Did the event of 1948 Israel fulfill any Bible prophecy?

Did event of Israel 1948 fulfill any Bible prophecy?


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Lulav

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You need to study circumcision and learn about the role it played in making one a physical Jew and a physical member of Israel. And then consider Jesus abolished it on the cross.
1. Circumcision does not 'make one a Jew'
2. Circumcision was not 'abolished' on the cross. It is a sign of the covenant which was not abolished as well.

Why in His omniscience He chose Abram over all the other people to come from Noah's line, we can't really know. He was of the line of Shem, who was a direct descendant of Noah, and we do know that Noah asked a special blessing upon Shem for his part in covering Noah's nakedness. Beyond that, there doesn't seem to be any particular reason that God would have chosen Abram over all the other children of Noah, but He did.
Because he was pure like Noah was, the only choice to bring through the Messiah.

But understand please that from the very day that God called Abram out of Haran, Jesus was going to die. That was God's plan from the very beginning and He worked out His plan upon the earth through His people.

Hi lulav,

Well, people aren't that smart or omniscient. Yes, everyone had their little bit part in bringing about God's great plan of salvation, but they didn't any of them realize at the time how it was all going to end. It was only after it was all done that we can look back and see the thread of God's hand in all that came to pass and how that thread leads from Abram to Jesus. That's just the way humans are. This is why the plan couldn't be accomplished until the old covenant Scriptures were complete. We humans are not a particularly bright bunch. Especially when it comes to understanding the things of God. So God had to get it all written down for us first.

So, I wouldn't agree that any of them were 'in on it'. It wasn't really a matter of them being 'in on it'. They just each had their part to play in God's plan of salvation and despite their repeated and near constant rebellion to the yoke of God, they did complete the plan for which God called them to do. As I say, if one reads the prophecies of the old covenant, there shouldn't be any surprise that it all worked out as it did. There shouldn't be any surprise to the born again believer that God used His people to work out the completion of His plan upon the earth. It was for this very purpose that God called Abram.

God bless,
In Christ, ted
Thanks Ted, btw, I am Jewish, I was actually addressing some that believe all Jews are responsible for Messiah dying. The thing is they don't understand that they would be forever doomed had things not taken place the way they did but to continue to put the 'blood guilt' on Jews today is really short-sighted.

Israel later became a kingdom under Saul, David, and Solomon. But it never was a "kingdom" prior to Saul. It started out as a Democracy. Have you not read that in Judges 21:25....

Israel as a nation was started as a Theocracy, God himself was to be their king and was until they complained too much, however they wanted to be like the other nations and have a visible King and he gave them Saul , which we see was a very bad choice.

Israel was intended all along to be a kingdom under Yeshua, but it was not initially established as a kingdom.
Again, yes it was.

Jesus is Abraham's seed along with believers according to Paul. Abraham's seed = Israel. First called Hebrews and then Israel interchangeably by Moses. All the promises made to Abraham are yes in Jesus according to Paul. And Israel now occupies the entire earth as promises to Abraham.
Abrahams' seed does NOT = Israel.

If you believe that then you are saying that the Arabs (the twelve sons of Ishmael), as well as the descendants of Zimran, Jokshan, Medan, Midian, Ishbak, and Shuah are Israel and it just ain't so.
 
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OldWiseGuy

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Abrahams' seed does NOT = Israel.

If you believe that then you are saying that the Arabs (the twelve sons of Ishmael), as well as the descendants of Zimran, Jokshan, Medan, Midian, Ishbak, and Shuah are Israel and it just ain't so.

The Arabs are not counted as Abrahams seed in regard to the promises. Paul makes this clear.
 
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Grip Docility

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1. Circumcision does not 'make one a Jew'
2. Circumcision was not 'abolished' on the cross. It is a sign of the covenant which was not abolished as well.


Because he was pure like Noah was, the only choice to bring through the Messiah.




Thanks Ted, btw, I am Jewish, I was actually addressing some that believe all Jews are responsible for Messiah dying. The thing is they don't understand that they would be forever doomed had things not taken place the way they did but to continue to put the 'blood guilt' on Jews today is really short-sighted.



Israel as a nation was started as a Theocracy, God himself was to be their king and was until they complained too much, however they wanted to be like the other nations and have a visible King and he gave them Saul , which we see was a very bad choice.


Again, yes it was.


Abrahams' seed does NOT = Israel.

If you believe that then you are saying that the Arabs (the twelve sons of Ishmael), as well as the descendants of Zimran, Jokshan, Medan, Midian, Ishbak, and Shuah are Israel and it just ain't so.

Are you Messianic? I am gathering yes.
 
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jgr

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The birthright promise wasn't a covenant, nor was the sceptre promise. However both were racial; the birthright to Joseph, the sceptre to Judah.

