The Commandments

Shimshon

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A precedence is established, the spirit of God passes over the blood (of the covenant). Past sins are forgotten and then the Law is introduced.
Now apply this to the work the Spirit does actively in your heart. Through faith your sins are forgiven and washed into the sea, then the Spirit comes to make its home in your heart where it leads and teaches you, reminding you of all he instructed and keeps you till the day of your redemption. Sins forgiven then the law of the Spirit is applied through your heart and mind. You are not lawless. You are supposed to be accountable to the law of the Spirit of God. This is why the Son who is one with the Father comes to live within us through the Spirit. To enable you to walk in the Way commanded by Messiah. We walk by the law of the Spirit. It introduces and reminds us of all his commands and teachings. In Spirit and Truth. There is no law against this. And it is the function of the Spirit within us.

Through the power of Jesus our sins are forgiven and the Spirit is given to all who believe and repent. The law of the Spirit is then applied to our lives.
 
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sparow

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Yes if everyone keeps the law you can have a nice carnal life. If you want eternal life and rest for your soul you will only find that in Jesus. Mat 11:28-30

The law has always been spiritual yet man with his mouth cannot speak spiritual, can only speak carnal, the mind/body can only read and write carnal. But we have a spirit that is us and as carnal communication arrives we have to process it into a spiritual understanding and so our lives should be spirit expressed and not a carnal expression.

Not making the spiritual connection is where Israel failed but not all failed: there were them with whom the covenant was confirmed.

What does this verse, out of context mean:

John 1:17 (NKJV)
17 For the law was given through Moses, but grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.

Does it mean that the God who created the heavens and the earth and man, is ungraceful and a liar.
 
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ace of hearts

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The law has always been spiritual yet man with his mouth cannot speak spiritual, can only speak carnal, the mind/body can only read and write carnal. But we have a spirit that is us and as carnal communication arrives we have to process it into a spiritual understanding and so our lives should be spirit expressed and not a carnal expression.

Not making the spiritual connection is where Israel failed but not all failed: there were them with whom the covenant was confirmed.

What does this verse, out of context mean:

John 1:17 (NKJV)
17 For the law was given through Moses, but grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.

Does it mean that the God who created the heavens and the earth and man, is ungraceful and a liar.
It's very obvious we both read Deut 28 much differently.
 
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ace of hearts

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The law has always been spiritual yet man with his mouth cannot speak spiritual, can only speak carnal, the mind/body can only read and write carnal. But we have a spirit that is us and as carnal communication arrives we have to process it into a spiritual understanding and so our lives should be spirit expressed and not a carnal expression.

Not making the spiritual connection is where Israel failed but not all failed: there were them with whom the covenant was confirmed.

What does this verse, out of context mean:

John 1:17 (NKJV)
17 For the law was given through Moses, but grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.

Does it mean that the God who created the heavens and the earth and man, is ungraceful and a liar.
Please tell me how I used JN 1:17 to mean something it doesn't. I don't think I even quoted it in this thread.
 
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JackRT

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There are three versions of the ten commandments but only one of them actually self identifies as "the ten commandments" and that is Exodus 34:1-28. In that version the sixth commandment is
21 “Six days you shall labor, but on the seventh day you shall rest; even during the plowing season and harvest you must rest."

With respect to the Sabbath law the other two Bible passages differ in the reason for the law. Why did God, or was it Moses, need three versions of the ten commandments that contradict each other?
 
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Shimshon

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Not making the spiritual connection is where Israel failed but not all failed: there were them with whom the covenant was confirmed
Individually some of them did, but as a nation they did not. The righteousness of a few did not cover the sins of many. But the righteousness of one did cover the sins of all. And before the nations know the Holy one of Israel, Israel will be redeemed. It's the act that causes the nations of the world to see the salvation of God in person and realize the heart of God. The love you know he has for you and the world is equal to the love he has for Israel, as a nation. He swore his undying love and devotion to keep and restore her. You can't love God, Yeshua and claim the inspiration of the Spirit if you forsake his firstborn.
 
