When you die you know your dead...

Jonathan Mathews · Apr 17, 2019

devin553344 said:
Does the spirit leave the body at the moment of death?

The spirit/soul leaving the body IS the moment of Death. This is the first death. Soul and Body being throw into the the lake of Fire is the 2nd Death.

devin553344 · Apr 17, 2019

myst33 said:
According to this video, there are several stages described by people who returned from a clinical death:

Stage 1:
All pain and fears are suddenly gone. (I think this is the moment of disconnecting from the body).

Stage 2:
Floating over the body, seeing, hearing what is going on in hospital

Stage 3:
Seeing a light and being drawn to it.

Stage 4:
Meeting family members who died before or "a being full of love and light" and being sent to the body again.

Its longer, but you may be interested in it:

Good video

It's nice to hear doctors with positive ideas of the afterlife. I think I also understand, from what he was saying, that the spirit leaves the body upon death.

Gregory Thompson · Apr 17, 2019

devin553344 said:
I found this interesting and also disturbing: When you die ‘you know you’re dead because your brain keeps working’, scientist claims

Does the spirit leave the body at the moment of death, or after the brain stops working?

The "wind" in us leaves with our last breath, but the brain activity thing might explain human to human wifi uploads post mortem.

1am3laine · Apr 17, 2019

devin553344 said:
I found this interesting and also disturbing: When you die ‘you know you’re dead because your brain keeps working’, scientist claims

Does the spirit leave the body at the moment of death, or after the brain stops working?

I knew I was dead because right before I died I hit the floor really hard and I pee'd myself.
The next thing I felt no pain and I was dry in white space. Then I came back to life and I was wet again because of the pee and had head pains because of the fall.

devin553344 · Apr 17, 2019

1am3laine said:
I knew I was dead because right before I died I hit the floor really hard and I pee'd myself.
The next thing I felt no pain and I was dry in white space. Then I came back to life and I was wet again because of the pee and had head pains because of the fall.

Is that a near death experience?

marineimaging · Apr 17, 2019

devin553344 said:
I found this interesting and also disturbing: When you die ‘you know you’re dead because your brain keeps working’, scientist claims

Does the spirit leave the body at the moment of death, or after the brain stops working?

My dad, a firefighter, had a full arrest at a house fire. We slid him down from the roof and administered CPR all the way to the hospital. By the time he arrived at the hospital he was hooked up to monitors and went straight the trauma room where he was technically dead according to modern science. They shocked him 24 times. On the 25th he suddenly began to show a beating heart. For about 35 minutes he had no discernible heart beat of his own and was not breathing except for the forced air through intubation. Was he dead? He said, I could hear everything everybody was saying, including the fact that I was in full arrest. I could feel the punch of every shock. It hurt like nothing I have ever felt. I just could not communicate that I was there and listening. He said, I didn't float above the room, I didn't have a Jesus experience. I was just unable to do anything. We concluded that the question is not whether science can declare you dead or alive; but rather it rests on one thing and only one thing with the Christian. When God decides and where He decides it and what becomes of it in His space and His time is all that matters to us.

devin553344 · Apr 17, 2019

marineimaging said:
My dad, a firefighter, had a full arrest at a house fire. We slid him down from the roof and administered CPR all the way to the hospital. By the time he arrived at the hospital he was hooked up to monitors and went straight the trauma room where he was technically dead according to modern science. They shocked him 24 times. On the 25th he suddenly began to show a beating heart. For about 35 minutes he had no discernible heart beat of his own and was not breathing except for the forced air through intubation. Was he dead? He said, I could hear everything everybody was saying, including the fact that I was in full arrest. I could feel the punch of every shock. It hurt like nothing I have ever felt. I just could not communicate that I was there and listening. He said, I didn't float above the room, I didn't have a Jesus experience. I was just unable to do anything. We concluded that the question is not whether science can declare you dead or alive; but rather it rests on one thing and only one thing with the Christian. When God decides and where He decides it and what becomes of it in His space and His time is all that matters to us.

