Boy, have we got it wrong.... (What One Things You Would Do To Improve Our Christian Experience

Gideons300 · Apr 22, 2019

1stcenturylady said:
We'll have to agree to disagree, brother. He's talking about national Israel, not the Church.

Like many others, this prophecy is dualistic in nature. As to it being for Israel, if this were teue then the New Covenant would not be ofr is as Gentiles.

Yet if it were for Israel, God tells them that ahe will actually CAUSE them to walk as obedient children. Will He give them a different new covenant than He has given us?
Have we not as the church done far more to discredit His name than the Jews? We cannot cherry-pick the parts of the prophecy that suit us and eliminate others that we say must not apply to us. At least that is what I believe.

As to the rest of my post, can you tell me where the church is that is currently saved, if sin, especially sinning as Paul did in Romans 7, where the desire to stop is there but the ability to follow through is not? Does sin eliminates one from the roll call? All sin? Any sin? One sin?

Many of the elect are asleep right now, and yes, they are in danger, and yes, thwy are living as carnal believers, but will God not rescue His own so that His house will be full?
i believe with all my heart that He will.

blessings,

Gideon

1stcenturylady · Apr 22, 2019

Gideons300 said:
As to the rest of my post, can you tell me where the church is that is currently saved, if sin, especially sinning as Paul did in Romans 7, where the desire to stop is there but the ability to follow through is not? Does sin eliminates one from the roll call? All sin? Any sin? One sin?

Just so you know I will read E 36 again, but I still think it is national Israel. We'll talk about that again, but this below is more important. Please don't read this in a hurry, study it and be sensitive to the Holy Spirit. Context is everything!

Paul was NOT a Christian in Romans 7, that's the point. Read it in context with chapter 8 and you will see that Romans 7 is explaining why the LAW was the ministry of sin and death. Romans 8 shows that the Spirit (which Paul most certainly had) frees us from the law of sin and death. Read Romans chapters 1-8 in one sitting. Paul is talking about the LAW. And then in chapter 6 he shows us that we are not under the law, and we are dead to sin. Is Paul saying he is NOT dead to sin, just all other Christians??? That's looney. Romans 7 vs. 8 is his conclusion to his whole teaching that why, even though the law was holy, it was a weak substitute, because it was trying to be kept with sinful natures. Sin was the real problem, not the law. The Spirit kills our sinful nature and we are no longer in that nature of carnal flesh, but in the Spirit. That is what being born again of the Spirit of Christ is all about. It is why we don't commit willful sin. And if we do commit willful sin, we are still slaves to sin, and do not belong to Christ, because Jesus frees us from sin altogether. Gideon, many get misled in reading Romans 7 because Paul is writing in "first person" as if it his current state. Romans 7:9 says, "I was alive once without the law, but when the commandment came, sin revived and I died." Was Paul there with Moses when God gave the Law to mankind? Just as John used first person in 1 John 1 and many believe verses 6, 8 and 10 are about Christians, NO! It is a Semitic writing style. You must read in context. 1 John 1 must be read in context with chapter 3. Both are contrasts between light and darkness. And Romans 7 and 8 are contrasts between the LAW and the SPIRIT. Here, I'll show you:

Here are some key verses.

I'll repeat, Romans 7:9 I was alive once without the law, but when the commandment came, sin revived and I died. Paul is saying "I", but talking about mankind and God giving the Law through Moses! Was Paul there? It seems so using first person doesn't it. Wrong.

John 8:34-36 34 Jesus answered them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, whoever commits sin is a slave of sin. 35 And a slave does not abide in the house forever, but a son abides forever. 36 Therefore if the Son makes you free, you shall be free indeed. (That is free from sin!)

Romans 7:7-8 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. For I would not have known covetousness unless the law had said, “You shall not covet.” 8 But sin, taking opportunity by the commandment, produced in me all manner of evil desire.

Romans 7:13 Has then what is good become death to me? Certainly not! But sin, that it might appear sin, was producing death in me through what is good, so that sin through the commandment might become exceedingly sinful.

Romans 8:1-9
There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit. 2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death. 3 For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh, 4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

9 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His.

2 Corinthians 3:7-11But if the ministry of death, written and engraved on stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of the glory of his countenance, which glory was passing away, 8 how will the ministry of the Spirit not be more glorious? 9 For if the ministry of condemnation had glory, the ministry of righteousness exceeds much more in glory. 10 For even what was made glorious had no glory in this respect, because of the glory that excels. 11 For if what is passing away was glorious, what remains is much more glorious.

1 John 3:5-9 5 And you know that He was manifested to take away our sins, and in Him there is no sin. 6 Whoever abides in Him does not sin. Whoever sins has neither seen Him nor known Him.

7 Little children, let no one deceive you. He who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous. 8 He who sins is of the devil, for the devil has sinned from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that He might destroy the works of the devil. 9 Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God.

Gideons300 · Apr 24, 2019

1stcenturylady said:
Just so you know I will read E 36 again, but I still think it is national Israel. We'll talk about that again, but this below is more important. Please don't read this in a hurry, study it and be sensitive to the Holy Spirit. Context is everything!

