How is one saved?

MDC

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What about the fact God knows all. How is it still a choice
God knows all things simply because God has decreed all that comes to pass. Isaiah 46: 9-11. Mans will isn’t free. Mans desires dictate his actions and choices. But nothing moves outside Gods decrees and Sovereignty. Sinful men are in bondage to their sinful nature. You cannot choose what you desire. But you can make choices according to what you desire. And if one desires to be saved while being convicted of his sin while trusting and laying hold upon Christ, then you know it has been given to him by Gods grace freely via regeneration.
 
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dqhall

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Do we choice to be saved or is it already given? I mean God knows all is there a point? Than again John 3:16 is who ever believe in Jesus. Wouldn't that mean we have a choice? Even God tried to warn us of our actions. He didn't create us to love us automatically but to pick or is free will a lie?
People who welcome Christ have a better chance of getting saved than those who do not. If everything was known before the foundation of the universe, there would have been no improvement. In fact people have been learning as time goes on. We have much better technology than my grandparents' generation. I believe it was brought forth by God after the foundation of the world.

John 1:9 (World English Bible - Public Domain)
The true Light who gives light to every man was coming into the world. 10 He was in the world, and though the world was made through Him, the world did not recognize Him. 11 He came to His own, and His own did not receive Him. 12 But to all who did receive Him, to those who believed in His name, He gave the right to become children of God — 13 children born not of blood, nor of the desire or will of man, but born of God.
 
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Toro

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Do we choice to be saved or is it already given? I mean God knows all is there a point? Than again John 3:16 is who ever believe in Jesus. Wouldn't that mean we have a choice? Even God tried to warn us of our actions. He didn't create us to love us automatically but to pick or is free will a lie?
It is both, already given and it is choice.

Just because we have choice and God knows all that will be saved and belong to him does not nullify the other.

In fact it is Gods "fairness" and just nature that allows us free will and choice. For how can we be guilty of that which we never got a chance to do otherwise?

Like minority report.. it's not justice to punish someone before a law is broken. Even if you know what they will choose.

You could say that God could alter things for people that wouldnt otherwise choose Christ.... but I do not believe it is that simple.

God was willing and DID give His only begotten son for the sake of the world. IF giving someone that winning lotto number or anything else that people might pray for in order to "turn to God and believe." If it would be a legitimate turn to God I have no doubt that He would do it. After all, the Lord hung on a cross and suffered separation from the Father to turn people to God, I dou t that "granting a wish" would be too much.

The problem with that is, IF someone is only willing to turn to the Lord IF they get a desire or wish, they have shown their heart places that wish ABOVE God and the "turn to God" is not genuine, so their "salvation" would not be real.... so youd reach the same outcome.

Yes, John 3:16 says "those who believe in Him" but the demons known as legion ALSO believe in Him and yet do we believe that they were let into the Kingdom after being sent into the pigs ?

Believe can be a shallow meaning or a deep meaning. Shallow meaning being that like legion you believe He exists. Deeper meaning being, you believe that He IS the savior AND in that belief heed His words and DO as He says you are to do.

If you believe your boss has the authority to fire you, do you do your job or do you do nothing not believing he has the authority to fire you? You can say you believe in your boss, but how much you believe in his authority of beingyour boss is going to decide how you behave/react to him as such.
 
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Blade

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As the word says.. the sweet sweet Holy Spirit is the only way anyone come to Christ. It was it is always will be He that found us. When I was young I asked Him.. how can you send all these people to hell? And what does not happen ALL the time.. oh I wish it did.. He came right back with.. for God so loved the world.. everyone gets a choice.

Creation its self is the biggest sign? That GOD is real. More like a slap in the face lol.
 
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Calvin_1985

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Do we choice to be saved or is it already given? I mean God knows all is there a point? Than again John 3:16 is who ever believe in Jesus. Wouldn't that mean we have a choice? Even God tried to warn us of our actions. He didn't create us to love us automatically but to pick or is free will a lie?
We all have a choice.
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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What about the fact God knows all. How is it still a choice
Parents often know what their children are going to do, even if it is something that hurts,
and still let them do what hurts (i.e. to learn from experience). Both the parents and the children make their own choices.
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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The Bible says both of these are true:
1. God determined who would be chosen before the creation of the world. (anti-free will)
2. We will be held responsible for our choices. (pro-free will)

no, that is not anti-free will. God let people with their free will choose,
and knowing already what they would choose,
God let them hurt (even &*d&mn*& (condemn)) themselves.

