Threatening Iran Today

Ana the Ist

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Well, he's certainly wrong if he thinks the tactics which failed him in North Korea are going to work in Iran... especially if one considers that everyone saw him fail in North Korea... including Iran.

What is the tactic you're referring to? Threatening military action?

To point out that it didn't work out in the case of N Korea ...and then claim it can't possibly work anywhere else...is the same as saying threats of military action don't work.

Which is the exact same flawed thinking I was talking about.

Noting that nobody was allegedly "begging" for help until after Donald's policies were enacted. Could it be a response to his own incompetence?

It could be that you have no clue what you're talking about. It's the same problem that's been steadily growing for years. What policies are you referring to?

Moreover, if there was some policy responsible (and there clearly isn't) why would that justify silence or disbelief from the left?

Does Donald get an "attaboy" for being right about a "crisis" that he either he caused or made worse?

Lol what fantasy world are you living in??? What policy could possibly cause a hundred thousand people to cross the border and request asylum?

The only thing to blame are those unwilling to address the problem, those pretending it's not happening, and those who simply don't care. I don't see anyone on the left even talking about it.

Indeed... everyone will blame the left...

If they aren't now....they definitely should. The only things I've heard from the left are AOC's racist suggestion that immigration laws shouldn't apply to latinos (a racial open border) and assorted leftist politicians trying to cripple or outright destroy ICE and their ability to arrest and deport illegals.

It's as if they don't care....or want this to continue.
 
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Aryeh Jay

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Right! They shot off some fireworks in the Green Zone the other day.

Iraq truly loves its liberator; why else would they build the largest US embassy in the world.
 
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TLK Valentine

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What is the tactic you're referring to? Threatening military action?

To point out that it didn't work out in the case of N Korea ...and then claim it can't possibly work anywhere else...is the same as saying threats of military action don't work.

Perhaps it's the same to you, but the rest of know that when the entire world watches you slink away after your bluff is called, making the exact same bluff a little while later isn't going to inspire fear.

Plus, the rest of us know that this is Iran we're talking about... a nation where apocalyptic rhetoric from world leaders (their own directed at others, and others directed towards theirs) means... it must be Tuesday.

Their government hasn't been cowed into submission by credible threats in the past. If Donald barely impresses us, do you think he's going to scare them?

Which is the exact same flawed thinking I was talking about.

The flawed thinking here is your own, if you think that anyone is saying threats of military action never work.

Threats of military action must be used sparingly, proportionally, and most importantly, must occasionally be followed up with actual military action.

A competent leader can make military threats work. We've already agreed that Donald is not one of these.


Donald howls empty threats continually like the bully he is... and always against those he sees as weaker than himself, like the bully he is, but like any other bully, when faced with actual adversity, backs down... like the coward every bully is.



It could be that you have no clue what you're talking about.

I'd say we've debunked that possibility.
 
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TLK Valentine

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Every time I ask Iraqis how they feel about America and out Elected Leader Donald J. Trump, they all gather around, smile and give a hearty thumbs up. They love us I tell you.

Are you sure those are thumbs?
 
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SarahsKnight

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Two months? Think two hours. Just chuck a few nukes on the cities and the country will be gone, and there will be no negative repercussions!

On the world stage? Nah! Never!

.....

(Keeping your sarcasm going, mind you.)
 
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Ana the Ist

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Perhaps it's the same to you, but the rest of know that when the entire world watches you slink away after your bluff is called, making the exact same bluff a little while later isn't going to inspire fear.

Plus, the rest of us know that this is Iran we're talking about... a nation where apocalyptic rhetoric from world leaders (their own directed at others, and others directed towards theirs) means... it must be Tuesday.

Their government hasn't been cowed into submission by credible threats in the past. If Donald barely impresses us, do you think he's going to scare them?

Let's pretend for a moment that you're right....

What's the appropriate response to this situation then?


The flawed thinking here is your own, if you think that anyone is saying threats of military action never work.

When is it appropriate then?

Threats of military action must be used sparingly, proportionally, and most importantly, must occasionally be followed up with actual military action.

Well if you genuinely intend to use force in the immediate future....it would seem that warning your enemy first would be a mistake.

The threat is used to avoid military action.

I'd say we've debunked that possibility.

Who is "we"?? Did some other poster back up your claims with some facts?

I didn't see it....maybe you/they forgot to press "post reply".
 
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TLK Valentine

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Let's pretend for a moment that you're right....

What's the appropriate response to this situation then?

Something too long to fit our president's Twitter attention span... but that's not the point.

One doesn't need a great idea to recognize a bad one. Other people know that, too.

