Is the GREAT CITY in Revelation symbolizing the LAKE OF FIRE?

Ronald · Apr 17, 2019

LittleLambofJesus said:
edited...........
First of all, the phrase "lake of fire" is used in only 5 verses of the entire Bible, and those in 3 chapters of Revelation.

"lake of fire" occurs 4 times in 4 verses

Revelation 19:20
and is arrested<4084> Beast<2342>, and with it the False-Prophet<5578>, the one-doing the signs in view of it, in which he deceives<4105> the ones getting the mark of the beast, and the ones worshiping to the image of it.
Living were cast, the two, into the Lake of the Fire the one burning<2545> in sulfur <2303>

Revelation 20:
10 And the Devil, the one-deceiving<4105> them, was cast into the Lake of the Fire and of sulfur<2303>, the where-are the beast and the false-prophet,
and they shall be being tormented<928> day and night into the ages of the ages.
14 And the Death and the Hades<86> were cast into the Lake of the Fire.
This the Death, the second-one, is being the Lake of the Fire .
15 And if anyone not was found in the Book of the Life having been written
, he was cast into the Lake of the Fire.

Revelation 21:8
To the yet fearful and faithless and ones being abominated and murderers, and paramours<4205>, and enchanters<5333>, and idolaters<1496>, and to-all falsifiers<5571>,
the part of them in the Lake, the one burning<2545> Fire<4442> and sulphur<2306>, which is being the Death, the second-one.

Here is a little info gathered off the net:

Lake of fire - Wikipedia

Posts I have posted:

.............................

.

Why not just read the passage, it literally tells you.
The "great city" in Rev. 11:8 is Jerusalem some time in the future.
"Their bodies (the two witnesses) will lie in the street of the great city which is figuratively called Sodom and Egypt, where also their Lord was crucified."

LittleLambofJesus · Sep 14, 2019

Ronald said:
Why not just read the passage, it literally tells you.The "great city" in Rev. 11:8 is Jerusalem some time in the future.
"Their bodies (the two witnesses) will lie in the street of the great city which is figuratively called Sodom and Egypt, where also their Lord was crucified."

Hello Ronald.......why must it be future instead of 1st century?

The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD

The day on which Titus encompassed Jerusalem, was the feast of the Passover

Nevertheless, the city was at this time crowded with Jewish strangers, and foreigners from all parts, so that the whole nation may be considered as having been shut up in one prison, preparatory to the execution of the Divine vengeance ; and, according to Josephus this event took place suddenly ; thus, not only fulfilling the predictions of our LORD, that these calamities should come, like the swift-darting lightning" that cometh out of the east and shineth even unto the West," and " as a snare on all of them (the Jews) who dwelt upon the face of the whole earth " (Matt. xxiv. 27, and Luke xxi 35,) but justifying, also, his friendly direction, that those who fled from the place should use the utmost possible expedition..................
Finding it impossible to restrain the impetuosity and cruelty of his soldiers, the Commander in chief proceeded, with some of his superior officers, to take a survey of those parts of the edifice which were still uninjured by the conflagration.,,,,,,,,,,,,
Meanwhile the Temple continued burning, until at length, vast as was its size, the flames completely enveloped the, whole building ; which, from the extent of the conflagration, impressed the distant spectator with an idea that the whole city was now on fire. The tumult and disorder which ensued upon this event, it is impossible (says Josephus) for language to describe. The Roman legions made the most horrid outcries ; the rebels, finding themselves exposed to the fury of both fire and sword, screamed dreadfully ; while the unhappy people who were pent up between the enemy and the flames, deplored their situation in the most pitiable complaints. Those on the hill and those in the city seemed mutually to return the groans of each other. Such as were expiring through famine, were revived by this hideous scene, and seemed to acquire new spirits to deplore their misfortunes. The lamentations from the city wore re-echoed from the adjacent mountains, and places beyond Jordan.

The flames which enveloped the Temple were so violent and impetuous, that the lofty hill. on which it stood appeared, even front its deep foundations, as one large body of fire. The blood of the sufferers flowed in proportion to the rage of this de structive element ; and the number of the slain exceeded all calculation. The ground could not be seen for the dead bodies, over which the Romans trampled in pursuit of the fugitives ; while the crackling noise of the devouring flames mingled with the clamor of arms, the groans of the dying and the shrieks of despair, augmented the tremendous horror of a scene, to which the pages of history can furnish no parallel.

iamlamad · Sep 14, 2019

LittleLambofJesus said:
Hello Ronald.......why must it be future instead of 1st century?

