Abortion: The Real Reason Why States are Passing Laws Against It

zephcom · May 23, 2019

WherevertheWindblows said:
There are Atheists against abortion, how would that fit into this religious dogma engraved in American law?

You mean the two or three who are Closet Christians???

One can't excuse the mob because there are two or three in the crowd who agrees with them.

Shiloh Raven · May 23, 2019

WherevertheWindblows said:
There are Atheists against abortion, how would that fit into this religious dogma engraved in American law?

And there are also liberals like me who oppose abortion too.

(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ) · May 23, 2019

Shiloh Raven said:
I consider you a friend, Usincognito, and with that in mind, I would like to share my opinion with you on the abortion issue. I don't support abortion. I literally can't as a mother of nine children and as a social justice and political activist. I've dedicated almost thirty years of my life to being a voice for the marginalized, the helpless and the vulnerable. And in my heart, that is what unborn children are.

And for me personally, opposing abortion, even ending legalized abortion, isn't about punishing the women who have had abortion. It's about saving the lives of the unborn. It's about being their voice and defending their life. I've defended the lives and the rights of Native Americans, other minorities, LGBT, the poor, the disabled, single mothers, battered women, women's rights to be treated equally to men, orphans, and abused children. I wouldn't be morally consistent if I didn't defend the lives of the unborn too. I want to help women who feel they have no other choice than to abort their unborn child. And I have done that in the past. I don't want to hurt or punish anyone for their choices. I just want to help people and I've spent the majority of my life doing that.

You know. Because of our talks, I have had serious discussion with my wife about starting an organization dedicated to supporting the single mothers who's child was conceived as a result of rape. I think it is fair that if a raped woman must carry their baby to term that there should be people willing to help them care for their child or help them find loving parents who would adopt the child.

bekkilyn · May 23, 2019

thecolorsblend said:
At some point, society really needs to recognize that single motherhood is an objectively bad thing with objectively bad results. The social safety net can be expanded as wide as the liberals want and the results won't change.

One reason I support ending abortion nationwide is precisely because women just might have to think twice about being physical with men whom they don't like. If Planned Parenthood and the nanny state aren't there to bail these women out of their bad decisions, who knows? They just might make better decisions.

I very much doubt it.

But we can hope.

What a terrible thing to say, but at least someone is actually being honest that this issue really isn't about life, but about punishment, power, and control over women.

zephcom · May 23, 2019

Shiloh Raven said:
I consider you a friend, Usincognito, and with that in mind, I would like to share my opinion with you on the abortion issue. I don't support abortion. I literally can't as a mother of nine children and as a social justice and political activist. I've dedicated almost thirty years of my life to being a voice for the marginalized, the helpless and the vulnerable. And in my heart, that is what unborn children are.

And for me personally, opposing abortion, even ending legalized abortion, isn't about punishing the women who have had abortion. It's about saving the lives of the unborn. It's about being their voice and defending their life. I've defended the lives and the rights of Native Americans, other minorities, LGBT, the poor, the disabled, single mothers, battered women, women's rights to be treated equally to men, orphans, and abused children. I wouldn't be morally consistent if I didn't defend the lives of the unborn too. I want to help women who feel they have no other choice than to abort their unborn child. And I have done that in the past. I don't want to hurt or punish anyone for their choices. I just want to help people and I've spent the majority of my life doing that. I can't turn my back on unborn children.

I don't completely disagree with you. -I- think women desperately need support and help when they find themselves in that situation. I think the entire bunch of people who dislike abortion HAVE to get together and solve the issues which make a woman consider an abortion.

I don't think making a criminal out a woman is going help her in any way whatsoever. If she STILL thinks abortion is her best or only option, she will just break the law and hope she doesn't get caught. And she will end up in a back alley somewhere where her danger level goes off the scale.

Desperate people will take desperate measures. Surely you know that to be true.

Shiloh Raven · May 23, 2019

No Username Found said:
You know. Because of our talks, I have had serious discussion with my wife about starting an organization dedicated to supporting the single mothers who's child was conceived as a result of rape. I think it is fair that if a raped woman must carry their baby to term that there should be people willing to help them care for their child or help them find loving parents who would adopt the child.

I think that's absolutely wonderful, my friend. May God bless your compassionate endeavor.

Pommer · May 23, 2019

zephcom said:
What if the REAL reason they are trying to legally end abortions is really about simply getting their religious dogma engraved in American law?

Welcome to reality!

Pommer · May 23, 2019

thecolorsblend said:
If Planned Parenthood and the nanny state aren't there to bail these women out of their bad decisions, who knows? They just might make better decisions.

Are you unaware of human-history?

WherevertheWindblows · May 23, 2019

zephcom said:
You mean the two or three who are Closet Christians???

One can't excuse the mob because there are two or three in the crowd who agrees with them.

No, I mean Atheists who deny Christ (like the ones in the video)

since you stated

" What if conservatives really don't give a rat's behind about giving women a reason not to abort? What if the REAL reason they are trying to legally end abortions is really about simply getting their religious dogma engraved in American law?

You are making it about getting religious dogma into American law. There are Atheists who believe that the child is a life and are against murdering it. Thats what I am pointing out, not everyone is religious, or needs to be to be against taking a life.

USincognito · May 23, 2019

No Username Found said:
And that is exactly why the Governor of Alabama, who is a woman, signed the bill into law?

Maybe you should take that up with the person I quoted.

Sketcher · May 23, 2019

zephcom said:
Unborn lives matter???? I will believe that when conservatives take the same stance on 'born lives'. When Christians refuse to join the military, campaign to end capital punishment and demand Flint, Michigan fix their water system THEN maybe that claim will pass muster.

