50 REAL Differences between Men & Women

Thir7ySev3n · Apr 14, 2019

Paidiske said:
Sure, that happens. I'm sure it happens to men too. It's not a gender problem.

You know, at one point I had a job with a significant security component to it. I was the first woman ever appointed to that role, and there was quite some talk that I wouldn't be able to do it, that I would be assaulted by the "difficult" people, and so on.

The reality was that in the years that I held that job, I was never physically assaulted; unlike any of my male colleagues. Not because I'm so physically impressive (I'm really not); but my guess would be that I dealt with those people in a way which helped them feel safe and able to de-escalate (to borrow a term from an earlier post).

So, I had advantages and disadvantages. I suspect this is true for everyone in the police force, too. Refusing to see any strengths in what stereotypical women (because what you say isn't true of all women, of course) is a fairly profound denial of reality.

And yet the actual police forces haven't found it so.

Imagine alternatively, if it helps, saying that people shouldn't organize fights between adults and children because the children are at a significant disadvantage and placed in unnecessary danger. Now imagine someone responds with the claim, "well adults get beaten up by adults too. It's not an an age thing."

SkyWriting · Apr 14, 2019

Paidiske said:
Because then you get things like (these are real life examples) when you go to a lecturer for help with the subject he teaches, and he refuses to help you, and finishes his refusal with, "and anyway, women don't belong in science." Or when you are bullied in the workplace by someone who excuses his behaviour by saying, "It's not appropriate for a young woman to do this job." (One of those jobs @SkyWriting wants women to put their hands up for, I note!) Or when you get kicked out of college when you're pregnant. And so on.

The "women are different" narrative always ends up as an excuse to treat us not just as different but as lesser.

@SkyWriting, different jobs get different rates of pay. I don't see anyone arguing against that. But trying to force people to do work they wouldn't choose? How is that reasonable? Or even treating them as you would wish to be treated?

Becasue that's business. That what we get paid to do. Whatever the customer needs.

We have office jobs at the shop, some male, some female. We have more labor intensive, noisey, dusty jobs, running the CNC machines. "The ladies" try out the shop jobs and after a couple weeks "Oh no. Too NOISY and DIRTY for ME!" And they leave. But the office jobs, about 50/50 female. The shop jobs, about 95% male. Now this is common for the dozen places I've worked.

The useful, valuable, and long time workers do skilled labor, hard labor, and office work as needed. The females only do office work and shipping. Yes, there are some exceptions of females doing whatever needs to be done anywhere.
But for those "preferred" jobs in larger offices, large enough for baby cribs and pack N plays, the ladies want to sit at desks and file paperwork and work the phones. They put up bunnies for Easter, and shamrocks for St Patricks and other wall decorations.

And they want the same pay as people men who will work the office, the QC lab, the machine shop, whatever. My best friend calls himself "The Warehouse Beach" (possibly misspelled) becasue he does shipping, cuts parts for customers, handles the snow blowing, salting the parking lot, restocks the bathrooms twice a day, drives our own delivery truck for rush orders, whatever.

But the ladies want the same pay for the few jobs that suite their more delicate constitution. The "same pay as the men" in those limited jobs they are willing to do.

I say...do the same job, or any job that the customer needs to have done....then you can get the same pay. But if your not willing to work the shop floor as needed, then you don't get the same pay in the office as men who will.

thecolorsblend · Apr 14, 2019

SkyWriting said:
Becasue that's business. That what we get paid to do. Whatever the customer needs.

We have office jobs at the shop, some male, some female. We have more labor intensive, noisey, dusty jobs, running the CNC machines. "The ladies" try out the shop jobs and after a couple weeks "Oh no. Too NOISY and DIRTY for ME!" And they leave. But the office jobs, about 50/50 female. The shop jobs, about 95% male. Now this is common for the dozen places I've worked.

The useful, valuable, and long time workers do skilled labor, hard labor, and office work as needed. The females only do office work and shipping. Yes, there are some exceptions of females doing whatever needs to be done anywhere.
But for those "preferred" jobs in larger offices, large enough for baby cribs and pack N plays, the ladies want to sit at desks and file paperwork and work the phones. They put up bunnies for Easter, and shamrocks for St Patricks and other wall decorations.

And they want the same pay as people men who will work the office, the QC lab, the machine shop, whatever. My best friend calls himself "The Warehouse [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]" becasue he does shipping, cuts parts for customers, handles the snow blowing, salting the parking lot, restocks the bathrooms twice a day, drives our own delivery truck for rush orders, whatever.