Both (and all) fulfilled in and bequeathed to Christ.

2 Corinthians 1
20 For all the promises of God in him are yea, and in him Amen, unto the glory of God by us.

Hebrews 1
1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
 
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jgr

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The Arabs are not counted as Abrahams seed in regard to the promises. Paul makes this clear.

Where?

In Christ, they are. (Galatians 3:29)
 
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Copperhead

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Well it still remains, and I have not seen a serious rebuttal that would convince me different, that the modern state of Israel is indeed a fulfillment based on Ezekiel 4, Leviticus 26 and some other minor passages.

There was 430 cumulative years of punishment assigned to the Hebrew people for the number of sabbatical years that were not observed as per Ezekiel 4.

70 of those years ticked off in the Babylonian Exile, leaving 360 years remaining. But when the Hebrew people were granted the right of return to the Land, most of them remained in Babylon which was an act of profaning the name of the Lord as per Ezekiel 36.

Since they remained in rebellion after being punished for 70 years in Babylon, Leviticus 26 says that if they remained in rebellion after being punished, their punishment would be magnified 7 times.

7 x the remaining 360 years is 2520 years. 2520 years multiplied by the Hebrew Lunar 360 day calendar is 907,200 days. 907,200 days divided by our 365.25 day Solar calendar is 2483.8 years.

The decree of Cyrus for the Hebrew people to return was in roughly the late summer of 537BC, which equates to -536.4 for math purposes.

-536.4 plus 2483.8 years is 1947.4. There is no "zero" year between BC and AD, so we must add 1 year to the calculation. That makes the year 1948.4 or darn close to May 14, 1948 when the modern state of Israel was established.

The eliminates any ambiguity for me regarding the modern state of Israel. It is following basic rules of hermeneutics on the scripture and applying it using basic grade school math. I don't even have to play the game of who is a true Jew / Israelite and other ideas designed to derail the discussion, or how it all came about thru intrigue and other conspiratorial hocus pocus.
 
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Lulav

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Many whom Paul spoke to were circumcised Jews entering the New Covenant where circumcision no longer applied. Those who did not join in became gentiles by default, after Jesus abolished circumcision.
Circumcision is a perpetual covenant, it was not abolished.
How do you become a Gentile by default? :scratch:

"Those who did not join in became gentiles by default"

It's unfortunate that people think the founding of the secular, anti-Christian state of Israel has anything to do with God or His promises.
It's unfortunate that there are those in these times still thinking that G-d had no part in the bringing back of His people to His land.

I see nothing in the Bible where Jews would continue to be God's chosen, simply on account of their birth regardless of their rejection of Christ due to that the Bible plainly states that those who deny the Son are of the devil. Are we to suggest that rejection of Christ is only a damnable offense if committed by a non-Jew?
And yet after millennia of attacks and pograms, and 'final solutions' to get rid of the Jews they still exist, not something you can say about many if any ancient nations. They exist in their Jewish state as a living sign of God.

This new theology replacing historical theology regarding what is disparagingly called "replacement theology" is especially popular among Messianic Jews and Dispensationalists. It is clearly, however, a false teaching. It seems to be heavily based on a literalist reading of the book of Ezekiel regarding the building of the Third Temple. Since Jesus' sacrifice not only replaced animal sacrifice but the Law itself, there is no reason to build a literal third temple and hold animal sacrifices there. Such a thing is to legitimize the rejection of Christ as the Sacrificial Lamb.
Replacement theology is a false teaching in that it exists but is not Biblical.
Jesus did not replace the Law.
All sacrifices were not for atonement.


A New Covenant was predicted:

Jeremiah 31:31-

'"The days are coming,' declares the LORD, 'when I will make a new covenant with the people of Israel and with the people of Judah. It will not be like the covenant I made with their ancestors when I took them by the hand to lead them out of Egypt, because they broke my covenant, though I was a husband to them,' declares the LORD. 'This is the covenant I will make with the people of Israel after that time,' declares the LORD. 'I will put my law in their minds and write it on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people.'"​

God did not save all Jews, but a remnant He chose by grace. That remnant are believers in the Messiah. Romans 11:1-36
Have you ever noticed that prophecy speaks of making the New Covenant with the same people He made the 'Old Covenant' with?

Israel and Judah

There is no difference between Jew and Gentile : "For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him" - Romans 10:12

He also said there was no difference between slave and free and men and woman, but he must have been speaking of something specific because we know that there are differences.

Sadly, I've come across not only bad arguments for rejecting "replacement theology," but ones that antisemite bait while doing so, such as here. Jews are called, like everyone else, but they do not get special seats at the table regardless of their rejection of Christ simply because they have a Jewish mother.

