it?

Neither morphology nor genetics nor coin-flipping can tell us what a chicken is. Taxonomy is the stupidest of sciences. It's not science, it's an arbitrary neurotic hobby for anal retentive control freaks. Alphabetizing one's own record or CD collection is sensible and practical since you'll be using it. Alphabetizing someone else's collection when they didn't ask you to and you won't be using it is kind of insane.

Occams Barber · Jun 26, 2019

FrumiousBandersnatch said:
Hmm. There may be something in what you say, but it is elusive...

A Russian-doll atomism would be a more invigorating conception - an infinite recursive hierarchy of indivisible entities; indeed, I shall alert Mr Cantor!

Meanwhile, I continue my work on the Hackenthorpe Vacuum, in which he proposes we take a flask containing a normal vacuum and suck all the vacuum out...

My compliments to Cantor. I bow to your greater wisdom.

Meanwhile, I must away. Her Majesty has favoured me with an urgent brief to build a better Cat Flap.
OB

KateforChrist · Dec 13, 2019

The chicken came first. Eggs weren't commanded by God to multiply.

Genesis 1:20-23 (KJV)

20 And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven.

21 And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good.

22 And God blessed them, saying, Be fruitful, and multiply, and fill the waters in the seas, and let fowl multiply in the earth.

23 And the evening and the morning were the fifth day.

Kaon · Dec 13, 2019

To know said:
"First, came the egg. The chicken was merely a whimsical afterthought!"

What if both genders of chickens came first, then the egg?

FrumiousBandersnatch · Dec 14, 2019

KateforChrist said:
The chicken came first. Eggs weren't commanded by God to multiply.

Chickens are the eggs way of making more eggs.

Chesterton · Dec 14, 2019

FrumiousBandersnatch said:
Chickens are the eggs way of making more eggs.

Them's some pretty smart eggs innit?

FrumiousBandersnatch · Dec 14, 2019

Chesterton said:
Them's some pretty smart eggs innit?

Smart enough to make chickens is all that's necessary.

Chesterton · Dec 14, 2019

FrumiousBandersnatch said:
Smart enough to make chickens is all that's necessary.

I stand by my contention that that is very smart. I am highly intelligent yet have been met with nothing but repeated failures in my numerous attempts to make a chicken.

"Obviously, the Egg Came First!"

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