If it was history, then all the trumpets must be history. Yet, in all this time NO ONE has ever been able to show us each trumpet judgment in history: when it was or where it was. Isn't this the basis for prophecy - it comes TRUE?

Revealing Times · Sep 14, 2019

Ronald said:
Why not just read the passage, it literally tells you.
The "great city" in Rev. 11:8 is Jerusalem some time in the future.
"Their bodies (the two witnesses) will lie in the street of the great city which is figuratively called Sodom and Egypt, where also their Lord was crucified."

No it doesn't, you are conflating TWO different Great Cities.

We are indeed told what that Great City is. It Babylon that John saw in his VISION. That Great City YOU SAW !! Rev. 17:18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth. Well who/what did John see ? The vision is only 4 verses.

Rev. 17:3 So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.

4 And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication: {THINK Daniel 5, MENE, MENE TEKEL, that's where this comes from, Babylon FALLS because they profaned that which was holy}

5 And upon her forehead was a name written, Mystery,{COMMA}.......Babylon The Great, The Mother Of Harlots And Abominations Of The Earth. {These are FOUR DESCRIPTORS}

6 And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration [WONDERMENT}.

The Harlot is All False Religion of ALL TIME !! So The Harlot = A Mystery that the Angel explains in verses 8-18, so its no longer a Mystery to those of us who see/hear what thus saith the Lord. The Harlot = Babylon the Great meaning that is where All False Religion was Birthed. False Religion is of course an Abomination unto a Jealous God and Semiramis is the Mother of Harlots because she birthed these Mystery False Religions.

So that GREAT CITY is Babylon, not Jerusalem, not anything else, and since its a dead city God is using it as a Metaphor for something, but what ? Well read Vial number 7 it tells us who God sees as Babylon the Great, wright there for all to see.

Rev. 16:19 And the great city was divided into three parts {Jerusalem/Earthquake/Jesus Return}, and the CITIES of the Nations FELL {Think City States of Old}: and GREAT BABYLON came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.

So who is GREAT BABYLON ? Well who did Jesus defeat ? Look at Vial number 6 for the Answer !!

Rev. 16:12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared. 13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.

14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.

So ALL THE KINGS of ALL THE EARTH are defeated at bArmageddon and God...God Himself called them Babylon the Great !! So Babylon = The Whole World or Satan's Dark Kingdom on Earth.

Its written in plain english if we just follow the verses. Men tend to complicate things. I stopped following Men's Traditions and just asked God to show me, IT WORKS !!

Babylon = The Whole World

The Harlot = All False Religion of ALL TIME

The Beast = False Governance under Satan.

iamlamad · Sep 15, 2019

Revealing Times said:
No it doesn't, you are conflating TWO different Great Cities.

We are indeed told what that Great City is. It Babylon that John saw in his VISION. That Great City YOU SAW !! Rev. 17:18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth. Well who/what did John see ? The vision is only 4 verses.

Rev. 17:3 So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.

4 And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication: {THINK Daniel 5, MENE, MENE TEKEL, that's where this comes from, Babylon FALLS because they profaned that which was holy}

5 And upon her forehead was a name written, Mystery,{COMMA}.......Babylon The Great, The Mother Of Harlots And Abominations Of The Earth. {These are FOUR DESCRIPTORS}

6 And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration [WONDERMENT}.

The Harlot is All False Religion of ALL TIME !! So The Harlot = A Mystery that the Angel explains in verses 8-18, so its no longer a Mystery to those of us who see/hear what thus saith the Lord. The Harlot = Babylon the Great meaning that is where All False Religion was Birthed. False Religion is of course an Abomination unto a Jealous God and Semiramis is the Mother of Harlots because she birthed these Mystery False Religions.

So that GREAT CITY is Babylon, not Jerusalem, not anything else, and since its a dead city God is using it as a Metaphor for something, but what ? Well read Vial number 7 it tells us who God sees as Babylon the Great, wright there for all to see.

Rev. 16:19 And the great city was divided into three parts {Jerusalem/Earthquake/Jesus Return}, and the CITIES of the Nations FELL {Think City States of Old}: and GREAT BABYLON came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.

So who is GREAT BABYLON ? Well who did Jesus defeat ? Look at Vial number 6 for the Answer !!

Rev. 16:12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared. 13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.

14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.

So ALL THE KINGS of ALL THE EARTH are defeated at bArmageddon and God...God Himself called them Babylon the Great !! So Babylon = The Whole World or Satan's Dark Kingdom on Earth.