When is it appropriate then?

See above, and do try to stay on topic.

Well if you genuinely intend to use force in the immediate future....it would seem that warning your enemy first would be a mistake.


Indeed it usually is... such as during the Vietnam War, when the US would telegraph their imminent landings by first softening up the target area with artillery.

Nevertheless, other people know that continual empty threats of violence accomplish less than nothing. Alas, Donald has little else to work with but his bluster and his cowardice.

The threat is used to avoid military action.

And the threat is empty. Donald doesn't have the spine to use military action.

Who is "we"?? Did some other poster back up your claims with some facts?

I didn't see it....maybe you/they forgot to press "post reply".

No, you replied just fine... you've been most helpful whether you realize it or not.
 
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grandvizier1006

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I doubt it will happen. Remember how we were going to have a war with North Korea? We didn't. Trump just likes to make threats. It's some kind of alpha male psychology I personally don't understand, but I don't really care.
 
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TLK Valentine

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I doubt it will happen. Remember how we were going to have a war with North Korea? We didn't. Trump just likes to make threats. It's some kind of alpha male psychology I personally don't understand, but I don't really care.

It's actually quite easy to understand. A bully makes threats against those he thinks can't/won't fight back, and then backs down if they do... because when you scratch the surface of a bully, you always find a coward underneath.
 
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SarahsKnight

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Trump just likes to make threats. It's some kind of alpha male psychology I personally don't understand, but I don't really care.

That may be true. However I'd much rather him not say anything at all, taking even the 1 in a thousand chance of ticking another country off and getting missiles launched.
 
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Ana the Ist

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Something too long to fit our president's Twitter attention span... but that's not the point.

One doesn't need a great idea to recognize a bad one. Other people know that, too.

We aren't talking about ideas, so much as responses.

If you don't know the correct one, how do you know this one is wrong?


See above, and do try to stay on topic.

I am on topic.

Indeed it usually is... such as during the Vietnam War, when the US would telegraph their imminent landings by first softening up the target area with artillery.

Nevertheless, other people know that continual empty threats of violence accomplish less than nothing. Alas, Donald has little else to work with but his bluster and his cowardice.

Not sure what you mean by this....you think conflict with Iran cannot happen?


And the threat is empty. Donald doesn't have the spine to use military action.

Thanks for weighing in.

No, you replied just fine... you've been most helpful whether you realize it or not.

It's always a pleasure to educate you TLK.
 
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Zoii

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As a country thats an ally - who would you worry about more - a country that has invaded no-one......or a country that since WWII has bombed
  • China 1945-46
  • Korea 1950-53
  • China 1950-53
  • Guatemala 1954
  • Indonesia 1958
  • Cuba 1959-60
  • Guatemala 1960
  • Belgian Congo 1964
  • Guatemala 1964
  • Dominican Republic 1965-66
  • Peru 1965
  • Laos 1964-73
  • Vietnam 1961-73
  • Cambodia 1969-70
  • Guatemala 1967-69
  • Lebanon 1982-84
  • Grenada 1983-84
  • Libya 1986
  • El Salvador 1981-92
  • Nicaragua 1981-90
  • Iran 1987-88
  • Libya 1989
  • Panama 1989-90
  • Iraq 1991
  • Kuwait 1991
  • Somalia 1992-94
  • Bosnia 1995
  • Iran 1998
  • Sudan 1998
  • Afghanistan 1998
  • Yugoslavia – Serbia 1999
  • Afghanistan 2001
  • Iraq 2003
  • Libya 2011
  • Pakistan 2012
  • Syria 2015
and is the only nation to use a nuclear weapon on a civilian population - twice; and has used more chemical weapons on civilian and military personnel, than the rest of the world combined.
 
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TLK Valentine

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We aren't talking about ideas, so much as responses.

If you don't know the correct one, how do you know this one is wrong?

You truly don't know the answer to this, do you?

Let me try to give you an example -- I don't need to know who the 14th vice president of the U.S. was in order to know that it wasn't George Clooney.

But if you insist on an idea (those do seem to be in short supply) I'd say that since Iran was abusing by the Nuclear Deal, and since withdrawing it and replacing it with... nothing... was a stupid idea, I'd say reinstating it would be a good move... The stock is an empty threat; the carrot was actually working.

The catch, of course, is that since Donald's word is worthless, it'll have to be his successor who does it.

What to do in the meantime is the $64,000 question...

I am on topic.

I'm sure you think so.

Not sure what you mean by this....you think conflict with Iran cannot happen?

Not sure how you got that... Almost positive the explanation will be amusing.

