Carl Emerson
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- Dec 18, 2017
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Exactly - its either faith or unbelief.After hearing ..all have the choice to believe
Or not..
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Exactly - its either faith or unbelief.After hearing ..all have the choice to believe
Or not..
If it is genuine faith, absolutely. But we must know as well that the converse is also true. Real faith delivers us from evil works. Do you agree?Faith, automatically brings good works.
Its like sitting in the sun. The after effect is sunburn!
Morning brother. Let me clarify. Fruits are not something we generate. They are what the Spirit does inside us as we abide in Him.@Gideons300
Interesting thought, “works the same as fruit”.??? Worth pondering before God.
Let see, both are a action that the body produces. Both are seen outwardly. Both are said to be produced by faith. Curious???
Let’s see, the thief on the cross had saving faith, therefore he had both faith and works. The faith of his heart caused him to humble himself and turn to Christ and with his mouth asked to be remembered. That act had both faith and works or faith and the fruit of faith.
Interesting, ???
Blessings,
Much love in Christ, Not me
If it is genuine faith, absolutely. But we must know as well that the converse is also true. Real faith delivers us from evil works. Do you agree?
blessings,
Gids
Works are the outer expression in our lives of those inner fruits. They are not the same, but one will produce the other.
@Gideons300
Interesting thought, “works the same as fruit”.??? Worth pondering before God.
Let see, both are a action that the body produces. Both are seen outwardly. Both are said to be produced by faith. Curious???
Let’s see, the thief on the cross had saving faith, therefore he had both faith and works. The faith of his heart caused him to humble himself and turn to Christ and with his mouth asked to be remembered. That act had both faith and works or faith and the fruit of faith.
Interesting, ???
Blessings,
Much love in Christ, Not me
The only reason the thief needed no works is because he was not going to be able to do any as his time was short. It's also like if a paraplegic was saved, works would not be expected anymore from God than they would from his family/caretaker.
These are normal exceptions we as humans make, and I know we are not more compassionate than Christ so of course he makes the same exceptions, it would be cruel to expect the impossible from anyone. Though they are often used wrongly in attempt to do away with works, the lesson with things like that have nothing to do with Christians in general not needing to do works but the common sense works cannot be expected at times.
Hi,
As I wrote in my post, I see it as the thief did have works.
The faith of his heart caused him to turn to Jesus and ask to be remembered. That act of putting his faith in action was the work that saved him.
But you see it differently, so I wish you well, as we search after this God, who called us unto Himself.
Blessings,
Much love in Christ, Not me
The error is in thinking that faith is a "thing" you have.
But it is not.
It is an action you take based upon what you truly believe.
Because a person believes- they act in obedience.
Which changes the course and then destination.
A person who says they believe but does not take obedient action (have faith) can never be saved untill they do.
Because disobedience is rebellion and sin.
Hi,
As I wrote in my post, I see it as the thief did have works.
The faith of his heart caused him to turn to Jesus and ask to be remembered. That act of putting his faith in action was the work that saved him.
But you see it differently, so I wish you well, as we search after this God, who called us unto Himself.
Blessings,
Much love in Christ, Not me
No, the thief did not have "works" as Paul defines "works" in the context of salvation:
Now to the one who works, wages are not credited as a gift but as an obligation. -- Romans 4
When Paul speaks of "work" in his Romans teaching of salvation, he is speaking of the attempt of persons to obligate God to eternal life through their own activity. They perform certain actions, live a certain way, and they believe that obligates God to pay them their due wages of eternal life.
Paul does not use this specific definition of "work" in other places. He's not using this definition of work in, for instance, Ephesians 2:10. Nor is this the definition used by James. All of those are "works" that are the result of actions propelled by faith.
Faith causes good works--consistently and reliably. If there are no good works, there is question whether faith even exists.
The thief displayed "good work" in his confession of faith while in agony on his cross. Testimony is a good work. His testimony did not save him, it was the result of his faith.
I wasn't clear of what you were getting at, as yours is a different take than what many get out of that scripture. I think in a sense you are correct, at least in a case like this,
send pic of it .post it here or pm it to me.Hebrews defines faith very specifically and definitely as a palpable "thing."
The error is in thinking that faith is a "thing" you have.
But it is not.
It is an action you take based upon what you truly believe.
Because a person believes- they act in obedience.
Which changes the course and then destination.
A person who says they believe but does not take obedient action (have faith) can never be saved untill they do.
Because disobedience is rebellion and sin.