A Question About Ressurection Versus Instant Glorification

FineLinen

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Just to remember . . . 2 Corinthians 5 tells us that if our earthly tent is dissolved, We Have a building not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.

Perhaps our spiritual existance is a little more substantial than we suspect!

Much love!

My friend: welcome to the amazing world of C.F. I trust your experience here will be as pleasurable as it has been for us.

You have presented a wonderful word regarding the outer garment which God is in various stages being swallowed up in Him.
 
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FineLinen

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I was told long ago about the story of a pastor in a Japanese POW camp. When it was discovered he was a Christian Pastor he was pulled out of the ranks and taken outside the camp to dig his grave and be shot. As he dug he lamented and whined to God about how unfair this all was. That he, a servant of the Lord should die like this. But then his 'attitude' changed. He dwelt upon the promises of God and the glory of the hereafter, and how his tribulations and days of strife were almost over. He began to sing praises to God with an ever growing smile upon his face. Then, suddenly the guards who were standing over him with guns ready got a look of abject fear on their faces. They asked him to tell them of this God whom he was worshiping. He did, and they gave their lives to the Lord. Upon questioning them after, he asked why they had such a change of heart. As he was singing and praising.....he transfigured and was glowing with the spirit of Christ within breaking through his earthen vessel of flesh.

To what degree did this man 'manifest' the glory of the Christ within? I don't know. I can't even find an account on Google to support this story I heard decades ago. So I'll give a personal testimony, for what it's worth to unbelieving believers here.

Several years back, I was asked to attend a deliverance session with the sister and brother in law of a young Mexican man I was mentoring at the time. They were visiting from a town a 100 miles away. His sister was being pulled out of bed by the feet at night by a demon, with her husband hanging on to keep her. This was something that brother said he'd witness as a child in Mexico growing up when their mom was part of some occult thing. It had quit when they left Mexico for America, But now was back. A group of us went to pray over them. Every one gathered around and prayed, declared, 'cast out in the name of Jesus' for a length of time. It was a time I couldn't even enter into because of the chaos and yelling as though demons had to respond because authority in creased with volume. :doh:So I sit an prayed for 'His word' to pray, before even joining the others. But it was 'a word' which never came until everyone else quit. Surprised when it did come, I stood up and walked over to the couple seated in 'two chairs side by side' so 'everyone' could lay hands on them earlier. But now it was just me. I laid hands on each one's shoulder and began to pray and declare, and when I finished I sit back down. No big deal, no bells or whistles and we all went home. The next day her brother came to me and said; "This morning my sister asked me who the 'shiny one' was who prayed for them last night?" He ask her what she was talking about. She said; "Last night when that last man prayed for us, we both 'felt' something at the same time. We both opened our eyes and looked up at him and he was 'SHINING'." :amen:and :amen: Their deliverance and victory took place that night. And, even later, when they would talk to the brother on the phone they would always ask "How is the shiny one doing?" So yes I do believe in glory this side of everlasting/adios glory.

Dear Hillsage: the wonderful story demonstrates the glory of the God-Life and the words we speak out of that Life.

Angel at Presbyterian Hospital

A couple of Wednesdays ago, I got an evening phone call from the pediatric ICU at Presbyterian Hospital, in Charlotte, NC, where I work as a child life specialist. Usually when they call at night, it means something bad has happened. This, however, was different. My coworker told me that the most amazing thing had just happened and she just had to call to tell me.

We had a patient who has really grown up in and out of the hospital. All the staff knows her and her family. She had been in the Pediatric Intensive Care Unit (PICU) for about a month, and had been intubated - on life support. She was not doing well. The doctors had approached mom about taking her off life support the Saturday before. Mom was okay with it, and said that she’d been through so much and if was her time to go she wanted to honor that. So they had taken her off.

It was Wednesday and she was still alive. Amazing. The doctors approached mom about taking off her oxygen mask. Mom was supportive, and began praying over her daughter. The mother of another young patient who was in the bed next to her began praying with her.

