The Book of Acts isn't just for Dispensationalists!!!

Grip Docility · Jun 5, 2019

Contenders Edge said:
What I advised that you elaborate further on is how the Apostle Paul was the turning point in the Church for your readers that they might understand what you mean by that aside from what we already know.

I did check out the link you provided to a previous post of yours, but we are already basically in agreement there: God has not reneged on His promises to Israel as others among us may believe.

Excellent!

On the Apostle Paul...

Because Judas was a (type) for Satan (AntiType)... we see that Judas was blessed to work with God the Son and even had access to follow through in faith, beyond Christ’s DBR to salvation. Unfortunately, Judas never believed and instead betrayed God the Son. He is recorded as lost, which is very rare in scripture.

The Apostles, after Christ ascended... in Acts Of the Apostles 1:21-26, chose two men, prayed, then cast lots over the men to see who was to replace Judas. Mathias was Chosen.

This is a grey area. Jesus had instructed the Apostles to wait for Pentecost. It is conjecture to number Mathias one of the 12 or not.

In Acts 7, a man Named Saul guarded the cloaks of the men that stoned Steven and fervently HUNTED Christians... as “Saul” eludes and Acts reveals later.

Saul was the poster boy for the Jew that desires to serve God By stomping out “the false insurrection of The Way - Jewish term for followers of Jesus at the time-“.

Just as The Children Of Israel heard God in the Pentateuch, so Saul, while on the road to Damascus heard God. Saul is asked why he is persecuting God. Saul asked, who he was Persecuting. God replied; “I AM Jesus”. (Acts Of the Apostles 9)

Saul became Paul... and was forever changed!

Paul began his ministry and had to deal with the whole... “Oh, you’re not here to kill us, but guide us as the Chosen Of Jesus” gig for quite a while.

Paul, a fervent Pharisee Of Pharisee, Who by His own admission, kept the Law better than most Pharisee’s began to do something, even Peter hadn’t done.

Paul dismantled the Jewish customs and even railed against attempting to keep the Law for Salvation. Read Deuteronomy 1 - Deuteronomy 31:26 to get the full picture of what this meant.

Paul became the Gentile Dog (Goyem) ambassador of the Gospel and planted a major portion of the 7 churches, through travel and writing. We have 14 of his epistles in the NT (Hebrews is up to dispute as Paul’s, though it seems his work)...as only St. Paul would place even the Stone 10, in the Old Covenant.

Paul, boldly swept away the Judaising that attempted to bind the BOC back to the Old Covenant... and thusly is the very foundation of what we know to be “Christian Doctrine”... Post Red Letters.

From the epistles of Romans all the way to Philemon... we know Paul is the author. All following books are geared towards Messianic Jews. All scripture is for the BOC, but paying attention to Context within the Diaspora writings (or Jew centric NT writings is imperative!

Paul is unique to all Post Christ writers, because he attributes all of his words to DIRECT revelation from Jesus Christ, Ascended.

This is why it is difficult to name Paul one of the 12, or to say he is simply the Sole Ambassador to the solidifying doctrine of the BOC, as we know it today.

If Paul was not in scripture... Sola Fide (Faith Alone) would be enormously complex to proof.

Suggestions on more info on Paul?

Grip Docility · Jun 5, 2019

Ken Rank said:
What is BOC? I know something simple, I am sure.

Ekklesia is the word we translate as church. My point in sharing it was to just show that it isn't a NT word. Israel is called "the church" or "the called out ones" (more accurate) as ekklesia is used to describe them at Sinai.

And as an aside brother... while I respect your right to draw whatever conclusions you draw... I am not a dispensationalist.

You claim Jesus, Sola Fide, and know Jesus is God. That’s the essential doctrine (John 5:39-40)... we are at peace.

“Body of Christ” as Paul names is in Ephesians 2 and other writings of his.

All Love in Jesus Christ to you.

