OSAS....= is Grace

Neogaia777

Old Soul
Supporter
Oct 10, 2011
23,277
5,237
45
Oregon
✟952,487.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Celibate
The Holy Spirit "hates" our pride though...

God Bless!
Everyone tends to picture a proud or prideful person as being "too high up" basically...

But, do you know the opposite can be true as well, rooted in "self" sometimes, very selfish and self-centered and is a oftentimes a result of being too self-absorbed in the first place... time to wake up... Sober up and find a, or the balance, ect...

God Bless!
 
Upvote 0

Neogaia777

Old Soul
Supporter
Oct 10, 2011
23,277
5,237
45
Oregon
✟952,487.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Celibate
Still no one has commented on the prophesy of Jeremiah that clearly states New Covenant believers cant loose their salvation.

Maybe folks prefer to argue rather than take scripture seriously??

Pretty sad realy.
I already know one "won't" lose it, if they ever truly had it in the first place or to begin with... If they do, they didn't, ect...

God Bless!
 
Upvote 0

Neogaia777

Old Soul
Supporter
Oct 10, 2011
23,277
5,237
45
Oregon
✟952,487.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Celibate
I already know one "won't" lose it, if they ever truly had it in the first place or to begin with... If they do, they didn't, ect...

God Bless!
Now some are going to yell or scream, "I've been saved since, ect, ect, How dare you, ect, ect"... Pride, ect...

There is still hope for them, but not if they do not embrace the Truth or the possibility of a truth that they may not be or have ever been really truly saved or not, ect, then I don't know, (what's going to happen to or with them) ect...

And I'm not saying they all are not saved, just some of them maybe... Not truly saved yet, ect...

But I believe there is still hope, ect...

God Bless!
 
Upvote 0

NothingIsImpossible

Well-Known Member
May 22, 2015
5,615
3,254
✟274,922.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
I'll be very blunt... people who believe in OSAS likely may listen to ear ticklers and half gospel teachers. Think about what OSAS is. It basically means no matter what you do, you go to heaven. Believing such lies makes people comfortable because they may be living sinful lives and this means for them they can continue to sin and believe they still get to see heaven.

Lets setup an easy example. Let's say a guy who was an atheist who lead a bad lifestyle of casual sex, drug use....etc. Then around 20 he became saved. He changed most of his life. No drugs, no sex...etc. He went on to become a pastor one day and lead his own church. Everybody loved him because he was so nice and preached the truth, even if others didn't like hearing some things.

But lets say around 50, for whatever reason, he snaps and leaves his christian life behind to become a satanist. He really feels "power" from that. He starts casual sex, drugs, drinking...etc all over again. He goes on to rape someone underage and ends up in prison. Where he dies not long after from a another convict he hates pedophiles.

Does he go to heaven? OSAS says yes. But I say no. No, the ONLY response OSAS people have to say to this is "He was never saved to begin with!" That is a just a weak answer and somewhat desperate to defend OSAS. Admittedly of course there are people who are saved but never meant it when they were saved (maybe they just said it to please someone). But for someone to become saved and change their life like said pastor, then to turn around decades later and become such a horrible person. This means they lost their salvation. Hence they would not end up in heaven.

I do find people often misunderstand what I am saying. I'm not saying if you for example swear right now that you will end up in hell. That's silly. We all screw up and will always do so in these bodies (not that its an excuse to purposely sin). What I am saying is in extreme situations, you can lose it. However it does not mean you can't get it back. In the pastors situation he could change his life again in prison and come back to the Lord and be saved again.

Am I right or wrong? Well everyone has their own view of course. If I am wrong I would feel a bit weird getting to heaven and seeing my grandfather who was raised catholic but spent his whole life beating up people, cheating on his wife, molesting/raping his own kids (boys and girls), while beating them, until they left home.
 
Upvote 0

Gods not mad

Active Member
Mar 31, 2019
91
25
united states
✟11,950.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
thank you for your response.