The nurse practitioner went to the nurses’ station to chart that she had taken off the oxygen mask. While doing so, she looked up at the security monitor that videotapes the double doors leading into the PICU. It records anyone who may be waiting outside the doors to get in since it is a secure unit. She saw a man standing there, and it looked a little funny to her, so she decided to walk down the hall to open the double doors personally. When she opened them, no one was standing there.

She walked back down to the nurses station to finish charting, assuming he had walked away, but saw him still standing there on the monitor. So she opened the doors with a button near the nurses’ station and leaned over to see him walk in, but no one was standing there.

She pulled over another nurse and both stood staring at this man on the monitor and opening the doors to find no one there. The nurse practitioner leaned in closely to look at the man on the monitor and said, ‘Oh my gosh. That’s an angel. You can see his wings!’

They said that the sun starting shining so brightly and the whole PICU was strangely filled with light. They said he was a tall man and you could see wings behind him.

They pulled over all the staff of the PICU and the two praying mothers and everyone was staring at this man on the monitor and opening the doors to find no one there. Crying, everyone pulled out their camera phones to take pictures, but no one could get it to show up on their camera. The mother of the girl pulled out her camera phone and finally got a picture of the angel who was guarding the doors to the PICU. He turned out as a man of light. I have attached the picture from her phone.

The girl was later discharged from the hospital to go home.

A Miracle.

0ad6e69affd393f6e8ffb67962c148ccad0f349f.jpeg
 
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FineLinen

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Twenty Six Guards

A missionary on furlough told this true story while visiting his home church in Michigan.

While serving at a small field hospital in Africa, every two weeks I traveled by bicycle through the jungle to a nearby city for supplies. This was a journey of two days and required camping overnight at the halfway point.

On one of these journeys, I arrived in the city where I planned to collect money from a bank, purchase medicine and supplies, and then begin my two-day journey back to the field hospital.

Upon arrival in the city, I observed two men fighting; one of whom had been seriously injured. I treated him for his injuries and at the same time witnessed to him of the Lord Jesus Christ. I then traveled two days, camping overnight, and arrived home without incident.

Two weeks later I repeated my journey. Upon arriving in the city, I was approached by the young man I had treated. He told me that he had known I carried money and medicines. He said:

"Some friends and I followed you into the jungle, knowing you would camp overnight. We planned to kill you and take your money and drugs. But just as we were about to move into your camp, we saw that 26-armed guards surrounded you."

At this I laughed and said that I was certainly all alone out in that jungle campsite.

The young man pressed the point, however, and said, "No sir, I was not the only person to see the guards. My five friends also saw them, and we all counted them. It was because of those guards that we were afraid and left you alone."

At this point in the sermon, one of the men in the congregation jumped to his feet and interrupted the missionary and asked if he could tell him the exact day that this happened. The missionary told the congregation the date, and the man who interrupted told him this story:

"On the night of your incident in Africa, it was morning here and I was preparing to go play golf. I was about to putt when I felt the urge to pray for you. In fact, the urging of the Lord was so strong that I called men in this church to meet with me here in the sanctuary to pray for you. Would all of those men who met with me on that day stand up?"

The men who had met together that day stood up. The missionary wasn't concerned with who they were he was too busy counting how many men he saw. There were 26.
 
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Hillsage

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Just to remember . . . 2 Corinthians 5 tells us that if our earthly tent is dissolved, We Have a building not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.

Perhaps our spiritual existance is a little more substantial than we suspect!

Much love!
I agree, but I also suspect that it is very much "more substantial", than many are believing for.

I too welcome you to CF. :clap: And may your stay here reap the 'acronym benefit' of good fruit from Christian Fellowship :) and not so much the bad fruit of Christian's Fighting :(.
 
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imMD

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I agree, but I also suspect that it is very much "more substantial", than many are believing for.