Paul was NOT a Christian in Romans 7, that's the point. Read it in context with chapter 8 and you will see that Romans 7 is explaining why the LAW was the ministry of sin and death. Romans 8 shows that the Spirit (which Paul most certainly had) frees us from the law of sin and death. Read Romans chapters 1-8 in one sitting. Paul is talking about the LAW. And then in chapter 6 he shows us that we are not under the law, and we are dead to sin. Is Paul saying he is NOT dead to sin, just all other Christians??? That's looney. Romans 7 vs. 8 is his conclusion to his whole teaching that why, even though the law was holy, it was a weak substitute, because it was trying to be kept with sinful natures. Sin was the real problem, not the law. The Spirit kills our sinful nature and we are no longer in that nature of carnal flesh, but in the Spirit. That is what being born again of the Spirit of Christ is all about. It is why we don't commit willful sin. And if we do commit willful sin, we are still slaves to sin, and do not belong to Christ, because Jesus frees us from sin altogether. Gideon, many get misled in reading Romans 7 because Paul is writing in "first person" as if it his current state. Romans 7:9 says, "I was alive once without the law, but when the commandment came, sin revived and I died." Was Paul there with Moses when God gave the Law to mankind? Just as John used first person in 1 John 1 and many believe verses 6, 8 and 10 are about Christians, NO! It is a Semitic writing style. You must read in context. 1 John 1 must be read in context with chapter 3. Both are contrasts between light and darkness. And Romans 7 and 8 are contrasts between the LAW and the SPIRIT. Here, I'll show you:

Here are some key verses.

I'll repeat, Romans 7:9 I was alive once without the law, but when the commandment came, sin revived and I died. Paul is saying "I", but talking about mankind and God giving the Law through Moses! Was Paul there? It seems so using first person doesn't it. Wrong.

John 8:34-36 34 Jesus answered them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, whoever commits sin is a slave of sin. 35 And a slave does not abide in the house forever, but a son abides forever. 36 Therefore if the Son makes you free, you shall be free indeed. (That is free from sin!)

Romans 7:7-8 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. For I would not have known covetousness unless the law had said, “You shall not covet.” 8 But sin, taking opportunity by the commandment, produced in me all manner of evil desire.

Romans 7:13 Has then what is good become death to me? Certainly not! But sin, that it might appear sin, was producing death in me through what is good, so that sin through the commandment might become exceedingly sinful.

Romans 8:1-9
There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit. 2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death. 3 For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh, 4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

9 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His.

2 Corinthians 3:7-11But if the ministry of death, written and engraved on stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of the glory of his countenance, which glory was passing away, 8 how will the ministry of the Spirit not be more glorious? 9 For if the ministry of condemnation had glory, the ministry of righteousness exceeds much more in glory. 10 For even what was made glorious had no glory in this respect, because of the glory that excels. 11 For if what is passing away was glorious, what remains is much more glorious.

1 John 3:5-9 5 And you know that He was manifested to take away our sins, and in Him there is no sin. 6 Whoever abides in Him does not sin. Whoever sins has neither seen Him nor known Him.

7 Little children, let no one deceive you. He who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous. 8 He who sins is of the devil, for the devil has sinned from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that He might destroy the works of the devil. 9 Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God.

I am in agreement with this...... but... (Ha, you knew one was coming, didn't you?)..... these truths are not automatic. If they were, there would have been no reason for Paul to write to the Romans to tell them these things. It would have happened to them automatically.

How does it happen? As we hold up our shields of faith and believe that we are new creature, believe that the old us is dead. Believe that we are no longer in the flesh but in the Spirit and owe the flesh NOTHING.

This is our good fight of faith to which every saint has been called. We are to grow in faith, to overcome by faith, to resist the devil by faith, to have Christ abide in our hearts by faith. To what purpose? That we become established in the faith, unshakable.

If these things are automatic as you suggest, a man who sins now has never met Christ. The entire church as we know it is lost, all tares. Is this true? Absolutely not. The truth of the new creature that we are must be believed in order for us to begin bearing fruits. This is why the church is in the mess it is. They are still carnal Christians, but
they ARE Christians. Why? Because they have never been taught the need for faith in the facts that we died when Christ died and we rose again when Jesus rose from the dead.

And because we have not believed it, used it as our shield against the devil's attacks, our heads have embraced the truths, but head knowledge will not set us free. Our hearts must grasp it.

We must realize that ever since the grievous wolves came into the church after Paul's death, we have been robbed of the understanding as to what faith is for. It is not just believing Jesus died and rose again. It is believing that we too have done so!

This is all according to God's plan. A wonderful early rain to get the church strong and with deep roots, followed by 1900 years of small, intermittent showers, just enough to keep the crop alive.

But as the end approaches, a harvest is coming. But for there to be a harvest, there must be workers...... workers walking in the FREE INDEED Jesus promised us, just as the early saints did. That is the purpose of this last awakening.

Both wheat and tares have grown together in what we call church. And both wheat and tares sin, for all are walking in their old nature, and no matter the effort, man in his old nature cannot defeat sin and self.

But there is a huge difference between the wheat and the tares. One has always possessed only an old nature, but the wheat? Here is where it gets awesome. The wheat has been new creatures since the day they were born again. Why are they sinning then? Because they have not mixed the truth with their faith!

And what will change this? Being awakened to the truth of who they are! And what will they do when they are awakened? They will light their lamps! They will combine the blood of the Lamb with the words of their testimony and be changed from overcome to overcomers!