Thanks, that is in fact one of the reasons I started the thread was to know if when your dead you feel pain

Sorry to hear about your Dads experience, good to hear that he made it back

marineimaging · Apr 17, 2019

marineimaging said:
My dad, a firefighter, had a full arrest at a house fire. We slid him down from the roof and administered CPR all the way to the hospital. By the time he arrived at the hospital he was hooked up to monitors and went straight the trauma room where he was technically dead according to modern science. They shocked him 24 times. On the 25th he suddenly began to show a beating heart. For about 35 minutes he had no discernible heart beat of his own and was not breathing except for the forced air through intubation. Was he dead? He said, I could hear everything everybody was saying, including the fact that I was in full arrest. I could feel the punch of every shock. It hurt like nothing I have ever felt. I just could not communicate that I was there and listening. He said, I didn't float above the room, I didn't have a Jesus experience. I was just unable to do anything. We concluded that the question is not whether science can declare you dead or alive; but rather it rests on one thing and only one thing with the Christian. When God decides and where He decides it and what becomes of it in His space and His time is all that matters to us.

devin553344 said:
Thanks, that is in fact one of the reasons I started the thread was to know if when your dead you feel pain Sorry to hear about your Dads experience, good to hear that he made it back

So, his answer was YES! Until the brain dies you feel it. It could also be said that he was not dead in the sense that God had not taken him and instead, as part of God's eternal plan, his demise on the emergency table was an event that touched a lot of other people that day for a variety of reasons. It touched us and changed our lives in a lot of ways. Before he passed away (for real) he became a Christian and we think that experience was part of his awakening to his mortality.

trophy33 · Apr 17, 2019

devin553344 said:
Good video It's nice to hear doctors with positive ideas of the afterlife. I think I also understand, from what he was saying, that the spirit leaves the body upon death.

Depends on how you define, spirit, soul etc. There are various views. Therefore I rather say "conciousness".

Original Happy Camper · Apr 18, 2019

myst33 said:
Yeah, but the New Testament revealed that dead ones are living after the death of the body. That the conciousness (or soul, if you wish) continues.

so we are immortal on this earth once we are born?

The Bible says:

Romans 2:7
To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:

1 Corinthians 15:53
For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

1 Corinthians 15:54
So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

1 Timothy 1:17
Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only wise God, be honour and glory for ever and ever. Amen.

1 Timothy 6:16
Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.

2 Timothy 1:10
But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:

Welcome to the truth

trophy33 · Apr 18, 2019

Original Happy Camper said:
so we are immortal on this earth once we are born?

The Bible says:

Romans 2:7
To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:

1 Corinthians 15:53
For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

1 Corinthians 15:54
So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

1 Timothy 1:17
Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only wise God, be honour and glory for ever and ever. Amen.

1 Timothy 6:16
Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.

2 Timothy 1:10
But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:

Welcome to the truth

Yes, who believes in Christ, has the eternal life. Who does not, will perish eternally (this does not mean that unbelievers cease to exist in the moment of physical death, there will be judgement first).

Kaon · Apr 18, 2019

Lazarus Short said:
As Solomon stated, the dead know nothing, and only decomposition is a sure sign that you are dead. God can (and will) reverse that, btw.

Solomon was speaking about physical reality, and colloquial death.

We are all dead; we are all decomposing. We eat, bathe and sleep to slow down the decomposition process. We are walking corpses, and most of us do not realize we are dead. We run to and fro, believing "we are the most advanced, peaceful and/or knowledgeable generation" of our time every generation, when we know nothing about the world or cosmos around us. We have the audacity to believe we can manufacture a path to godhood/immortality, we look toward the cosmos as a new frontier when we barely understand the physics around us, and we continuously destroy the world around us. That is what the [spiritually] dead do; the Most High God separated this darkness from light when it sent the earth into darkness/void the first time.

On the other hand, when we actually expire, we do not know we are dead - although, if we are alive in the name of the Redeemer, we realize our lives, and are set aside for Judgment and resurrection. Those who have expired, and dead in the name of the Redeemer do not see the difference between

Lazarus Short · Apr 18, 2019

Kaon said:
Solomon was speaking about physical reality, and colloquial death.