Hi Hillsage,

And I agree with this. I think we tend to look at our life terrestrial as our "real" life, and we wonder about, What when our Real Life ends?

But I see our bodies of flesh as the veil that prevents us from seeing our true life.

I too welcome you to CF. :clap: And may your stay here reap the 'acronym benefit' of good fruit from Christian Fellowship :) and not so much the bad fruit of Christian's Fighting :(.

and thank you! That's what I'm here for, Christian fellowship. I've had quite enough of "Christian" fighting.

Much love!
Mark
 
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Hillsage

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Dear Hillsage: the wonderful story demonstrates the glory of the God-Life and the words we speak out of that Life.

Angel at Presbyterian Hospital

A couple of Wednesdays ago, I got an evening phone call from the pediatric ICU at Presbyterian Hospital, in Charlotte, NC, where I work as a child life specialist. Usually when they call at night, it means something bad has happened. This, however, was different. My coworker told me that the most amazing thing had just happened and she just had to call to tell me.

We had a patient who has really grown up in and out of the hospital. All the staff knows her and her family. She had been in the Pediatric Intensive Care Unit (PICU) for about a month, and had been intubated - on life support. She was not doing well. The doctors had approached mom about taking her off life support the Saturday before. Mom was okay with it, and said that she’d been through so much and if was her time to go she wanted to honor that. So they had taken her off.

It was Wednesday and she was still alive. Amazing. The doctors approached mom about taking off her oxygen mask. Mom was supportive, and began praying over her daughter. The mother of another young patient who was in the bed next to her began praying with her.

The nurse practitioner went to the nurses’ station to chart that she had taken off the oxygen mask. While doing so, she looked up at the security monitor that videotapes the double doors leading into the PICU. It records anyone who may be waiting outside the doors to get in since it is a secure unit. She saw a man standing there, and it looked a little funny to her, so she decided to walk down the hall to open the double doors personally. When she opened them, no one was standing there.

She walked back down to the nurses station to finish charting, assuming he had walked away, but saw him still standing there on the monitor. So she opened the doors with a button near the nurses’ station and leaned over to see him walk in, but no one was standing there.

She pulled over another nurse and both stood staring at this man on the monitor and opening the doors to find no one there. The nurse practitioner leaned in closely to look at the man on the monitor and said, ‘Oh my gosh. That’s an angel. You can see his wings!’

They said that the sun starting shining so brightly and the whole PICU was strangely filled with light. They said he was a tall man and you could see wings behind him.

They pulled over all the staff of the PICU and the two praying mothers and everyone was staring at this man on the monitor and opening the doors to find no one there. Crying, everyone pulled out their camera phones to take pictures, but no one could get it to show up on their camera. The mother of the girl pulled out her camera phone and finally got a picture of the angel who was guarding the doors to the PICU. He turned out as a man of light. I have attached the picture from her phone.

The girl was later discharged from the hospital to go home.

A Miracle.

0ad6e69affd393f6e8ffb67962c148ccad0f349f.jpeg

You post not one, but two hope inspiring testimonies. :oldthumbsup:
 
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Hillsage

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Hi Hillsage,

And I agree with this. I think we tend to look at our life terrestrial as our "real" life, and we wonder about, What when our Real Life ends?

But I see our bodies of flesh as the veil that prevents us from seeing our true life.
Ahh yes the true source of 'our life'.
"the glory of this mystery, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory."

and thank you! That's what I'm here for, Christian fellowship. I've had quite enough of "Christian" fighting.