When do you think Revelation 7 will happen? Sounds like all tribal Israel here

I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea, 3Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.

144,000 Sealed

4And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.

5Of the tribe of Juda were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Reuben were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Gad were sealed twelve thousand. 6Of the tribe of Aser were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Nepthalim were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Manasses were sealed twelve thousand. 7Of the tribe of Simeon were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Levi were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Issachar were sealed twelve thousand. 8Of the tribe of Zabulon were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Joseph were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Benjamin were sealed twelve thousand.​




I'm wondering how you rationalize the idea that a country founded explicitly by a group of anti-Christian, anti-Christ, Jesus-rejecting secular leftists is a special place in God's eyes. Not only do they reject Christ, but Christian churches continue to be vandalized by Jews and Christian pilgrims harassed. It seems you're taking a few Bible verses out of context and placing people on a pedestal due to their ethnicity.

Have you not heard that God uses all things to His purpose?

The OT and NT both state that the behavior of Jews regarding their acceptance or rejection of God is directly related to their continuing to be His people and allowed to live on that land.

there is a time and a purpose for everything under heaven. Who are we to say how or when God will do something. But be assured that if He said he will bring them back and replant them in His land it will be done no matter what Gentiles protest.

But actually it has to do with keeping Gods commandments, the very ones you say are done away with.
 
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Dave L

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Jesus can and will remove His Bride (The Church)
at any moment where we (believers since Pentacost until present, dead in Christ first) meet Him in the air/clouds.
But , His Second Coming where He sets foot on the earth (mount of Olives) will happen after the removal of the Church and after the 7 year tribulation.
It happens on the last day. There is no 7 year tribulation (Dispie false prophecy). It will be as in the days of Noah when Jesus returns.
 
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Dave L

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That is your opinion in regards to Dispensationalism.
Replacement Theology is a FALSE TEACHING.
Obviously. Well should be obvious , but apparently not .
And there will definitely be a Third Temple.
There is no such thing as Replacement Theology. It is a Dispie straw man aimed at the unstudied.
 
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Dave L

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These passages have serious impact on how we interpret 1948;

“And the uncircumcised man child whose flesh of his foreskin is not circumcised, that soul shall be cut off from his people; he hath broken my covenant.” (Genesis 17:14)

“Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, That I will make a new covenant With the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers In the day that I took them by the hand To bring them out of the land of Egypt; Which my covenant they brake, Although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:” (Jeremiah 31:31–32)

“And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;” (Colossians 2:13–14)

“Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage. Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.” (Galatians 5:1–2)

“For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.” (Galatians 5:3–4)
 
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ItIsFinished!

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It happens on the last day. There is no 7 year tribulation (Dispie false prophecy). It will be as in the days of Noah when Jesus returns.
Actually there will be a 7 year tribulation.
That is a prophecy that has been yet to be fulfilled.
Christ Second Coming will be at the end of the 7 year tribulation and before the literal 1,000 year reign of Christ.
 
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Dave L

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Actually there will be a 7 year tribulation.
That is a prophecy that has been yet to be fulfilled.
Christ Second Coming will be at the end of the 7 year tribulation and before the literal 1,000 year reign of Christ.
This is all Dispensational false prophecy. It will be as in Noah's day (like now) when Jesus returns.
 
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Douggg

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Yup,

And that blood is Jewish blood! :)
And Jesus was a Jew, even by Judaism standards by his mother being a Jew.
 
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Dave L

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Yup,

And that blood is Jewish blood! :)
“And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;” (Acts 17:26)

“He that is born in thy house, and he that is bought with thy money, must needs be circumcised: and my covenant shall be in your flesh for an everlasting covenant. And the uncircumcised man child whose flesh of his foreskin is not circumcised, that soul shall be cut off from his people; he hath broken my covenant.” (Genesis 17:13–14)
 
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This is all Dispensational false prophecy. It will be as in Noah's day (like now) when Jesus returns.
It isn't Dispensational false prophecy at all.
What is false is Replacement Theology/ Supersessionism.
I agree that when Jesus Second Coming occurs it will be like the days of Noah, but we are not presently there YET, but will be during the end of the 7 year tribulation which the Anti-Christ rules during those hellish years.
 
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Dave L

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It isn't Dispensational false prophecy at all.
What is false is Replacement Theology/ Supersessionism.
I agree that when Jesus Second Coming occurs it will be like the days of Noah, but we are not presently there YET, but will be during the end of the 7 year tribulation which the Anti-Christ rules during those hellish years.
Everything you mention is part of the Dispie false prophecy scheme.
 
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Everything you mention is part of the Dispie false prophecy scheme.
Not false, not a scheme.
However Replacement Theology/ Supersessionism is false .
Dave, do you believe the Church replaced Israel?
 
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