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sparow

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Now apply this to the work the Spirit does actively in your heart. Through faith your sins are forgiven and washed into the sea, then the Spirit comes to make its home in your heart where it leads and teaches you, reminding you of all he instructed and keeps you till the day of your redemption. Sins forgiven then the law of the Spirit is applied through your heart and mind. You are not lawless. You are supposed to be accountable to the law of the Spirit of God. This is why the Son who is one with the Father comes to live within us through the Spirit. To enable you to walk in the Way commanded by Messiah. We walk by the law of the Spirit. It introduces and reminds us of all his commands and teachings. In Spirit and Truth. There is no law against this. And it is the function of the Spirit within us.

Through the power of Jesus our sins are forgiven and the Spirit is given to all who believe and repent. The law of the Spirit is then applied to our lives.


I am not familiar with your posts or your religion; I see in your reply the “Law abrogated” theme.



Having past sins forgiven is a function of Law, a legal decision. It doesn't change the person except to remove the burden of guilt; if the person continues to sin then further forgiveness is required and this is not without cost.



“We walk by the law of the Spirit.” Does this mean we do not do all of the commandments; if not which ones are not required, and where does scripture say so?

Ten Commandments simple list
  1. You shall have no other gods before Me.

  2. You shall make no idols.

  3. You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain.

  4. Keep the Sabbath day holy.

  5. Honour your father and your mother.

  6. You shall not murder.

  7. You shall not commit adultery.

  8. You shall not steal.

  9. You shall not bear false witness against your neighbour.

  10. You shall not covet.
It can be argued that one cannot earn salvation by keeping the Law, but one can forfeit ones salvation by not keeping the commandments. The allegiance to god required for salvation requires the Law be kept.

It is by Jesus's authority that our sins are for given; and in the OT it was by the authority of the God that became Jesus in the carnal flesh that sins were forgiven.
 
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ace of hearts

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Individually some of them did, but as a nation they did not. The righteousness of a few did not cover the sins of many. But the righteousness of one did cover the sins of all. And before the nations know the Holy one of Israel, Israel will be redeemed. It's the act that causes the nations of the world to see the salvation of God in person and realize the heart of God. The love you know he has for you and the world is equal to the love he has for Israel, as a nation. He swore his undying love and devotion to keep and restore her. You can't love God, Yeshua and claim the inspiration of the Spirit if you forsake his firstborn.
Really? I don't think the Scripture will support that.
 
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ace of hearts

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I am not familiar with your posts or your religion; I see in your reply the “Law abrogated” theme.



Having past sins forgiven is a function of Law, a legal decision. It doesn't change the person except to remove the burden of guilt; if the person continues to sin then further forgiveness is required and this is not without cost.



“We walk by the law of the Spirit.” Does this mean we do not do all of the commandments; if not which ones are not required, and where does scripture say so?

Ten Commandments simple list
  1. You shall have no other gods before Me.

  2. You shall make no idols.

  3. You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain.

  4. Keep the Sabbath day holy.

  5. Honour your father and your mother.

  6. You shall not murder.

  7. You shall not commit adultery.

  8. You shall not steal.

  9. You shall not bear false witness against your neighbour.

  10. You shall not covet.
It can be argued that one cannot earn salvation by keeping the Law, but one can forfeit ones salvation by not keeping the commandments. The allegiance to god required for salvation requires the Law be kept.

It is by Jesus's authority that our sins are for given; and in the OT it was by the authority of the God that became Jesus in the carnal flesh that sins were forgiven.
Being born again is much more that removal of guilt for past sins. See Rom 6-8.
 
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sparow

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Please tell me how I used JN 1:17 to mean something it doesn't. I don't think I even quoted it in this thread.

Do you have a persecution complex? It was I who quoted Jn 1:17, as a hypothetical, and in the context of the debate: the Law/covenant of Moses and the Law/covenant of Jesus; are they different or is it only the mediators/administrators that are different.


<<What does this verse, out of context mean:

John 1:17 (NKJV)
17 For the law was given through Moses, but grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.

