Is it ok to lie in this case?

Sketcher · Jun 9, 2019

I'd really need to know what happened before I make a recommendation. Generally speaking, a person needs to screw up for a church to want nothing to do with them or anyone they associate with.

Swan7 · Jun 9, 2019

CamillaBegumm said:
Recently they cutoff all ties with the pastor of our church, because the family they offended was using our pastor to track them.

This is correct, Biblically speaking. If a matter cannot be resolved with one or two people, then it is taken to the whole congregation and the person in sin is cast out, but only for a time until that person reaches repentance. It sounds like this person did not repent... and is in darkness.
Matthew 18:15-20

CamillaBegumm said:
Our pastor also expressed the seriousness of the situation where if I was to interact with this person again I would be excommunicated from the church.

CamillaBegumm said:
I said that I don’t hang out with this person I just steer them in the right direction towards repentance.

I can see this two ways:
1. Deliberately not listening to the pastor's institution, which is Biblical and the Word of God, is not wise and should be repentant from.
2. However, if you had initially heard and listened to this instruction given to us by God, and you had run into this person not of your own accord; then I agree with your second statement above. This is the Spirit of the Word.
Hebrews 4:11-12

CamillaBegumm said:
This was 3 weeks ago and a few days back this person asked me if I would meet them somewhere for food to just talk through some stuff. Which I figured wouldn’t be that big a deal, although I had been asked not to spend anytime with them. I thought this would be when I would finally say that they needed to find some friends from outside the church because I put a lot at risk by interacting with them, but to my luck, while we were walking out, we passed somone from the family that they offended.

See, here is a great lesson to be learned: Sin works in our life like a young lion. It seems cute and harmless, but quickly becomes an overbearing weight and even a threat to your salvation. Sin separates us from God.
Job 38:39

Please do not despair reading this, I am only pointing you to scripture with what God has already said. We all have come short of the glory of God - all have sinned.
But thanks be to God! He gave His only begotten Son to die for all (the ultimate sacrificial Lamb of God), so we can be reconciled with Him - those who believe in Him and love Him.

This is why we have a conscience, the Holy Spirit convicts us of sin in our life so we may repent and allow Jesus Christ to live in and through us.

This is why I said this is a great lesson, so please have joy in our Lord and Saviour! :angel:

John 16:8

CamillaBegumm said:
It was a lie, I knowingly lied, but it got me out of being put in the same boat as the person who asked me for support sometimes. All parties believe me as far as I know, but I lied and I regret it very much.

Also, please do repent quickly or God will correct you: Please read Hebrews 10 as it seems to correlate to this very issue, plus giving you hope and encouragement at the same time! God is Great!

Andrew77 · Jun 9, 2019

CamillaBegumm said:
Hey so kinda a long story....
Basically somone at my church caused deep emotional pain to a family that also goes. I won’t go into detail, but like it’s at the point where the police have gotten involved and there have been hearings. This person wants to go away to another state but they can’t, due to what the court decided. Shortly after it happened the pastors got together and asked the church to avoid this person at all cost given the nature of the situation and to maintain the body togetherness or however it’s called.

For some reason this person has reached out to me for support in this. They’re on their own with no friends or job, and stuck in Pennsylvania until their probation ends. I honestly want out of this situation as much as possible but I can’t say no to someone in this situation. I have interacted with this person a few times, by their request to offer them emotional support. They think I’m the only one from church who doesn’t hate them. While I’ve tried to get them to reach out to other people besides me, it’s no use. Recently they cutoff all ties with the pastor of our church, because the family they offended was using our pastor to track them.

It was kinda known that I was in sort of contact with this person, although I didn’t want to be. The family asked me to stop talking to them which I said that I don’t hang out with this person I just steer them in the right direction towards repentance.
Our pastor also expressed the seriousness of the situation where if I was to interact with this person again I would be excommunicated from the church.
This was 3 weeks ago and a few days back this person asked me if I would meet them somewhere for food to just talk through some stuff. Which I figured wouldn’t be that big a deal, although I had been asked not to spend anytime with them. I thought this would be when I would finally say that they needed to find some friends from outside the church because I put a lot at risk by interacting with them, but to my luck, while we were walking out, we passed somone from the family that they offended.
Immediately they called the pastoral leadership and my family that also goes to the church, and I was put under intense heat. I didn’t know what to do when I got home, but I didn’t want to be put under the scrutiny of my church. So I called my pastor and said that I was out downtown working, which is where I work, and when I was done my shift I passed by this person on the street and they invited me to eat with them real quick cause we just happened to be there. I said that we didn’t plan it, it was a situation that I couldn’t rly avoid, or at least knew how to. It was a lie, I knowingly lied, but it got me out of being put in the same boat as the person who asked me for support sometimes. All parties believe me as far as I know, but I lied and I regret it very much. Normally I wouldn’t go on a forum like this, but as you can see, I don’t really have a party to go to. I made it clear after our meeting to this person that we can’t interact anymore, it hurts my relationship with so many people, but I hate the fact that I lied and I just don’t know what to do. I’ve prayed and asked God, studied the Bible, and I know I should tell the truth, but I’m already in deep, and I could actually be kicked out. I know it must sound like a cult or something, but what this person did, really is something worth these threats.