At present, they possess the oil, unlike the tares. But there is no light proceeding from them, no victory over sin and self, because the oil is not yet lit. And what lights it? Our testimony as to who we are... new creatures! Free creatures who owe the flesh nothing.

The tares too will be awakened but will not receive the truth. And their rejection of the truth will be the great falling away spoken of in scripture. Many tell me that they see a great falling away coming but not a great revival. What they miss is that the church being awakened is what causes the great falling away!

Do we honestly think we are ready to meet the Lord? I beg to differ. LOL. We are a visionless, passionless, lukewarm, earthly minded church but much of it is made up of the elect of God regardless. And when they are awakened, and thn light their lamps, they will become the saints they are called to be. The world will be amazed. Heck, WE will be amazed! It is coming, but not one thing is standing in the way of anyone hungry for victory from grabbing hold this very hour.

The key is reckoning that God's truths are OUR truths. Not 'will be'. ARE. We ARE new creatures, this very minute. It is time we believed it, amen?

I hope this clarifies a bit.

blessings,

Gideon

1stcenturylady · Apr 24, 2019

Gideons300 said:
these truths are not automatic. If they were, there would have been no reason for Paul to write to the Romans to tell them these things. It would have happened to them automatically.

To clarify, what part of Romans are you specifying? I certainly hope not Romans 7! If so, you're not in agreement, let alone understand the difference between the LAW and the Spirit at all.

The Spirit is not something we work towards. It is a free gift that is given to us as soon as we fully repent. IT IS AUTOMATIC! It is the promise of ACTS 2:38. The problem with some is they have to work towards repentance. That is our choice - to love sin, or to see ourselves as weak sinners and repent, crying out to Jesus to change us completely. But until they get there and repent, they are NOT born again of the Spirit of Christ, and do NOT belong to Him.

You've got it backwards. We ARE dead to sin, but we have to keep that reality in our minds and not quench the Spirit. It is NOT something you have to build your faith towards receiving - when you receive the gift of the Holy Spirit you ARE dead to sin.

Gideons300 · Apr 25, 2019

1stcenturylady said:
To clarify, what part of Romans are you specifying? I certainly hope not Romans 7! If so, you're not in agreement, let alone understand the difference between the LAW and the Spirit at all.

The Spirit is not something we work towards. It is a free gift that is given to us as soon as we fully repent. IT IS AUTOMATIC! It is the promise of ACTS 2:38. The problem with some is they have to work towards repentance. That is our choice - to love sin, or to see ourselves as weak sinners and repent, crying out to Jesus to change us completely. But until they get there and repent, they are NOT born again of the Spirit of Christ, and do NOT belong to Him.

You've got it backwards. We ARE dead to sin, but we have to keep that reality in our minds and not quench the Spirit. It is NOT something you have to build your faith towards receiving - when you receive the gift of the Holy Spirit you ARE dead to sin.

If what you are saying were true, then pretty much every single soul in church today is lost. What you are misunderstanding is that the elect may have been given new natures but they have yet to put them on by faith.

Thus, the benefits are of no avail to them yet, for possessing them and putting them on by the reckoning of faith are two different things.

blessings,

Gideon

1stcenturylady · Apr 25, 2019

Gideons300 said:
If what you are saying were true, then pretty much every single soul in church today is lost. What you are misunderstanding is that the elect may have been given new natures but they have yet to put them on by faith.

blessings,

Gideon

The truth may either be scary or wonderful. This hasn't been spoken in generations, but I'll believe the word over the twisted, liberal doctrine of the Reformationists, who are sending millions to hell. Why do you think they were called the "dead church" by Jesus, Himself? They taught that 'no sin can separate us from Jesus, so sin boldly. His blood is strong enough to cover it.' That is the opposite of Scripture.

Matthew 7:21-23
21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

Gideon, have you ever seen my teaching on the two types of sin? 1 John 5:16-17. One, a Christian cannot commit with the Holy Spirit inside. The other can be forgiven as long as we forgive each other of the same.

Gideons300 said:
Thus, the benefits are of no avail to them yet, for possessing them and putting them on by the reckoning of faith are two different things.

blessings,

Gideon

Gids, when we are filled with the Spirit after true repentance (the key) you KNOW IT. It is life-changing. Your desire to sin is gone! So it is FACT. Not something you need to get to by faith. After that, you need to keep reckoning yourself dead to sin and not quench the Spirit. There are things that will help, like a change of friends and peers. And doing those things you now love and have an unending thirst for, like studying the Word of God and pressing into Him.

Repentance is the key. Just like in AA, you must first come to recognize that sin is a problem no amount of will-power can fix. The law made us realize "that sin through the commandment might become exceedingly sinful." We can't fix it, but that is BEFORE the SPIRIT. That is the problem of the man in Romans 7 who has the law showing him his sin, but his carnal nature is pulling him - it isn't dead. Romans 8 shows the difference having the Spirit makes. Jesus frees us from ALL sins of lawlessness.

The truth is the narrow road leading to heaven; the Reformation garbage is the wide road leading to hell.

If you still have my testimony, re-read it. If not, ask and I'll resend it to you.

