Same-Sex Attraction And The Church

Introverted1293

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You will get different responses to this question depending on the method of exegesis used in interpreting the Bible.

As a Christian who seeks to understand the meaning of the scriptures through the lens of tradition, reason and experience, and a qualified nurse who agrees with the consensus of opinion in medical literature, I believe sexual orientation is for the most part fixed and unchangeable. I believe it is part of who they are. Therefore I am of the view that same sex attraction in itself is not sinful.

I also concur with the medical view that attempts to change sexual orientation can cause tremendous harm to the person involved.

With regard to practising homosexuality, I am very aware of the scriptures that appear to state that same sex activity is sinful and naturally this will cause people to be cautious when approaching the subject. These texts have given rise to a series of different interpretations, and if I am being honest I do not have the answer to this one.

Some Christians choose the path of celibacy and it is by no means an easy path to take. Humans are sexual beings and have an innate need for companionship, intimate relationships and expressing their love both physically and emotionally. Therefore I take very strong issue with people who state "well that's ok, be celibate" unless that is a path they have dared to venture themselves. I commend anyone who choses to remain celebate and would always support them if that is the path they feel they are being led to take. It is a path I have chosen myself for the same reason as you and it is not an easy one. It requires the renunciation of a way of life which others take seemingly for granted.

The bottom line is I do not believe homosexual inclinations or feelings to be sinful. Homosexual practice, that is acting on these feelings, is an area which theologically I do not have an answer. Even if it is a sin, I believe that Christ is a lot kinder to sinners than some of his followers.

Thank you very much. That was very helpful.
 
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Introverted1293

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No, not really. Let me ask you this: Is it kinder, more gracious and loving, for a doctor to tell his patient that he has cancer, or not? Is his patient really helped if the doctor says nothing to him about his disease? His patient won't feel the fear, and sorrow, and stress of knowing he is deathly ill. But his cancer will kill him, if he remains ignorant to his problem and does nothing about it. So, which is, ultimately, the better thing to do? Tell the patient the hard, scary truth or let him go on, blissfully ignorant, to an early grave?

My concern is that some on this thread think the diagnosis of sin is too harsh and unpleasant and would rather pretend it won't produce the death God promises in His word that it will. No, they'd rather virtue signal and make out like homosexuality isn't sin - even using vague scientific research to justify doing so - than speak the difficult but necessary truth.

Having a sinful impulse or attraction isn't itself a wicked thing. It is how you respond to it that may or may not be sinful. Fantasizing about homosexual relations, encouraging the homosexual impulse or attraction in any way, is sin.

Every Christian is commanded by God to take every thought captive and bring each one into obedience to Christ. You are not your own, the apostle Paul wrote, you have been bought with a price; therefore glorify God in your body and spirit which are His. Doing so begins by keeping careful watch and control over your thought life. Bring your thoughts into conformity to God's truth, not the World's.

See Philippians 4:8.

Praying for you!

Thank you very much.

To be perfectly honest I don't understand scientific research and all of that.
 
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Watchmanwoman

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Thank you for adding which were some of you. You spoke the truth as well as Grace. Some, not all, Christians will point out the fact that practicing homosexuals cannot enter the kingdom of heaven, which is true, but a lot of times they fail to point out that it says which were some of you. So, thank you for that.

I want to be one of those people that's completely cleansed from my sin.

And thank you for not making me feel like I'm the worst sinner for struggling with a different kind of sin that most people struggle with. God bless

I am afraid to ask this question, for I am afraid that it's going to lead to a fight. But are you concerned because you feel that people are saying that my attraction is okay as long as I don't act on it? I don't know if that's what they are saying. But is that your concern?

Because my fear is that just having homosexual tendencies is sinful as well. But I am unsure if it is or not. I don't fully know the mind of God.
No it's not ok to even have thoughts of homosexuality..those thoughts come from the demonic spirits and as Christian's we r to cast down every thought that does not line up with God's word..the Lord tells us in phillippians 4:8 what we r to think on that will give u a guideline of what is Godly and ungodly thoughts.

Our thoughts r important let me give u an example: I can be out shopping and all the sudden I am thinking about shrimp, coleslaw and french fries I can imagine how good they will taste and the next thing u know
Thank you for adding which were some of you. You spoke the truth as well as Grace. Some, not all, Christians will point out the fact that practicing homosexuals cannot enter the kingdom of heaven, which is true, but a lot of times they fail to point out that it says which were some of you. So, thank you for that.

