There will be different versions of Mueller report for different people...

redleghunter

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Well, that's not the case, it seems...
White House and Justice Dept. Officials Discussed Mueller Report Before Release



I don't think that's going to work for you. Barr and Trump were colluding over report.

And we don't know yet what Mueller reported. All we know is that Barr and Trump are inexplicably reluctant to let anyone other than the WH know what's in it. He's apparently hoping that he'll be able to refuse Congress even a redacted copy.

And now, no more talk about exoneration. I think you can connect the dots. Let's see how much Barr decides to hide from the public.
When I connect the dots I see an embarrassing display of so called news outlets and journalists snookered by extreme leftists who wished their own press were true.
 
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redleghunter

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In an extensive 448-page report sent to Congress Thursday, the former FBI director detailed dozens of instances in which Russian operatives interacted with Trump associates, although he ultimately found no evidence that the campaign worked with Russia in the end.
So Mueller is now complicit in the conspiracy to cover for Trump?
 
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redleghunter

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Conspiracy also resembles attempt. However, attempt, like solicitation, can be committed by a single person. On another level, conspiracy requires less than attempt. A conspiracy may exist before a crime is actually attempted, whereas no attempt charge will succeed unless the requisite attempt is made.
So there was a conspiracy between the media and Democrats to frame Trump?
 
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Yarddog

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Thank you both for taking the time to deal with my ignorance :)I think I heard him say there was not enough proof; yet, if he says he is sure there was "intent", I think this can be prosecutable.
The thing is that "intent" is hard to prove beyond a reasonable doubt and prosecutors are reluctant to take a case to trial without hard evidence. Mueller seems to say that doesn't exist. Trump did a lot of unethical things but that doesn't mean illegal.

As an example, the Trump Tower meeting. Junior went to the meeting seeking dirt on Clinton. The lawyer didn't have any but wanted to make a deal regarding adoption. Trump left, so nothing illegal occurred, though the meeting was unethical.
A maybe different thing, for example, is if you yell you're going to kill someone, and then you start to move toward that person, they can get you for intent to commit murder.
Close. It is illegal to threaten to kill someone. More like a drug sting. Money has to change hands before the buyer does something illegal.
 
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redleghunter

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As an example, the Trump Tower meeting. Junior went to the meeting seeking dirt on Clinton. The lawyer didn't have any but wanted to make a deal regarding adoption. Trump left, so nothing illegal occurred, though the meeting was unethical.
The account given is actually opposite. The Russian lawyer (who did work for a law firm associated with Fusion GPS aka the Clinton front for the dossier) offered dirt. And Jr did not bite.
 
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jgarden

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Nixon did not get hammered for claiming executive privilege.
Nixon got "hammered" over the White House tapes which contained the "smoking gun" of him providing prior knowledge of criminal activity!

Nixon tried to claim "executive privilege" concerning the tapes, but that was overruled by the Courts!
 
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redleghunter

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Nixon got "hammered" over the White House tapes which contained the "smoking gun" of him providing prior knowledge of criminal activity!

Nixon tried to claim "executive privilege" concerning the tapes, but that was overruled by the Courts!
How did knowledge of the tapes become known? That is what got him hammered.
 
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jgarden

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The account given is actually opposite. The Russian lawyer (who did work for a law firm associated with Fusion GPS aka the Clinton front for the dossier) offered dirt. And Jr did not bite.
If that was the case, why did Trump Sr, on his flight home from Europe, invent the "cover story" that the meeting was about Russian adoptions - if this President's surrogates had been conducting themselves in a honourable manner, why the need to lie and mislead the American public?
 
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jgarden

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How did knowledge of the tapes become known? That is what got him hammered.
NIXON TAPES

... In February 1971, a sound-activated taping system was installed in the Oval Office, including in Nixon's Oval Office desk, using Sony TC-800B open-reel tape recorders to capture audio transmitted by telephone taps and concealed microphones. The system was expanded to include other rooms within the White House and Camp David. The system was turned off on July 18, 1973, two days after it became public knowledge as a result of the Senate Watergate Committee hearings ...

The tapes' existence came to light during the Watergate scandal of 1973 and 1974, when the system was mentioned during the televised testimony of White House aide Alexander Butterfield before the Senate Watergate Committee. Nixon's refusal of a congressional subpoena to release the tapes constituted an article of impeachment against Nixon, and led to his subsequent resignation on August 9, 1974.