Ken Rank · Jun 5, 2019

Grip Docility said:
You claim Jesus, Sola Fide, and know Jesus is God. That’s the essential doctrine (John 5:39-40)... we are at peace.

“Body of Christ” as Paul names is in Ephesians 2 other writings of his.

All Love in Jesus Christ to you.

I love Ephesians 2... you WERE a gentile in the flesh, you WERE an alien of the Commonwealth of Israel... but through the shed blood of Christ you are NOW a fellow citizen.

Blessings friend.

Grip Docility · Jun 5, 2019

Ken Rank said:
I love Ephesians 2... you WERE a gentile in the flesh, you WERE an alien of the Commonwealth of Israel... but through the shed blood of Christ you are NOW a fellow citizen.

Blessings friend.

Ahem... I caught that... now let’s see that in Full Context

IMO

To usurp Israel from this passage as the BOC’s namesake is to Ignore that Neither is Namesake, Jew nor Gentile...

Because the Two... Israel and Gentiles become Co-Heirs through Christ Jesus...

The NEW MAN with a Different Body. Thus a NEW name. For instance ... YHWH verses YeHoShua (YHWH is Salvation)

And you were dead in your trespasses and sins in which you previously walked according to the ways of this world, according to the ruler who exercises authority over the lower heavens, the spirit now working in the disobedient.

We too all previously lived among them in our fleshly desires, carrying out the inclinations of our flesh and thoughts, and we were by nature children under wrath as the others were also.

But God, who is rich in mercy, because of His great love that He had for us, made us alive with the Messiah even though we were dead in trespasses. You are saved by grace! Together with Christ Jesus He also raised us up and seated us in the heavens, so that in the coming ages He might display the immeasurable riches of His grace through His kindness to us in Christ Jesus.

For you are saved by grace through faith, and this is not from yourselves; it is God’s gift— not from works, so that no one can boast. For we are His creation, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared ahead of time so that we should walk in them.
Ephesians 2:1-10 - Bible Gateway passage: Ephesians 2:1-10 - Holman Christian Standard Bible

So then, remember that at one time you were Gentiles in the flesh—called “the uncircumcised” by those called “the circumcised,” which is done in the flesh by human hands. At that time you were without the Messiah, excluded from the citizenship of Israel, and foreigners to the covenants of the promise, without hope and without God in the world.

But now in Christ Jesus, you who were far away have been brought near by the blood of the Messiah.

For He is our peace, who made both groups one and tore down the dividing wall of hostility. In His flesh, He made of no effect the law consisting of commands and expressed in regulations, so that He might create in Himself one new man from the two, resulting in peace.

He did this so that He might reconcile both to God in one body through the cross and put the hostility to death by it.

When the Messiah came, He proclaimed the good news of peace to you who were far away and peace to those who were near. For through Him we both have access by one Spirit to the Father. So then you are no longer foreigners and strangers, but fellow citizens with the saints, and members of God’s household, built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus Himself as the cornerstone. The whole building, being put together by Him, grows into a holy sanctuary in the Lord. You also are being built together for God’s dwelling in the Spirit.
Ephesians 2:11-22 - Bible Gateway passage: Ephesians 2:11-22 - Holman Christian Standard Bible

Mmmm-hmmmm, you’re no stranger to this discussion, Ken!

ViaCrucis · Jun 5, 2019

Ken Rank said:
Just a quick note and we can't chat privately or start another thread another day. But just as a defense... you're right, that is the definition. But I think you'll be hard pressed to find any nation at any time that practiced it to the point where the collective benefited equally without taking away the desire to strive for more. In every case that I am aware of, the central governments have always taken advantage and at the very least we have seen ridiculous taxes on the people, and at worst, a shift to a more totalitarian system that controlled the collective rather than served it.

"This is the love of God, that we obey His commandments and His commandments are not grievous."

