Who is the Bride of Christ? (Hint: It's not the Church)

Marilyn C · May 28, 2019

ewq1938 said:
He is saying we are the bride of Christ but beating a dead concept won't result in anything new so thanks for the conversation.

Hi ewq,

So let`s sum up & see what your view is based on -

1. Eph. 5. Exhortation to husbands.
2. 2 Cor. 11.2 Paul is talking to his disciples, and he will not present us to Christ, only Christ will do that. (Jude 24)
3. Rom. 7: 4 Is not saying that men will marry Jesus, (homosexuality) but they are joined to Him who is the Head.

No scripture says `Bride of Christ,` and that teaching is false and leads the believer to the wrong inheritance. And that topic I will talk to Mark about.

Marilyn.

Marilyn C · May 28, 2019

mark kennedy said:
Marilyn,

Israel is part of the church, actually the church has been grafted into the covenants and promises of God to Israel and extended to the Gentiles:

Jesus therefore called His disciples to fulfill Abraham’s commission to bless the nations (Genesis 12:2–3) by preaching the gospel of the Kingdom to all nations until the end of this age (Matthew 28:18–20). Paul thus preached the gospel of the Kingdom to the Jews and was repeatedly rejected (Acts 13—28); in consequence, Paul brought the good news to the Gentiles, who in turn became Abraham’s spiritual seed by faith and heirs of the promises to Abraham and his seed (Galatians 3—4). This is what Paul meant in Romans 11 by the Gentiles being “grafted” into the “olive tree” and nourished by the “root” (the promises to Abraham). The tree thus signifies the collective people of God; the “wild branches” grafted in are Gentile believers; the “natural branches” that are cut off are the Jews in unbelief. Jewish believers remain in the tree but are joined with Gentiles and “made” into a “new body,” the Church (Ephesians 2:11–22). (What does it mean that the church has been grafted in Israel’s place?)

Jerusalem during the Millennial reign of Christ, is the hub of the ministry of the church the entire time. The way leading in is the way called holiness and the Word of God will be taught everywhere. Paul insists throughout his writings there is no different between Jew and Gentile in Christ. Every believer will be there from righteous Abel to the last soul to receive Christ during the tribulation period.

Abraham "looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God" (Heb. 11:10). That city is the New Jerusalem.

Grace and peace,
Mark

Hi Mark,

I see what you are saying, however had you realised that the Body of Christ is a different purpose and has a greater inheritance than Israel. The gospel of the kingdom, is the good news that Christ will rule through Israel in the millennium. The further revelation given to the Apostle Paul, that was not known previously, is of the Body of Christ who will rule with Christ in the heavenly realms. (Rev. 3: 21)

Each have a purpose in God`s great kingdom over all.

The olive tree is the Lord, as the root is holy and nourishes us. Israel is not holy and does not nourish us.
`...the root is holy.....a partaker of the root and fatness of the olive tree.` (Rom. 11: 16 & 17)

The Old Testament saints were promised the city, (Heb. 11: 16) however the Body of Christ has been promised a great dominion, (Heb. 11: 40)

`God having provided something better, (greater dominion) for us...` (Heb. 11: 40)

They will rule in the lower heavens and we will rule in the higher heavens and together there will be peace, joy and righteousness.

Marilyn.

nolidad · May 29, 2019

ThatCanadianDude_88 said:
I know this may be the popular view, but is it the Biblical view?

We often rush to Ephesians 5:25, but where does Paul in that chapter ever say that the Church is the Bride of Christ? He tells husbands to love their wives "just as" Christ loves the Church. It is an expression meant to typify the kind of love husbands ought to have for their wives, which is the greatest kind of love. This has nothing to do with prophecy, it's meant to be instructional.

So who is the Bride of Christ? You'll discover that not only is the "Church" view at odds with Scripture, but it will also cause you to completely miss just how powerful and glorious this particular prophecy actually is.

Matthew 9:15 New American Standard Bible (NASB)
And Jesus said to them, “The attendants of the bridegroom cannot mourn as long as the bridegroom is with them, can they? But the days will come when the bridegroom is taken away from them, and then they will fast.