I want to be one of those people that's completely cleansed from my sin.

And thank you for not making me feel like I'm the worst sinner for struggling with a different kind of sin that most people struggle with. God bless

I am afraid to ask this question, for I am afraid that it's going to lead to a fight. But are you concerned because you feel that people are saying that my attraction is okay as long as I don't act on it? I don't know if that's what they are saying. But is that your concern?

Because my fear is that just having homosexual tendencies is sinful as well. But I am unsure if it is or not. I don't fully know the mind of God.
 
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Watchmanwoman

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Thank you for adding which were some of you. You spoke the truth as well as Grace. Some, not all, Christians will point out the fact that practicing homosexuals cannot enter the kingdom of heaven, which is true, but a lot of times they fail to point out that it says which were some of you. So, thank you for that.

I want to be one of those people that's completely cleansed from my sin.

And thank you for not making me feel like I'm the worst sinner for struggling with a different kind of sin that most people struggle with. God bless

I am afraid to ask this question, for I am afraid that it's going to lead to a fight. But are you concerned because you feel that people are saying that my attraction is okay as long as I don't act on it? I don't know if that's what they are saying. But is that your concern?

Because my fear is that just having homosexual tendencies is sinful as well. But I am unsure if it is or not. I don't fully know the mind of God.
 
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Watchmanwoman

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Our thoughts do matter and we can either think evil thoughts or Godly thoughts..the Lord tells us to cast down every thiu
Thank you for adding which were some of you. You spoke the truth as well as Grace. Some, not all, Christians will point out the fact that practicing homosexuals cannot enter the kingdom of heaven, which is true, but a lot of times they fail to point out that it says which were some of you. So, thank you for that.

I want to be one of those people that's completely cleansed from my sin.

And thank you for not making me feel like I'm the worst sinner for struggling with a different kind of sin that most people struggle with. God bless

I am afraid to ask this question, for I am afraid that it's going to lead to a fight. But are you concerned because you feel that people are saying that my attraction is okay as long as I don't act on it? I don't know if that's what they are saying. But is that your concern?

Because my fear is that just having homosexual tendencies is sinful as well. But I am unsure if it is or not. I don't fully know the mind of God.

In my reply above I posted that God sees all of our thoughts, so we are to be mindful of what we are thinking. If thoughts come into our minds that are against Gods word we are to cast them down and repent of them if we had started meditating on them. The Lord tells is in Phillippians 4:8 what thoughts we are to think about. So if a thought comes into your mind that is the opposite of these then we are to cast them down.

On thoughts and how they can become actions I'll give you a real live example in my own life: Recently I was in town shopping and I was getting hungry, all of the sudden I remembered about a restaurant that has a great shrimp meal, with coleslaw, fries and a drink. I could see it in my mind and almost taste it. I immediately thought well I may have a coupon for this and then it was do I have enough cash or do I need to use my cc? The next thing you know I am driving to that restaurant and ordering that shrimp meal. All of this came from 1 thought planted in my mind and with pictures and then was reminded of how good it would taste, the next thing was I planned out how I could obtain that shrimp meal.

Our thoughts soon become actions this is why the Lord has said in Hebrews to cast down thoughts and imaginations that come against the word of God. We can't allow our minds to become the devils play ground because then actions will be sure to follow.

When I stopped smoking and drinking 23 years ago, cigs went on sale and I was even sent a free coupon in the mail for a whole carton now that never happened while I had been smoking.. Then my favorite beer of choice was put on a big display in the store I always shopped. I had to literally run from the temptations. I'd go around the aisles and never in them and it took years before I could actually see a cig advertised before I could actually look at it and not be tempted. But notice it's been 23 years.. We can say NO and we can run from temptation. We have to fight the temptations that the enemy plants in our thoughts because he knows if he can get you meditating on it the deeds will follow.

So NO it's not okay to meditate on a homosexual relationship, you must cast down those thoughts and repent and run from them.

My advise, is to repent to Jesus get your heart right, get in the word of God so you will not sin against yourself, God or others. It is possible to live a sin free life, but it takes work because your in a spiritual war for your soul. But Jesus will help you if you will ask!
 
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Introverted1293

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Our thoughts do matter and we can either think evil thoughts or Godly thoughts..the Lord tells us to cast down every thiu


In my reply above I posted that God sees all of our thoughts, so we are to be mindful of what we are thinking. If thoughts come into our minds that are against Gods word we are to cast them down and repent of them if we had started meditating on them. The Lord tells is in Phillippians 4:8 what thoughts we are to think about. So if a thought comes into your mind that is the opposite of these then we are to cast them down.

