OSAS....= is Grace

Not David

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This just proves how people who mock the gospel as "easy believism" prove it isn't easy at all... It's very hard to humble yourself and believe in the gospel and let go of the idea your effort and works are in any way indicative of your salvation. Pride, fear, the flesh, and the devil himself gets in the way. These discussions here prove it isn't easy after all, and the narrow way really is narrow. Most will not accept his free gift but think their works are what justifies them even partially which will lead them to hell for not trusting in Jesus alone but their works for salvation. And to those people, God will say this:

Matthew 7:21
"Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful WORKS?
And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity."

And it's a very sad reality which is why I pray for you guys...
It ok, I will also pray to Jesus and ask the Mother of God, Mary, to intercede for you. :prayer:
 
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Not David

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Nope. Haha you're still not getting it are you? That's not what the verse is saying at all. The verse is saying your faith does not save a hungry person, actions save them.... It has nothing to do with YOUR salvation and justification before God. Nice try though.
Using different versions:
"What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save them?"
"What good is it, dear brothers and sisters, if you say you have faith but don’t show it by your actions? Can that kind of faith save anyone?"
"What good is it, my brothers, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can that faith save him?"
"What is the profit, my brothers, if anyone says to have faith, but has no works? Is the faith able to save him?"
 
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Not David

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Repent from dead works of the law... You are the one teaching something ubiblical buddy. Peter and Jesus are speaking to you when he says repent, just as he spoke to the pharisees in saying repent, which means a change of mind. Not "repent of your sins". But repent from DEAD WORKS of the law. He is telling you to repent from dead works of the law and religion because you aren't saved or born again and that is clear by your posts. But again, nice try.
That's not what the Bible says
 
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DM25

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Using different versions:
"What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save them?"
"What good is it, dear brothers and sisters, if you say you have faith but don’t show it by your actions? Can that kind of faith save anyone?"
"What good is it, my brothers, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can that faith save him?"
"What is the profit, my brothers, if anyone says to have faith, but has no works? Is the faith able to save him?"
You must use the KJV if you want the accurate version. Other versions will of course twist verses like these, along with many other verses.
 
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Not David

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You must use the KJV if you want the accurate version. Other versions will of course twist verses like these, along with many other verses.
There you go!
"What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?"
 
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DM25

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That's not what the Bible says
Yes it does.... You are not understanding obviously. You are accusing me when you yourself are preaching false teachings. This is exactly what the bible says and this is exactly what the gospel is.

Hebrews 6:1
"Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,"

As you can see it clearly says "repentance from dead works". The law is a curse, and you are no longer under the curse of the law when you are in Christ.

The entire time Jesus came was to call the Jews to repentance from the dead works of the law and into salvation in him alone. You would know this if you actually read the bible in context with help of the holy spirit. Repent, when Peter said it, means change of mind. Change of mind from the works of the law, and to believe in Jesus Christ to receive the holy spirit. Water baptisms were also performed during this time because that was a custom to the Jews.
 
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DM25

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There you go!
"What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?"
What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?

15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,

16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?

Again, proving my point. Proving what scripture says. Faith alone CAN'T save the hungry person. But your actions can save the hungry person by feeding him and helping him. It has nothing to do with the justification of the believer the book is addressing before God. That's not what "save him" means here. It means save the needy person.. Read it in context man.
 
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Not David

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What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?

15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,

16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?

Again, proving my point. Proving what scripture says. Faith alone CAN'T save the hungry person. But your actions can save the hungry person by feeding him and helping him. It has nothing to do with the justification of the believer the book is addressing before God. That's not what "save him" means here. It means save the needy person.. Read it in context man.
Why you don't continue with the next verse?
"Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone."
 
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Yes it does.... You are not understanding obviously. You are accusing me when you yourself are preaching false teachings. This is exactly what the bible says and this is exactly what the gospel is.

Hebrews 6:1
"Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,"

As you can see it clearly says "repentance from dead works". The law is a curse, and you are no longer under the curse of the law when you are in Christ.

The entire time Jesus came was to call the Jews to repentance from the dead works of the law and into salvation in him alone. You would know this if you actually read the bible in context with help of the holy spirit. Repent, when Peter said it, means change of mind. Change of mind from the works of the law, and to believe in Jesus Christ to receive the holy spirit. Water baptisms were also performed during this time because that was a custom to the Jews.
That's your interpretation and no what the Bible says.
 
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DM25

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That's your interpretation and no what the Bible says.
I just showed you in Hebrews that the bible says that.

Why you don't continue with the next verse?
"Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone."
Yes, when it says faith without the works is dead, it is saying it is not alive or functioning. It is not saying faith without works does not exist.
 
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SeventhFisherofMen

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I hope everyone had a blessed Easter.
Jesus is risen, and isn't this Good News.

We might add to our prayer time a prayer for those who were injured in Sri Lanka, and of course for their families.
--------------------------------------

So, i wanted to ask you... Have any of you ever heard of OSAS?
This concept is an interesting outcome of salvation, and a prime result of Grace.
Its a "man made" idea, and similar to the word "Trinity", its not found in any Greek Text, or in any Translation of Scripture that make up any New Testament, extant.