At baptism, Christians make promises to God. They reject the devil and all rebellion against God, renounce the deceit and corruption of evil, repent of the sins that separate us from God and neighbour, turn to Christ as Saviour and submit to Him as Lord, and vow to remain faithful to Christ for the rest of their life. They are promises made before God and professed publically.

do you still rebel against God? do promises need to be made at baptism? what about the thief on the cross? do you still have any corruption within you that could be considered evil? what is repentance? how do you personally repent? how does one exactly remain faithful to Christ for the rest of their lives?

When we repent of our sins and allow the Lord to transform us, when we love others, and seek to do the common good, and persevere in the faith, we live in a state of sanctifying grace. Sanctification is the ongoing process in which we become transformed by the Holy Spirit working in our lives.

how do you allow the Lord to transform you? love others and do good. is this done by the power of God in faith producing good works or works to maintain salvation?

When a person falls into grave sin, such as apostasy, publically renouncing their faith, or choosing to live in deliberate and persistent sin, they fall from that state of grace. If they choose to repent and come back to the Lord then they will be forgiven.

deliberate or persistent sin. lets say the person has a rejection problem formed by consistent abuse. so rejection breads sexual sin but the person has never been given the understanding of the root and also feels as if God has rejected them. would that person be considered fallen from grace and would God reject them to hell? if one chooses to repent is it really him who has chosen to come back? then they will be forgiven. has not Christ already done that one time for those that belong to him?
 
Upvote 0

Neogaia777

Old Soul
Supporter
Oct 10, 2011
23,277
5,237
45
Oregon
✟952,487.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Celibate
I'll be very blunt... people who believe in OSAS likely may listen to ear ticklers and half gospel teachers. Think about what OSAS is. It basically means no matter what you do, you go to heaven. Believing such lies makes people comfortable because they may be living sinful lives and this means for them they can continue to sin and believe they still get to see heaven.

Lets setup an easy example. Let's say a guy who was an atheist who lead a bad lifestyle of casual sex, drug use....etc. Then around 20 he became saved. He changed most of his life. No drugs, no sex...etc. He went on to become a pastor one day and lead his own church. Everybody loved him because he was so nice and preached the truth, even if others didn't like hearing some things.

But lets say around 50, for whatever reason, he snaps and leaves his christian life behind to become a satanist. He really feels "power" from that. He starts casual sex, drugs, drinking...etc all over again. He goes on to rape someone underage and ends up in prison. Where he dies not long after from a another convict he hates pedophiles.

Does he go to heaven? OSAS says yes. But I say no. No, the ONLY response OSAS people have to say to this is "He was never saved to begin with!" That is a just a weak answer and somewhat desperate to defend OSAS. Admittedly of course there are people who are saved but never meant it when they were saved (maybe they just said it to please someone). But for someone to become saved and change their life like said pastor, then to turn around decades later and become such a horrible person. This means they lost their salvation. Hence they would not end up in heaven.

I do find people often misunderstand what I am saying. I'm not saying if you for example swear right now that you will end up in hell. That's silly. We all screw up and will always do so in these bodies (not that its an excuse to purposely sin). What I am saying is in extreme situations, you can lose it. However it does not mean you can't get it back. In the pastors situation he could change his life again in prison and come back to the Lord and be saved again.

Am I right or wrong? Well everyone has their own view of course. If I am wrong I would feel a bit weird getting to heaven and seeing my grandfather who was raised catholic but spent his whole life beating up people, cheating on his wife, molesting/raping his own kids (boys and girls), while beating them, until they left home.
Your free to do whatever, but you will not want to do "just whatever", and will not do "just whatever", if you were ever truly saved to begin with, ect...

But, what is acceptable and what is not...? That's where we get into deep waters... Men judging that, or being the judges of that, ect...

God Bless!
 
Upvote 0

Neogaia777

Old Soul
Supporter
Oct 10, 2011
23,277
5,237
45
Oregon
✟952,487.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Celibate
thank you for your response.



do you still rebel against God? do promises need to be made at baptism? what about the thief on the cross? do you still have any corruption within you that could be considered evil? what is repentance? how do you personally repent? how does one exactly remain faithful to Christ for the rest of their lives?



how do you allow the Lord to transform you? love others and do good. is this done by the power of God in faith producing good works or works to maintain salvation?



deliberate or persistent sin. lets say the person has a rejection problem formed by consistent abuse. so rejection breads sexual sin but the person has never been given the understanding of the root and also feels as if God has rejected them. would that person be considered fallen from grace and would God reject them to hell? if one chooses to repent is it really him who has chosen to come back? then they will be forgiven. has not Christ already done that one time for those that belong to him?
Repentance is and inner, deep inward change or complete turnaround, and Baptism is and outer, outward public declaration (before others) of this, or that event...