Gideons300 · Apr 25, 2019

1stcenturylady said:
The truth may either be scary or wonderful. This hasn't been spoken in generations, but I'll believe the word over the twisted, liberal doctrine of the Reformationists, who are sending millions to hell. Why do you think they were called the "dead church" by Jesus, Himself? They taught that 'no sin can separate us from Jesus, so sin boldly. His blood is strong enough to cover it.' That is the opposite of Scripture.

Matthew 7:21-23
21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

Gideon, have you ever seen my teaching on the two types of sin? 1 John 5:16-17. One, a Christian cannot commit with the Holy Spirit inside. The other can be forgiven as long as we forgive each other of the same.

Gids, when we are filled with the Spirit after true repentance (the key) you KNOW IT. It is life-changing. Your desire to sin is gone! So it is FACT. Not something you need to get to by faith. After that, you need to keep reckoning yourself dead to sin and not quench the Spirit. There are things that will help, like a change of friends and peers. And doing those things you now love and have an unending thirst for, like studying the Word of God and pressing into Him.

Repentance is the key. Just like in AA, you must first come to recognize that sin is a problem no amount of will-power can fix. The law made us realize "that sin through the commandment might become exceedingly sinful." We can't fix it, but that is BEFORE the SPIRIT. That is the problem of the man in Romans 7 who has the law showing him his sin, but his carnal nature is pulling him - it isn't dead. Romans 8 shows the difference having the Spirit makes. Jesus frees us from ALL sins of lawlessness.

The truth is the narrow road leading to heaven; the Reformation garbage is the wide road leading to hell.

If you still have my testimony, re-read it. If not, ask and I'll resend it to you.

So do you believe that in church today, or here on CF, if someone is not walking in full victory over sin, they are unsaved? Just curious how you fellowship with others if you think they are not brothers and sisters in the Lord.

Blessings,

Gideon

Gideons300 · Apr 25, 2019

1stcenturylady said:
The truth may either be scary or wonderful. This hasn't been spoken in generations, but I'll believe the word over the twisted, liberal doctrine of the Reformationists, who are sending millions to hell. Why do you think they were called the "dead church" by Jesus, Himself? They taught that 'no sin can separate us from Jesus, so sin boldly. His blood is strong enough to cover it.' That is the opposite of Scripture.

Matthew 7:21-23
21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

Gideon, have you ever seen my teaching on the two types of sin? 1 John 5:16-17. One, a Christian cannot commit with the Holy Spirit inside. The other can be forgiven as long as we forgive each other of the same.

Gids, when we are filled with the Spirit after true repentance (the key) you KNOW IT. It is life-changing. Your desire to sin is gone! So it is FACT. Not something you need to get to by faith. After that, you need to keep reckoning yourself dead to sin and not quench the Spirit. There are things that will help, like a change of friends and peers. And doing those things you now love and have an unending thirst for, like studying the Word of God and pressing into Him.

Repentance is the key. Just like in AA, you must first come to recognize that sin is a problem no amount of will-power can fix. The law made us realize "that sin through the commandment might become exceedingly sinful." We can't fix it, but that is BEFORE the SPIRIT. That is the problem of the man in Romans 7 who has the law showing him his sin, but his carnal nature is pulling him - it isn't dead. Romans 8 shows the difference having the Spirit makes. Jesus frees us from ALL sins of lawlessness.

The truth is the narrow road leading to heaven; the Reformation garbage is the wide road leading to hell.

If you still have my testimony, re-read it. If not, ask and I'll resend it to you.

Here is something worth considering. When Paul wrote to the Corinthians, he addressed them as brethren and yet told them they were still carnal.

"And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.

I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.

For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?

Paul then goes on to tell them that we will be rewarded for our works and there will be some who have only stubble to show for their walk in the Lord. All their works will be burnt up.

"If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire."

Can carnal believers be saved? According to Paul, yes.

He then tells them a truth they might have known in their doctrines and heads but not yet with their hearts.

"Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?"

1 Corinthians 3:1-3,14-16

The church, all 500+ denominations, is far, far from what God wills for us. Within that group are both tares and carnal wheat. But both are asleep. One has the seal of the Holy Spirit and yet are carnal. Let us not be so quick to assume they are lost.

God has shown us how He operates with us as Christians in His dealings with Israel. They have been stiff-necked and rebellious, taking on the characteristics of the lost around them. (So have we.)

Yet, though they outwardly looked like the heathens, inside, God saw them differently. They had His seed in them, they were His, and He will again draw them to His breast before all is said and done. And so will He with us! Glory!

blessings,

Gids

1stcenturylady · Apr 25, 2019

Gideons300 said:
So do you believe that in church today, or here on CF, if someone is not walking in full victory over sin, they are unsaved? Just curious how you fellowship with others if you think they are not brothers and sisters in the Lord.

Blessings,

Gideon

I believe the truth will set you free. And the Spirit is Truth. Even before one repents, the Spirit is drawing. I'm here to encourage them to repentance, and that there IS victory. Reformationsts are taught that we will always sin, and they are, frankly, brainwashed into believing an unvictorious demonic lie. When Jesus sets us free, we are free indeed. And that is not after we die, as they teach. They are the hardest to reach, even calling me a heretic. Not even presenting them with the Word will make them give up their liberal teachers.

1stcenturylady · Apr 25, 2019

Gideons300 said:
Here is something worth considering. When Paul wrote to the Corinthians, he addressed them as brethren and yet told them they were still carnal.