Now, about "Grace".
I like this word "Grace", as this word describes the nature of God, and gives us an understanding of what the Love of God is like. His love is Grace.
I guess we could say that a combination of words like (charity, compassion, mercy, hope, goodness, forgiveness), and similar could barely try to help us understand God and His nature of Grace, because its Salvation that really spotlights, "Grace", as this is God giving the life of His Son, for the undeserving, and in this we see......Grace.......The Grace of God.

If we consider that Jesus is the heart of God, and when we have seen Jesus, we have seen the Father, then Grace also accurately describes ......Jesus.
Jesus, literally IS Grace.
This could be explained or demonstrated by the idea that God Himself, wrapped in human flesh, born of a virgin, was "manifested as a man, as a Savior, to take away the sin of the world"......and He did.
Jesus bore the sin of the world, but the application of this Grace, is not executed into/unto a person, unless they meet the one requirement that God requires for Him to give to you the "Righteousness of Christ:....and your FAITH, is the one "work" that God requires for you to receive the imputed Righteousness of HIMSELF.
No other work will He accept from you, to save you, and recreate you as "born again" for eternity.

The Blood Atonement is Grace.......and Salvation is a product of God's Grace.
The Cross, the blood of Jesus, the resurrection, these are all examples of Grace as a literal reality, regarding how the Love of God is expressed towards all of His creation, as perfect love and mercy and hope.

Another truth and perfect way to express Grace/Salvation, in the Christian context, would be......OSAS.

So, what is this, exactly? As there are many deceits written about it in books, and pamphlets, and on forums like this one, and many denominations are probably originally birthed as some type of resistance to the very idea of what they think it means.
What i can tell you, is that the KJV and the idea/subject of OSAS, get insulted more by Christians, then any of the cults you find, such as JW's, and Mormons, and others.
Yes, the KJV and OSAS, endure more mean spirited carnal ridicule, by people who say they are born again, then any true false religious cult, or all of them, combined.
And this is fascinating, as the reality is, most, maybe 90 % of the people who have such hatred in their heart for both the KJV and idea of OSAS, actually have a very skewed and misinformed understanding of both.........and its to this point, i'll write a brief bit of clarification, regarding only one......OSAS.

So what is it?......What is OSAS?......... well, simply put its God's Grace.
Thats what it is.
First, its an understanding that you are born again only once, and that you can't be "unborn again".
Just as you can't go back into your mother's womb, you also can't stop being 'in Christ".
You can't be "unborn" as a heavenly Son of God, just like you can't be unborn from the Mother who birthed you into this earthly existence.
Born is Born.....done is done........"It is finished", once it is applied to you..(Blood Atonement).
So, OSAS, is an understanding-comprehension of Salvation and of the Blood Atonement, that realizes that the mercy of God that saved you, is the same mercy that keeps you saved.
Its the SAME. = He who saved you, will keep you saved., and you have no part in this...none.
Its an understanding that the Law that once judged you as a sinner, has been abolished by the Cross, and thereby has no more power or authority to judge you ever again. This is why the scripture says that "Grace came by Jesus", and we are "Under Grace" now, and no longer under (being judged by) the Law.
Romans 4:8...study it.

And this means that God judged Himself on a Cross, as guilty for our sin, and this judgment will never fall again on a born again Son of God in Eternity/Heaven, as it already fell on Jesus The Christ, on earth.
If you, the reader, are not saved, if you are not born again, and you die, you will meet God as your Judge, and you can realize what happened to Jesus on a Cross, to honestly evaluate what you are up-against, for eternity, if you die as a Christ Rejector.
But if you are born again, then you will never meet God as Judge in heaven, as Christ has already met the Judge for you, on earth.
You will only meet your God as your Father, ......IF you are born again.

Then there is this part. A person who realizes that OSAS, is just giving God full credit for saving them and keeping them saved, also understands that they are to "be ye holy, as God is holy"...>"present your body a living sacrifice"..... everyday, every minute... without FAIL.
See...
OSAS, is not a "license to sin", as it is portrayed by liars and similar.....not at all.
OSAS, is simply the understanding of "born again"....which gives GOD and Christ full credit, for Salvation...for saving us and keeping us saved.
A person who understands that God saves once, and that "born again" happens once, and
"God is the author and finisher of our faith, and that the God who started Salvation in us, is faithful to complete it".....OSAS =believes this truth, and does not try to add their self effort (works) in place OF this truth.... that God alone saves you and keeps you saved.
Philippians 1:6
Hebrews 12:2

OSAS, defined....= simply gives God full credit for Salvation......the beginning of it, and the ending of it.
Thats it.
Simple.