And it (Baptism) is a "declaration" (Baptism is) declaring that you have "repented" in front of and before all... but is also, like saying it or even yelling "to" all, as it is a "declaration", and a public one at that...

And for me, It's also a declaration that you will no longer cower or shrink or fall back in fear of man, or keep your Christianity quiet or "secret" or a quiet secret private thing anymore, also...

Kind of like a coming out party...

God Bless!
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Neogaia777

Old Soul
Supporter
Oct 10, 2011
23,277
5,237
45
Oregon
✟952,487.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Celibate
I'll be very blunt... people who believe in OSAS likely may listen to ear ticklers and half gospel teachers. Think about what OSAS is. It basically means no matter what you do, you go to heaven. Believing such lies makes people comfortable because they may be living sinful lives and this means for them they can continue to sin and believe they still get to see heaven.

Lets setup an easy example. Let's say a guy who was an atheist who lead a bad lifestyle of casual sex, drug use....etc. Then around 20 he became saved. He changed most of his life. No drugs, no sex...etc. He went on to become a pastor one day and lead his own church. Everybody loved him because he was so nice and preached the truth, even if others didn't like hearing some things.

But lets say around 50, for whatever reason, he snaps and leaves his christian life behind to become a satanist. He really feels "power" from that. He starts casual sex, drugs, drinking...etc all over again. He goes on to rape someone underage and ends up in prison. Where he dies not long after from a another convict he hates pedophiles.

Does he go to heaven? OSAS says yes. But I say no. No, the ONLY response OSAS people have to say to this is "He was never saved to begin with!" That is a just a weak answer and somewhat desperate to defend OSAS. Admittedly of course there are people who are saved but never meant it when they were saved (maybe they just said it to please someone). But for someone to become saved and change their life like said pastor, then to turn around decades later and become such a horrible person. This means they lost their salvation. Hence they would not end up in heaven.

I do find people often misunderstand what I am saying. I'm not saying if you for example swear right now that you will end up in hell. That's silly. We all screw up and will always do so in these bodies (not that its an excuse to purposely sin). What I am saying is in extreme situations, you can lose it. However it does not mean you can't get it back. In the pastors situation he could change his life again in prison and come back to the Lord and be saved again.

Am I right or wrong? Well everyone has their own view of course. If I am wrong I would feel a bit weird getting to heaven and seeing my grandfather who was raised catholic but spent his whole life beating up people, cheating on his wife, molesting/raping his own kids (boys and girls), while beating them, until they left home.
And you are what you like to dwell on or focus on...

God Bless!
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Gods not mad

Active Member
Mar 31, 2019
91
25
united states
✟11,950.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
The bible clearly says those who trust partly in their works won't make it... I'm not even the one saying it, God is. Death was the punishment to those who worked on the sabbath in old testament times, and that was a foreshadow to now when God says rest and you work (for righteousness I mean and to be justified) you will get destroyed as well because you need to rest in Jesus and his finished work. This is absolutely key, and it makes Christianity different from religion when the focus becomes on Jesus and not yourself or your works.

Romans 8:3
"For what the Law could not do, weak as it was through the flesh, God did: sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and as an offering for sin, He condemned sin in the flesh"

Romans 11:6
"But if it is by grace, it is no longer on the basis of works, otherwise grace is no longer grace."

Romans 3:20
"because by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified in His sight; for through the Law comes the knowledge of sin. But now apart from the Law the righteousness of God has been manifested, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all those who believe; for there is no distinction;read more."

peter.
never will you wash my feet
i will never deny you (trusting in self/works)
look at his life pride/works mentality

my only point to you is we do not have the place to cast people into hell that is not our position. we can call out scripture and place it before them. let me ask you this are you currently basing any part of your relationship with the Lord on works? even a small part. i know you understand that the finished work on the cross is just that and by faith we are fully justified unable to lose what we could not on our own gain. that any work one would try to add to his salvation is counted as dirty rags as i believe. but i am just curious going the other direction would you say in the sense of law/grace mix you are 100% grace?
you could pray for these people to. Gods good.
 
