Flat Earth - It's NOT Ridiculous

d taylor said:

I am not a scientist and i do not have a theory about rain, hail, etc.. really i do not need one.
What i believe is stated by the Bible. The Bible states that God somewhere has hail stored away for times of war. theses hail stones were used in the past and will be used in the future.
And as for the jars, there is nowhere in the Bible where the Bible states, rain comes from jars.


The Bible does state rain comes from clouds and also the sky.
"He wraps up the waters in His clouds, And the cloud does not burst under them.
Then he prayed again, and the sky poured rain and the earth produced its fruit.

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The Bible is not enough on its own since there are countless different interpretations Of course you do realize that there are immense problems if you interpret the Bible literally. Tell me, can God lie?

Kaon said:

What's not true?

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It is not true that pilots can't tell the layperson everything they see, and it is not true that astronauts need top secret clearance.

d taylor said:

Show me in the Bible where rain is stated to be coming from jars.
Do you believe there are large hail stones up in heaven.

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I already did. Job 38:37.

Strathos said:

I already did. Job 38:37.

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Want to show me in that verse where this poring out is associated with rain or that is where rain comes from.

You do realize that when God flooded the earth, part of the water came form the windows of heaven.
Of course you probably do not believe the flood happened either.

d taylor said:

Want to show me in that verse where this poring out is associated with rain or that is where rain comes from.

You do realize that when God flooded the earth, part of the water came form the windows of heaven.
Of course you probably do not believe the flood happened either.

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Read it in context. God is asking Job if he can "pour out the bottles of heaven", i.e. make it rain. The fact that the verse talks about clouds right before this just emphasizes the point that the "bottles of heaven" are a metaphor for the source of rain from clouds.

Strathos said:

Read it in context. God is asking Job if he can "pour out the bottles of heaven", i.e. make it rain. The fact that the verse talks about clouds right before this just emphasizes the point that the "bottles of heaven" are a metaphor for the source of rain from clouds.

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So you are adding in the make it rain.
The verse nowhere indicates that pouring out the Jars of heaven is the same as where rain comes from.
But even so God does not need clouds for rain since above the raqia is a large body of water, and as the Bible says jars of heaven. I am sure the earth was not covered solid with clouds when He cause the earth to flood like Genesis states the windows were opened.

So there is another word windows, they were open and released water to flood the earth.
Again i have no problem with the Bible and what the Bible says and i will believe the Bibles accounts over any sinful human being.

Actually, a flat earth has some real advantages! Just ask your land surveyor. For trigonometric calculations there is just nothing better than a perfectly flat earth. It's only when you start throwing in an ellipse for a model and a lumpy old geoid that he has to mess with matrix algeba. How would you like to try and make a flat map with those kinds of variables? It's like trying to get an orange peel to lay flat.

Coady said:

Actually, a flat earth has some real advantages! Just ask your land surveyor. For trigonometric calculations there is just nothing better than a perfectly flat earth. It's only when you start throwing in an ellipse for a model and a lumpy old geoid that he has to mess with matrix algeba. How would you like to try and make a flat map with those kinds of variables? It's like trying to get an orange peel to lay flat.

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Hmm, never thought of that. Of course one would still have to use a polar coordinate system since most flat Earth believers demand that the Earth is a disc. It would be simpler yet if they believed it was a rectangle. Think of the advantages. A Mercator projection would be accurate!

There must be wild distort south of the equator (I almost said hemisphere).

Zetetica said:

Okay... Why do YOU believe Earth is a sphere?

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Because I have seen how the horizon extends as one climbs a hill or mountain.

Because I have watched eclipses of the Moon and seen that the edge of the Earth's shadow is curved.

Because I have travelled to the southern hemisphere and seen stars that are never visible from Britain.

Zetetica said:

... and so I come to where I now exit this debate...

There are good reasons to accept that the world is as we are told. However, there are also good reasons to accept that it's not. For me, I am now in a place of humility. I don't know and you know what else? I'm okay with not knowing. I've spent my entire life, seeking to know this or to know that. I even ventured far into the occult in pursuit of knowing.

Finally, after over 9 months of researching FE, God set my head right. I have come to understand that life isn't all about knowing or not knowing, it's about having faith and walking in spirit.

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Is it really humble to declare that you know better than everyone who has seen for themselves that the earth is round?

Subduction Zone said:

Hmm, never thought of that. Of course one would still have to use a polar coordinate system since most flat Earth believers demand that the Earth is a disc. It would be simpler yet if they believed it was a rectangle. Think of the advantages. A Mercator projection would be accurate!

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Surely any bible-believing Flerfer must demand some sort of quadrilateral. That's the only way you can have 4 corners of the Earth.

Bungle_Bear said:

Surely any bible-believing Flerfer must demand some sort of quadrilateral. That's the only way you can have 4 corners of the Earth.

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That is good to hear. No more complex math is needed to make maps any more. Not even polar coordinates. Those rely on an ungodly value for pi anyway. So with pi equal to three and a rectilinear mapping system we can get rid of surveyors forever.

Zetetica said:

I have come to understand that life isn't all about knowing or not knowing, it's about having faith and walking in spirit.

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"I am against religion because it teaches us to be satisfied with not understanding the world." ~ Richard Dawkins

I mean, Eratosthenes showed that the Earth wasn't flat more than 2,000 years ago so...it kind of is ridiculous

Zetetica said:

... and so I come to where I now exit this debate...

There are good reasons to accept that the world is as we are told. However, there are also good reasons to accept that it's not. For me, I am now in a place of humility. I don't know and you know what else? I'm okay with not knowing. I've spent my entire life, seeking to know this or to know that. I even ventured far into the occult in pursuit of knowing.

Finally, after over 9 months of researching FE, God set my head right. I have come to understand that life isn't all about knowing or not knowing, it's about having faith and walking in spirit.

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Before you leave would you please summarize in brief points what those good reasons are for accepting that the world is not "as we are told" which I interpret as meaning nearly spherical.


Thanks.

Zetetica said:

No, I’m done. There are plenty of books and videos and other resources for those interested in an alternative model of the world. FE isn’t the only competing model either. Enjoy.

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Books!? Really? Videos, yes, those are a dime a dozen. And they tend to make me laugh at the terrible ignorance of the creators of those videos. Almost all of those can be refuted by Desertphile's Gravity Rant. Due to just a touch, not excessive, of "foul language" I will not link it here, but if you search YouTube for it you should have no trouble finding it.

TBDude65 said:

I mean, Eratosthenes showed that the Earth wasn't flat more than 2,000 years ago so...it kind of is ridiculous

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That's not correct.
Eratosthenes used the conclusion of other, earlier natural philisophers. Several had already concluded that the earth was spherical, like Thales, Platon or Aristotle. Others, like Aristarchon had derived methods to conclude the vast distance of the celestial objects.
Eratosthenes took these positions and established a method to calculate the radius of this spherical earth with a distant sun. His method relied on these earlier conclusions, and, if these were wrong - if the earth was flat and the sun close - his method would not work.

This doesn't lessen the scope of his experiment though. He achived a very good result, and the premises of his experiment can be confirmed by other means.

A method to calculate the radius of the earth that used the spherical form was invented by the persian mathematician Al-Biruni in the 11th century CE. He used the horizon drop at different elevations to calculate the radius.