Much love!
Mark
You've had enough "fighting"....but come to the 'Controversial Theology' forum. ;) As I've often said here; "Iron only sharpens iron" when the 'attitude/angle' of the two steels is correct. It is good to believe one is right, but it is wrong to believe 'everyone else is WRONG!!!' May your good attitude prevail and the wind of the spirits that blow here, not separate you from your hat. :pray:
 
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Der Alte

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Hi Hillsage,
And I agree with this. I think we tend to look at our life terrestrial as our "real" life, and we wonder about, What when our Real Life ends?
But I see our bodies of flesh as the veil that prevents us from seeing our true life.
and thank you! That's what I'm here for, Christian fellowship. I've had quite enough of "Christian" fighting.
Much love!
Mark
Shouldn't that be "Contentious Fighting?"
 
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Hillsage

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Just for clarification purposes, am I hearing what you are possibly implying? That being, are you saying that us "seeking glory, honor, IMMORTALITY" is the attainable hope of 'putting on immortality' here by becoming the "overcomers", which Revelation makes plain is not ALL the 'saved' church? An 'immortality' which would be the fulfillment of the 'first fruits order' in 1Cor 15 which implies that Jesus is 'seated on the throne' until "the last enemy to be destroyed is death" down here, by us with His authority? IOW, by those who have put on "the knowledge of the Son of God, to mature manhood, to the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ;"?

I know that was a mouthful, but what's your take brother? Does your 'head spin' but your 'spirit rejoices'? Or does your heart just cry blasphemy for thinking so far outside the nominal box of orthodoxy? ;) Or do you have another view, that 'not even I' have ever entertained? :idea: If so, share it. :cool:
 
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FineLinen

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Just for clarification purposes, am I hearing what you are possibly implying? That being, are you saying that us "seeking glory, honor, IMMORTALITY" is the attainable hope of 'putting on immortality' here by becoming the "overcomers", which Revelation makes plain is not ALL the 'saved' church? An 'immortality' which would be the fulfillment of the 'first fruits order' in 1Cor 15 which implies that Jesus is 'seated on the throne' until "the last enemy to be destroyed is death" down here, by us with His authority? IOW, by those who have put on "the knowledge of the Son of God, to mature manhood, to the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ;"?

I know that was a mouthful, but what's your take brother? Does your 'head spin' but your 'spirit rejoices'? Or does your heart just cry blasphemy for thinking so far outside the nominal box of orthodoxy? ;) Or do you have another view, that 'not even I' have ever entertained? :idea: If so, share it. :cool:

Dear Hillsage: there is very little of my being that is not spinning. I have totally given up attempting to think within the box.

We, the called out ones, the "especially" of His glorious love & grace, are but the first-fruits of that which shall ultimately be expressed in many various dimensions of His many dwelling places.

My brother, my precious wife of over 1/2 century, has given me an ultimatum>>>I must go!

I do desire to speak a mite on the overcomer on the next post. Till then, may the exceedingly wonderful Presence of Jesus Christ be with you and yours!
 
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Hillsage

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Dear Hillsage: there is very little of my being that is not spinning. I have totally given up attempting to think within the box.
May the Spirit of truth continue to work within 'your limits' ;) (and mine :(). And may He slow down the 'tornado' of His leading for you in particular. I don't care if you're dizzy, I just don't want you to fall and hurt your-'old'-self. ^_^

We, the called out ones, the "especially" of His glorious love & grace, are but the first-fruits of that which shall ultimately be expressed in many various dimensions of His many dwelling places.
My understanding of the "especially" scripture is that 'we' determine how 'special' we become based upon our obedience or disobedience. :idea:

My brother, my precious wife of over 1/2 century, has given me an ultimatum>>>I must go!
I thought that was very funny when I first read it, possibly thinking my wife would say the same. :D Now I'm not so sure. :confused: No doubt, to die is gain, but at what degree of ultimate loss? A loss as to that which could have been, had we stayed? Hmmm.

PHI 1:21 For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain. 22 If it is to be life in the flesh, that means fruitful labor for me. Yet which I shall choose I cannot tell. 23 I am hard pressed between the two. My desire is to depart and be with Christ, for that is far better. 24 But to remain in the flesh is more necessary on your account.