His Judgment is always Perfect, Absolutely Righteous, without any sin and without any error.
 
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Peter J Barban

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no, that is not anti-free will. God let people with their free will choose,
and knowing already what they would choose,
God let them hurt (even &*d&mn*& (condemn)) themselves.

His Judgment is always Perfect, Absolutely Righteous, without any sin and without any error.
No one would choose God if God did not enable them. The natural man will always run away/rebel from God. We see that from the beginning with Adam and Eve.
If left to our free choice, we would all go to eternal torment.
 
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Gregory Thompson

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Do we choice to be saved or is it already given? I mean God knows all is there a point? Than again John 3:16 is who ever believe in Jesus. Wouldn't that mean we have a choice? Even God tried to warn us of our actions. He didn't create us to love us automatically but to pick or is free will a lie?
In the gospel of John salvation is likened to childbirth, so simplifying in western terminology (i.e. using the english language) is probably not possible.
 
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JLB777

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Do we choice to be saved or is it already given? I mean God knows all is there a point? Than again John 3:16 is who ever believe in Jesus. Wouldn't that mean we have a choice? Even God tried to warn us of our actions. He didn't create us to love us automatically but to pick or is free will a lie?


Everyone must choose to obey the Gospel in order to be saved, born again, regenerated.


Since you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit in sincere love of the brethren, love one another fervently with a pure heart, having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever,
1 Peter 1:22-23


He gives us grace, the power to obey, but it is us who must obey the Gospel. God does not obey it on our behalf.





We must continue to obey Hs commandments and doctrine to remain saved; ie “in Him”.



If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned. John 15:6


Here’s how we remain, or abide “in Him”.



Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us. 1 John 3:24



JLB
 
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WESTOZZIE

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Because God is LOVE......If you have children or even if you do not, you are still someone's child...We may know what is the right path for our child....we have far more experience than they do....do we then force the child to go down the path we know is best for them? Would that be Love?
Love(God) is always setting the other person free from Himself. Love is not self centered. Love is always for the other person...always laying down it's own desires and wishes for the other person. Because God is Love it is not in Him to force anyone to believe in Jesus. To do so is not love.
As someone said above -The Prodigal son is a good example to think on. Luke 15.
The Father in the story(God) did not stop the son from claiming his inheritance early, and spending it all on wasteful things. He most likely knew that his son would blow it all....but he did not intervene at all. He knew the son must learn some important things.
So that son eventually hits rock bottom and comes to his senses. He chooses to come home to Father. The circumstances helped him make the choice....and his memory of kindness shown in his father's house also helped his choice. The Father was waiting patiently...hoping against hope that his errant son would repent....and he did repent.
But in the case of a sinner wandering around in life without God...
Jesus is drawing all people to Himself. John 12:32
The word translated drawing...is helkuo in Greek. It actually means draw by inward power....and it has the meaning of a stronger one drawing a weaker one. It is also used in the passage at the end of John, when Peter dragged the net of 153 large fish to shore. Peter helkuo the fish to shore.
The fish could not resist because Peter and the net were stronger than they were.

You may think I am contradicting what I said about God not forcing anyone.
God is drawing all to Jesus.....but they/we still choose to give Jesus permission to come into our heart.
Many times God drew me...I was confronted over and over for about 10 years by different Christians...but each time I rejected their Jesus.
Then finally when I hit rock bottom, I found myself calling upon Jesus to save me.
Did God know all that I would choose to do? Yes of course. But He still gave me the freedom to choose Him.
Hebrews tells us in Chapter 3...when you hear His voice DO NOT HARDEN YOUR HEARTS....
This clearly shows that there is a choice....If there was no choice....then God is not Love....and He could not accept any worship from those who had no choice in the matter. He would be like a Tyrant who deludes himself into thinking his loyal subjects adore him...when they only do so out of fear for their lives if they don't...like in North Korea.
I have fled that god years ago and am not going back.
 
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Saint JOHN

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37 ¶ Now when they heard [this], they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men [and] brethren, what shall we do?
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, [even] as many as the Lord our God shall call.

and when you receive ,so as to become a true believer.....

16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
18 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

so you can tell religious types from real believers.
 
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