Notice the clear reference to the bridegroom. In speaking of his disciples, what is the word Jesus uses? Attendants. This harkens back to what John said of the Messiah.

John 3:29 New American Standard Bible (NASB)
He who has the bride is the bridegroom; but the friend of the bridegroom, who stands and hears him, rejoices greatly because of the bridegroom’s voice. So this joy of mine has been made full.

Remember what Jesus said to His disciples during those final few intimate moments He spent with them.

John 15:13-15 New American Standard Bible (NASB)
Greater love has no one than this, that one lay down his life for his friends. You are My friends if you do what I command you. No longer do I call you slaves, for the slave does not know what his master is doing; but I have called you friends, for all things that I have heard from My Father I have made known to you.

Now let's move to Revelations.

Revelation 19:7-8 New American Standard Bible (NASB)
Let us rejoice and be glad and give the glory to Him, for the marriage of the Lamb has come and His bride has made herself ready.” It was given to her to clothe herself in fine linen, bright and clean; for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints.

How could the saints be the bride if the righteous acts of the saints are what clothe the bride? You cannot accept the "Church is the Bride" view unless you throw out this critical distinction and break Scripture.

The righteous acts of the Church are what clothe the bride. So who is the bride?

Revelation 21:2 New American Standard Bible (NASB)
And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, made ready as a bride adorned for her husband.

What does this all mean?

Psalm 2:6-8 New American Standard Bible (NASB)
“But as for Me, I have installed My King
Upon Zion, My holy mountain.”

“I will surely tell of the decree of the Lord:
He said to Me, ‘You are My Son,
Today I have begotten You.
‘Ask of Me, and I will surely give the nations as Your inheritance,
And the very ends of the earth as Your possession.

John 3:35 New American Standard Bible (NASB)
The Father loves the Son and has given all things into His hand.

Matthew 25:31 New American Standard Bible (NASB)
“But when the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on His glorious throne.

It is not the consummation of Christ and His Church that is in view, although this is an incredibly glorious event.

What is in view is the consummation of Christ and His kingdom. It's all about the eternal Kingship of the Lord Jesus. This is the time when the Father gives the Son His inheritance.

Doesn't that completely shift how you view things?

What the Bible does say is that we are co-heirs with Christ.

Romans 8:17 New American Standard Bible (NASB)
...and if children, heirs also, heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, if indeed we suffer with Him so that we may also be glorified with Him.

nolidad · May 29, 2019

You make some powerful statements but err in a few key and critical places.

1. Paul in corinthians said He has espoused the church to one groom-christ! Paul says the church is the bride of Christ (a bride being the espoused until after the first year of marriage in the Jewish economy)

2. If the Kingdom is what is in mind, then Jesus ends up divorcing His kingdom! Why?

1 Cor. 15:

22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.

26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.

28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

After the millenial kingdom that Christ reigns over, he hands the kingdom back to God the Father! That is kinda like a metaphorical wife swapping!

nolidad · May 29, 2019

To all here:

I had a post removed for the reason of flaming. I wish to apologize to all who fgound the post offensive. My intent was not to flame or goad. When I saw it again, I could see how it was very very easy to see it that way.

I was responding to Marilyn C. #21 and focusing on the part of tolling an unsaved homosexual man come to be part of the bride of Christ.

I was trying to say we should avoid the precious truth of us being the bride to the unsaved for they have not the capacity yet to understand these truths. We should offer the simple gospel. The unsaved cannot perceive the things of God as Paul says in corinthians, so in that sense I said it would be casting our pearls( doctrine beyond salvation) to swine (people who are unsaved and not in the place of understanding truths like these). It was not meant to attack or goad anyone but to add a biblical exhortation about giving the unsaved spiritual truths beying their capacity to understand as unsaved.

So once again I apologize and will endeavor to be more careful in my wording of things.

Marilyn C · May 29, 2019

nolidad said:
To all here:

I had a post removed for the reason of flaming. I wish to apologize to all who fgound the post offensive. My intent was not to flame or goad. When I saw it again, I could see how it was very very easy to see it that way.