But the ladies want the same pay for the few jobs that suite their more delicate constitution. The "same pay as the men" in those limited jobs they are willing to do.

I say...do the same job, or any job that the customer needs to have done....then you can get the same pay. But if your not willing to work the shop floor as needed, then you don't get the same pay in the office as men who will.

You're post deserves an award. And you are right, of course.

It's funny how this "pay-gap" thing persists though.

Paidiske · Apr 14, 2019

If someone applies for, and is given, a job; and then refuse to undertake some of the tasks in that role, that's wrong; and I would expect them to be disciplined and, eventually, fired. But if we're talking about people applying for different jobs... you can't force people to apply for jobs they don't want to apply for.

SkyWriting · Apr 14, 2019

thecolorsblend said:
Golly.

I wouldn't imagine that it would. There are other factors working against female officers; only one of them is a relative lack of physical strength.

Is crying while their police cruiser gets pelted by rocks thrown by yellow vest protesters "interpersonal skills"?

The officer who instantly started screaming and begging when the perp pulled a gun on her certainly deescalated the situation.

The weird thing is that male officers have no small number of terrible habits. Every single aspect of their training is seemingly designed to provoke suspects into doing something stupid. Getting into a perp's face and screaming at the top of their lungs, the old "stop resisting, stop resisting" bit as they break somebody's arm, etc.

So in case I'm not being clear, my disrespect and antipathy extends to male officers as well. Just for different reasons.

Yelling stop resisting! Is the alternative to shooting, which is perfectly viable im my opinion. If you resist arrest, expect to be shot.

If an officer questions you, sit down and shut up. Speaking will not help. Just sit down and shut up. Or hands on the steering wheel if one is close enough to reach.

SkyWriting · Apr 14, 2019

Paidiske said:
If someone applies for, and is given, a job; and then refuse to undertake some of the tasks in that role, that's wrong; and I would expect them to be disciplined and, eventually, fired. But if we're talking about people applying for different jobs... you can't force people to apply for jobs they don't want to apply for.

And you can't force equal pay between sexes if your not willing to do hard labor whenever the customer needs it.

thecolorsblend · Apr 14, 2019

SkyWriting said:
Yelling stop resisting! Is the alternative to shooting, which is perfectly viable im my opinion. If you resist arrest, expect to be shot.

If an officer questions you, sit down and shut up. Speaking will not help. Just sit down and shut up. Or hands on the steering wheel if one is close enough to reach.

I get what you're saying. But when male cops shout that, they're twisting the perp's arm at an unnatural angle, he's in pain and he's reflexively struggling. A big sweaty 220 lb officer digging his knee into the perp's back probably isn't helping matters either.

The police know this. But they do it anyway because that's how little regard they have for your liberty.

The police take a lot of grief these days and I have no sympathy for any of them.

Paidiske · Apr 14, 2019

SkyWriting said:
And you can't force equal pay between sexes if your not willing to do hard labor whenever the customer needs it.

If one role is hard labour and the other isn't, there's no reason for the pay to be the same, either. But for two people in the same role, responding to customer demand, it should be the same.

SkyWriting · Apr 14, 2019

Paidiske said:
If one role is hard labour and the other isn't, there's no reason for the pay to be the same, either. But for two people in the same role, responding to customer demand, it should be the same.

But the men ARE more flexible and the women are not.
So they don't deserve equal pay.
Like woman and men can both drive a fork lift. But that ladies always ask men for help changing the propane tank twice a day, because it's too heavy and awkward to connect propane tanks. So she can do the job...as long as she has male support for the hard work.
Don't we men deserve easy jobs where the women do the hard labor parts for us?
So, don't ask for equal pay ladies. You don't deserve it.

But Like I said, I work at a female owned and run business and she has 3 houses and 6 cars. Do that ladies, and get your equal pay. Earn it with hard work.

Sparagmos · Apr 14, 2019

A police force that has a balance of men and women is a better police force, more equipped to handle a wider variety of situations. The idea that the ability to exert physical force is the most important quality for a police officer is flawed. Police women are more likely to deescalate situations, which is a more commonly used tool than force in police work. We have had to learn to talk people more physically powerful than us into complying or calming down rather than use force or aggression. I have stopped fights and aggressive, threatening men on the train four times, while the men just watched, and I’m only 5’4. The more we can move away from using violence and physical force to enforce laws, the better. So many police encounters become violent because the officer escalated rather than deescalated.

Paidiske · Apr 14, 2019

SkyWriting said:
But the men ARE more flexible and the women are not.
So they don't deserve equal pay.

Are they employed in the same role, or not?

If they are, they should receive the same pay (and should fulfill the job requirements). If they're not, you're comparing apples and oranges anyway.