Its written in plain english if we just follow the verses. Men tend to complicate things. I stopped following Men's Traditions and just asked God to show me, IT WORKS !!

Babylon = The Whole World

The Harlot = All False Religion of ALL TIME

The Beast = False Governance under Satan.

Your theory: Babylon = all false religion.
TRUTH and what John actually wrote: "that great city." And in thee same book by the same writer, he tells us "the great city" is JERUSALEM.

Do you think the Antichrist Beast will deceive some into following Buddha, others into folling Hinduism, yet others into following Islam? WRONG! By the time God is ready to destroy "Mystery, Babylon" all these false religions of the world will be deceived into follow the false religion of the BEAST! In other words, THERE WILL BE ONLY ONE FALSE RELIGION LEFT: and it will be coming from Jerusalem.

LittleLambofJesus · Sep 15, 2019

iamlamad said:
Your theory: Babylon = all false religion.
TRUTH and what John actually wrote: "that great city." And in thee same book by the same writer, he tells us "the great city" is JERUSALEM.

Do you think the Antichrist Beast will deceive some into following Buddha, others into folling Hinduism, yet others into following Islam? WRONG! By the time God is ready to destroy "Mystery, Babylon" all these false religions of the world will be deceived into follow the false religion of the BEAST! In other words, THERE WILL BE ONLY ONE FALSE RELIGION LEFT: and it will be coming from Jerusalem.

Correctomundo!!!!

Allusions in Revelation from Old Testament

Ezekiel 8:3
He stretched out the form of a hand, and took me by a lock of my hair; and the Spirit lifted me up between earth and heaven, and brought me in visions of God to Jerusalem,
to the door of the north gate of the inner court, where the seat of the image of jealousy was, which provokes to jealousy. [Revelation 17:3]

Revelation 17:3
and he carried me away to a wilderness in the Spirit, and I saw a Woman sitting upon a scarlet-coloured beast, full of names of evil-speaking, having seven heads and ten horns, [Ezekiel 8:3]
===================
Isa 1:18
“Come now, and let us reason together,” Says the LORD,
“Though your sins are like scarlet, They shall be as white as snow;
Though they are red like crimson, They shall be as wool.

Reve 18:16 "woe! woe! THE GREAT CITY arrayed with PURPLE AND FINE LINEN / JERUSALEM 70AD?

Rev 17:4
The woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet, and adorned with gold and precious stones and pearls, having in her hand a golden cup full of abominations and the filthiness of her fornication.
Rev 18:12
“merchandise of gold and silver, precious stones and pearls, fine linen and purple, silk and scarlet, every kind of citron wood, every kind of object of ivory, every kind of object of most precious wood, bronze, iron, and marble;
Rev 18:16
“and saying, ‘Alas, alas, that great city that was clothed in fine linen, purple, and scarlet, and adorned with gold and precious stones and pearls!
=================
The identity of the RICH MAN in Luke 16:
[The Husband [Ahab] of the Rich Woman[Jezebel] in Revelation]

Lazarus and the Rich Man - Here a little, there a little - Commentary

Luke 16:19
A certain Man/Judah was rich and clothed in purple and fine linen making-merry down to a-day, shiningly<2988> [Matt 22:11]
The clothing of the rich man identifies him symbolically with the people of Israel, chosen by God to be His special people. They were called to be a witness to the nations surrounding them, confirming the blessings available to those who would obey God and keep His laws. Unfortunately, they frequently did not live up to the high calling given to them by God.
While the significance of this seemingly pointless detail has been neglected by scholars throughout the centuries, you can be certain that it did not escape the notice of the Pharisees and scribes to which Yeshua was speaking. They thoroughly knew their history and were extremely proud of their heritage. Yeshua wanted those self-righteous Pharisees to know exactly who he was referring to with this parable.
This detail cements the identity of the rich man as the House of Judah, the Jews!

Revealing Times · Sep 15, 2019

iamlamad said:
Your theory: Babylon = all false religion.
TRUTH and what John actually wrote: "that great city." And in thee same book by the same writer, he tells us "the great city" is JERUSALEM.

Do you think the Antichrist Beast will deceive some into following Buddha, others into folling Hinduism, yet others into following Islam? WRONG! By the time God is ready to destroy "Mystery, Babylon" all these false religions of the world will be deceived into follow the false religion of the BEAST! In other words, THERE WILL BE ONLY ONE FALSE RELIGION LEFT: and it will be coming from Jerusalem.