I was responding to Marilyn C. #21 and focusing on the part of tolling an unsaved homosexual man come to be part of the bride of Christ.

I was trying to say we should avoid the precious truth of us being the bride to the unsaved for they have not the capacity yet to understand these truths. We should offer the simple gospel. The unsaved cannot perceive the things of God as Paul says in corinthians, so in that sense I said it would be casting our pearls( doctrine beyond salvation) to swine (people who are unsaved and not in the place of understanding truths like these). It was not meant to attack or goad anyone but to add a biblical exhortation about giving the unsaved spiritual truths beying their capacity to understand as unsaved.

So once again I apologize and will endeavor to be more careful in my wording of things.

Hi nolidad,

I can imagine people`s response to my comments, however sometimes we need to see what we are really teaching. Whether you tell someone before they come to Christ or later it is still the same error. If it was just a matter of a symbol of being pure, that wouldn`t matter so much, BUT it leads to the wrong inheritance for the Body of Christ.

We are destined for the very throne of the Lord. (Rev. 3: 21) and that authority/throne is in the highest heaven. His authority/throne and power is throughout God`s great kingdom BUT HIS SEAT of authority/throne is supreme, the highest heavens.

If you are misled to believe we are the Bride, (purpose) then you will be thinking we are in the New Jerusalem and we, the Body of Christ have never been promised that.

regards, Marilyn.

nolidad · May 30, 2019

Marilyn C said:
Hi nolidad,

I can imagine people`s response to my comments, however sometimes we need to see what we are really teaching. Whether you tell someone before they come to Christ or later it is still the same error. If it was just a matter of a symbol of being pure, that wouldn`t matter so much, BUT it leads to the wrong inheritance for the Body of Christ.

We are destined for the very throne of the Lord. (Rev. 3: 21) and that authority/throne is in the highest heaven. His authority/throne and power is throughout God`s great kingdom BUT HIS SEAT of authority/throne is supreme, the highest heavens.

If you are misled to believe we are the Bride, (purpose) then you will be thinking we are in the New Jerusalem and we, the Body of Christ have never been promised that.

regards, Marilyn.

Hi Marilyn:

Well I can only defend what the word says:
2 Corinthians 11:2
For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ.

We are engaged to jesus!

Revelation 21:9
And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.

Revelation 22:17
And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

Ephesians 5:

25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.

28 So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.

29 For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:

30 For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.

31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.

32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

Mystery is musterion which means something hidden that Paul revealed!

As for New Jerusalem- it is our eternal destination! Rev. 21 makes that clear!

But as to all these future events. I do not worry. For wherever we dwell, we will be with Christ and that is heaven! I know what I believe based on SCripture with no private interpretation, but I do not worry-God will care for us perfectly!

Marilyn C · May 30, 2019

nolidad said:
Hi Marilyn:

Well I can only defend what the word says:
2 Corinthians 11:2
For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ.

We are engaged to jesus!

Revelation 21:9
And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.

Revelation 22:17
And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

Ephesians 5:

25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.

28 So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.

29 For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:

30 For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.

31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.

32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

Mystery is musterion which means something hidden that Paul revealed!

Hi nolidad,

2 Cor. 11: 2 is Paul talking to his disciples saying that he wants to present them to the Lord. Scripture DOES NOT say that Paul will present US to the Lord.

Rev. 21: 9 & 21: 2 reveal that the word `bride` is a description of the glory of God. THAT is scripture.

Eph. 5 is an exhortation to husbands.

None of that adds up to DOCTRINE!

Marilyn.

Grip Docility · May 30, 2019

nolidad said:
Hi Marilyn:

Well I can only defend what the word says:
2 Corinthians 11:2
For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ.

We are engaged to jesus!

Revelation 21:9
And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.

Revelation 22:17
And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

Ephesians 5:

25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.

28 So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.

29 For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:

30 For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.

31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.

32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

Mystery is musterion which means something hidden that Paul revealed!

As for New Jerusalem- it is our eternal destination! Rev. 21 makes that clear!