I think I rendered that accurately... my point... it was commanded to take care of the widow and orphan, and those who can't take care of themselves. There are also commandments related to functioning within a community... and I think what we are seeing in the first century (i.e. Acts) is the church being obedient which, because of the nature of the subject we have here, is showing their love of God. It isn't socialism... because it isn't political. It is love... godly people doing what God desires.

I certainly don't disagree with the fact that every time a state has tried to create a Marxist-style revolution (I'd probably still want to make a distinction between socialism as an idea broadly and Marxism in particular) the result has always resulted in tyranny and totalitarianism. I think part of the reason for that is that Marxism doesn't work. The idea of a perfect utopia where the people own all the means of production and there are no class distinctions at all, and--indeed--no government at all (ostensibly the end-goal of Marxism is the eradication of the state entirely) is simply untenable. It is, at best, an idealistic pipe dream that simply cannot work in the modern world because it ignores one simple thing: human nature. There will always be people who want power for themselves and will overpower the weak in order to get it. There will always be Stalins and Maos in the world; and once using revolution as the means to secure their own power will try and retain that power by all means necessary.

As such I think Marxism is at best pure fantasy. At worst it is the mechanism by which tyrants can try and seize power.

-CryptoLutheran

Ken Rank · Jun 5, 2019

Grip Docility said:
Ahem... I caught that... now let’s see that in Full Context

IMO

To usurp Israel from this passage as the BOC’s namesake is to Ignore that Neither is Namesake, Jew nor Gentile...

Because the Two... Israel and Gentiles become Co-Heirs through Christ Jesus...

The NEW MAN with a Different Body. Thus a NEW name. For instance ... YHWH verses YeHoShua (YHWH is Salvation)

And you were dead in your trespasses and sins in which you previously walked according to the ways of this world, according to the ruler who exercises authority over the lower heavens, the spirit now working in the disobedient.

We too all previously lived among them in our fleshly desires, carrying out the inclinations of our flesh and thoughts, and we were by nature children under wrath as the others were also.

But God, who is rich in mercy, because of His great love that He had for us, made us alive with the Messiah even though we were dead in trespasses. You are saved by grace! Together with Christ Jesus He also raised us up and seated us in the heavens, so that in the coming ages He might display the immeasurable riches of His grace through His kindness to us in Christ Jesus.

For you are saved by grace through faith, and this is not from yourselves; it is God’s gift— not from works, so that no one can boast. For we are His creation, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared ahead of time so that we should walk in them.
Ephesians 2:1-10 - Bible Gateway passage: Ephesians 2:1-10 - Holman Christian Standard Bible

So then, remember that at one time you were Gentiles in the flesh—called “the uncircumcised” by those called “the circumcised,” which is done in the flesh by human hands. At that time you were without the Messiah, excluded from the citizenship of Israel, and foreigners to the covenants of the promise, without hope and without God in the world.

But now in Christ Jesus, you who were far away have been brought near by the blood of the Messiah.

For He is our peace, who made both groups one and tore down the dividing wall of hostility. In His flesh, He made of no effect the law consisting of commands and expressed in regulations, so that He might create in Himself one new man from the two, resulting in peace.

He did this so that He might reconcile both to God in one body through the cross and put the hostility to death by it.

When the Messiah came, He proclaimed the good news of peace to you who were far away and peace to those who were near. For through Him we both have access by one Spirit to the Father. So then you are no longer foreigners and strangers, but fellow citizens with the saints, and members of God’s household, built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus Himself as the cornerstone. The whole building, being put together by Him, grows into a holy sanctuary in the Lord. You also are being built together for God’s dwelling in the Spirit.
Ephesians 2:11-22 - Bible Gateway passage: Ephesians 2:11-22 - Holman Christian Standard Bible

Mmmm-hmmmm, you’re no stranger to this discussion, Ken!

Like I said, I am not a dispensationalist. We can leave it at that.

