The 1st type of molecule ever formed in the universe found confirming more evidence for the Big Bang

SpiritualBeing

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Scientists using @SOFIAtelescope have located helium hydride in our own galaxy. It is a contributor to the formation of the 1st stars. Unveil our cosmic beginnings.

The Universe’s First Type of Molecule Is Found at Last

Illustration of planetary nebula NGC 7027 and helium hydride molecules. In this planetary nebula, SOFIA detected helium hydride, a combination of helium (red) and hydrogen (blue), which was the first type of molecule to ever form in the early universe. This is the first time helium hydride has been found in the modern universe.
Credits: NASA/SOFIA/L. Proudfit/D.Rutter

The first type of molecule that ever formed in the universe has been detected in space for the first time, after decades of searching. Scientists discovered its signature in our own galaxy using the world’s largest airborne observatory, NASA’s Stratospheric Observatory for Infrared Astronomy, or SOFIA, as the aircraft flew high above the Earth’s surface and pointed its sensitive instruments out into the cosmos.

When the universe was still very young, only a few kinds of atoms existed. Scientists believe that around 100,000 years after the big bang, helium and hydrogen combined to make a molecule called helium hydride for the first time. Helium hydride should be present in some parts of the modern universe, but it has never been detected in space — until now.

SOFIA found modern helium hydride in a planetary nebula, a remnant of what was once a Sun-like star. Located 3,000 light-years away near the constellation Cygnus, this planetary nebula, called NGC 7027, has conditions that allow this mystery molecule to form. The discovery serves as proof that helium hydride can, in fact, exist in space. This confirms a key part of our basic understanding of the chemistry of the early universe and how it evolved over billions of years into the complex chemistry of today. The results are published in this week’s issue of Nature.

“This molecule was lurking out there, but we needed the right instruments making observations in the right position — and SOFIA was able to do that perfectly,” said Harold Yorke, director of the SOFIA Science Center, in California’s Silicon Valley.

Today, the universe is filled with large, complex structures such as planets, stars and galaxies. But more than 13 billion years ago, following the big bang, the early universe was hot, and all that existed were a few types of atoms, mostly helium and hydrogen. As atoms combined to form the first molecules, the universe was finally able to cool and began to take shape. Scientists have inferred that helium hydride was this first, primordial molecule.

Once cooling began, hydrogen atoms could interact with helium hydride, leading to the creation of molecular hydrogen — the molecule primarily responsible for the formation of the first stars. Stars went on to forge all the elements that make up our rich, chemical cosmos of today. The problem, though, is that scientists could not find helium hydride in space. This first step in the birth of chemistry was unproven, until now.

“The lack of evidence of the very existence of helium hydride in interstellar space was a dilemma for astronomy for decades,” said Rolf Guesten of the Max Planck Institute for Radio Astronomy, in Bonn, Germany, and lead author of the paper.

Helium hydride is a finicky molecule. Helium itself is a noble gas making it very unlikely to combine with any other kind of atom. But in 1925, scientists were able to create the molecule in a laboratory by coaxing the helium to share one of its electrons with a hydrogen ion.

Then, in the late 1970s, scientists studying the planetary nebula called NGC 7027 thought that this environment might be just right to form helium hydride. Ultraviolet radiation and heat from the aging star create conditions suitable for helium hydride to form. But their observations were inconclusive. Subsequent efforts hinted it could be there, but the mystery molecule continued to elude detection. The space telescopes used did not have the specific technology to pick out the signal of helium hydride from the medley of other molecules in the nebula.

In 2016, scientists turned to SOFIA for help. Flying up to 45,000 feet, SOFIA makes observations above the interfering layers of Earth’s atmosphere. But it has a benefit space telescopes don't— it returns after every flight.

“We’re able to change instruments and install the latest technology,” said Naseem Rangwala SOFIA deputy project scientist. “This flexibility allows us to improve observations and respond to the most pressing questions that scientists want answered.”

A recent upgrade to one of SOFIA’s instruments called the German Receiver at Terahertz Frequencies, or GREAT, added the specific channel for helium hydride that previous telescopes did not have. The instrument works like a radio receiver. Scientists tune to the frequency of the molecule they’re searching for, similar to tuning an FM radio to the right station. When SOFIA took to the night skies, eager scientists were onboard reading the data from the instrument in real time. Helium hydride’s signal finally came through loud and clear.