But as to all these future events. I do not worry. For wherever we dwell, we will be with Christ and that is heaven! I know what I believe based on SCripture with no private interpretation, but I do not worry-God will care for us perfectly!

We can't be "Engaged" to Jesus... if we are Bone of His Bone... which is exactly what Body of Christ Means.

Faith is our "Marriage to Jesus".

The BOC is gathered together in the (as the) clouds, with Jesus, in the sky.

Zechariah 14 reveals what happens next...

We are already as One with Christ, as Christ is One with the Father.

My point???

It ain't the BOC that Jesus is coming for at the close of time... (End of the age of Gentiles)...

Jesus is going to show how deeply He KEEPS HIS WORD, despite what the other party does.

These verses are wise to look into...

Zechariah 13:6 ; Matthew 15:24 ; Zechariah 12:10

Marilyn C · May 30, 2019

nolidad said:
As for New Jerusalem- it is our eternal destination! Rev. 21 makes that clear!

But as to all these future events. I do not worry. For wherever we dwell, we will be with Christ and that is heaven! I know what I believe based on SCripture with no private interpretation, but I do not worry-God will care for us perfectly!

Hi nolidad,

Rev. 21 does not say the Body of Christ will be in the new Jerusalem.

Now as to `wherever we dwell, we will be with Christ,` that sounds very spiritual but it actually is a cope out and worst of all deception, I believe. Let me explain.

It would seem that all God should have written was John 3: 16 and not worry about giving us the wonderful revelation of His purposes for - the Body of Christ, for Israel and for the Nations. You see we actually need to study God`s word as He told us to so that we wont be ashamed -

`...Be diligent to present yourself approved to God, a worker who does not need to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.` (2 Tim. 2: 15)

It is the Holy Spirit sent by the Lord to bring us into ALL truth of Christ, His character and His purposes. (John 16: 13) And why is ALL THE TRUTH necessary? Why can`t we just say `God will care for us, I don`t have to study?` It is most important that the Body of Christ comes to ALL THE TRUTH of Christ and His purposes so that we grow up and know our true inheritance.

`...that we no longer be children tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, .... but GROW UP in all things into Him who is the Head - Christ. (Eph. 4: 14 & 15)

Over the years the Holy Spirit has clarified most of the truths - Salvation, baptism, infilling of Holy Spirit, giftings & ministry gifts, the final truth to be clarified is our eternal inheritance. That is why it is important for people to study and discuss this final truth.

Marilyn.

Marilyn C · May 30, 2019

Grip Docility said:
We can't be "Engaged" to Jesus... if we are Bone of His Bone... which is exactly what Body of Christ Means.

Faith is our "Marriage to Jesus".

The BOC is gathered together in the (as the) clouds, with Jesus, in the sky.

Zechariah 14 reveals what happens next...

We are already as One with Christ, as Christ is One with the Father.

My point???

It ain't the BOC that Jesus is coming for at the close of time... (End of the age of Gentiles)...

Jesus is going to show how deeply He KEEPS HIS WORD, despite what the other party does.

These verses are wise to look into...

Zechariah 13:6 ; Matthew 15:24 ; Zechariah 12:10

Hi Grip,

Good point there - bone of His bone....as one. Also there is NO marriage in heaven as the Lord told the people of Israel. So no one `marries` Jesus. The word `bride` is used as a symbol for God`s relationship with Israel - her master, and it is also used to describe the glory of the New Jerusalem.

And our inheritance is NOT in the New Jerusalem.

Marilyn.

Grip Docility · May 30, 2019

Marilyn C said:
Hi Grip,

Good point there - bone of His bone....as one. Also there is NO marriage in heaven as the Lord told the people of Israel. So no one `marries` Jesus. The word `bride` is used as a symbol for God`s relationship with Israel - her master, and it is also used to describe the glory of the New Jerusalem.

And our inheritance is NOT in the New Jerusalem.

Marilyn.

Can we agree that the symbol given is to show union? As in the BOC is "Joined" to Christ and is seen as one with the Jews in the "Jerusalem Above" that Paul cites, unified in the NEW MAN?

