Do not condemn others.

Robert65 said:

Do not condemn others. I hear this a lot from Christians. So does this mean that Christians cannot condemn a politician for immoral behavior?

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It doesn't matter whether or not Christians condemn, what matters is whether God condemns the action. (Side note: God both qualifies as and defines what is good.)

Robert65 said:

If not then then what motivation is there for the sinner to change?

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The motivation to change is never because Christians don't like what you're doing. It ought to be because you know God is not being worshiped in your life as he ought to be.

Robert65 said:

But if God does not exist then it is a solitary self appraisal witch is biased and convenient.

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That's a possible reality. But you do realize you're saying that sexual immorality is not wrong? In order to think about this fairly think about your spouse doing that to you. Is it immoral then?

Robert65 said:

Do not condemn others. I hear this a lot from Christians. So does this mean that Christians cannot condemn a politician for immoral behavior?

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I think Christians can correct others for immoral behavior without condemning the person, with love and support and an attitude of “there but for the grace of God go I”.

I like the CS Lewis quote “Think of me as a fellow patient in the same hospital who, having been admitted a little earlier could give some advice.”

Robert65 said:

Do not condemn others. I hear this a lot from Christians. So does this mean that Christians cannot condemn a politician for immoral behavior? If not then then what motivation is there for the sinner to change? I spent enough years in the religion to know that peer-pressure, condemnation and shaming exists, and I think there is a positive function in this. When a Christian (or anyone) is engaged in immorality with reckless abandon, peer-pressure, condemnation and shaming are useful tools to motivate change in the sinner. Without the aforementioned tools all we are left with is tolerance of and a likely continuation of sin aka immorality. If we rely upon God to judge then that assumes that God exists. But if God does not exist then it is a solitary self appraisal witch is biased and convenient.

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Hi, Robert,

God, as the supreme authority, is the only one qualified to condemn people. Jesus said, "Don't fear those who kill the body but are not able to kill the soul; rather, fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell." (Mt. 10:28)

John 3:18 says, "Anyone who believes in Him [Jesus Christ] is not condemned, but anyone who does not believe is already condemned, because he has not believed in the name of the One and Only Son of God."

So, those who believe in Jesus Christ as their Savior, as evidenced by our works (i.e. behavior), are no longer condemned. We receive the perfect righteousness of Christ and will be judged according to His righteousness.

I pray that you will receive Jesus as your Savior! I can't imagine trying to make it through this life without His love.

Robert65 said:

Do not condemn others. I hear this a lot from Christians. So does this mean that Christians cannot condemn a politician for immoral behavior? If not then then what motivation is there for the sinner to change? I spent enough years in the religion to know that peer-pressure, condemnation and shaming exists, and I think there is a positive function in this. When a Christian (or anyone) is engaged in immorality with reckless abandon, peer-pressure, condemnation and shaming are useful tools to motivate change in the sinner. Without the aforementioned tools all we are left with is tolerance of and a likely continuation of sin aka immorality. If we rely upon God to judge then that assumes that God exists. But if God does not exist then it is a solitary self appraisal witch is biased and convenient.

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There is confusion about the word "judgement" in the Bible, but it actually speaks about 2 different kinds of judgement. One is the Judgement seat of God (which Christians are not to do, we are not to condemn anyone) and the other judgement that is used for discerning and helping a brother/sister in Christ who's gone or going astray from faith in God.

Christians are to mirror what Jesus did for us, to extend the invitation of grace which is His Word, the Gospels of Jesus Christ.

There are situations where we should judge others. One of them obviously is when we decide who to vote for on Election Day. So go ahead and condemn politicans all you want if they deserve it.

I think it is that we ought not to condemn the person, because we don't know what is in their hearts - that is between them and God; He is their judge, not us. There is plenty of talk throughout Scripture however, about correcting wrong behavior in others. The correction ought to be done in love, not anger or self-righteousness. It ought not to be hypocritical. It ought first to be done privately, between you and the other person...if they do not take it to heart, then a couple other brothers ought to be brought in...if they still do not take it to heart, it ought to be brought to the Church.

I'm not one of the Christians that says that. Condemning others, as Jesus demonstrated, has a time and a place. What I am not saying is that condemning others should be something we should be quick to do.

“Paisios” said:

I think Christians can correct others for immoral behavior without condemning the person, with love and support and an attitude of “there but for the grace of God go I”.

I like the CS Lewis quote “Think of me as a fellow patient in the same hospital who, having been admitted a little earlier could give some advice.”

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The Bible says to tell them to repent and if they don't take them to the church and then if they don't kick them out of the church.
M-Bob

Robert65 said:

Sadly I have met many Christians who do condemn. If more did as you say then my view of the religion would be much more positive.

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From what I've seen the figure is probably less than 5%.

If one studies the Bible they don't do that.

Question how many are good?
Answer none.


M-Bob

Robert65 said:

I give a pass to those new to the religion, but when I see people who are decades in I am not so tolerant of their hypocrisy.

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Maybe just a little judgmental there?
M-Bob

Robert65 said:

Sadly I have met many Christians who do condemn. If more did as you say then my view of the religion would be much more positive.

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I understand and agree with you! But please don't reject the love of Jesus Christ because His followers don't get it. I pray that you will find His love, which is worth more than all the gold in the world! Knowing Him is what makes my life worth living.

Robert65 said:

Yet it is humans that interpret the alleged word of God thus the lack of universal agreement within Christianity.

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I disagree, I think we're pretty unanimous on what sexual immorality is as defined by Scripture.

Robert65 said:

Which again is highly subjective and not universally agreed upon by all Christians.

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Again, I disagree. If a Christian tells you that you obey because the church tells you to rather than because God tells you to then I would argue that there is an obsession with religion rather than a strong relationship with God there.

Robert65 said:

So you believe that it is a possible reality that God doesn't exist?

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If you can find the body of Jesus, yeah. Your argument has some weight there then.

Robert65 said:

No, I am saying immorality is subjective and not universally agreed upon by all Christians let alone all humanity.

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Well what does that mean? That means that all morality is nothing but cultural preferences. And then, how can you say that honor killings in the religion of Islam are wrong? 'Cause that's just a cultural practice.

Robert65 said:

My moral code is based on the avoidance of harm. If it is harmful then I do not do it and if I do then I am being immoral.

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Okay, how selfish are you with that? Is it about you avoiding harm, or you helping others avoid harm, or both?

Mountainmanbob said:

The Bible says to tell them to repent and if they don't take them to the church and then if they don't kick them out of the church.
M-Bob

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Yes, but the manner in which this is done is important.

It's not our place to act as the judge of our neighbor, as though they are somehow subject to our judgment, as though we had some kind of authority over them.

But calling out evil as evil, to speak of injustice, or to address toxic, abusive, caustic, and otherwise harmful actions, behaviors, and words is, in some way, necessary. If I see my neighbor being beaten by a robber, standing idly by and not trying to stop the violence from happening is an act of cruelty itself. And if I stand there and say, "Who am I to say that such violence is a problem?" I am an absolute fool who refuses to see the damage, harm, and destruction caused upon others.

This boils down to whether or not we are speaking truth to power or if we are simply trying to be powerful ourselves. Are we seeking our own glory by pretending like we have no sin and that our neighbor is somehow subject to us? Or are we being a people mindful of justice, mercy, compassion, and love, especially for the least of these?

-CryptoLutheran