"And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.

I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.

For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?

Paul then goes on to tell them that we will be rewarded for our works and there will be some who have only stubble to show for their walk in the Lord. All their works will be burnt up.

"If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire."

Can carnal believers be saved? According to Paul, yes.

He then tells them a truth they might have known in their doctrines and heads but not yet with their hearts.

"Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?"

1 Corinthians 3:1-3,14-16

The church, all 500+ denominations, is far, far from what God wills for us. Within that group are both tares and carnal wheat. But both are asleep. One has the seal of the Holy Spirit and yet are carnal. Let us not be so quick to assume they are lost.

God has shown us how He operates with us as Christians in His dealings with Israel. They have been stiff-necked and rebellious, taking on the characteristics of the lost around them. (So have we.)

Yet, though they outwardly looked like the heathens, inside, God saw them differently. They had His seed in them, they were His, and He will again draw them to His breast before all is said and done. And so will He with us! Glory!

blessings,

Gids

Why do you think he was so hard on them?

2 Corinthians 7:1 Therefore, having these promises, beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.

2 Corinthians 7:9 Now I rejoice, not that you were made sorry, but that your sorrow led to repentance. For you were made sorry in a godly manner, that you might suffer loss from us in nothing.

2 Peter 2:
18 For when they speak great swelling words of emptiness, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through lewdness, the ones who have actually escaped from those who live in error. 19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are slaves of corruption; for by whom a person is overcome, by him also he is brought into bondage. 20 For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning. 21 For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them. 22 But it has happened to them according to the true proverb: “A dog returns to his own vomit,” and, “a sow, having washed, to her wallowing in the mire.”

Gideons300 · Apr 25, 2019

1stcenturylady said:
Why do you think he was so hard on them?

2 Corinthians 7:1 Therefore, having these promises, beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.

2 Corinthians 7:9 Now I rejoice, not that you were made sorry, but that your sorrow led to repentance. For you were made sorry in a godly manner, that you might suffer loss from us in nothing.

2 Peter 2:
18 For when they speak great swelling words of emptiness, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through lewdness, the ones who have actually escaped from those who live in error. 19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are slaves of corruption; for by whom a person is overcome, by him also he is brought into bondage. 20 For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning. 21 For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them. 22 But it has happened to them according to the true proverb: “A dog returns to his own vomit,” and, “a sow, having washed, to her wallowing in the mire.”

So they were Christians, rhey repented, theychad the Spirit, and yet they were still carnal, not free at all. How is that possible?

What you are missing is that everything God has for us is to be made real in Heaven first, then made manifest to us as we believe.

Our putting on our new nature is not automatic victory over sinful habits. It is through faith that our victory is made real... as we continue to believe. This is the good fight of faith we are all called to, and that end is that we become established in the faith. Remember, God told Joshua that He had given them the land. Then He told him, "Now go in and take it." That is us and our walk of faith, abiding in Him.

And so it is with us. We are free. We are new. Right now. BUT, we experience it only as we endure in the faith, holding up our shields of faith when satan comes tempting and accusing.

Why would it be necessary to reckon ourselves dead to sin if we were God's children and our death and our resurrection were accomplished facts? They would already be free. Right? Yet Paul tells the Romans that very thing. The facts precipitate faith. We are dead. Now believe it. Make it our profession and it will be our possession. That is how God has ordained that we grow up into Him in all things.

Sister, it is our believing the promises.... faith in His faithfulness....that we see their fulfillment manifested in our lives. Yes, God's will is rhat we do not sin, but thank God IF ( not when but IF) we sin, we have an advocate and forgiveness and cleansing are sure to any sincere heart.

Our victory is walked out moment by moment, with ahields held high that we are no longer old creatures teying to become new. We ARE new creatures and as we believe that, we root deeply into Christ, abiding in Him in a greater and greater way, and with that comes the promsie rhat we will not fulfil the lusts of the flesh. We are not sinlessly perfect, unable to sin again. But we are kept by the power of God..... through faith!

Blessings,

Gids

1stcenturylady · Apr 25, 2019

Gideons300 said:
So they were Christians, rhey repented, theychad the Spirit, and yet they were still carnal, not free at all. How is that possible?

What you are missing is that everything God has for us is to be made real in Heaven first, then made manifest to us as we believe.

Our putting on our new nature is not automatic. It is through faith. This is the good fight of faith we are all called to. Remember, God told Joshua that He had given them the land. Then He told him, "Now go in and take it."

And so it is with us. We are free. We are new. Right now. BUT, we experience it as we endure in the faith, holding up our shields of faith when satan comes tempting and accusing.

Why would it be necessary to reckon ourselves dead to sin if we were God's children and our death and our resurrection were accomplished facts? They would already be free. Right?

Sister, it is our believing the promises.... faith in His faithfulness....that we see their fulfillment manifested in our lives. Yes, God's will is rhat we do not sin, but thank God IF ( not when but IF) we sin, we have an advocate and forgiveness and cleansing are sure to any sincere heart.

Our victory is walked out moment by moment, with ahields held high that we are no longer old creatures teying to become new. We ARE new creatures and as we believe that, we root deeply into Christ, abiding in Him in a greater and greater way, and with that comes the promsie rhat we will not fulfil the lusts of the flesh. We are not sinlessly perfect, unable to sin again. But we are kept by the power of God..... through faith!