Does it mean that the God who created the heavens and the earth and man, is ungraceful and a liar.>>
 
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sparow

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Being born again is much more that removal of guilt for past sins. See Rom 6-8.

Being born again is different to having sins remembered no more; Having ones righteousness restored is a precondition to being born again.
 
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Tone

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This raises the interesting question; what is it that Easter doesn't recognise for fails to achieve?

Easter doesn't recognize the continuity of the seed (beginning)...it seeks to jump out of the "cycles of Yah" and be its own darwinian like mutation.

A precedence is established, the spirit of God passes over the blood (of the covenant). Past sins are forgotten and then the Law is introduced.

Yeah, and some folks have forgotten or refuse to see that restoration means a move back to something in the beginning, so they attempt to cut out vital portions of the tree and expect to only have to sit back and enjoy the fruit.
 
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Tone

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John 1:17 (NKJV)
17 For the law was given through Moses, but grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.

I believe it reads more accurately with an "and" after "Moses". Western thought will automatically interpret "but" as a contrast and set the two (law and grace) at odds with each other, when Hebrew thought involves a more organic interpretation as one growing out of the other...as likened to a tree.
 
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HIM

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Yes if everyone keeps the law you can have a nice carnal life. If you want eternal life and rest for your soul you will only find that in Jesus. Mat 11:28-30
What is HIS yoke?
 
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Dkh587

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I believe it reads more accurately with an "and" after "Moses". Western thought will automatically interpret "but" as a contrast and set the two (law and grace) at odds with each other, when Hebrew thought involves a more organic interpretation as one growing out of the other...as likened to a tree.
The word “but” isn’t even in the manuscript. One translation, the New American Standard Bible, words it correctly based on overall context, imo

John 1:17 NASB
For the Law was given through Moses; grace and truth were realized through Jesus Christ.
 
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HIM

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It is the ministration of the law that has changed. It went from Tables of stone and parchment (the Book of the Law) to the fleshly tables of the heart. Thus saith the Word in Romans 9:30-33

What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith. But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

As seen above Faith is the issue. Faith is the stumbling stone in which Israel stumble on.

Let's continue. Romans 10:6-8,4

For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth. For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them. But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ (THE WORD) down from above
upload_2019-4-20_8-43-5.gif
Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ (THE WORD) again from the dead.) But what saith it? The word (CHRIST)is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
(Rom 10:4-8 KJV)

For Christ (the Word in the heart and mouth; which is the faith in which we speak) is the end of the law (on tables of Stone and and on parchment) for righteousness to every one that believeth.

Do we then make void the Law through Faith? Nay we establish it!

For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
(Heb 8:10 KJV)

GOD'S Laws, HIS Word, Christ in the heart, mind and mouth. A New Ministration! A new Manifestly declared to be the Epistle of Christ!

In that he saith, A new he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.
(Heb 8:13 KJV)

Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart. And such trust have we through Christ to God-ward: Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;
(2Co 3:3-5 KJV)
 
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ace of hearts

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Do you have a persecution complex? It was I who quoted Jn 1:17, as a hypothetical, and in the context of the debate: the Law/covenant of Moses and the Law/covenant of Jesus; are they different or is it only the mediators/administrators that are different.


<<What does this verse, out of context mean:

John 1:17 (NKJV)
17 For the law was given through Moses, but grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.

Does it mean that the God who created the heavens and the earth and man, is ungraceful and a liar.>>
Then who used the verse out context? What does it mean in context? Why are you so interested in an out of context meaning?

It's not the change of a mediator/administrator; it's a complete change of covenants which necessitates a mediator and it just happens to be Jesus Christ the Righteous. Moses doesn't have a part of leading or running the new covenant. So if one wants to be ruled by Moses as administrator, that's their choice. That being said they then have no part of the new covenant in their life. Take that any way you want.
 
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ace of hearts

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Being born again is different to having sins remembered no more; Having ones righteousness restored is a precondition to being born again.
On the contrary, the righteousness God requires is a direct result of being born again. The only prerequisite for being born again is is being dead in sin needing redemption. IOW no one can qualify for salvation/redemption by their own merit. Jesus only came for those needing help.
 
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