I can't emphasize enough... I believe Israel is the Bride Jesus has in mind at the close of time... and I mean... the "naughty" Israel that people are so down on.

I do not mix the BOC and Israel, btw.

Marilyn C · May 30, 2019

Grip Docility said:
Can we agree that the symbol given is to show union? As in the BOC is "Joined" to Christ and is seen as one with the Jews in the "Jerusalem Above" that Paul cites?

I can't emphasize enough... I believe Israel is the Bride Jesus has in mind at the close of time... and I mean... the "naughty" Israel that people are so down on.

I do not mix the BOC and Israel, btw.

Hi Grip,

Wonderful to have such agreement there. Great. Now I do understand why you put us both together in Jerusalem, but I have not been taught that. So perhaps you may think upon this -

In scripture we see that when God talks of Jerusalem He means Mount Zion AND the city. Two parts there. Think of Psalm 48 `...in the city of our God, in His holy mountain...is Mount Zion...` King David ruled from Mount Zion and then the city was further down.

Then we see in Hebrews the two parts again -
`But you have come to Mount Zion AND to the city of the living God the heavenly Jerusalem...` (Heb. 12: 22)

Note the city part comes down out of heaven from God BUT MOUNT ZION is still in the highest heaven. It is symbolic for the ruling realm of Christ, which we, the Body of Christ will share. The city part coming down, will house the Old testament saints for they were promised it, (Heb. 11: 16) and Christ rulership will be there too, but not His SEAT of power & authority. The word throne is just a symbol of authority and not meaning Jesus` highest seat of power.

regards, Marilyn.

Grip Docility · May 30, 2019

Marilyn C said:
Hi Grip,

Wonderful to have such agreement there. Great. Now I do understand why you put us both together in Jerusalem, but I have not been taught that. So perhaps you may think upon this -

In scripture we see that when God talks of Jerusalem He means Mount Zion AND the city. Two parts there. Think of Psalm 48 `...in the city of our God, in His holy mountain...is Mount Zion...` King David ruled from Mount Zion and then the city was further down.

Then we see in Hebrews the two parts again -
`But you have come to Mount Zion AND to the city of the living God the heavenly Jerusalem...` (Heb. 12: 22)

Note the city part comes down out of heaven from God BUT MOUNT ZION is still in the highest heaven. It is symbolic for the ruling realm of Christ, which we, the Body of Christ will share. The city part coming down, will house the Old testament saints for they were promised it, (Heb. 11: 16) and Christ rulership will be there too, but not His SEAT of power & authority. The word throne is just a symbol of authority and not meaning Jesus` highest seat of power.

regards, Marilyn.

I understand what you are saying, yet in Galatians 4, Paul spells out Jerusalem above and Jerusalem below (In bondage)...

In Galatians, Paul is speaking of the integration of Jews and Gentiles into the BOC.

Does not the Body go to dwell with the Head of the Body, upon death, as Paul says? He speaks as a member of the BOC when He makes the statement "Absent from the Body", present with the Lord.

What do you make of these matters?

Marilyn C · May 31, 2019

Grip Docility said:
I understand what you are saying, yet in Galatians 4, Paul spells out Jerusalem above and Jerusalem below (In bondage)...

In Galatians, Paul is speaking of the integration of Jews and Gentiles into the BOC.

Does not the Body go to dwell with the Head of the Body, upon death, as Paul says? He speaks as a member of the BOC when He makes the statement "Absent from the Body", present with the Lord.

What do you make of these matters?

Hi Grip,

Yes there is an earthly Jerusalem with two parts, Mount Zion (for ruling) and the city part. Then there is the heavenly Jerusalem, also with two parts, Mount Zion, (for ruling) and the city part.

And yes I agree that in the Body there is Jew & Gentile, and we go to be with the Lord on His throne in the highest heavens.

Then Israel has been promised two inheritances as the stars of heaven, and as the sand of the sea-shore.

- as the stars of heaven. This is a prominent place in the heavens, (but not the predominant like a sun), and this is in the New Jerusalem, (Heb. 11: 16) This is especially for those of the Old Testament who believed God for that inheritance. The city is a prominent place in the heavens but not the predominant place which is for the Body of Christ on Mount Zion, (figuratively) in the third heaven.