“It was so exciting to be there, seeing helium hydride for the first time in the data,” said Guesten. “This brings a long search to a happy ending and eliminates doubts about our understanding of the underlying chemistry of the early universe.

Scientists on the airborne observatory SOFIA detected the first type of molecule that ever formed in the universe. They found the combination of helium and hydrogen, called helium hydride, in a planetary nebula near the constellation Cygnus. This discovery confirms a key part of our basic understanding of the early universe and how it evolved over billions of years into the complex chemistry of today.
Credits: NASA/Ames Research Center

SOFIA, the Stratospheric Observatory for Infrared Astronomy, is a Boeing 747SP jetliner modified to carry a 106-inch diameter telescope. It is a joint project of NASA and the German Aerospace Center, DLR. NASA’s Ames Research Center in California’s Silicon Valley manages the SOFIA program, science and mission operations in cooperation with the Universities Space Research Association headquartered in Columbia, Maryland, and the German SOFIA Institute (DSI) at the University of Stuttgart. The aircraft is maintained and operated from NASA’s Armstrong Flight Research Center Building 703, in Palmdale, California.

The Universe’s First Type of Molecule Is Found at Last
 

SeventyOne

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Ok, so they assume a big bang, then assume at some point after the bang there would be a particular molecule as a result. Then they claim to find the molecule at a distance of around 17,636,000,000,000,000 miles away, and further claim that since they think a bang would generate those, then it's proof of the assumed bang itself. This kind of fiction just doesn't write itself.
 
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tas8831

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Ok, so they assume a big bang, then assume at some point after the bang there would be a particular molecule as a result. Then they claim to find the molecule at a distance of around 17,636,000,000,000,000 miles away, and further claim that since they think a bang would generate those, then it's proof of the assumed bang itself. This kind of fiction just doesn't write itself.

No, it sure doesn't.
 
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Michael

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Ok, so they assume a big bang, then assume at some point after the bang there would be a particular molecule as a result. Then they claim to find the molecule at a distance of around 17,636,000,000,000,000 miles away, and further claim that since they think a bang would generate those, then it's proof of the assumed bang itself. This kind of fiction just doesn't write itself.

Technically they claim that every type of light and heavy element and molecule in the entire physical universe was created in the bang or shortly thereafter, so they could have randomly picked any one of them and claimed that it supported the BB model.

"Chemistry works, therefore LCDM did it". :scratch:

I think their long list of laboratory and observational failures of late have made them a tad desperate for anything that they might claim actually supports the big bang model. :)
 
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Jimmy D

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Ok, so they assume a big bang, then assume at some point after the bang there would be a particular molecule as a result. Then they claim to find the molecule at a distance of around 17,636,000,000,000,000 miles away, and further claim that since they think a bang would generate those, then it's proof of the assumed bang itself. This kind of fiction just doesn't write itself.

Do you understand the meaning of the word “assume”?

Many on-line dictionaries are freely available if you need to refresh your memory.
 
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SeventyOne

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Do you understand the meaning of the word “assume”?

Many on-line dictionaries are freely available if you need to refresh your memory.

Would you prefer I say 'they believe' as opposed to 'they assume' instead, as the article does? Would that make you feel better about it?
 
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Brightmoon

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Technically they claim that every type of light and heavy element and molecule in the entire physical universe was created in the bang or shortly thereafter, so they could have randomly picked any one of them and claimed that it supported the BB model.

"Chemistry works, therefore LCDM did it". :scratch:

I think their long list of laboratory and observational failures of late have made them a tad desperate for anything that they might claim actually supports the big bang model. :)
where did you get your information from? The only elements formed at the Big Bang were mainly hydrogen , some helium and a small amount of lithium . The other elements were formed in stars. You really shouldn’t trust creationist sources as they’re usually pathetically wrong. Helium hydride HeH is a plausible molecule to form at the Big Bang. I’m not a chemist and I couldn’t tell you whether or not this was Helium with an extra proton (H+) ; an extra electron ( H-) or the molecule HeH that could form instead of lithium . It’s definitely plausible even as a thought experiment.
 