Blessings,

Gids

He was addressing the whole church at Corinth. Some were Christians, some weren't yet and still carnal. They had to be told to excommunicate one member, and not to even have lunch with others. It was mixed.

Some were actual Christians and accordingly "came short in no gift." But others you can tell weren't believers yet as Paul wished they ALL spoke with tongues, so obviously those that couldn't weren't believers yet.

There is a vast difference between 1 Corinthians and 2 Corinthians.

Gideons300 · Apr 25, 2019

1stcenturylady said:
He was addressing the whole church at Corinth. Some were Christians, some weren't yet and still carnal. They had to be told to excommunicate one member, and not to even have lunch with others. It was mixed.

Some were actual Christians and accordingly "came short in no gift." But others you can tell weren't believers yet as Paul wished they ALL spoke with tongues.

So you are of the mind set that if your do not speak in tongues, you are not saved?

Gideons300 · Apr 25, 2019

1stcenturylady said:
He was addressing the whole church at Corinth. Some were Christians, some weren't yet and still carnal. They had to be told to excommunicate one member, and not to even have lunch with others. It was mixed.

Some were actual Christians and accordingly "came short in no gift." But others you can tell weren't believers yet as Paul wished they ALL spoke with tongues, so obviously those that couldn't weren't believers yet.

There is a vast difference between 1 Corinthians and 2 Corinthians.

So a man can be carnal and have all his works burned up and he will not be saved. I thought we just read that such a one will be saved? Can you explain?

1stcenturylady · Apr 25, 2019

Gideons300 said:
So you are of the mind set that if your do not speak in tongues, you are not saved?

I believe what Mark 16:16-18 says. Those are the authorities to all who believe and are baptized. But, no, I do not believe you "have to" speak in tongues. Would you if you were taught that speaking in tongues was of the devil. It is quenched before even begun! Chains of doubt and unbelief have to first be removed.

1stcenturylady · Apr 26, 2019

Gideons300 said:
So a man can be carnal and have all his works burned up and he will not be saved. I thought we just read that such a one will be saved? Can you explain?

What exactly did you read?

Works burned up? That is talking about MINISTRIES, but not all ministries. There are false ministries too as you will see in 2 Peter at the end.

Paul's works remain and are even a part of Scripture. So who are you talking about? What carnal pastor? A carnal pastor would be a false teacher. I really don't believe Paul is talking about a non-Christian pastor, like Jim Jones being saved, or a carnal, unsaved pastor.We must be born again of the Spirit of Christ to be saved. That is NOT carnal. Many of the drawn are in the process of being saved, through repentance, and receiving the Holy Spirit, but even then, to be ultimately saved, you must endure to the end.

Romans 8:7-9
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

9 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His.

1 Corinthians 3:
5 Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers through whom you believed, as the Lord gave to each one? 6 I planted, Apollos watered, but God gave the increase. 7 So then neither he who plants is anything, nor he who waters, but God who gives the increase. 8 Now he who plants and he who waters are one, and each one will receive his own reward according to his own labor.

9 For we are God’s fellow workers; you are God’s field, you are God’s building. 10 According to the grace of God which was given to me, as a wise master builder I have laid the foundation, and another builds on it. But let each one take heed how he builds on it. 11 For no other foundation can anyone lay than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 Now if anyone builds on this foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw, 13 each one’s work will become clear; for the Day will declare it, because it will be revealed by fire; and the fire will test each one’s work, of what sort it is. 14 If anyone’s work which he has built on it endures, he will receive a reward. 15 If anyone’s work is burned, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.

2 Peter 2:

Destructive Doctrines
2 But there were also false prophets among the people, even as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction. 2 And many will follow their destructive ways, because of whom the way of truth will be blasphemed. 3 By covetousness they will exploit you with deceptive words; for a long time their judgment has not been idle, and their destruction does not slumber.

Doom of False Teachers
4 For if God did not spare the angels who sinned, but cast them down to hell and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved for judgment; 5 and did not spare the ancient world, but saved Noah, one of eight people, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood on the world of the ungodly; 6 and turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah into ashes, condemned them to destruction, making them an example to those who afterward would live ungodly; 7 and delivered righteous Lot, who was oppressed by the filthy conduct of the wicked 8 (for that righteous man, dwelling among them, tormented his righteous soul from day to day by seeing and hearing their lawless deeds)— 9 then the Lord knows how to deliver the godly out of temptations and to reserve the unjust under punishment for the day of judgment, 10 and especially those who walk according to the flesh in the lust of uncleanness and despise authority. They are presumptuous, self-willed. They are not afraid to speak evil of dignitaries, 11 whereas angels, who are greater in power and might, do not bring a reviling accusation against them before the Lord.

Depravity of False Teachers
12 But these, like natural brute beasts made to be caught and destroyed, speak evil of the things they do not understand, and will utterly perish in their own corruption, 13 and will receive the wages of unrighteousness, as those who count it pleasure to carouse in the daytime. They are spots and blemishes, carousing in their own deceptions while they feast with you, 14 having eyes full of adultery and that cannot cease from sin, enticing unstable souls. They have a heart trained in covetous practices, and are accursed children. 15 They have forsaken the right way and gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Beor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness; 16 but he was rebuked for his iniquity: a dumb donkey speaking with a man’s voice restrained the madness of the prophet.