Nixon White House tapes - Wikipedia
***************************************************************

A White House aide testified before the Watergate Committee that the President was in the habit of secretly recording his conversations in the White House - his initial refusal to release them initiated a series of events that resulted in his loss of Republican congressional support, facing certain impeachment, Nixon chose to resign!
 
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Yarddog

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The account given is actually opposite. The Russian lawyer (who did work for a law firm associated with Fusion GPS aka the Clinton front for the dossier) offered dirt. And Jr did not bite.
Nope, not the opposite. I never said who offered first. Junior still went looking for dirt. This is collusion but it's not illegal since nothing illegal occurred at the meeting.
 
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redleghunter

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If that was the case, why did Trump Sr, on his flight home from Europe, invent the "cover story" that the meeting was about Russian adoptions - if his surrogates were conducting themselves in a honourable manner, why the need to lie and mislead the American public?
Who said he invented a story? That’s another made up false narrative. To get in the door the Fusion GPS agent on the Clinton campaign dollar made the claim she wanted to speak about orphans.
 
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redleghunter

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The investigators received word that President Nixon was in the habit of secretly recording his conversations in the White House - they placed the WH individual responsible for the tapes before the Senate Committee and he confirmed their existence!
Yes who knew that?
 
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redleghunter

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Nope, not the opposite. I never said who offered first. Junior still went looking for dirt. This is collusion but it's not illegal since nothing illegal occurred at the meeting.
The only evidence of anyone digging up dirt is HRC campaign hiring a retired SAS intelligence officer who used his RUSSIAN contacts to create the Trump dossier.

Jr wanting to get dirt on Hillary is purely leftist media speculation. One of those elements of wishful thinking which was again a media false narrative.
 
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Yarddog

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The only evidence of anyone digging up dirt is HRC campaign hiring a retired SAS intelligence officer who used his RUSSIAN contacts to create the Trump dossier.

Jr wanting to get dirt on Hillary is purely leftist media speculation. One of those elements of wishful thinking which was again a media false narrative.
Lol. You haven't kept up with this have. Trump admitted going to the meeting looking for info on Clinton. They admitted that none was there.
 
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redleghunter

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Lol. You haven't kept up with this have. Trump admitted going to the meeting looking for info on Clinton. They admitted that none was there.
Who set up the meeting and what was their motive and reason to meet?

Who actually hired an agency to hire a foreign spy to contact Russians to manufacture dirt on a political opponent during an election? What the HRC and DNC actually did is what Trump was accused of.
 
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Well, that's not the case, it seems...
White House and Justice Dept. Officials Discussed Mueller Report Before Release



I don't think that's going to work for you. Barr and Trump were colluding over report.

And we don't know yet what Mueller reported. All we know is that Barr and Trump are inexplicably reluctant to let anyone other than the WH know what's in it. He's apparently hoping that he'll be able to refuse Congress even a redacted copy.

And now, no more talk about exoneration. I think you can connect the dots. Let's see how much Barr decides to hide from the public.

I've definitely noticed the wording Barr used. He seems to be playing to the White House instead of legalese. Collusion isn't the term which prosecutors use. Conspiracy is.

There was definitely collusion but it doesn't seem to have risen to the point of criminal conspiracy.

Yes, you also have to note that President Trump doesn't actually need to be exonerated as our system is INNOCENT until proven GUILTY not the other way around

As for Trump and Barr colluding...
Is this going to be the next conspiracy narrative? Is there any circumstance under which the Democrat party will accept that Donald Trump won the election legally, and that social media "influence" is not illegal.

Sure Russia leaked out information on Hillary and the DNC. Illegal yes, but would you be perusing such a passionate investigation if they had done something similar to Trump and the RNC?
 
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Yarddog

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Who set up the meeting and what was their motive and reason to meet?
Who cares? It makes no difference. There was no evidence on Clinton. The meeting was a bust.
Who actually hired an agency to hire a foreign spy to contact Russians to manufacture dirt on a political opponent during an election?
I don't know. No evidence exists that anyone "manufactured" evidence. Russians hacked the DNC. Some was leaked. Christopher Steele accumulated info on Trump's dealings with Russia. Some was verified and some wasn't.
What the HRC and DNC actually did is what Trump was accused of.
What they did wasn't illegal.
 
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