On thoughts and how they can become actions I'll give you a real live example in my own life: Recently I was in town shopping and I was getting hungry, all of the sudden I remembered about a restaurant that has a great shrimp meal, with coleslaw, fries and a drink. I could see it in my mind and almost taste it. I immediately thought well I may have a coupon for this and then it was do I have enough cash or do I need to use my cc? The next thing you know I am driving to that restaurant and ordering that shrimp meal. All of this came from 1 thought planted in my mind and with pictures and then was reminded of how good it would taste, the next thing was I planned out how I could obtain that shrimp meal.

Our thoughts soon become actions this is why the Lord has said in Hebrews to cast down thoughts and imaginations that come against the word of God. We can't allow our minds to become the devils play ground because then actions will be sure to follow.

When I stopped smoking and drinking 23 years ago, cigs went on sale and I was even sent a free coupon in the mail for a whole carton now that never happened while I had been smoking.. Then my favorite beer of choice was put on a big display in the store I always shopped. I had to literally run from the temptations. I'd go around the aisles and never in them and it took years before I could actually see a cig advertised before I could actually look at it and not be tempted. But notice it's been 23 years.. We can say NO and we can run from temptation. We have to fight the temptations that the enemy plants in our thoughts because he knows if he can get you meditating on it the deeds will follow.

So NO it's not okay to meditate on a homosexual relationship, you must cast down those thoughts and repent and run from them.

My advise, is to repent to Jesus get your heart right, get in the word of God so you will not sin against yourself, God or others. It is possible to live a sin free life, but it takes work because your in a spiritual war for your soul. But Jesus will help you if you will ask!

Thank you
 
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aiki

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To be perfectly honest I don't understand scientific research and all of that.

Well, one telling study was with identical twins where, if homosexuality was actually genetic, and genes induced homosexual behaviour as directly as some would have us believe they do, the concordance rate of homosexuality between the twins should have been 100%. If one of a pair of identical twins was homosexual the other - being identical genetically - should also have been homosexual every single time. But the results of the study revealed that less than 50% of the time both twins were homosexual. This seriously confounds the idea that homosexuality is primarily biological. It is a particular social narrative, not science, that is powerfully promoting the idea that homosexuality is genetic and imperative. Behind that narrative, I believe, stands the devil, working as he always is to dissolve and destroy God's creation and holy institutions.
 
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DW1980

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I saw pictures of half and half. yeah, they have rights too.
you have one hermaphrodite and 5,000 gays find lame excuses to pretend like a hermaphrodite.
I have no idea where you get your information. Issues with biological sex (like being a hermaphrodite) are not the same as sexual orientation. Biological sex, gender, and sexual orientation are three totally different things.
 
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DW1980

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Thank you for adding which were some of you. You spoke the truth as well as Grace. Some, not all, Christians will point out the fact that practicing homosexuals cannot enter the kingdom of heaven, which is true, but a lot of times they fail to point out that it says which were some of you. So, thank you for that.

I want to be one of those people that's completely cleansed from my sin.

And thank you for not making me feel like I'm the worst sinner for struggling with a different kind of sin that most people struggle with. God bless

I am afraid to ask this question, for I am afraid that it's going to lead to a fight. But are you concerned because you feel that people are saying that my attraction is okay as long as I don't act on it? I don't know if that's what they are saying. But is that your concern?

Because my fear is that just having homosexual tendencies is sinful as well. But I am unsure if it is or not. I don't fully know the mind of God.

There are a couple of issues here. Firstly there's being gay. That is not a sin. It's firmly rooted in your biological make up, and in that respect, it's no different to your hair or eye colour. Nothing in the Bible suggests that being gay is a sin. The Bible only mentions homosexual behaviour, not orientation. It's not a barrier to faith in Jesus or salvation. In fact in Romans 3:22 (NLT) Paul wrote, "We are made right with God by placing our faith in Jesus Christ. And this is true for everyone who believes, no matter who we are." That includes you.

So, being gay is not a sin, and it's not a sickness. There is nothing wrong with you.