I don't have a THEORY, that is what you have with the Seals......

You didn't even comprehend what I wrote, bravo. Buddhist, and Islamist will all be KILLED OFF by the Beast and his henchmen the 10 Kings...they kill off the Harlot. {SEE Rev. 17:16} So no, I don't think the Anti-Christ tries to get anyone to believe in these other religions, HE KILLS THEM OFF !! Just the opposite of what you cited me as espousing, at least get it right when you reply brother.

He says that Babylon is the Whole World, Read Rev. 16:19, or do you just refuse to do that ? There are MANY Great Cities, you guys sure love to hinder God's ability to speech. So only you can name a Great City, God can't have many Great Cities ? Even though He describes it that way and shows that those people He kills He calls Babylon the Great. I am tired of discussing this with you to be honest. Looks like you would just stop replying to me. I think I will just try to avoid your posts from now on, or maybe place you on ignore for both our sakes, it does me no good whatsoever to discuss eschatology with someone who says the Seals were opened 2000 years ago.

Believe what you will brother, when you get to Heaven you will see the Seals are broken at the Midway Point and Babylon is Babylon the Great, the Kingdom of Satan on earth. The Harlot is ALL FALSE RELIGION and the Beasts are Government Entities that dominate the people(s).

God Bless.

iamlamad · Sep 15, 2019

Revealing Times said:
I don't have a THEORY, that is what you have with the Seals......

You didn't even comprehend what I wrote, bravo. Buddhist, and Islamist will all be KILLED OFF by the Beast and his henchmen the 10 Kings...they kill off the Harlot. {SEE Rev. 17:16} So no, I don't think the Anti-Christ tries to get anyone to believe in these other religions, HE KILLS THEM OFF !! Just the opposite of what you cited me as espousing, at least get it right when you reply brother.

He says that Babylon is the Whole World, Read Rev. 16:19, or do you just refuse to do that ? There are MANY Great Cities, you guys sure love to hinder God's ability to speech. So only you can name a Great City, God can't have many Great Cities ? Even though He describes it that way and shows that those people He kills He calls Babylon the Great. I am tired of discussing this with you to be honest. Looks like you would just stop replying to me. I think I will just try to avoid your posts from now on, or maybe place you on ignore for both our sakes, it does me no good whatsoever to discuss eschatology with someone who says the Seals were opened 2000 years ago.

Believe what you will brother, when you get to Heaven you will see the Seals are broken at the Midway Point and Babylon is Babylon the Great, the Kingdom of Satan on earth. The Harlot is ALL FALSE RELIGION and the Beasts are Government Entities that dominate the people(s).

God Bless.

"all the world wondered after the beast. And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast?"

Does this look like murder, or deception? Now show us your verses to back up what you said.

He, the Antichrist Beast will DECEIVE the world, not kill off the world. Did you not understand, it is BELIEVERS he goes after to kill. You have this backwards.

By the way, just so you can get it right next time:
And upon her forehead was a name written, Mystery, Babylon The Great, The Mother Of Harlots And Abominations Of The Earth.

It is the WOMAN that is called "Babylon" not the kingdom she is riding.

The "Beast" is a MAN, not a government.
The False Prophet is a MAN, not a government.

You are also mistaken about Rev. 16:19. That verse is talking about JERUSALEM!

How could you get so far off? It will be the "man of sin" that turns into the Beast. My friend, we have to go by what is written, not by human imagination!

Erik Nelson · Sep 16, 2019

perhaps everyone could acknowledge that both before and after the millennium, The Deceiver dupes virtually the whole of humanity

such that there would very likely be qualitative similarities and parallels between both periods

possibly enough to confuse the issue and obscure which one is which

iamlamad · Sep 16, 2019

LittleLambofJesus said:
First of all, the phrase "lake of fire" is used in only 5 verses of the entire Bible, and those in 3 chapters of Revelation.

"lake of fire" occurs 4 times in 4 verses

Revelation 19:20
and is arrested<4084> Beast<2342>, and with it the False-Prophet<5578>, the one-doing the signs in view of it, in which he deceives<4105> the ones getting the mark of the beast, and the ones worshiping to the image of it.
Living were cast, the two, into the Lake of the Fire the one burning<2545> in sulfur <2303>

Revelation 20:
10 And the Devil, the one-deceiving<4105> them, was cast into the Lake of the Fire and of sulfur<2303>, the where-are the beast and the false-prophet,
and they shall be being tormented<928> day and night into the ages of the ages.
14 And the Death and the Hades<86> were cast into the Lake of the Fire.
This the Death, the second-one, is being the Lake of the Fire .
15 And if anyone not was found in the Book of the Life having been written
, he was cast into the Lake of the Fire.