Sparagmos · Apr 14, 2019

SkyWriting said:
And you can't force equal pay between sexes if your not willing to do hard labor whenever the customer needs it.

I don’t understand your point. Women simply want equal pay for the same job. In your company, it sounds like women have chosen not to take the more physical jobs, which a man could also choose, right? Where do wages come into the equation?

SkyWriting · Apr 14, 2019

Paidiske said:
Are they employed in the same role, or not?If they are, they should receive the same pay (and should fulfill the job requirements). If they're not, you're comparing apples and oranges anyway.

Men are willing to do hard labor as needed.
Women in the same jobs are not.
When you get to the real world, you'll see this.
Women flood the work force seeking the easy jobs not requiring hard labor
and are Just Too Noisy! Whaaaa!

This pushes men out of the easy jobs low labor market.
Jobs we'd like to have when older or hurting.

trophy33 · Apr 14, 2019

Paidiske said:
Are they employed in the same role, or not?

If they are, they should receive the same pay (and should fulfill the job requirements). If they're not, you're comparing apples and oranges anyway.

The same role does not equal the same outcome, i.e. the same pay.

For example two programmers in the same position can have different payments because one is more experienced or simply asked for more money in the beginning or is in the company for a longer time.

All these "equal payment" requirements are rather socialistic, instead of realistic.

SkyWriting · Apr 14, 2019

Sparagmos said:
I don’t understand your point. Women simply want equal pay for the same job. In your company, it sounds like women have chosen not to take the more physical jobs, which a man could also choose, right? Where do wages come into the equation?

The jobs are never equal, becasue the secretary refuses to unload the delivery truck if needed. The male secretary will do whatever needs to be done. Salt the sidewalk, drive the forklift, unclog the toilets, etc.

The female secretary continues to wear the wrong shoes to do actual work. Females are of less value to a company. The paying customer has no interest in ones job description. They want the boxes loaded and on the truck, today. Getting what they want today is how their customer pays them.

mama2one · Apr 14, 2019

SkyWriting · Apr 14, 2019

christine40 said:
the woman who took over the company where husband works doesn't see it that way

now the company mostly hires females
since she took over, several men have quit due to all her changes

husband used to be in mtgs predominantly men
now some days he's the only man at a mtg
two major dept- men were the head, now woman are top

he's not quitting though as many of his colleagues have since changeover
despite all the changes the woman boss has made, he still likes his job

I mentioned that I am at a female owned and run company
and I said starting ones own company is the path to better
pay for females. I've worked at two female owed companies.

The black female owned company had the same problem finding
any women willing to "do whatever it took" to advance the company.

Daniel C · Apr 14, 2019

christine40 said:
the woman who took over the company where husband works doesn't see it that way

now the company mostly hires females
since she took over, several men have quit due to all her changes

husband used to be in mtgs predominantly men
now some days he's the only man at a mtg
two major dept- men were the head, now woman are top

he's not quitting though as many of his colleagues have since changeover
despite all the changes the woman boss has made, he still likes his job

I have some questions please:

1)What type of business is it.

2)Why are more women being hired than men.

3)What changes have been made.

4)Has the profit of the business increased since the takeover?

Brightmoon · Apr 14, 2019

Romans 8 said:
You just made a generalization.

Mistreated is a rather strong word. Given that you left no details for so called "mistreatment", are we supposed to take your complaint at face value?

Being stereotyped is a form of mistreatment in general because you a using delusional thinking instead of seeing a real person . Being told despite all evidence to the contrary that I can’t do certain tasks because I’m female is delusional thinking. Being told I’m more emotional and less intelligent because I’m female is delusional thinking . Being told that I like to dance , or I’m somehow less intelligent because I’m Black is delusional thinking . The first time it happens to you is the last time you’ll think that this stupid ignorant behavior isn’t mistreatment. Even if a stereotype is positive it isn’t true of everyone and when people expect you to do these things and you don’t, sometimes they want to punish you.

Daniel C · Apr 14, 2019

christine40 said:
don't want to answer specifics
just know that the woman is running things different than the male did

Ok I will not press you for specific details.

I just want you to understand that when a member said women had no value or whatever they said, your opening statement implied they did. You implied it by saying the female owner hires more women than men, changed things to the previous owner etc.

It sounded like you were challenging his view by using your husbands workplace as an example but you didn't really give any evidence of how the business improved. Just that changes have been made, men have left and women have been hired.

For all we know these 'changes' the new female owner made could have brought the business to the point of bankruptcy.

50 REAL Differences between Men & Women

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