I do desire to speak a mite on the over comer on the next post. Till then, may the exceedingly wonderful Presence of Jesus Christ be with you and yours!
I will patiently await your words....until my patience comes up short proving that immortality awaits more perfecting of this saint.
 
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Tayla

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They're in a better place...or with the Lord...or walking those streets of gold...or singing in the choir invisible...in the bosom of Abraham...or in short, poof, already in Heaven.

OTOH, we are told in the Bible to look forward to the Resurrection.
The final goal is a glorified body in the new heavens and new earth. This has not occurred for anyone yet and awaits the second coming of Christ.

In the meantime, when each believer dies, their soul lives in heaven without a body.
 
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FineLinen

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Just for clarification purposes, am I hearing what you are possibly implying? That being, are you saying that us "seeking glory, honor, IMMORTALITY" is the attainable hope of 'putting on immortality' here by becoming the "overcomers", which Revelation makes plain is not ALL the 'saved' church? An 'immortality' which would be the fulfillment of the 'first fruits order' in 1Cor 15 which implies that Jesus is 'seated on the throne' until "the last enemy to be destroyed is death" down here, by us with His authority? IOW, by those who have put on "the knowledge of the Son of God, to mature manhood, to the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ;"?

Dear brother: The vast operation of the living God is separating a few in this age & every age into a dimension of Spirit & life that encompasses present tense immortality. The unique group of those known in the Revelation as overcomers, I dare say, are closely linked with this mighty happening and mature manhood. This is only a measure for the present, but is breaking more & more fully as His Life envelops us.

The Overcomer

We have been considering boxes. The one problem of theological boxes is the constraint that makes it well nigh impossible to follow the Lamb in the whithersoever. The Son always goes a little further, and the call is to join Him where He is. Those of this remnant company are constrained by His mighty anointing to follow, not loving their lives (earthly & spiritually), but laying them down by the working of the cross.

The 144,000 of the Revelation are not identified as overcomers, but they are, and they sing a song that cannot be learned, they are born IN the Song.

My old broken frame must leave it there for now. We had a wonderful day with a few of the remnant today (the perfect number), but lest F.L. thinks immortality has been fully realized, back to terrafirma! In His great love David
 
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Hillsage

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Dear brother: The vast operation of the living God is separating a few in this age & every age into a dimension of Spirit & life that encompasses present tense immortality. The unique group of those known in the Revelation as overcomers, I dare say, are closely linked with this mighty happening and mature manhood. This is only a measure for the present, but is breaking more & more fully as His Life envelops us.

The Overcomer

We have been considering boxes. The one problem of theological boxes is the constraint that makes it well nigh impossible to follow the Lamb in the whithersoever. The Son always goes a little further, and the call is to join Him where He is. Those of this remnant company are constrained by His mighty anointing to follow, not loving their lives (earthly & spiritually), but laying them down by the working of the cross.

The 144,000 of the Revelation are not identified as overcomers, but they are, and they sing a song that cannot be learned, they are born IN the Song.

My old broken frame must leave it there for now. We had a wonderful day with a few of the remnant today (the perfect number), but lest F.L. thinks immortality has been fully realized, back to terrafirma! In His great love David
A good word. I wrote much more, but then deleted. :holy: And we can leave this thread at that.
 
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FineLinen

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A good word. I wrote much more, but then deleted. :holy: And we can leave this thread at that.

Dear Hillsage: A couple of months ago I posted to someone regarding the outer laminar spheres of the unspeakable unknown. That very night, in the wee hours, Abba gave me a small glimpse, and all I could gasp was "oh God, oh God, oh God." My poor wife thought I was dying.

In discussion of that which surrounds our Father, we can attempt to describe that which cannot be described>>>"His voice is like" comes as close as can be articulated.

The secret place of the Most High God is the world in which we must dwell, as fearfully awesome as it is. May He continue to lead us more fully into it by His grace!
 
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