Revelation 21:8
To the yet fearful and faithless and ones being abominated and murderers, and paramours<4205>, and enchanters<5333>, and idolaters<1496>, and to-all falsifiers<5571>,
the part of them in the Lake, the one burning<2545> Fire<4442> and sulphur<2306>, which is being the Death, the second-one.

Here is a little info gathered off the net:

Lake of fire - Wikipedia

Posts I have posted:

.............................

.

God is going to destroy "Babylon" but the lake of fire goes on forever.

Erik Nelson · Sep 17, 2019

Revealing Times said:
He says that Babylon is the Whole World, Read Rev. 16:19, or do you just refuse to do that ? There are MANY Great Cities, you guys sure love to hinder God's ability to speech. So only you can name a Great City, God can't have many Great Cities ? Even though He describes it that way and shows that those people He kills He calls Babylon the Great. I am tired of discussing this with you to be honest. Looks like you would just stop replying to me. I think I will just try to avoid your posts from now on, or maybe place you on ignore for both our sakes, it does me no good whatsoever to discuss eschatology with someone who says the Seals were opened 2000 years ago.

Believe what you will brother, when you get to Heaven you will see the Seals are broken at the Midway Point and Babylon is Babylon the Great, the Kingdom of Satan on earth. The Harlot is ALL FALSE RELIGION and the Beasts are Government Entities that dominate the people(s).

God Bless.

Revelation 16:19 The great city split into three parts, and the cities of the nations collapsed. God remembered Babylon the Great and gave her the cup filled with the wine of the fury of his wrath.

Where is "the whole world" in that verse ?

Erik Nelson · Sep 17, 2019

iamlamad said:
God is going to destroy "Babylon" but the lake of fire goes on forever.

God will do what God actually prophesied with those verses, yes

Looking back on things with 20/20 hindsight, it will wind up having been true that, yes, there once was a well-known city symbolically dubbed "Babylon" which was cataclysmically desolated

iamlamad · Sep 17, 2019

Erik Nelson said:
perhaps everyone could acknowledge that both before and after the millennium, The Deceiver dupes virtually the whole of humanity

such that there would very likely be qualitative similarities and parallels between both periods

possibly enough to confuse the issue and obscure which one is which

If we go by what is written, I cannot find that he deceives the whole world after the millennium. Certainly he deceives many.

iamlamad · Sep 17, 2019

Erik Nelson said:
Revelation 16:19 The great city split into three parts, and the cities of the nations collapsed. God remembered Babylon the Great and gave her the cup filled with the wine of the fury of his wrath.

Where is "the whole world" in that verse ?

"the cities of the nations"

Revealing Times · Sep 18, 2019

Erik Nelson said:
Revelation 16:19 The great city split into three parts, and the cities of the nations collapsed. God remembered Babylon the Great and gave her the cup filled with the wine of the fury of his wrath.

Where is "the whole world" in that verse ?

I don't know what bible you use, be the CITIES/STATES/Nations were DEFEATED at Armageddon, they didn't collapse per se. All these odd bibles people pull out.............

Rev. 16:19 And the great city was divided into three parts {EARTHQUAKE, Jesus lands on Mt. Zion, Jesus defeats the NATIONS/City States as they were known then}, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.

The Cities falling is Jesus defeating the Nations/City States that come against him at Armageddon. And here we see that God calls them Babylon the Great.......So who are these States/Cities/Nations that are defeated at Armageddon ? Well Vial #6 tells us who they are......we know its the E.U. and the Beast, they are of the Beast, but the three Demon Frogs gather who to Armageddon ?

Rev. 16:12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.

13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.

14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.

So the kings of the WHOLE EARTH is whom God defeats at Armageddon, and he calls them BABYLON THE GREAT !! Why do we not know whom he defeats at Armageddon ? We do, but people overlook these facts because people have tunnel vision.

sdowney717 · Sep 18, 2019

Revealing Times said:
I don't know what bible you use, be the CITIES/STATES/Nations were DEFEATED at Armageddon, they didn't collapse per se. All these odd bibles people pull out.............

Rev. 16:19 And the great city was divided into three parts {EARTHQUAKE, Jesus lands on Mt. Zion, Jesus defeats the NATIONS/City States as they were known then}, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.