And finally, a person who understands that Grace, is OSAS...(they are the same), that Salvation itself is explained perfectly by OSAS.....WE understand also a very important understanding.
And this is where the problem starts for legalists, as its this one misunderstanding, that if they could come to understand this one theological fact, and grasp it, they could come to see the Light, that Grace is actually OSAS.

Here is their issue.......... A Legalist, or someone who hates OSAS, does not understand that our Christian Discipleship, is something we do because we ARE saved, and never something we do to try to save ourselves or keep ourselves saved.
In other words....Salvation, is all of God, applied to us...and then, ONCE WE HAVE IT.... we try to live a lifestyle (Discipleship) that reflects what we have become, that is caused and kept ONLY by God and the Blood of Jesus.
The legalist, has the idea that God started salvation, and they finish it by their lifestyle, and if they get this wrong, or don't do enough, then, God will remove them from the Book of Life, and Jesus will find a way out of their body, and take the Holy Spirit with Him.
Which of course, is impossible, but that is what would have to happen, if you could "lose it".(lose your salvation). And so, OSAS, understands that this is not possible. Its not possible for Jesus to exit you once He is living IN YOU and you are "in Christ"..= "unborn again". However the legalist will insist that this can happen if you dont continue in a lifestyle that they feel QUALIFIES you to stay saved and inherit heaven by works, ONLY if you continue.....

So, one thing to add... and for you to consider.
Every work, you can do for God... commandment keeping, confessing sins, missionary work, joining a church, living a holy lifestyle.... Listen, all of these DEEDS, can be done, even if Jesus never hung as God on a Cross.
Now think about that...
In other words, all that a legalist is doing to "stay saved".. all of it, can be done by ANYONE, and Jesus never had to come down here as God and die, if any of this could save you.
So, a question for you legalist....= Would any of those works you are doing that you can do, before the Cross was given, or after.......If there was NO CROSS, would any of your works, works, works, save you?
NO !!
Then why would you believe that if none of those can save you, and only Jesus Saves, .. would you believe that what won't save you without the Blood Atonement, the CROSS......why would you think any of these works, if not done after you are SAVED, that this could cause you not to be saved?
This type Legalist mentality, is not only missing truth, its missing Logic.
So, a legalist believes that what can't save them...is able to take away their salvation, if they dont do the LIST of works, whatever that is, (till they die) as its a different list for each legalist.
> Wild.

So, the OSAS person, understands that all that legalism junk, is not something they will ever be found dead worrying about, because they understand that the God who saves us, keeps us saved, and that is OSAS.......thats what it means.
It means to give full credit to God and Christ for Salvation....Both saving us and keeping us saved, as this is GRACE, and GRACE is OSAS.

Philippians 1:6
Hebrews 12:2
Yes I’ve heard of it and no I don’t believe in it. I have verses to support it you can find it from other replies to my thread that is very very similar to this one which is titled, “Is It Impossible To Lose Your Salvation?”
 
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timewerx

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17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

The entire book of James is about how to treat each other.

The book of 1 John too.

However, St. John equates loving with action to loving God. Thus, no love of brothers and sisters means no love of God.

And then we come to Luke 16:13. You will only either love or hate. If one does not love God, means they hate God.

Is it possible for those who hates God and died hating God to be saved?
 
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DM25

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The book of 1 John too.

However, St. John equates loving with action to loving God. Thus, no love of brothers and sisters means no love of God.

And then we come to Luke 16:13. You will only either love or hate. If one does not love God, means they hate God.

Is it possible for those who hates God and died hating God to be saved?
1 John is about how to have joy in your walk, not how to get saved as well. Just as the book of John is about how to treat others. Both of these books are addressed to already saved people.

Love, in the context of salvation, is displayed by believing in the gospel of Jesus Christ, that is what saves you. That is doing the will of the Father.
 
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Carl Emerson

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You seem to be in agreement with the OP that a Christian can simply live a life of mortal sin and remain in God's grace. It appears that you are using Romans 7 to support that idea when it is clear that the writer is addressing "sins of ignorance".

Totally wrong I am afraid...

Sin is sin whether in ignorance or not.

As I have already stated the Fear of God within a true believer seals against mortal sin. Jer 32:40
 
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HTacianas

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Totally wrong I am afraid...

Sin is sin whether in ignorance or not.

As I have already stated the Fear of God within a true believer seals against mortal sin. Jer 32:40

The entirety of the old testament sacrificial system was solely for sins of ignorance. There was no atonement under the law for mortal sin.
 
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timewerx

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1 John is about how to have joy in your walk, not how to get saved as well. Just as the book of John is about how to treat others. Both of these books are addressed to already saved people.

Love, in the context of salvation, is displayed by believing in the gospel of Jesus Christ, that is what saves you. That is doing the will of the Father.


It touches the important topic of loving or hating God.

Based on the book, they are many Christians who thinks they love God but unknowingly hates God due to their deeds or actions, according to 1 John.

In John 14:28, it states that a judge will for those who rejects God.

It would seem there are actions or deeds that would doom you though. For example, materialism, not helping our brothers and sisters in dire need (those who are poor).
 
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