I just need prayer and encouragement and advice in this situation, because I have no one to talk to about this.

Yeah, this does sound odd.

In order to determine what I would do, I would need to know exactly what this person did. I would need to know all the details of what is going on.

Because there are situations where I would want everyone to steer clear of this person.

There are other situations, where it just sounds like you have a weak pastor, that is being manipulated by some crazy people, and I would say tell them off. I'm not going to be bullied into being a jerk to someone who has done nothing wrong to me, just because he offended your tiny little egos. And if you don't want me going to your church, works for me. I wouldn't want to be with crazy people anyway.

But again, this is all dependent on what exactly this guy did, and you didn't say.

I would not lie about it though. Better to obey the pastor, and cut off contact with the guy, than lie to the pastor. Either tell the pastor the truth, and accept whatever the consequences are with a smile.... or do what the pastor says.

Make a choice. One or the other. Both isn't an option.

Cis.jd · Jun 9, 2019

CamillaBegumm said:
Email me at cazzarks@gmail.com and I’ll send you a link to the news story

I;m not sure if i need to..I mean, if you are that discrete then it must be that serious or you are something embarrassing, i'll just assume it's the earlier.

If it is something that is going to get you in trouble with the law or just against your code then just decline.

Gregory Thompson · Jun 9, 2019

CamillaBegumm said:
Hey so kinda a long story....
Basically somone at my church caused deep emotional pain to a family that also goes. I won’t go into detail, but like it’s at the point where the police have gotten involved and there have been hearings. This person wants to go away to another state but they can’t, due to what the court decided. Shortly after it happened the pastors got together and asked the church to avoid this person at all cost given the nature of the situation and to maintain the body togetherness or however it’s called.

For some reason this person has reached out to me for support in this. They’re on their own with no friends or job, and stuck in Pennsylvania until their probation ends. I honestly want out of this situation as much as possible but I can’t say no to someone in this situation. I have interacted with this person a few times, by their request to offer them emotional support. They think I’m the only one from church who doesn’t hate them. While I’ve tried to get them to reach out to other people besides me, it’s no use. Recently they cutoff all ties with the pastor of our church, because the family they offended was using our pastor to track them.

It was kinda known that I was in sort of contact with this person, although I didn’t want to be. The family asked me to stop talking to them which I said that I don’t hang out with this person I just steer them in the right direction towards repentance.
Our pastor also expressed the seriousness of the situation where if I was to interact with this person again I would be excommunicated from the church.
This was 3 weeks ago and a few days back this person asked me if I would meet them somewhere for food to just talk through some stuff. Which I figured wouldn’t be that big a deal, although I had been asked not to spend anytime with them. I thought this would be when I would finally say that they needed to find some friends from outside the church because I put a lot at risk by interacting with them, but to my luck, while we were walking out, we passed somone from the family that they offended.
Immediately they called the pastoral leadership and my family that also goes to the church, and I was put under intense heat. I didn’t know what to do when I got home, but I didn’t want to be put under the scrutiny of my church. So I called my pastor and said that I was out downtown working, which is where I work, and when I was done my shift I passed by this person on the street and they invited me to eat with them real quick cause we just happened to be there. I said that we didn’t plan it, it was a situation that I couldn’t rly avoid, or at least knew how to. It was a lie, I knowingly lied, but it got me out of being put in the same boat as the person who asked me for support sometimes. All parties believe me as far as I know, but I lied and I regret it very much. Normally I wouldn’t go on a forum like this, but as you can see, I don’t really have a party to go to. I made it clear after our meeting to this person that we can’t interact anymore, it hurts my relationship with so many people, but I hate the fact that I lied and I just don’t know what to do. I’ve prayed and asked God, studied the Bible, and I know I should tell the truth, but I’m already in deep, and I could actually be kicked out. I know it must sound like a cult or something, but what this person did, really is something worth these threats.

I just need prayer and encouragement and advice in this situation, because I have no one to talk to about this.

I'd say be honest. If they cast you out, you're better off for it anyway. The behavior you are describing from the congregation doesn't sound like Jesus, it sounds like the people who crucified Him.

Before reading your post the scripture that came to mind was "to the innocent you show yourself innocent, to the crooked, you show yourself shrewd" I don't know how that applies to the specifics .. but there you are.

Kenny'sID · Jun 9, 2019

I don't know how bad a thing this guy did, but I don't like the churches controlling attitude over you. There also seems to be a LOT of unforgiveness going on here.

Anyway, the lie? that's between you and God and we all know how the verse goes, "Charity covers a multitude of sin". I'd say you were being mighty charitable towards this man when no one else seems to care.

I honestly would ask forgiveness for it and worry no more about the lie. Just keep it between you and God, as I think the necessity for the lie was the bigger problem here.

Kenny'sID · Jun 9, 2019

Michael Collum said:
If they cast you out, you're better off for it anyway.

I tend to agree, but might consider just leaving. And tha's just me so be careful with what i say.

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Is it ok to lie in this case?

Sketcher

Born Imperishable

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Swan7

Made in the image of His Grace

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Andrew77

The walking accident

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Cis.jd

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Gregory Thompson

Change is inevitable, feel free to spare some.

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Kenny'sID

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Kenny'sID

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