17 These are wells without water, clouds carried by a tempest, for whom is reserved the blackness of darkness forever.

Deceptions of False Teachers
18 For when they speak great swelling words of emptiness, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through lewdness, the ones who have actually escaped from those who live in error. 19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are slaves of corruption; for by whom a person is overcome, by him also he is brought into bondage. 20 For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning. 21 For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them. 22 But it has happened to them according to the true proverb: “A dog returns to his own vomit,” and, “a sow, having washed, to her wallowing in the mire.”

1stcenturylady · Apr 26, 2019

@Gideons300 I see you came back online. Just so you know I just edited and added a bit more to my last post. Good night.

Gideons300 · Apr 26, 2019

1stcenturylady said:
@Gideons300 I see you came back online. Just so you know I just edited and added a bit more to my last post. Good night.

I fully agree with all these verses. We must not forget however that there will also be sheep, true sheep, who will be led into pastures that cannot sustain life. Jesus will not forget them, and will bring them back.

Yes, saints must be warned and repentance is needed. But until they are told the HOW of holiness, until they are told they really ARE dead and stop trying and failing to die to self by self effort, there is no positive pulling them deeper into the Lord. There is just a legalistic "You are bad. Stop it."

That may cut it in the short run, but eventually, without their shields of faith up, believing that they are no longer in the flesh, and yielding themselves to God as those who are alive from the dead, they will eventually fall back again into the flesh.

We cannot separate repentance and faith. They must go together. Repentance without faith leads to miserable legalism. Faith without repentance leads to turning the grace of God into lasciviousness.

blessings,

Gideon

1stcenturylady · Apr 26, 2019

Gideons300 said:
Yes, saints must be warned and repentance is needed. But until they are told the HOW of holiness, until they are told they really ARE dead and stop trying and failing to die to self by self effort, there is no positive pulling them deeper into the Lord. There is just a legalistic "You are bad. Stop it."

You have someone in mind. Tell me their story. You see with me there was a lot of self-effort, but when I gave up and said, Lord, you are bigger than I am, you do it, then just relaxed, supernatural circumstances came into play and the night it came to a head, I saw a vision of my sin, and God spoke to me for the first time. It shocked me and I became still to see if He would continue. He did and spoke 8 sentences to me - a prophecy. I truly repented wanting to be scrubbed clean. After that He literally poured the Holy Spirit all over me starting at the top of my head. My unholy desires died and were replaced overnight. No self-effort at all. That is the whole point of being baptized with the Holy Spirit. We are not in the flesh, using self-effort, but in the Spirit, following His lead, and empowered by Him! And from there we start to grow. I was born again of the Spirit of Christ and had new desires to read the word, and to be at church every time the doors opened, and the church was 45 minutes away down in a valley. He placed His desires for me into me and they became mine.

Psalms 37:
Trust in the Lord, and do good;
Dwell in the land, and feed on His faithfulness.
4 Delight yourself also in the Lord,
And He shall give you the desires of your heart. (His desires became mine)

5 Commit your way to the Lord,
Trust also in Him,
And He shall bring it to pass.
6 He shall bring forth your righteousness as the light,
And your justice as the noonday.

I just listen for His leading and He does it through me.

I was in love with Jesus. And ever since then our relationship grew. He would speak to me more and more, and I never had a prayer not answered, because He always first gave me the words to speak, I would speak them, and it came to pass immediately.

I'm not unique in this. A friend of mine had the same experience though he was driving and had to pull over for fear he might pass out! He got two buckets full. When we've talked, it is amazing that as extreme as my view of the Word is, his is the same. We are completely on the same page.

I was kicked out of a Spirit-filled (Calvinist) Bible Study about a year ago that crushed me, as I had thought I had been invited to join because I was a teacher, but the leader yelled at me and told me they didn't want to hear any more, but an 89 year old missionary lady there called me and told me about some brochures and books she gets in the mail that she doesn't understand, but she thought I might like to sign up and get them as this pastor in Texas teaches the same thing I am.

Gideons300 · Apr 28, 2019

1stcenturylady said:
You have someone in mind. Tell me their story. You see with me there was a lot of self-effort, but when I gave up and said, Lord, you are bigger than I am, you do it, then just relaxed, supernatural circumstances came into play and the night it came to a head, I saw a vision of my sin, and God spoke to me for the first time. It shocked me and I became still to see if He would continue. He did and spoke 8 sentences to me - a prophecy. I truly repented wanting to be scrubbed clean. After that He literally poured the Holy Spirit all over me starting at the top of my head. My unholy desires died and were replaced overnight. No self-effort at all. That is the whole point of being baptized with the Holy Spirit. We are not in the flesh, using self-effort, but in the Spirit, following His lead, and empowered by Him! And from there we start to grow. I was born again of the Spirit of Christ and had new desires to read the word, and to be at church every time the doors opened, and the church was 45 minutes away down in a valley. He placed His desires for me into me and they became mine.

Psalms 37:
Trust in the Lord, and do good;
Dwell in the land, and feed on His faithfulness.
4 Delight yourself also in the Lord,
And He shall give you the desires of your heart. (His desires became mine)

5 Commit your way to the Lord,
Trust also in Him,
And He shall bring it to pass.
6 He shall bring forth your righteousness as the light,
And your justice as the noonday.