The Cities falling is Jesus defeating the Nations/City States that come against him at Armageddon. And here we see that God calls them Babylon the Great.......So who is these States/Cities/Nations that are defeated at Armageddon ? Well Vial #6 tells us who they are......we know its the E.U. and the Beast, they are of the Beast, but the three Demon Frogs gather who to Armageddon ?

Rev. 16:12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.

13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.

14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.

So the kings of the WHOLE EARTH is whom God defeats at Babylon, and he calls them BABYLON THE GREAT !! Why do we not know whom he defeats at Armageddon ? We do, but people overlook these facts because people have tunnel vision.

Yes a world wide gathering to destruction, not a local flood was Noah's flood, it killed all flesh that had the breath of life, (air breathers), except them in the ark, (Christ). Jesus said when He returns, the times will be just like that time when the flood swept them all away.
The world that then was destroyed by water, this world of today to be destroyed by fire.

iamlamad · Sep 18, 2019

Revealing Times said:
I don't know what bible you use, be the CITIES/STATES/Nations were DEFEATED at Armageddon, they didn't collapse per se. All these odd bibles people pull out.............

Rev. 16:19 And the great city was divided into three parts {EARTHQUAKE, Jesus lands on Mt. Zion, Jesus defeats the NATIONS/City States as they were known then}, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.

The Cities falling is Jesus defeating the Nations/City States that come against him at Armageddon. And here we see that God calls them Babylon the Great.......So who is these States/Cities/Nations that are defeated at Armageddon ? Well Vial #6 tells us who they are......we know its the E.U. and the Beast, they are of the Beast, but the three Demon Frogs gather who to Armageddon ?

Rev. 16:12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.

13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.

14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.

So the kings of the WHOLE EARTH is whom God defeats at Babylon, and he calls them BABYLON THE GREAT !! Why do we not know whom he defeats at Armageddon ? We do, but people overlook these facts because people have tunnel vision.

Rev. 16:19 And the great city [JERUSALEM] was divided into three parts [EARTHQUAKE: at the 7th vial; NOT the earthquake when Jesus touches down: He will not return to earth until chapter 19 - probably 30 more days later] and the cities of the nations fell [the cities of all nations] and great Babylon [the city of Jerusalem] came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.

You see, it makes perfect sense that "Babylon" is that great city of Jerusalem where the Beast and False prophet will end up deceiving the entire world.

The Cities falling is Jesus defeating the Nations/City States that come against him at Armageddon Sorry, but your timing is all messed up! We are in chapter 16 and Jesus does not return until the end of chapter 19. THINGS (STUFF) happens between the end of chapter 16 and the end of chapter 19. For example, did you forget that the marriage and supper will take place IN HEAVEN before Jesus descends to Armageddon? Well, it is true even if you did forget it.

Remember Daniel mentioning first "time, times and half of time" in chapter 12?
Next He mentioned a time of 1290 days - or 30 days AFTER the end of the week. (the week ends at the 7th vial on day 1260.) This COULD be the day of Armageddon.

And here we see that God calls them Babylon the Great. No, you imagine that. He mentioned Jerusalem breaking into three parts. Then He mentioned the cities of the world. Then he went back to talking about Jerusalem as "great Babylon."

.So who is these States/Cities/Nations that are defeated at Armageddon ? Sorry, but John has not yet arrived at Armageddon: that is in chapter 19, not 16. You, my friend, have not understood John's timing.

we know its the E.U. I don't think so - but it could be: I think every nation in the world with a standing army will send troops to Israel. It is the ten horns which throw in with the beast for "one hour." I think this ten represents many nations.

"they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world..."

Notice that these evil spirits go to the whole world.

Next, kings SEND troops, they usually don't go themselves. Perhaps a few might go.

LittleLambofJesus · Sep 20, 2019

iamlamad said:
Rev. 16:19 And the great city [JERUSALEM] was divided into three parts [EARTHQUAKE: at the 7th vial; NOT the earthquake when Jesus touches down: He will not return to earth until chapter 19 - probably 30 more days later] and the cities of the nations fell [the cities of all nations] and great Babylon [the city of Jerusalem] came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.

Could the cities of the Nations be referring to the Nations of Israel and Judah [which were still separated at that time]...........

Nah 3:1
Woe to the city of blood, full of lies, full of plunder, never without victims!
Nah 3:12
All your fortresses are like fig trees with their first ripe fruit; when they are shaken, the figs fall into the mouth of the eater.
Nah 3:13
Look at your troops— they are all weaklings. The gates of your land are wide open to your enemies; fire has consumed the bars of your gates.