- as the sand of the sea-shore. This is the predominant place upon the earth and they will rule over the nations of the earth.

So we can see that God has prepared different groups for ruling in different parts of His great kingdom, and all under the Lord Jesus Christ.

Thank you for your good manner in our discussions, much appreciated.

Marilyn.

nolidad · May 31, 2019

Marilyn C said:
It would seem that all God should have written was John 3: 16 and not worry about giving us the wonderful revelation of His purposes for - the Body of Christ, for Israel and for the Nations. You see we actually need to study God`s word as He told us to so that we wont be ashamed

The distinctions for Israel and the Bride of Christ are only for the millennial kingdom. We do not know much about the eternal order of things.

Marilyn C said:
Now as to `wherever we dwell, we will be with Christ,` that sounds very spiritual but it actually is a cope out and worst of all deception, I believe. Let me explain.

Well When we are glorified- we will have all the attributes of the kingdom within us!

And as REv. 22 declares:

14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.

16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.

Marilyn C said:
It is the Holy Spirit sent by the Lord to bring us into ALL truth of Christ, His character and His purposes. (John 16: 13) And why is ALL THE TRUTH necessary? Why can`t we just say `God will care for us, I don`t have to study?` It is most important that the Body of Christ comes to ALL THE TRUTH of Christ and His purposes so that we grow up and know our true inheritance.

Well let me tell you where I come from in studying the word of God!

I have been walking with the Lord for almost 45 years now!
I have read the NT over 150 times
The OT in whole about 6 and in parts over 4 dozen.
Topically I have studied all doctrines many many times.

I have been a teacher for over 35 years and created the curriculuum and administer and teach in a Bible Institute!

I believe in the literal, historical, grammatic hermeneutic.

I also believe we need to study biblical history to understand how words were used by8 the authors, as well as the settings of biblical scenes.

This doesn't include the fact I have graduated Bible College, studied the languages to get a basic working knowledge, as well as systematic theology and systematic doctrine.

I have specialized teaching eschatology and Genesis 1-11 As well as doctrine.

I say all this not to pat myself on the back, but to say I have at least a little knowledge of the Word of God.

nolidad · May 31, 2019

Grip Docility said:
We can't be "Engaged" to Jesus... if we are Bone of His Bone... which is exactly what Body of Christ Means.

Faith is our "Marriage to Jesus".

The BOC is gathered together in the (as the) clouds, with Jesus, in the sky.

Zechariah 14 reveals what happens next...

We are already as One with Christ, as Christ is One with the Father.

My point???

It ain't the BOC that Jesus is coming for at the close of time... (End of the age of Gentiles)...

Jesus is going to show how deeply He KEEPS HIS WORD, despite what the other party does.

These verses are wise to look into...

Zechariah 13:6 ; Matthew 15:24 ; Zechariah 12:10

Well teh Bible says we are engaged to Jesus and that in Rev. 19 we get married. I won't add to that. and yes we are Jesus hands and feet and tongues, but we still also are the engaged.

Faith is our entrance into the body- we do not get married till REv. 19 in heaven.

A short but excellent study on the Jewish Wedding system and the Bride of Christ is found here:

http://www.arielm.org/dcs/pdf/mbs113m.pdf

Jesus in John 14 was following the jewish system of marriage. The church to come is his espoused. Jesus paid the bride price (His blood) and now He has gone to His fathers house to prepare a place for us- all in accord with teh Jewish system.

When the Father approves of the dwelling- He tells His son to fetch His bride (the Rapture)

Matt. 24:
36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

37 But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

since Pentecost- the church has been preparing itself both corporately and indivdually to be His bride (sanctification).

I Agree at teh end of teh 70th week of Daniel that Jesus comes to rescue Isael from an all out assault by8 the antichrist and the worlds armies.

But the rapture is a pre 70th week event and can come at any moment.

nolidad · May 31, 2019

Marilyn C said:
Hi nolidad,

2 Cor. 11: 2 is Paul talking to his disciples saying that he wants to present them to the Lord. Scripture DOES NOT say that Paul will present US to the Lord.