Thanks for weighing in.

Feel free to do likewise.


It's always a pleasure to educate you TLK.

Always a pleasure to attempt to do likewise. What's life without challenge?
 
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Ana the Ist

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You truly don't know the answer to this, do you?

Feel free to explain.

Let me try to give you an example -- I don't need to know who the 14th vice president of the U.S. was in order to know that it wasn't George Clooney.

Oh....I see the problem. You think your opinions are objective facts. I'm sorry, but that's simply not the case.....

You see, there's a between being mistaken about the factual events in the past....and what the correct course of action is now.

If Iran is sabotaging boats and suddenly shifting it's missiles into dangerous positions....there's multiple ways to handle that. Some methods are going to be better than others, some worse.....but that analysis is the sort of thing that's better done with more information than we presently have.

So again, opinions are fun....but yours doesn't seem very informed.

But if you insist on an idea (those do seem to be in short supply) I'd say that since Iran was abusing by the Nuclear Deal, and since withdrawing it and replacing it with... nothing... was a stupid idea, I'd say reinstating it would be a good move... The stock is an empty threat; the carrot was actually working.

The catch, of course, is that since Donald's word is worthless, it'll have to be his successor who does it.

Are we talking about the same thing here?

What 2 senators took away from intelligence briefing on Iran

"Today's briefing comes at the end of a dramatic few weeks. On May the 5th, after the administration said it received intelligence of a — quote — "imminent attack" on U.S. forces and allies, National Security Adviser John Bolton released a statement promising any Iranian attack would be met with — quote — "unrelenting force."

Now....as of yet, no attack from Iran. Were they just posturing? Was it bad intelligence?

Or did Iran call it off because we told them we see what they're doing and we'll make them pay dearly for it?

Time will tell.


Feel free to do likewise.

Ok, since you asked me so nicely....

You're the president and after allied boats have been sabotaged and your enemy is shuffling missiles around like it's 3-card monte....you get a report that the same enemy is planning a large surprise attack on you and your allies.

You're response to this is "Hey, maybe I should call them up and talk about how we can get a plan in place to let them get some nukes?"

And you're asking me to weigh in on that lol?

I think your plan would just encourage bolder and more violent behavior from your enemy.
 
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TLK Valentine

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Feel free to explain.

I've tried my best.

Oh....I see the problem.

Not yet, it would seem.

You think your opinions are objective facts. I'm sorry, but that's simply not the case.....

No, but I'm certainly not going to accept yours as such.




If Iran is sabotaging boats and suddenly shifting it's missiles into dangerous positions....there's multiple ways to handle that. Some methods are going to be better than others, some worse.....but that analysis is the sort of thing that's better done with more information than we presently have.

And this has what to do with Donald's posturing and empty threats?

Are we talking about the same thing here?

Not for some time now, which is why I suggested that you stay on topic.

What 2 senators took away from intelligence briefing on Iran

"Today's briefing comes at the end of a dramatic few weeks. On May the 5th, after the administration said it received intelligence of a — quote — "imminent attack" on U.S. forces and allies, National Security Adviser John Bolton released a statement promising any Iranian attack would be met with — quote — "unrelenting force."

Now....as of yet, no attack from Iran. Were they just posturing? Was it bad intelligence?

Donald tends not to act on intelligence, so what does it matter?

Or did Iran call it off because we told them we see what they're doing and we'll make them pay dearly for it?

Call what off? The threat that Donald's people tell you he just heroically rescued us from?

Time will tell.

Those who don't learn from history tend to repeat it... and Donald never learns.



Ok, since you asked me so nicely....

You're the president and after allied boats have been sabotaged and your enemy is shuffling missiles around like it's 3-card monte....you get a report that the same enemy is planning a large surprise attack on you and your allies.

You allegedly get a report...

You're response to this is "Hey, maybe I should call them up and talk about how we can get a plan in place to let them get some nukes?"

And you're asking me to weigh in on that lol?

I'm asking you to pay attention. I already told you Donald shouldn't do that anyway because his word is garbage.

I think your plan would just encourage bolder and more violent behavior from your enemy.

Your opinion is noted. But it doesn't seem very informed.

But while I hope we can agree that the Nuear deal never should have been rescinded, you are correct that any attempt to reinstate the deal would be unwise. The damage Donald has done to US credibility is, in this case at least, irreversible.
 
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KCfromNC

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The only thing I feel I can predict about him is the likelihood that he will spew profoundly stupid, insulting, and disrespectful things on Twitter at basically anyone or everyone as the mood strikes him.

Don't forget all the lying.
 
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