Blessings.
Ken

notreligus · Jun 5, 2019

Contenders Edge said:
Make no mistake, while I do agree with much your post, there are still some things that cannot be dismissed:

“1) The shift form Judaism to Christianity wasn't an easy matter.”

Technically speaking, Christianity at first was viewed as a newly formed sect of Judaism as implied by the scriptures and recorded in history, but the book of Acts also states when the followers of Christ were first called Christians (Acts 11:26) At first, and this is historically speaking, “Christian” was hurled at the followers of Christ as an insult, but the followers of Christ decided to adopt the label for the newly formed faith perhaps because they decided that this is what they were and it has served since that day to keep followers of “The Way” as it was first called according to the book of Acts from being confused with Judaism at large.

Christianity did not abolish Judaism, but actually fulfills it, which seems to be the view of Messianic Jews who will say that when a Jew converts to Christianity, they do not stop being Jewish but that they become what they call “a completed Jew.”

“2) The 11 Apostles weren't Christians, but Jews... long into the book of Acts.”

There were elven to start out with, but Paul became the twelfth and that you may wish to make clear to your readers lest they think you are stating that there were only eleven.

And as mentioned earlier, they were first called in Christians in Antioch (Acts 11:26) and that is what we who follow Christ are called and call ourselves to this day.

3) “Paul was the turning point of it all.”

You may wish to elaborate on this point further. Paul was the primary vessel in taking the Gospel to the Gentiles although there were other followers of Christ preaching the Gospel to the Gentiles as well, and he also wrote over half of the New Testament, but to get right down to it, it is Jesus, who commissioned Paul and made him one of the Apostles, who is the turning point for the entire world.

Is Judaism based on the Mitzvot or is it based on the teachings of rabbis?

Synagogues were in all of the major cities. These

Contenders Edge said:
Make no mistake, while I do agree with much your post, there are still some things that cannot be dismissed:

“1) The shift form Judaism to Christianity wasn't an easy matter.”

Technically speaking, Christianity at first was viewed as a newly formed sect of Judaism as implied by the scriptures and recorded in history, but the book of Acts also states when the followers of Christ were first called Christians (Acts 11:26) At first, and this is historically speaking, “Christian” was hurled at the followers of Christ as an insult, but the followers of Christ decided to adopt the label for the newly formed faith perhaps because they decided that this is what they were and it has served since that day to keep followers of “The Way” as it was first called according to the book of Acts from being confused with Judaism at large.

Christianity did not abolish Judaism, but actually fulfills it, which seems to be the view of Messianic Jews who will say that when a Jew converts to Christianity, they do not stop being Jewish but that they become what they call “a completed Jew.”

“2) The 11 Apostles weren't Christians, but Jews... long into the book of Acts.”

There were elven to start out with, but Paul became the twelfth and that you may wish to make clear to your readers lest they think you are stating that there were only eleven.

And as mentioned earlier, they were first called in Christians in Antioch (Acts 11:26) and that is what we who follow Christ are called and call ourselves to this day.

3) “Paul was the turning point of it all.”

You may wish to elaborate on this point further. Paul was the primary vessel in taking the Gospel to the Gentiles although there were other followers of Christ preaching the Gospel to the Gentiles as well, and he also wrote over half of the New Testament, but to get right down to it, it is Jesus, who commissioned Paul and made him one of the Apostles, who is the turning point for the entire world.

Was Judaism based on the Mitzvot, or was it based on the teaching of rabbis?

Rabbi-led synagogues were in all of the major cities by the time of Christ's ministry. Eventually the oral law of the rabbis became more authoritative than the Scriptures (The Midrash, The Talmud). The Pseudopigrapha influenced Jews to reject Christ. The Messiah was presented as a political man who would lead the Jews out of Roman bondage. They weren't looking for a Suffering Servant. Today there are Messianics who still don't accept Jesus as divine, and there Jews who still believe that Isaiah 53 is about the nation of Israel.