Hos 8:14

Israel has forgotten their Maker and built palaces; Judah has fortified many towns.
But I will send fire on their cities that will consume their fortresses.”

Matt 24:6 has got to be referring to the 7/8 yrs Jewish Rebellion/Wars pre 70AD:

"Ye will hear of battles and rumors of battles" 1st century concluding in Judea/Jerusalem 70ad

Matthew 24:
6 “And ye will hear of battles and rumors of battles. See that you are not troubled;
for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
7 “For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom.
And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places.
8 “All these are the beginning of sorrows.”
Mark 13:
7 “But when ye hear of battles and rumors of battles, do not be troubled;
for such things must happen, but the end is not yet.
8 “For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom.
And there will be earthquakes in various places, and there will be famines and troubles.
These are the beginnings of sorrows.”
Luke 21:
9 “But when ye hear of battles and commotions/tumults, do not be terrified;
for these things must come to pass first, but the end is not immediate.”
10 Then He said to them, “Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom.
11 “And there will be great earthquakes in various places, and famines and pestilences;
and there will be fearful sights and great signs from heaven.”
=======================

Visual Timeline of the Roman-Jewish War ARTchive @ PreteristArchive.com, The Internet's Only Balanced Look at Preterist Eschatology and Preterism
CHRONOLOGY IMMEDIATELY SURROUNDING THE WAR
Stage 1: Murder of James the Just, "Opposition High Priest" ; Irrevocable Split: 62
Stage 2: General Revolt in Jerusalem ; Zealot Occupation of Masada: August-September 66
Stage 3: The Campaign of Cestius Gallus and the Defeat of the Twelfth Legion: October-November 66
Stage 4: End of Collaborative Government, Priesthood ; General Flight: November 66 - March 67
Part 6: Vespasian Subdues Northern and Western Palestine: December 66 - December 68
Part 7: Three-way Power Struggle within Jerusalem After Roman Retreat: January 68 - May 70
Part 8: Romans Breach City Walls and Leave Jerusalem Desolate: May 10 - September 10, 70
=================================
Watch this video and not the cities/towns that the Jewish rebels had taken and that the Romans had to take back before turning to Jerusalem.......

iamlamad · Sep 20, 2019

LittleLambofJesus said:
Could the cities of the Nations be referring to the Nations of Israel and Judah [which were still separated at that time]...........

Nah 3:1
Woe to the city of blood, full of lies, full of plunder, never without victims!
Nah 3:12
All your fortresses are like fig trees with their first ripe fruit; when they are shaken, the figs fall into the mouth of the eater.
Nah 3:13
Look at your troops— they are all weaklings. The gates of your land are wide open to your enemies; fire has consumed the bars of your gates.

Hos 8:14

Israel has forgotten their Maker and built palaces; Judah has fortified many towns.
But I will send fire on their cities that will consume their fortresses.”

Matt 24:6 has got to be referring to the 7/8 yrs Jewish Rebellion/Wars pre 70AD:

"Ye will hear of battles and rumors of battles" 1st century concluding in Judea/Jerusalem 70ad

Matthew 24:
6 “And ye will hear of battles and rumors of battles. See that you are not troubled;
for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
7 “For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom.
And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places.
8 “All these are the beginning of sorrows.”
Mark 13:
7 “But when ye hear of battles and rumors of battles, do not be troubled;
for such things must happen, but the end is not yet.
8 “For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom.
And there will be earthquakes in various places, and there will be famines and troubles.
These are the beginnings of sorrows.”
Luke 21:
9 “But when ye hear of battles and commotions/tumults, do not be terrified;
for these things must come to pass first, but the end is not immediate.”
10 Then He said to them, “Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom.
11 “And there will be great earthquakes in various places, and famines and pestilences;
and there will be fearful sights and great signs from heaven.”
=======================

Visual Timeline of the Roman-Jewish War ARTchive @ PreteristArchive.com, The Internet's Only Balanced Look at Preterist Eschatology and Preterism
CHRONOLOGY IMMEDIATELY SURROUNDING THE WAR
Stage 1: Murder of James the Just, "Opposition High Priest" ; Irrevocable Split: 62
Stage 2: General Revolt in Jerusalem ; Zealot Occupation of Masada: August-September 66
Stage 3: The Campaign of Cestius Gallus and the Defeat of the Twelfth Legion: October-November 66
Stage 4: End of Collaborative Government, Priesthood ; General Flight: November 66 - March 67
Part 6: Vespasian Subdues Northern and Western Palestine: December 66 - December 68
Part 7: Three-way Power Struggle within Jerusalem After Roman Retreat: January 68 - May 70
Part 8: Romans Breach City Walls and Leave Jerusalem Desolate: May 10 - September 10, 70
=================================
Watch this video and not the cities/towns that the Jewish rebels had taken and that the Romans had to take back before turning to Jerusalem.......

