Do the “dead say Yes?”

justbyfaith · May 10, 2019

yeshuaslavejeff said:
few are saved.

Few find salvation through their own searching.

However, in the last days, 144,000 Jewish people from every tribe except Dan (12 tribes) will evangelize the world; and scripture declares that those who are saved will be "a multitude that no one can number." (Revelation 7).

bling · May 10, 2019

yeshuaslavejeff said:
No where is it written that he was starving, is it ?
Most people on earth do not starve, yet they all need to turn to Yahuweh to be saved, no matter what their life and physical conditions, right ?

Luke 15: 16 He longed to fill his stomach with the pods that the pigs were eating, but no one gave him anything. And later he said: Luke 15: 17…here I am starving to death .

The physical hurting of the prodigal son can describe the hurting everyone experiences sometime in their life, because of hurting others in the past (sinning).

yeshuaslavejeff · May 10, 2019

bling said:
The physical hurting of the prodigal son can describe the hurting everyone experiences sometime in their life, because of hurting others in the past (sinning).

What does this mean, or where does it come from ?

The prodigal hurt himself, not others, right ? (not counting if you mean his father's feelings/ heart broken)

bling · May 11, 2019

yeshuaslavejeff said:
What does this mean, or where does it come from ?

The prodigal hurt himself, not others, right ? (not counting if you mean his father's feelings/ heart broken)

He hurt the father big time and was extremely selfish which hurts all he could have helped.

Gregory Thompson · May 11, 2019

redleghunter said:
“that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;”
ROMANS 10:9 NASB

I was curious, the people born without the ability to speak, how does this apply to them?

redleghunter · May 11, 2019

Michael Collum said:
I was curious, the people born without the ability to speak, how does this apply to them?

Salvation is always by Grace.

bcbsr · May 11, 2019

redleghunter said:
Refer to the OP passage from Ephesians chapter 2. It says God "made us alive together with Christ..."

The dead don't initiate. They are dead.

It could be likewise argued that the dead don't sin. How far do you want to take the analogy. And that's the problem in basing doctrine solely on a metaphor. It comes down to arguing about nuances of interpretation.

Do you interpret Ephesians to mean that there are unbelievers who are "alive in Christ"? If they belong to Christ then they must have the Holy Spirit (Rom 8:9). And according to Col 2:13 are you saying these unbelievers already have their sins forgiven as is the case for those "alive in Christ"?

Apparently you seem to be saying that people are saved apart from faith in Christ. To you do they become "alive in Christ" prior to even hearing the gospel?

Acts 16:30,31 The jailor asked "What must I do to be saved?" Was he "alive in Christ" at the time. If so, then apparently he was already saved.

So what's the application of your interpretation?

redleghunter · May 11, 2019

bcbsr said:
It could be likewise argued that the dead don't sin. How far do you want to take the analogy.

It’s not an analogy. It’s Ephesians 2.

Please read it again. The spiritually dead do indeed sin:

Ephesians 2: NASB
1And you were dead in your trespasses and sins, 2in which you formerly walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, of the spirit that is now working in the sons of disobedience.3Among them we too all formerly lived in the lusts of our flesh, indulging the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, even as the rest. 4But God, being rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, 5even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), 6and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, 7so that in the ages to come He might show the surpassing riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. 8For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; 9not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.

redleghunter · May 11, 2019

bcbsr said:
Apparently you seem to be saying that people are saved apart from faith in Christ.

Apparently I neither said nor implied such a thing.

The spiritually dead cannot exercise faith.

bcbsr · May 11, 2019

redleghunter said:
Apparently I neither said nor implied such a thing.

The spiritually dead cannot exercise faith.

Yes you did. If the spiritually dead cannot exercise faith, then it logically follows they must "alive in Christ" before they can exercise faith. I merely pointed out the implications of that theory, which don't appear to fit with scripture.

redleghunter · May 11, 2019

bcbsr said:
Yes you did. If the spiritually dead cannot exercise faith, then it logically follows they must "alive in Christ" before they can exercise faith. I merely pointed out the implications of that theory, which don't appear to fit with scripture.

Check out Ephesians 2:1-10

Paul actually lays out the order of things.

Gregory Thompson · May 11, 2019

redleghunter said:
Salvation is always by Grace.

exactly

yeshuaslavejeff · May 13, 2019

redleghunter said:
Apparently I neither said nor implied such a thing.

The spiritually dead cannot exercise faith.

They often do "exercise faith .

Every time they trust and go to a doctor and do what he says, they are exercising faith

in someone other than Yahuweh (God) and instead of Jesus.

p.s. btw, Scripture says that Yahuweh(God) curses everyone who trusts in man (flesh). (even believers)

Rick Otto · May 23, 2019

justbyfaith said:
We have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, Romans 5:2.

Since we are made alive in Christ by the grace of God; and salvation is by grace through faith: I would say that faith is the catalyst for entering into grace; and therefore faith must always come first. It is the key to the door by which we enter into the place of blessing that is called grace. And of course, Jesus is the door.

If we enter in by Him, we shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture, John 10:9.

This idea that grace comes before faith is contrary to proper evangelism.

The sinner can say, grace comes first; therefore I do not even need faith: it is unnecessary for my salvation since I can have grace apart from faith: if grace comes before faith.

Therefore the doorway by which we enter in to salvation is deterred from; the person is told that God will arbitrarily save them by His predetermined choice and that faith is not a factor in this.

Again, if grace comes before faith in salvation, then faith isn't necessary; a person can have grace apart from faith.

Grace apart from faith is like rain that falls on the crops of the wicked. It's called providence.

But salvation is the result of faith that wouldn't exist if not for grace. (

salvation is

by grace

through

faith

Rick Otto · May 23, 2019

Phil W said:
It's done when we are "baptized in the name of Jesus Christ" for the remission of past sins.
Baptism is where our old man is killed and the new creature is reborn of God's seed.

Since baptism leaves us spotless, shouldn't we wait until we are about to die like Constantine did, so we die with clean souls?

Phil W · May 23, 2019

Rick Otto said:
Since baptism leaves us spotless, shouldn't we wait until we are about to die like Constantine did, so we die with clean souls?

Why waste ones entire life in rebellion to God by waiting to be free from sin in the last hour or day?
Do you really think God would honor such a conniving way of life?
I don't.
Think of all the opportunities you will have missed to glorify the creator of the universe.
Real love starts the moment you feel gratitude for...everything!

Do the “dead say Yes?”

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