Christ is true Israel. We have been reconciled by a Person and not a people.

Gal 3:16 Now the promises were made to Abraham and to his offspring. It does not say, “And to offsprings,” referring to many, but referring to one, “And to your offspring,” who is Christ.

mkgal1 · Jun 5, 2019

notreligus said:
Christ is true Israel. We have been reconciled by a Person and not a people.

Gal 3:16 Now the promises were made to Abraham and to his offspring. It does not say, “And to offsprings,” referring to many, but referring to one, “And to your offspring,” who is Christ.

QFE

Grip Docility · Jun 5, 2019

mkgal1 said:
QFE

Cough... not talking about Israel... Cough ... talking about Abraham’s child of Promise... Cough ... Type of Jesus... Cough ... Abraham wasn’t a descendent .... cough ... of his Grandson

Excuse me... coughing fit.

mkgal1 · Jun 5, 2019

Grip Docility said:
Cough... not talking about Israel... Cough ... talking about Abraham’s child of Promise... Cough ... Type of Jesus... Cough ... Abraham wasn’t a descendent .... cough ... of his Grandson

Excuse me... coughing fit.

Maybe it's because I have a migraine right now, but I'm not understanding why one gets the idea that this would suggest Abraham had to be a descendent of his "grandson"?

Grip Docility · Jun 5, 2019

mkgal1 said:
Maybe it's because I have a migraine right now, but I'm not understanding why one gets the idea that this would suggest Abraham had to be a descendent of his "grandson"?

I typed that?

Please forgive me... it must have been a Freudian Slip.

mkgal1 · Jun 5, 2019

Quoting from linked article:
Who Is the True Israel of God?

by Nicholas T. Batzig

The Apostle Paul, along with the other New Testament authors, in no uncertain terms explained that Jesus fulfilled each and every single shadowy and typical aspect of the old covenant ceremonial law (Col. 2:16–17), just as He came to fulfill all of the Old Testament promises and prophecies (2 Cor. 1:20). While Christians profess that Jesus is the fulfillment of all of the preparatory and anticipatory aspects of the Old Testament, many lack the overarching framework by which the individual parts find their place in the grand narrative of God’s plan of redemption. In short, Jesus fulfills every preparatory and anticipatory aspect of the history of redemption in the Old Testament in general—and in the history of Israel in particular—because He is the true Israel of God. He recapitulates—summarizes and repeats—Israel’s history in His own experience and work in order to secure for His people the blessings promised to Abraham.

In Scriptures, Abraham stands as the covenant head of the people to whom God revealed Himself and His promise of redemption. The New Testament authors home in on the fact that God gave promises “to Abraham and to his seed.” The Apostle Paul goes a step further by suggesting that Christ is “the seed” (singular) to whom God was referring when He made His covenant promises with Abraham (Gal. 3:16 NIV). The point is clear: God gave promises to Abraham so that they might be passed down to Christ who would, in the fullness of time, fulfill them in His person and by His work. We see this in the divine dialogue that the writer to the Hebrews sets out from the Old Testament Scriptures (e.g., Heb. 2:10–16). The covenant promises that God gave to Abraham and to David had to make their way to the incarnate Christ. When the writer cites Psalm 2:7 and 2 Samuel 7:14 in Hebrews 1:5, he is helping us understand that God the Father was speaking to God the Son in the Old Testament about the covenant promises made to David.