I just listen for His leading and He does it through me.

I was in love with Jesus. And ever since then our relationship grew. He would speak to me more and more, and I never had a prayer not answered, because He always first gave me the words to speak, I would speak them, and it came to pass immediately.

I'm not unique in this. A friend of mine had the same experience though he was driving and had to pull over for fear he might pass out! He got two buckets full. When we've talked, it is amazing that as extreme as my view of the Word is, his is the same. We are completely on the same page.

I was kicked out of a Spirit-filled (Calvinist) Bible Study about a year ago that crushed me, as I had thought I had been invited to join because I was a teacher, but the leader yelled at me and told me they didn't want to hear any more, but an 89 year old missionary lady there called me and told me about some brochures and books she gets in the mail that she doesn't understand, but she thought I might like to sign up and get them as this pastor in Texas teaches the same thing I am.

Do I have someone in mind? LOL. Of course, ME!

For 38 years as a Christian, I tried to walk pleasing to God. At year 16, I had my first 'visitation' from the Lord and wrote "Repentance-Only Hope for a Sleeping Bride".

But I only had half the equation. Repentance alone will leave you lifeless and still full of self condemnation. It took another 22 years before I was visited again, this time face to face with God (to be honest, it was face to trembling, weeping back of my neck.)

I had repented multiple hundreds of times, but my flesh would always rise back up and rule over me. I finally came to the point that I was out of hope that I would ever change and despair overtook me.

But that night, now 12 years ago, the Lord visited me and opened my eyes to what I had missed for almost four decades.

I had just cried out saying that I give up, for I had nothing else to try to finally get victory in my life. It was at that moment that a blinding golden light filled the room and put me on my face. And then God spoke and yes, it was audible.

"My son, for this I am well pleased."

Before you chuckle at the absurdity of this, I beat you to it. For thirty eight years I had tried my best to feel, even for a moment that I was pleasing to God. But Heaven was brass. And now, now when I am crushed under the weight of my own failure to rein in my flesh.... now He tells me He is pleased with me?

It made no sense.... until He spoke His next words.

"I knew all along that you could not walk the walk I had for you, but you did not yet know it."

Did you get that key word? YET. Without a miracle, I would never bear fruit, never please God, never walk as I knew I should. That night, I finally knew it. Dying to self was not difficult. It was impossible.

But God did not stop there. He continued:

"In all your trying to please me, did you ever do what I instructed to you do through my servant Paul?"

Then, He simply dropped the answer into my heart. I saw it, and saw it clearly. It was found in Romans 6. I had read Romans 6-8 hundreds of times for intuitively I knew this was critical information. But guys, I had never, not once seen what God showed me.

In Romans 6, Paul begins by telling us two truths applicable to every single one of His children.

1) When Christ died, we.... our old nature.... died with Him.

2) When Christ rose again, we rose up together with Him with brand new natures.

Ok, but we all know that, right? So what?

Ahhh, but it was what God showed me next that was my "epiphany". There were further instructions right after these two truths. We were asked to DO something, and no, it is not a work, lol.

He told us to therefore reckon ourselves dead to sin and alive unto Him. Whoa.

I had never seen that and therefore never done it. What did I do? I obeyed! I spoke. Out loud. LOUDLY out loud. I confessed that I was a new creature and the old me was no more. I believed..... with my whole heart.... that I possessed a brand new nature. Not part white dog, part black dog. The black dog was dead.

I have tons more to share if anyone is interested, but for 12 years, as I have held up my shield of faith as to who I am and who I am not, and yielded myself to God as one who is alive from the dead, God has been faithful to do as He has promised.... to cause me to walk in obedience to Him. And to my surprise and delight, I have seen God begin to grow fruits in my life that were most definitely not there before.

I am far from a finished product, trust me. But I have found that as I have held up my shield of faith as to who Christ has made me, He has been faithful to do all that I has promised me. And for 12 years, I have shared with any who will listen to my ravings, lol, that all God wants from us is yieldedness and faith in HIS faithfulness.

And we are about to all be awakened to this truth, and the elect WILL light their lamps. They WILL become overcomers, victorious over the world, the flesh and the devil. When will this glorious event happen? whenever we are desperate and hungry enough see that our only hope is to take the precious blood of the Lamb snd combine it with OUR testimony as to who we are.

Saints, we ARE new creatures. Not will be. ARE. Because of our unbelief, we have walked like old natured people, trying and failing to rein in our self nature. We have thought we are part old man and part new. But that is a lie. We who are His are NOT in the flesh, and owe it nothing. Will you dare to believe that?

When we finally do believe , even if our faith is weak and wavering, God will move mountains to insure that we discover the HOW of holiness, and that He is the potter who promised to shape us and to fill us and to keep us from falling. Glory to Him forever!

blessings,

Gideon

Boy, have we got it wrong.... (What One Things You Would Do To Improve Our Christian Experience

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Our awakening is beginning. Prepare to be amazed.

Our awakening is beginning. Prepare to be amazed.

Spirit-filled follower of Christ

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Our awakening is beginning. Prepare to be amazed.

Spirit-filled follower of Christ

Our awakening is beginning. Prepare to be amazed.

Our awakening is beginning. Prepare to be amazed.

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