Rev. 21: 9 & 21: 2 reveal that the word `bride` is a description of the glory of God. THAT is scripture.

Eph. 5 is an exhortation to husbands.

None of that adds up to DOCTRINE!

Marilyn.

So Pauls disciples will be engaged to Jesus but we are not? I don't think so. When I am used to disciple someone, it is my purpose to present them to Christ as a chaste espoused virgin! We should all be presenting fellow believers as the espoused of Christ.

As for Revelation 21? YOu missed one little but critical word. "AS" This lets us know that it is a metaphor and not literal. John is comparing the beauty of New Jerusalem as a bride on her wedding day!
Do you think that the city of God is not glorious right now?
Rev. 19:
7 Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready.

8 And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white: for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints.

9 And he saith unto me, Write, Blessed are they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb. And he saith unto me, These are the true sayings of God.

Do you think Jesus metaphorically marries New Jerusalem and it is not glorious until all the saints are given their fine linen?

As for Ephesians 5:
32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

33 Nevertheless let every one of you in particular so love his wife even as himself; and the wife see that she reverence her husband.

Another important word to pay attention to: "NEVERTHELESS" The whole teaching about wives and husbands was a direct teaching about Christ and the Church! Verse 32.

Then Paul says- Nevertheless (even though this teaching is about Christ and the Church) verse 33.
Hope this helps.

Grip Docility · May 31, 2019

nolidad said:
Well teh Bible says we are engaged to Jesus and that in Rev. 19 we get married. I won't add to that. and yes we are Jesus hands and feet and tongues, but we still also are the engaged.

Faith is our entrance into the body- we do not get married till REv. 19 in heaven.

A short but excellent study on the Jewish Wedding system and the Bride of Christ is found here:

http://www.arielm.org/dcs/pdf/mbs113m.pdf

Jesus in John 14 was following the jewish system of marriage. The church to come is his espoused. Jesus paid the bride price (His blood) and now He has gone to His fathers house to prepare a place for us- all in accord with teh Jewish system.

When the Father approves of the dwelling- He tells His son to fetch His bride (the Rapture)

Matt. 24:
36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

37 But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

since Pentecost- the church has been preparing itself both corporately and indivdually to be His bride (sanctification).

I Agree at teh end of teh 70th week of Daniel that Jesus comes to rescue Isael from an all out assault by8 the antichrist and the worlds armies.

But the rapture is a pre 70th week event and can come at any moment.

I appreciate your expression of (1 Thessalonians 4:15-17)

I don’t lock in on the when and the how Of this matter... but only a fool could suggest this isn’t a literal snatching away in respects to 1 Thessalonians 4:17.

I emphasize one thing... Ephesians 2 specifies the BOC is already Bone of His bone. This is my opinion, but what I mean is.... as Bone of His Bone... we are one IN Him, as He alone is ONE in HIS Father.

All Love in Jesus Christ to you. Also, I will share that it is my hope that we are in that cloud He is returning amongst.

I hope we get to be under His command and have part in His response to His cherished Land and Peoples persecution and torment.

nolidad · May 31, 2019

Grip Docility said:
I appreciate your expression of (1 Thessalonians 4:15-17)

I don’t lock in on the when and the how Of this matter... but only a fool could suggest this isn’t a literal snatching away in respects to 1 Thessalonians 4:17.

I emphasize one thing... Ephesians 2 specifies the BOC is already Bone of His bone. This is my opinion, but what I mean is.... as Bone of His Bone... we are one IN Him, as He alone is ONE in HIS Father.

All Love in Jesus Christ to you. Also, I will share that it is my hope that we are in that cloud He is returning amongst.

I hope we get to be under His command and have part in His response to His cherished Land and Peoples persecution and torment.

Well if we are his children, part of HIs body, and His espoused-when that trumpet toots- we shall scoot!

And yes grip we will return with Jesus when He rescues Israel from teh grips of the antichrist assault!

Who is the Bride of Christ? (Hint: It's not the Church)

Pre-tribulation.

Pre-tribulation.

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