The implications are large. In the Old Testament, everything that seems to be for the nation of Israel had to be passed down to Jesus, who then fulfilled the realities of the promises for us in His own person and work. This is how the Apostle Paul could say, “All the promises of God find their Yes in him [Christ]” (2 Cor. 1:20). It is also the reason why he could say of the Old Testament Scriptures: “Whatever was written in former days was written for our instruction, that through endurance and through the encouragement of the Scriptures we might have hope” (Rom. 15:4). - https://tabletalkmagazine.com/posts/who-is-the-true-israel-of-god/

Grip Docility · Jun 5, 2019

mkgal1 said:
Quoting from linked article:
Who Is the True Israel of God?

by Nicholas T. Batzig

The Apostle Paul, along with the other New Testament authors, in no uncertain terms explained that Jesus fulfilled each and every single shadowy and typical aspect of the old covenant ceremonial law (Col. 2:16–17), just as He came to fulfill all of the Old Testament promises and prophecies (2 Cor. 1:20). While Christians profess that Jesus is the fulfillment of all of the preparatory and anticipatory aspects of the Old Testament, many lack the overarching framework by which the individual parts find their place in the grand narrative of God’s plan of redemption. In short, Jesus fulfills every preparatory and anticipatory aspect of the history of redemption in the Old Testament in general—and in the history of Israel in particular—because He is the true Israel of God. He recapitulates—summarizes and repeats—Israel’s history in His own experience and work in order to secure for His people the blessings promised to Abraham.

In Scriptures, Abraham stands as the covenant head of the people to whom God revealed Himself and His promise of redemption. The New Testament authors home in on the fact that God gave promises “to Abraham and to his seed.” The Apostle Paul goes a step further by suggesting that Christ is “the seed” (singular) to whom God was referring when He made His covenant promises with Abraham (Gal. 3:16 NIV). The point is clear: God gave promises to Abraham so that they might be passed down to Christ who would, in the fullness of time, fulfill them in His person and by His work. We see this in the divine dialogue that the writer to the Hebrews sets out from the Old Testament Scriptures (e.g., Heb. 2:10–16). The covenant promises that God gave to Abraham and to David had to make their way to the incarnate Christ. When the writer cites Psalm 2:7 and 2 Samuel 7:14 in Hebrews 1:5, he is helping us understand that God the Father was speaking to God the Son in the Old Testament about the covenant promises made to David.

The implications are large. In the Old Testament, everything that seems to be for the nation of Israel had to be passed down to Jesus, who then fulfilled the realities of the promises for us in His own person and work. This is how the Apostle Paul could say, “All the promises of God find their Yes in him [Christ]” (2 Cor. 1:20). It is also the reason why he could say of the Old Testament Scriptures: “Whatever was written in former days was written for our instruction, that through endurance and through the encouragement of the Scriptures we might have hope” (Rom. 15:4). - https://tabletalkmagazine.com/posts/who-is-the-true-israel-of-god/

Batty? Never heard of em.

mkgal1 · Jun 5, 2019

Grip Docility said:
Batty? Never heard of em.

I just discovered him/his writing this morning - and I can't say I agree with everything he writes, but I agree with how he expresses Jesus and His relation to "the Israel of God".

Stone-n-Steel · Jun 5, 2019

I have pointed to ACTS for anyone who has some knowledge of scripture for years. If you don't understand what is going on in ACTS, you will have a hard time with the rest of scripture.

Guojing · Jun 5, 2019

Stone-n-Steel said:
I have pointed to ACTS for anyone who has some knowledge of scripture for years. If you don't understand what is going on in ACTS, you will have a hard time with the rest of scripture.

Understanding acts 21 has helped me to understand James ch 2 instructions to the Jews more clearly. I have also learned that James was not addressing the gentiles and that he believes the gentiles are to be exempted.

Grip Docility · Jun 5, 2019

mkgal1 said:
I just discovered him/his writing this morning - and I can't say I agree with everything he writes, but I agree with how he expresses Jesus and His relation to "the Israel of God".

I was being ornery... I enjoyed reading his article.

All Love in Jesus Christ to you!

Mel333 · Jun 5, 2019

Grip Docility said:
Excellent!

On the Apostle Paul...