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SpiritualBeing

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Ok, so they assume a big bang, then assume at some point after the bang there would be a particular molecule as a result. Then they claim to find the molecule at a distance of around 17,636,000,000,000,000 miles away, and further claim that since they think a bang would generate those, then it's proof of the assumed bang itself. This kind of fiction just doesn't write itself.
A claim is finding something without evidence. They found evidence of the existence of HeH+ in nearby interstellar space. So your statement is incorrect.
 
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SeventyOne

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A claim is finding something without evidence. They found evidence of the existence of HeH+ in nearby interstellar space. So your statement is incorrect.

What they found was a radio frequency they have to assume was not altered by interference and is also exclusive to that compound only, and nothing else anywhere, ever. So, my statement stands.
 
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Michael

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where did you get your information from? The only elements formed at the Big Bang were mainly hydrogen , some helium and a small amount of lithium. The other elements were formed in stars.

True, hence the "shortly thereafter" comment.

You really shouldn’t trust creationist sources as they’re usually pathetically wrong. Helium hydride HeH is a plausible molecule to form at the Big Bang. I’m not a chemist and I couldn’t tell you whether or not this was Helium with an extra proton (H+) ; an extra electron ( H-) or the molecule HeH that could form instead of lithium . It’s definitely plausible even as a thought experiment.

My point is that big bang theory assumes that all forms of matter were created in a "bang" and the solar fusion processes that eventually followed. It's therefore possible to pick any element or molecule and claim it somehow supports the big bang model. The fact of the matter is that any cosmology model that predicts the existence of Hydrogen and Helium in space is supported by the same observation. It's not exactly unique to a single model.
 
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Brightmoon

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The only thing the Big Bang did was release energy. When that cooled down then subatomic particles sorta “ solidified” out of that energy . We do know at least this much
 
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Michael

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The only thing the Big Bang did was release energy. When that cooled down then subatomic particles sorta “ solidified” out of that energy . We do know at least this much

And we don't actually "know" that much, hence the fact that the big bang model is just one cosmology model. I'm sure that followers of Ptolemy also "believed" that they "knew" that the Earth was the center of the universe. :)
 
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SelfSim

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Brightmoon said:
The only thing the Big Bang did was release energy. When that cooled down then subatomic particles sorta “ solidified” out of that energy . We do know at least this much
And we don't actually "know" that much, hence the fact that the big bang model is just one cosmology model. I'm sure that followers of Ptolemy also "believed" that they "knew" that the Earth was the center of the universe. :)
We can 'know' what a given cosmological model is saying ... which is entirely different from knowing that model is correct. Science never needs to attribute correctness to its models .. only objectively evidence based consistency (as well as independent verifiability of its supportive data).

That other models may have also been created, in no way, lends credence to correctness one way or the other, about those models.

In fact for example, most of Scott's physical and cosmo-related models are total nonsense.
 
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SpiritualBeing

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What they found was a radio frequency they have to assume was not altered by interference and is also exclusive to that compound only, and nothing else anywhere, ever. So, my statement stands.
Once again you have no clue what you are talking about and your statement makes no sense whatsover. If there was interference then they would not have detected helium hydride's infrared signature around a dying star. Additionally, they used terahertz spectroscopy which detects and controls properties of matter with electromagnetic fields between the microwave and the infrared region. They DID NOT use radio frequency. What they detected was definitive evidence. This is not a claim.
 
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Michael

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What they detected was definitive evidence. This is not a claim.

What they found was definitive evidence that chemistry happens in space. The observation in question supports *any* and *all* cosmology models that happen to include Hydrogen and Helium, namely *all* of them.
 
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No, it sure doesn't.
An interesting thing about the Big Bang: Because of the humongous amount of energy needed to achieve it, the intense heat generated by it would have made everything absolutely sterile for trillions of miles around it. This would have formed a totally sterile universe with not even the smallest living cell! That is something that science can't satisfactorily answer.

So, if a living cell appeared on a sterile earth that had cooled, where did it come from?

Also, if there was no big bang, and the universe was always there, then the sun and stars would have burned out long ago, according to the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics which says that energy degrades over time. So the universe had to start at a point in time. So, if it started with the Big Bang, and science knows that such a cataclysmic explosion cannot happen spontaneously, who or what caused it? I don't think that science can answer that either.
 
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