I do take that same stance on born lives. Of every color.

zephcom said:
When Christians refuse to join the military

I did.

zephcom said:
campaign to end capital punishment

My state doesn't have the death penalty, no need. Also, equating the death penalty to abortion is a false equivalence.

zephcom said:
demand Flint, Michigan fix their water system

They do need to replace the pipes, but it's a massive undertaking. I'm not in a position to influence their local politicians as I am not a Flint resident.

I do not wish to talk about what I have personally done for Flint, but I will say that many churches with many pro-life conservatives in those churches sent water when the news broke about the lead.

WherevertheWindblows · May 23, 2019

Shiloh Raven said:
And there are also liberals like me who oppose abortion too.

I believe there are people on the right and left against it, just as there are believers and atheists.

USincognito · May 23, 2019

Shiloh Raven said:
I consider you a friend, Usincognito, and with that in mind, I would like to share my opinion with you on the abortion issue. I don't support abortion. I literally can't as a mother of nine children and as a social justice and political activist. I've dedicated almost thirty years of my life to being a voice for the marginalized, the helpless and the vulnerable. And in my heart, that is what unborn children are.

And for me personally, opposing abortion, even ending legalized abortion, isn't about punishing the women who have had abortion. It's about saving the lives of the unborn. It's about being their voice and defending their life. I've defended the lives and the rights of Native Americans, other minorities, LGBT, the poor, the disabled, single mothers, battered women, women's rights to be treated equally to men, orphans, and abused children. I wouldn't be morally consistent if I didn't defend the lives of the unborn too. I want to help women who feel they have no other choice than to abort their unborn child. And I have done that in the past. I don't want to hurt or punish anyone for their choices. I just want to help people and I've spent the majority of my life doing that. I can't turn my back on unborn children.

I am 100% with you on your rationale for being anti-abortion and I support you having that position. My response was directed at those who blame women for having dirty, dirty sex and getting pregnant with the many strange men they have dirty, dirty sex with.

They don't seem to know that a large percentage of women who seek abortions are married.

zephcom · May 23, 2019

WherevertheWindblows said:
No, I mean Atheists who deny Christ (like the ones in the video)

since you stated

You are making it about getting religious dogma into American law. There are Atheists who believe that the child is a life and are against murdering it. Thats what I am pointing out, not everyone is religious, or needs to be to be against taking a life.

And I just don't think there are enough of them in any of the states passing these laws to change the outcome. This STILL has the fingerprints of religious dogma being enshrined in law even if you can find a handful of non-religious people who might agree with this particular dogma.

It doesn't change the fact that this being driven by the religious right.

(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ) · May 23, 2019

USincognito said:
Maybe you should take that up with the person I quoted.

@thecolorsblend what do you think in regards to post #30?

Shiloh Raven · May 23, 2019

thecolorsblend said:
At some point, society really needs to recognize that single motherhood is an objectively bad thing with objectively bad results. The social safety net can be expanded as wide as the liberals want and the results won't change.

One reason I support ending abortion nationwide is precisely because women just might have to think twice about being physical with men whom they don't like. If Planned Parenthood and the nanny state aren't there to bail these women out of their bad decisions, who knows? They just might make better decisions.

And how does an attitude like that show other people the love of God? How does the mercy and love of God fit into an attitude like that? What about the personal witness for the Gospel? What about having compassion for people who are in trouble and are suffering? What about helping people who need it because they find themselves in a very difficult situation in their life? What about caring for people that you don't even know? Personally speaking, my heart breaks when I see another person hurting and suffering, even if that hurt and suffering was the result of a bad decision they made.

ChicanaRose · May 23, 2019

thecolorsblend said:
At some point, society really needs to recognize that single motherhood is an objectively bad thing with objectively bad results. The social safety net can be expanded as wide as the liberals want and the results won't change.

One reason I support ending abortion nationwide is precisely because women just might have to think twice about being physical with men whom they don't like. If Planned Parenthood and the nanny state aren't there to bail these women out of their bad decisions, who knows? They just might make better decisions.

So you are pro-life for the sake of "teaching 'em a lesson"?

zephcom · May 23, 2019

Sketcher said:
I do take that same stance on born lives. Of every color.

I did.

My state doesn't have the death penalty, no need. Also, equating the death penalty to abortion is a false equivalence.

They do need to replace the pipes, but it's a massive undertaking. I'm not in a position to influence their local politicians as I am not a Flint resident.

I do not wish to talk about what I have personally done for Flint, but I will say that many churches with many pro-life conservatives in those churches sent water when the news broke about the lead.

I truly do appreciate what you have done for human lives. And if you were the only person in this country who is Christian you would make my comments completely wrong. But let's face it, Christians flock to the military in such quantities the religion even sends preachers to the military to preach to them. I doubt those preachers are telling them to respect all lives and don't kill people.

And there are a LOT of Christians who do live in states with capital punishment. In fact, I think I just read that Alabama just executed another person.

I point out that, in general, human life is not precious to Christians. They just don't seem to have the passion for keeping people alive that they do for getting them alive.

Shiloh Raven · May 23, 2019

zephcom said:
I point out that, in general, human life is not precious to Christians. They just don't seem to have the passion for keeping people alive that they do for getting them alive.

I think that's a very sad Christian witness for you to see and I'm truly sorry.

WherevertheWindblows · May 23, 2019

zephcom said:
And I just don't think there are enough of them in any of the states passing these laws to change the outcome. This STILL has the fingerprints of religious dogma being enshrined in law even if you can find a handful of non-religious people who might agree with this particular dogma.

It doesn't change the fact that this being driven by the religious right.

To be for the life of a child? For not desiring to kill or to finance the destruction of your children? Its just being for something, for you and for yours. Just for the rights of a human child with a heart beat to live.

Who wants their fingerprints all over someones death?

Abortion: The Real Reason Why States are Passing Laws Against It

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