Because Judas was a (type) for Satan (AntiType)... we see that Judas was blessed to work with God the Son and even had access to follow through in faith, beyond Christ’s DBR to salvation. Unfortunately, Judas never believed and instead betrayed God the Son. He is recorded as lost, which is very rare in scripture.

The Apostles, after Christ ascended... in Acts Of the Apostles 1:21-26, chose two men, prayed, then cast lots over the men to see who was to replace Judas. Mathias was Chosen.

This is a grey area. Jesus had instructed the Apostles to wait for Pentecost. It is conjecture to number Mathias one of the 12 or not.

In Acts 7, a man Named Saul guarded the cloaks of the men that stoned Steven and fervently HUNTED Christians... as “Saul” eludes and Acts reveals later.

Saul was the poster boy for the Jew that desires to serve God By stomping out “the false insurrection of The Way - Jewish term for followers of Jesus at the time-“.

Just as The Children Of Israel heard God in the Pentateuch, so Saul, while on the road to Damascus heard God. Saul is asked why he is persecuting God. Saul asked, who he was Persecuting. God replied; “I AM Jesus”. (Acts Of the Apostles 9)

Saul became Paul... and was forever changed!

Paul began his ministry and had to deal with the whole... “Oh, you’re not here to kill us, but guide us as the Chosen Of Jesus” gig for quite a while.

Paul, a fervent Pharisee Of Pharisee, Who by His own admission, kept the Law better than most Pharisee’s began to do something, even Peter hadn’t done.

Paul dismantled the Jewish customs and even railed against attempting to keep the Law for Salvation. Read Deuteronomy 1 - Deuteronomy 31:26 to get the full picture of what this meant.

Paul became the Gentile Dog (Goyem) ambassador of the Gospel and planted a major portion of the 7 churches, through travel and writing. We have 14 of his epistles in the NT (Hebrews is up to dispute as Paul’s, though it seems his work)...as only St. Paul would place even the Stone 10, in the Old Covenant.

Paul, boldly swept away the Judaising that attempted to bind the BOC back to the Old Covenant... and thusly is the very foundation of what we know to be “Christian Doctrine”... Post Red Letters.

From the epistles of Romans all the way to Philemon... we know Paul is the author. All following books are geared towards Messianic Jews. All scripture is for the BOC, but paying attention to Context within the Diaspora writings (or Jew centric NT writings is imperative!

Paul is unique to all Post Christ writers, because he attributes all of his words to DIRECT revelation from Jesus Christ, Ascended.

This is why it is difficult to name Paul one of the 12, or to say he is simply the Sole Ambassador to the solidifying doctrine of the BOC, as we know it today.

If Paul was not in scripture... Sola Fide (Faith Alone) would be enormously complex to proof.

Suggestions on more info on Paul?

Yes, was Paul executed during Nero's reign? What's the approx date of it?

I was watching a doco last night on Nero and they said Peter and Paul died around then and all these other Christians were killed as a consequence of the fire that spread throughout Rome.

Thanks for your insights!

Contenders Edge · Jun 5, 2019

notreligus said:
Is Judaism based on the Mitzvot or is it based on the teachings of rabbis?

Synagogues were in all of the major cities. These

Was Judaism based on the Mitzvot, or was it based on the teaching of rabbis?

Rabbi-led synagogues were in all of the major cities by the time of Christ's ministry. Eventually the oral law of the rabbis became more authoritative than the Scriptures (The Midrash, The Talmud). The Pseudopigrapha influenced Jews to reject Christ. The Messiah was presented as a political man who would lead the Jews out of Roman bondage. They weren't looking for a Suffering Servant. Today there are Messianics who still don't accept Jesus as divine, and there Jews who still believe that Isaiah 53 is about the nation of Israel.

Christ is true Israel. We have been reconciled by a Person and not a people.

Gal 3:16 Now the promises were made to Abraham and to his offspring. It does not say, “And to offsprings,” referring to many, but referring to one, “And to your offspring,” who is Christ.