Upvote 0

crossnote

Berean
Supporter
May 16, 2010
2,903
1,593
So. Cal.
✟250,151.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
My take very short.
Osas is true provided the person was truly born again at the outset, otherwise many can be deceived thinking just because they parroted a sinners prayer or walked an aisle, was baptized etc., they are saved.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Kenny'sID

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Feb 28, 2016
18,185
7,001
69
USA
✟585,304.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
First, its an understanding that you are born again only once, and that you can't be "unborn again".
Just as you can't go back into your mother's womb, you also can't stop being 'in Christ".
You can't be "unborn" as a heavenly Son of God, just like you can't be unborn from the Mother who birthed you into this earthly existence.
Born is Born.....done is done........"It is finished", once it is applied to you.

The problem with that analogy is, it's very deceptive, and 100% untrue.

It's in error, in that being born again in Christ is not the same as a baby being born, yet instead of catching on to that right off the bat, those who want to have their cake and eat it too OSAS are awed at the so-called wisdom entailed in the analogy.

They will actuality pretend it's impossible to become unborn again as a christian based on a baby not being able to go back into the womb. There is so obvious a problem with the analogy, I'd be embarrassed to try to pull that on anyone, even if I was a deceptive OSAS'r. Only someone who is a little slow will buy that as a reason to go OSAS or as I say someone who very much wants to believe in a false, easy way salvation.

But, as has been evidenced many times on CF, that's what OSASr's has to offer in order to get people on board, deceptions and untruths just like that. Why? because it takes deceptions, and untruths to support a deception/untruth. Happens around here all the.
time.
 
Upvote 0

Kenny'sID

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Feb 28, 2016
18,185
7,001
69
USA
✟585,304.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Anyone who believes you can lose your salvation most likely isn't saved. True born again Christians believe grace is a free gift, that we are saved by the finished work of the cross in Jesus Christ alone, and nothing we do, no amount of works we do can affect our justification before God, and scripture says this. It's usually an easy way to spot who is born again and who isn't. Though some may be saved just in a season of deception.

IOW, of we don't come around to the OSAS way of thinking we are going to hell.

What was it I said in my last post about how OSAS will try to deceive one into coming over to their side? And this time with the threat of hell.

Care to show us where that is biblical? Or did you make that up as I strongly suspect?
 
Upvote 0

Romans 8

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Feb 16, 2019
1,410
1,151
Canada
✟114,753.00
Country
Canada
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
My take very short.
Osas is true provided the person was truly born again at the outset, otherwise many can be deceived thinking just because they parroted a sinners prayer or walked an aisle, was baptized etc., they are saved.

In your own words, how does one know if they are "truly" born again?
 
Upvote 0

Neogaia777

Old Soul
Supporter
Oct 10, 2011
23,277
5,237
45
Oregon
✟952,487.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Celibate
In your own words, how does one know if they are "truly" born again?
When they were baptized and then repented, which is most usually followed up by water baptism... though that is not what saves you (the water baptism) or is maybe even the moment you were saved either...

God Bless!
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

crossnote

Berean
Supporter
May 16, 2010
2,903
1,593
So. Cal.
✟250,151.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
It's in error, in that being born again in Christ is not the same as a baby being born, yet instead of catching on to that right off the bat, those who want to have their cake and eat it too OSAS are awed at the so-called wisdom entailed in the analogy.

They will actuality pretend it's impossible to become unborn again as a christian based on a baby not being able to go back into the womb. There is so obvious a problem with the analogy, I'd be embarrassed to try to pull that on anyone, even if I was a deceptive OSAS'r. Only someone who is a little slow will buy that as a reason to go OSAS or as I say someone who very much wants to believe in a false, easy way salvation.
No it's more like (unlike today), God isn't into abortions or infanticide. He promises to finish what He began. It's His work of salvation, not ours.

Philippians 1:6 (KJV) Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:

Philippians 2:13 (KJV) For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.
 
Upvote 0