Novel idea: why not just believe it as written: cities of the nations?

LittleLambofJesus · Sep 20, 2019

iamlamad said:
Novel idea: why not just believe it as written: cities of the nations?

I do.
Guess I should make a thread on it........

A Preterist view.......

Visual Timeline of the Roman-Jewish War ARTchive

The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD
Proof that Matthew 24 was fully fulfilled in 70 AD!

Matthew 24:
6 “And you will hear of battles and rumors of battles. See that you are not troubled;
for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
7 “For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom.
And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places.
8 “All these are the beginning of sorrows.”

While Jerusalem was a prey to these ferocious and devouring factions, every part of Judea was scourged and laid waste by bands of robbers and murderers, who plundered the towns; and, in case of resistance, slew the inhabitants, not sparing either women or children.
Simon, son of Gioras, the commander of one of these bands, at the head of forty thousand banditti, having with some difficulty entered Jerusalem, gave birth to a third faction, and the flame of civil discord blazed out again, with still more destructive fury.

The three factions, rendered frantic by drunkenness, rage, and desperation, trampling on heaps of slain, fought against each other with brutal savageness and madness. Even such as brou't sacrifices to the temple were murdered. The dead bodies of priests and worshippers, both natives and foreigners were heaped together, and a lake of blood stagnated in the sacred courts. John of Gischala, who headed one of the factions, burnt storehouses full of provisions ; and Simon, his great antagonist, who headed another of them, soon afterwards followed his example. Thus they cut the very sinews of their own strength.

At this critical and alarming conjuncture, intelligence arrived that the Roman an army was approaching the city. The Jews were petrified with astonishment and fear ; there was no time for counsel, no hope of pacification, no means of flight:-- all was wild disorder and perplexity :- nothing was to be heard but "the confused noise of the warrior, "
===========================
Revelation 16: A Preterist Commentary - Revelation Revolution

Revelation 16:19 Preterist Commentary: There was a Three-Way Civil War in both Rome and Jerusalem in A.D. 69 before the Roman Army Arrived at Jerusalem.
Revelation 16:19 says that Babylon split into three parts. In A.D. 69, Jewish refugees from the surrounding cities that had been destroyed during Vespasian’s campaign fled to Jerusalem to make their last stand. Shortly after the thunderstorm mentioned above a three-way civil war erupted. The Jewish rebels were split into three factions led by three aspiring Messiahs—John, Simon and Eleazar.43 Eleazar and his men were stationed in the inner court of the temple.44 Simon the son of Gioras controlled the upper city and much of the lower. John controlled the rest of Jerusalem. From here John and his men were attacked above and below by their two enemies.45

It is also worth noting that with the exception of the walls surrounding the Temple complex, first century Jerusalem, outside of the Temple fortress, was literally divided into three parts by fortified walls just prior to the Jewish War. These walls were built to progressively encapsulate a city that continually grew over the centuries.

While Jerusalem was torn in three parts by civil war, the rest of Rome suffered the same fate. In A.D. 69, Rome underwent a similar three-way civil war in which Galba, Otho and Vitellius pitted the Roman legions against each other. When one Caesar seized the throne, his rule was contested by a rival aristocrat who also declared himself Caesar.

During that year, Rome was ruled by four Caesars leaving three Caesars dead. Like a wildfire, civil war spread throughout Rome destroying many cities and threatening to collapse the empire. Hence, the cities of the nations also collapsed, as indicated in v. 19. The fact that the cities of the nations are said to collapse in v. 19 may also refer to all the cities of Judaea which fell to the Romans during the Jewish War prior to the fall of Jerusalem in A.D. 70. The fall of some of these cities were mentioned specifically by the previous plagues.
===========

Is the GREAT CITY in Revelation symbolizing the LAKE OF FIRE?

Could the Great City in Revelation be symbolizing the Lake of Fire?

Yes, it is possible

No, it is not possibe

That is an absolutely ridiculous and absurb view

Could it be OC Jerusalem 70ad or future Jerusalem?

I had never thought about it

Other

Rome

New York

Moscow

Vatican City

Exhortations

Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

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Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

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Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

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Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

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