That all depends on what period of Jewish history you are referring to. Jewish theology has its foundation in the Torah (five books of Moses) to which the rest of the Old Testament scriptures were later added. It is these scriptures which Jesus said spoke of Him and to which the Apostles appealed in their case for the Gospel.

As for the Mitzvot, I do not know what that is or at what point in Jewish history that came about. As for the Talmud, that did not come about until as early as the third century A.D. and from what I understand, it has been regarded as a commentary or series of commentaries on the Torah and Jewish tradition.

As for the establishment of oral laws, that is not possible or even practical for any society. Any political or religious system that is reliant on oral law and tradition lacks stability and ultimately fails within a short amount of time. In order for a set of laws to be firmly established, they have to be in written form and any government or religious system must be founded on a written precepts and creeds in order survive and be preserved.

Yet whatever the case may have been, it was these traditions that the Pharisee had imposed upon the people and which were condemned by our Lord because they were not a part of the laws of Moses by which the Pharisees professed to abide in and it was these traditions and laws that Jesus said they were teaching for doctrine instead of the actual scriptures. (Mt. )

The Jews rejected Christ because they were expecting a Messiah who would deliver them from their Roman occupiers but there is no evidence, biblically speaking, that any pseudopigrapha writings influenced the Jews to reject Jesus. He was rejected for reasons other than anything the pseudopigraphal writing may have said. If the psuedopigraphal writings had been a prominent influence in the thinking of the people, the inspired scriptures would have addressed the fact.

If there are Messianics who do not accept Jesus as being divine, then they are false professors of the faith.

Never does scripture call Christ Israel. He is their King just as he is our King, but He is never called Israel and scripture makes it clear that the promises made to Israel were never made null and void despite their rejection of Christ and that they are still invited to receive forgiveness just as the rest of us are. (Rom. 11) The promises made to the Jews are still in effect and we are warned not to exalt ourselves against the Jews (Rom. 11:18-21) and it is written that they will not continue to remain in unbelief. (Rom. 11:15)

Even before the reestablishment of Israel as a nation, God had not cast off His chosen people entirely and He never will. As long as God keeps His promises to the Jews, we can also be confident that He will also keep the promises that He has made to us; His Church.

Dorothy Mae · Jun 5, 2019

Grip Docility said:
How many people have REALLY studied the Book of Acts of the Apostles?

I'm going to venture to say that many Christians, actually don't study the book. I'm going to hurt some feelings here, because the book of Acts is literally THE TRUE FORMATION OF THE EARLY CHURCH.

true

Before skisms and Isms... We have Acts of the Apostles... But I warn you... Acts will actually confirm several things...

1) The shift form Judaism to Christianity wasn't an easy matter.

It’s more the fulfillment rather than shift. Believing Jews and Gentiles were grafted into the same tree, Jesus. The end of the Mosaic conevant was completed with the fall of Jerusalem. So now there is no Jew or Gentile in his family.

2 ) The 11 Apostles weren't Christians, but Jews... long into the book of Acts.

They followed Christ for sure making them Christ-ians. Do they were in the definition of Christ and his definition has weight.

3) Paul was the turning point of it all.

Doubtful. The other apostles accepted his teaching and did not disagree. You are assuming that because he wrote more his thoughts were singular.

4) Israel and the BOC aren't the same entity.

Been to Israel and this is correct. They aren’t. But Israel is no place to go to find God or his kingdom.

So, yes, the Book of Acts isn't just for Dispi's!!! But, I've got to warn you.... by the time you've read from Acts of the Apostles 1 - Acts of the Apostles 28 ... You might end up infected with a more ancient form of Dispensationalism.

Certainly different.

NO! I'm not talking about 2P2P... All of the books are for all of God's people!

But! CONTEXT CONTEXT CONTEXT!!!!!!

What’s 2P2P?

The Book of Acts isn't just for Dispensationalists!!!

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