We are all dead; we are all decomposing. We eat, bathe and sleep to slow down the decomposition process. We are walking corpses, and most of us do not realize we are dead. We run to and fro, believing "we are the most advanced, peaceful and/or knowledgeable generation" of our time every generation, when we know nothing about the world or cosmos around us. We have the audacity to believe we can manufacture a path to godhood/immortality, we look toward the cosmos as a new frontier when we barely understand the physics around us, and we continuously destroy the world around us. That is what the [spiritually] dead do; the Most High God separated this darkness from light when it sent the earth into darkness/void the first time.

On the other hand, when we actually expire, we do not know we are dead - although, if we are alive in the name of the Redeemer, we realize our lives, and are set aside for Judgment and resurrection. Those who have expired, and dead in the name of the Redeemer do not see the difference between

Your idea is interesting, and it puts me in mind of what Jesus said to Mary after His resurrection, not to touch Him because He had not yet ascended. I have often wondered if contact with a carnal human would have made Him unclean in some way, just as the Law given to Moses prescribed uncleanness for anyone who touched a corpse.

Kaon · Apr 18, 2019

Lazarus Short said:
Your idea is interesting, and it puts me in mind of what Jesus said to Mary after His resurrection, not to touch Him because He had not yet ascended. I have often wondered if contact with a carnal human would have made Him unclean in some way, just as the Law given to Moses prescribed uncleanness for anyone who touched a corpse.

Taking it from a scientific point of view, it would be like a sterile person touching a petri of microbes. Additionally, if we extrapolate laws of physics to the spirit, those of us severely lacking perfection (all of us) would increasingly try to "leech" His perfection - or, His perfection as the Word of God Himself would annihilate us. I think the latter is more likely; an entity full of Pure Perfection in all facets would annihilate imperfection by consequence. (This may also be why the Most High God says He "cannot" be in the presence of evil. He can; He would just annihilate it even before contact, and it is actually a mercy He isn't in our presence right now - as He would annihilate us. It is also why He had to come as a Son of Man.)

The Most High God is very natural, and He gave us plenty of clues and connections so that our primitive little minds can understand the secrets of Heaven - even to the point that it confuses the "wise".

usexpat97 · Apr 18, 2019

People are always going to swear up and down that your consciousness ends when the brain stops working. Problem is, too many witness accounts say that is not the case.

devin553344 · Apr 18, 2019

usexpat97 said:
People are always going to swear up and down that your consciousness ends when the brain stops working. Problem is, too many witness accounts say that is not the case.

Well I was thinking about that, and it could be that nervous system stimuli could imprint on a brain shortly after losing consciousness. Someone touches the arm of the patient and the electrical imprint is made to the brain. Then the person is revived and simply has the memories of the nervous system imprint.

Lazarus Short · Apr 18, 2019

usexpat97 said:
People are always going to swear up and down that your consciousness ends when the brain stops working. Problem is, too many witness accounts say that is not the case.

i happen to believe, or at least to suspect, that the brain is a mere transducer, and that our consciousness is located...somewhere else.

usexpat97 · Apr 18, 2019

i happen to believe, or at least to suspect, that the brain is a mere transducer, and that our consciousness is located...somewhere else.

Do you have something other than a metaphysical soul = consciousness in mind?

Lazarus Short · Apr 18, 2019

Kaon said:
Taking it from a scientific point of view, it would be like a sterile person touching a petri of microbes. Additionally, if we extrapolate laws of physics to the spirit, those of us severely lacking perfection (all of us) would increasingly try to "leech" His perfection - or, His perfection as the Word of God Himself would annihilate us. I think the latter is more likely; an entity full of Pure Perfection in all facets would annihilate imperfection by consequence. (This may also be why the Most High God says He "cannot" be in the presence of evil. He can; He would just annihilate it even before contact, and it is actually a mercy He isn't in our presence right now - as He would annihilate us. It is also why He had to come as a Son of Man.)

The Most High God is very natural, and He gave us plenty of clues and connections so that our primitive little minds can understand the secrets of Heaven - even to the point that it confuses the "wise".

Yes! I hink of what Paul writes in I Corinthians 3, that our works go through the Fire, and only those works which survive the Fire will rate a Reward.

Lazarus Short · Apr 18, 2019

usexpat97 said:
Do you have something other than a metaphysical soul = consciousness in mind?

Not sure, for it is a slippery subject.

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