I am afraid to ask this question, for I am afraid that it's going to lead to a fight.
This is the other issue - the question of how you live your life in a way that honours God's will and plan for your life. There are (broadly) two views.
  • Same-sex relationships are sinful, therefore gay men should be single and celibate.
  • The Bible in its original languages and culture only condemns abusive homosexual behaviour. It does not condemn loving faithful same sex relationships. Therefore, same sex relationships are not sinful, and are subject to the same standards as heterosexual relationships.
CF takes the first view and prohibits discussion (promotion) of the second view. This means that although there are faithful, Bible believing Christians on both sides of this debate, on CF you will only get one side of this debate.

Either way, I think we can all agree that being gay isn't a sin. You did not choose it, and you've not done anything to "deserve it". I think we can also all agree that everyone who has offered to pray for you, and encouraged you to follow Jesus has your best interests at heart. Whatever view individuals may take of same sex relationships, we can agree on that.
 
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DW1980

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they do their jobs well. they have no family to return home too.
This is blatantly untrue. You're aware that gay people have families (both by blood and Church families)? With as much kindness as I can, I remind you that the Bible tells us not to bear false witness.
 
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DW1980

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No it's not ok to even have thoughts of homosexuality..those thoughts come from the demonic spirits

I agree that we are to take captive every thought and make it obedient to Christ. However, the view that you stated here (if you'll forgive me for being blunt) is both mentally and spiritually dangerous. Aside from the fact that sexual orientation is rooted in biology, we must recognise that not every thought comes from a demon. We are, by nature sinners. We must therefore be accountable to God for our sin - blaming demonic forces in most cases is an easy cop out that just abdicates responsibility.

The overwhelming majority of gay men want the same thing as heterosexual people: love, companionship, and someone to share life with. The desire for these things is actually built in to who we are, and is from God (see Genesis 2:18). It's not sinful to want to share your life with someone.
 
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tulipbee

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This is blatantly untrue. You're aware that gay people have families (both by blood and Church families)? With as much kindness as I can, I remind you that the Bible tells us not to bear false witness.
I worked with them for 40 years. our marketing collected numbers and found a way to profit off them and we gained. numbers went up. numbers are facts, not false witness. your bible is a closed book to the unregenerates.

"Because of this, God gave them
over to shameful lusts. Even their
women exchanged natural relations
for unnatural ones
. In the same way
the men also abandoned natural
relations with women and were
inflamed with lust for one another.
Men committed indecent acts with
other men, and received in
themselves the due penalty for their
perversion." ( Romans 1:26-27 NIV )
 
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tulipbee

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I have no idea where you get your information. Issues with biological sex (like being a hermaphrodite) are not the same as sexual orientation. Biological sex, gender, and sexual orientation are three totally different things.
the masturbation parties takes their minds off jesus and misses the rapture boat. you being too busy to tell God he is wrong might make you miss the ship.

you don't wanna miss the boat.

""Do not be deceived; neither fornicators,
nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate,
nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the
covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor
swindlers, shall inherit the kingdom of God."
( 1 Corinthians 6:9 NASB )

"Nevertheless, because of sexual immorality,
let each man have his own wife, and let each
woman have her own husband."
( 1 Corinthians 7:2 NKJ )
 
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Anthony2019

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""Do not be deceived; neither fornicators,
nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate,
nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the
covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor
swindlers, shall inherit the kingdom of God."
( 1 Corinthians 6:9 NASB )
The word you have highlighted in bold is translated from the original Greek arsenokoitēs which literally means "men who lay with other men" or "male bedders" It is not referring to people with a homosexual orientation.
 
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samwise gamgee

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tulipbee

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The word you have highlighted in bold is translated from the original Greek arsenokoitēs which literally means "men who lay with other men" or "male bedders" It is not referring to people with a homosexual orientation.
Arsenos means male and koitenmeans bed. Lev 18:22 and 20:13 teach that a man cannot lie (sexual act) with another man as he lies with a woman. The origin of the word arsenokoitesmeans homosexual activity and homosexual. Lev 18:22 and 20:13 prove very clearly that arsenos koitenmeans homosexual sex, because the Jews scribes translated words' arsenos koiten describe men who have sex with other men (homosexuality), which is a sin and against the will of God. Apostle Paul didn't make up the word arsenokoites, but it was already as the concept in the Old Testament, where it meant homosexuality.
 
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tulipbee

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The word of God (Bible) teaches very clearly that those people who live in sinful homosexuality (and unrighteous, adulterers, idolatries and so on) cannot inherit the Kingdom of God, unless if they don't repent their sins and forsake their sins. Arsenokoites means homosexuality Septuagint evidence
 
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